Get BBC 1, 2, 3 and 4, BBC News and BBC World in the Netherlands. Obviously it would make less sence to broadcast Dutch channels in the UK in because of the language. Sadly though, the British also seem to feel less part of Europe or the rest of the World than the Dutch. This also partly explains why the Brits are far less informed about the EU than the populations of the other member states.
EU Referendum | UK residents vote today.
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Get BBC 1, 2, 3 and 4, BBC News and BBC World in the Netherlands. Obviously it would make less sence to broadcast Dutch channels in the UK in because of the language. Sadly though, the British also seem to feel less part of Europe or the rest of the World than the Dutch. This also partly explains why the Brits are far less informed about the EU than the populations of the other member states.
I wish it was so simple. The vast majority of intelligent & influential people in the UK disagree with you and want Britain to remain in the UK. For example, amongst politicians, economists and captain's of industry the 'leavers' are very much in the minority.
I'm not talking about what Remain have said (I'd agree a lot thats come out of that camp has been distorted too), I'm talking about the underlying statistics that do not agree with the perception that Leave are pushing.
I'd also agree with you that leaving the EU wouldn't lead to our 'destruction', rather, it would lead to a substantially worse future than one in Europe.
Also, I'm not saying, and have never said, I'm definitely right about anything, I don't think I'm dogmatically attached to anything, but I know what I've read, and I base what I think on what I have read, I find that a far better policy than blindly trusting authority.
That's good. For what it's worth I don't blindly trust anyone, authority least of all.
I'm not saying that leaving the EU will lead to Britains destruction! That's a rediculous statement. What I said is that for a country to disentangle themselves from the single market is by its very nature a destructive process. Think in terms of law, regulations and administration for example.
So, not trying to derail the thread or anything, but do you get all the English football matches too.
I get to watch every single United game live on the box, Saturday 3pm kick off or not.
But yet your argument is that 'intelligent and influential people' want to Leave, therefore they must be right that Leave would not be a bad thing. That trusting an authority over your own judgement.
Yes same as Rams
Canal+ show all the same PL matches that are shown in the UK plus an extra one - the 3pm Saturday match.
FA Cup League Cup CL EL are mainly on BeIn Sports
Rarely is there a United match that's not live on TV
I am most definitely not trying to explain that over and over again. I tried before, but this time it's explained simply and clearly and hopefully most will get the gist of what I'm trying to say.
Are all the matches in one (paid for I assume) package or do you pay extra for say CL/EL/FAC ?
In Holland there are 2 main sport channels that broadcast the footie, similar to Sky and BT. You pay a monthly fee for each channel.
Canal+ for the PL is one package but also have films and other channels included.
Also have the BeinSports package for the FAC/CL/EL/LC which is €11/month but they also have La Liga, Bundesliga, Serie A, Ligue 1 etc and other sports (12 channels)
Like the USA then. They get to see every match too. 
On the other hand two former Chancellors are leading the Brexit campaign and the former governor of the bank of England (Mervyn King) is dismissive of the disaster scenario's painted by both sides in this debate and won't rule our voting Brexit or Remain.
So while I'm sure you have a full grasp of the economic legal and immigration issues and feel that if only we were not so ignorant of the correct facts we would all fall into alignment with your thinking. I can't help but wonder why people who clearly have a better understanding of those matters don't agree with you even with your eminent insight backed up by being a guy on the internet and all that.
Its a conundrum isn't it? Could it be that even great thinkers disagree on this vote? No foolish me, surely it couldn't be that because you have staked your whole argument on everyone who doubts you being and idiot.
Like the last time we got all this pressure from the pro EU brigade and joined the ERM? That worked out for us didn't it?
From what I recall everybody warned the government not to join irrespective of their thoughts on the EU!!
This is not about whether the UK should join the Euro zone, it's about whether the UK should remain in the EU.
Take a look at the people who forced that move through though and look at the people in the same roles doing the same thing here. Later when it all turned to shit and they were writing about it, they were all against it.
Oh and I thought of something re the Germany rules the EU argument. Remember when Germany pushed through the stability pact and forced everyone to sign up it if they wanted to be in the Euro? Remember who broke the rules when it suited them and created the hole in monetary policy which the Greeks fell down?
No one accused you of being an idiot, not sure where that came from?
You've completely misinterpreted what I've said and perhaps would do well to re-read.
I think you've managed to get peronally offended about something that is almost the exact opposite of what I was saying.
What I was advocating is sourcing your information from both sides, being able to understand where other people are coming from and understanding how people have different opinions and don't find some arguments as convincing as you do. If you read literally two sentences past the bit you bolded you'll see I specifically said that you did not have to agree with it.
Rest assured I'm not.
In this thread people who vote for Brexit ( and I might be one yet ) have been called imperialists, xenophobic, little Englander and ignorant and I bet I could find a stupid or two as well. You can't get people to give credence to both sides of an argument like that.
I don't think that about either side in the debate just because of the way someone votes because I'm struggling with that decision myself. Not because I don't listen to both sides or know that both sides are often talking crap. I think I'm struggling because its about the future and no one really knows what will be best no matter how certain they think they are.
Reading up on the arguments and issues is actually very difficult as the space has become very partisan.
Please, name the names or stop writing this bull shit!
Besides the ERM has nothing with the question whether Britain should leave the EU.
I know a lot about Geece. This crisis was a crisis was first & foremost within the Euro zone. Again, not one of the EU. The onus was laid on the German tax payers to bail out the Greek banks. It is not an example of the Germans trying to rule the EU. The Greeks, who themselves have made it a national sport not to pay tax, this is the Greek people themselves. (For example, ever been to Greece and wonderd why so many houses are unfinished and still have the metal sticking out of the roof? Know why that is?) I love Greece, but I have no sympathy with the Greeks on this subject.
I'm sorry, your post is exactly the kind of thing that annoys me, it's full of bull shit! It's misleading and factually wrong to say the least. I don't want to get personal, but you are talking shit mate!!!!
To be fair you do believe in a German/Franco conspiracy to rule the EU. Boris Johnson even compared the EU to the Nazi's. All pretty xenophobic if you ask me.
This is encouraging.
We have a good idea what is happening if the Uk stays in the EU because we have the data. We have no idea what happens if the Uk leaves the EU.
Just yesterday a Brexit leaflet doing the rounds on Facebook. Just a couple of snippets - only positive thing is we get our fags cheaper if we Remain - if we leave we save the £55m a day we pay to the EU (distorting the facts again) it's £23m , ignoring what the other costs will be for the UK if it leaves and we get back our WTO place, UK have a place at the WTO as does the EU, just a list of these kind of things which the average person will believe and are blatantly untrue.
Few people are actually going to bother to do their own research and find out the truth.
Thus people will be voting on basically what they've decided to believe from whichever side has managed to sway them but totally unaware of any real facts and no clue what the future holds should the UK leave the EU.
And this is a major decision for the current and next generations, frightening.
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Exactly, Britain and the British are so uneuropean its untrue.
If they want to remain in the eu they should go in whole hogg, not just dip the toe in the European pool
That's just British inefficiency.
I commented to my brother last year that everything in the UK seems to be set up to be slow, supermarket checkouts, restaurant service etc
Are you being wilfully obtuse?
The present UK policy (albeit poorly executed) is to take refugees from the UN's facilities in Turkey, Lebanon and Jordan. Would it have been beyond the wit of Merkel or the EU to enact something similar, or were grand yet foolish gestures the only idea which sprang to mind?Unless German was going to suddenly beam them all up, Merkel's high-handed declaration could not but involve other EU states. How else were they going to get there after all? Not to mention the need for increased SAR, as the vessels of the traffickers sank in the Med?
These differences are fundamental, and beyond the scope of diplomats to alter. Such should be blindingly obvious by now, for the EU has moved further and further away from the trading entity Britain was comfortable with. If we were part of the single market and only that (with the option of migrant controls if numbers reach an unsustainably high point), i might well not be voting as i am.
Trade (w/o TTIP), yes. Environmental and consumer protections, yes. Science and energy, to very possible. Endless laws and government, No.
No taxes or harmonisation of such, no ECJ/EAW, no foreign policy department, no aspirations for an army, no parasitical and corrupt parliament, no flawed currency union, no overreach on agriculture e.t.c.
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Question: How many Syrian refugees has the UK resettled?
too many?
not enough?
Depends on your point of view but under the scheme designed to do so I understand that official statistics show that 1,337 people had been resettled in the UK under the scheme by the end of December 2015.
http://researchbriefings.parliament.uk/ResearchBriefing/Summary/SN06805
I have not seen more up to date stats - though the official line is 20,000 over a five year period
Also any Syrian people applying for asylum and or normal immigration outside of this specific scheme would not be counted to the best of my knolwedge
Thought it was something like that, less than a shipload that doesn't need to traverse Europe
How many Syrian refugees are there , something like 4.1million is one figure I've seen.
How many of these refugees were forced on the UK by being in the EU, zero
Labour MEP has a Gillian Duffy moment.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...anding-voter-racist-saying-never-come-is.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...anding-voter-racist-saying-never-come-is.html
And that's why Labour will continue to lose votes, either through people staying at home or opting for other parties.
Because they don't like racists or being caught saying they don't like racists?
But I thought the Referendum had nothing to do with party politics, how naïve can one get
Neither of those actually. Rather, it is the dismissive mindset of 'he/she is concerned about immigration, therefore they must be a horrible racist'. We've seen some of it in here, with accusations of xenophobia being being made against the pro-Brexit campaign. Admittedly, we don't have any quotes, but if the shadow minister cold cite racist remarks as justification there would be an apology. It's not unique to Labour either, Cameron has said the same thing about Tories who took their vote to UKIP in the GE.
Politicians talk about engaging with the issue, yet for the most part they just ignore it.
Is immigration either as serious or negative as voters believe? No, not in the sweeping way that some interpret it. However, that answer also applies to those people who people who believe unmanaged immigration is entirely a good thing, and requiring no government intervention (or modest controls).
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Well I think you're jumping the gun there assuming that nothing racist was said in the first place, given reportedly he was discussing the 'Polish' neighbours and 'spongers' I'd wager he did.
I accept your general point about Labour but using this case is a bit agenda driven. It's as important to accept the majority of the immigration debate has elements of racism than ignore it.
It was an old white guy in rural Derbyshire. You can almost guarantee it was racist.
is that not bordering on racist its self
More a reflection that people express 'concerns about immigration' every day without the people they're talking to threatening never to visit an entire village again (not that thats a rational response).
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