It’s a myth that defenders need to be quick to play in a high line. It stems from basic surface level analysis like “ball come in over top, defender run fast to recover” when actually playing in a high line is more about a compact coaching set up. Our new manager himself had success playing with Blind and De Ligt in the Champions League. Hummels looked world class in a Klopp team. City regularly play Laporte and Stones, and even put up 100 points while playing with Otamendi for two thirds of the season. These are all slow defenders and there are countless examples.
ESPN: Man United want evolution, not revolution under Erik ten Hag - sources
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yes. Much as i love him, last summer with ronaldo, did we just see his name and the commercials and the feel good factor and the fact he might join city and knee jerk sign him, or did we genuinely think at that time it would be the best thing for our system to sign a static no.9 who will score goals if we get him the ball in the box? And donny - why did we sign him? He obviously had no place in our plans tactically so why bother?
signings going forward need to be based around what attributes we want from what position in the manager system.
Defenders don’t need to be “quick” as for top speed or acceleration, but they definitely need to be capable of dealing with fast attacker at high defence line to stop opponents counter during their attack break. Maguire is very poor at defending against with fast attacker with space, especially with his slow turn of body and often easily exposed by pace in high defence line. He is better when we are defending deep and compact though, like when he is playing for England.
IMO, for the next 2 years Man united players and fans should avoid media and its garbage articles. The media doesn’t want our club to be successful and don’t want us to compete against City or Pool because of their love with Klopp, Pep, lego pep..
The Arsenal match was a good example for this media hate. Any other team on receiving end of those blatant decisions, we would’ve seen media screaming and running headlines as robbed but nothing for us.
Another example is, media trying to sell us Rice for 150m but theoretically we can get Paulinha and Tochouameni for the same price and there would be some money left.
I expect the likes of rashford and few others will stay due to contract situation and continue their leaks to media in the first season. So, we might play terribly in the first season and slowly pick up in the second season if ETH is given time.
The Arsenal match was a good example for this media hate. Any other team on receiving end of those blatant decisions, we would’ve seen media screaming and running headlines as robbed but nothing for us.
Another example is, media trying to sell us Rice for 150m but theoretically we can get Paulinha and Tochouameni for the same price and there would be some money left.
I expect the likes of rashford and few others will stay due to contract situation and continue their leaks to media in the first season. So, we might play terribly in the first season and slowly pick up in the second season if ETH is given time.
I'm sorry but if Timber comes he's not going to be a development guy. At the very least he's starting at RB unless we signed someone else as well, and quite possibly he'd be one of our better CBs / DMs too.
Possession football is the style and direction the team plays, not the possession of football they achieve.
Yes. Well said.
Probably. But he is only 20 and this was his first season as a starter/2nd all together. The jump from the Eredivisie to the prem is a big one. But our options suck so probably.
So you mean possession for possession sake. Who said ETH is going to play LVG football?
Liverpool this season are not a a possession team but have 63% possession whereas City a possession team has 68%.
So are you trying to say Ronaldo can't play in a side that keeps 68% possession?
How many times had timber played as RB this year?
I made no comment about Ronaldo.
No I mean the focus on possession and how to use it against your opponent. It does dictate a lot of how you pick players, Barcelona and City are good examples, they focus more on technical ability, agility, short passing, and being able to play in tight spaces more than other teams.
the original post was Ronaldo not being able to play in a possession team.
A possession team can be described in many ways like you mention.
Pep plays a false 9, he has played that at barca and City whereas Ajax have played with Haller who is a 9. I cannot accept someone saying Ronaldo cannot play in a Ten Hag system when Haller is scoring goals.
Does it matter? He's clearly a better footballer than AWB and Dalot.
You really think we've hired a new manager to make one signing? I know we're not going to sign 10 new players but feck me
I hope in 25 new signings, but we are under glazers, you know.
Well I guess it depends. I do not think he would be able to add much value to the possession part of it, but obviously he could to the goal scoring side of it.
Well, yes, it does matter.
up to 10 first teamers need to be replaced, the scouting system, the medic departement, the fitness and physio departement, the analytic departement ALL need to be completely overhaul but yeah sure we dont want revolution because it would upset "the hierarchy". this club is something else.
Be honest have you ever heard his name before this season? cause i havent. i checked his stats since people suddenly talking about him here, wiki say his height is 179 cm, another small CB is exactly what we dont need. Also the gap of Eredivisie and PL is so BIG, saying this kid better than Dalot and AWB is trully premature, he could be another flavour of the month like so many young talented players linked to us in the past.
Be honest have you ever heard his name before this season? cause i havent. i checked his stats since people suddenly talking about him here, wiki say his height is 179 cm, another small CB is exactly what we dont need. Also the gap of Eredivisie and PL is so BIG, saying this kid better than Dalot and AWB is trully premature, he could be another flavour of the month like so many young talented players linked to us in the past.
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I mean I was never any under illusions. We're not getting rid of the players that aren't out of contract and we're not signing a new team when barely anyone is leaving other than those out of contract.
It's gonna be 3-4 players this summer, 3-4 next etc. and we've got to move out the right players at the same time. A striker, a right winger and two centre midfielders should be the priorities this time around. Hopefully we add a bit more to the squad by blooding the likes of Mejbri, Garner and Garnacho.
It's gonna be 3-4 players this summer, 3-4 next etc. and we've got to move out the right players at the same time. A striker, a right winger and two centre midfielders should be the priorities this time around. Hopefully we add a bit more to the squad by blooding the likes of Mejbri, Garner and Garnacho.
This year was just not our year. It was noticeable early on and if not for Ronaldo's goals... our goal tally is abysmal.
This squad is not a winning squad in its current form. They dont know how to win or what it takes.
I can and will blame the players but with the understanding that 3 managers/ caretakers in a year is too much for anybody to try and get a handle of.
With our current squad we have bits and pieces ... but not a finished product.
Pogba - A complimentary player that plays to the level of the effort around him. He will not do it himself and instead feeds off of the players around him. He has strength and talent but seems to lack desire and consistent effort.
Rashford - Given too much too soon. Covid and his huger campaign coupled with the missed Penalty at Europa and the off season surgery have mentally tired him. He has lost his way and this is a critical spot for a footballer. Can he right the ship or has he peaked? Another club is the safer option for Rashford unless he can fully commit himself to football and not the ancillary side gigs.
Matic - Getting up in age and his legs are going away. He cant play more than 2 games in a row and that is stretching it. Plays great one game and the next game is a turn over machine.
Mata - A very likable guy that has outstayed his time at the club. Still has the "it" factor but should be showcased at a smaller club or in MLS.
Greenwood - Gone
Jones - I give him an A for effort, but another player that has stayed too long at the club.
Martial - started with a bang and finished with a fizzle. I love his ability to dribble around people and other than Sancho seems to be the best with the ball at his feet. I love his potential, but i question his work ethic and desire. That would be a coaches decision, but to me could be a bench player for united.
Baily - Love his intensity, but he is accident prone and seems to make a lot of careless mistakes. I would prefer intelligence over athletic ability from time to time when defending.
Cavanni - Last year I loved the guy, this year I feel as if he is not even in our club. Its almost like United said to him, "you did so well last year, take this season off with pay"!"
Shaw - I want to like Shaw. When he broke his leg, he became a sentimental favorite to me, but this year has made me realize that he is just too inconsistent to be a starter. Another squad player but doesnt appeal to me as a starter.
Telles - Potential but as time goes on.. I am leading more towards a squad player and nothing more
Bissaka - Depending on how we are going to play... this guy is such a wild card. Great defense but horrendous with offense. He slows our attack and really doesnt seem to offer much.
Mcguire - Got a ton of flack this season, but he is to blame for some of it. Shouldnt be our captain, but in defense is asked to play further up the pitch exposing his pace issue.
That is a ton of players on our squad now that very well could be gone next year. Ten Hag has his work cut out for him, but getting rid of some of the dead weight is the starting block.
This squad is not a winning squad in its current form. They dont know how to win or what it takes.
I can and will blame the players but with the understanding that 3 managers/ caretakers in a year is too much for anybody to try and get a handle of.
With our current squad we have bits and pieces ... but not a finished product.
Pogba - A complimentary player that plays to the level of the effort around him. He will not do it himself and instead feeds off of the players around him. He has strength and talent but seems to lack desire and consistent effort.
Rashford - Given too much too soon. Covid and his huger campaign coupled with the missed Penalty at Europa and the off season surgery have mentally tired him. He has lost his way and this is a critical spot for a footballer. Can he right the ship or has he peaked? Another club is the safer option for Rashford unless he can fully commit himself to football and not the ancillary side gigs.
Matic - Getting up in age and his legs are going away. He cant play more than 2 games in a row and that is stretching it. Plays great one game and the next game is a turn over machine.
Mata - A very likable guy that has outstayed his time at the club. Still has the "it" factor but should be showcased at a smaller club or in MLS.
Greenwood - Gone
Jones - I give him an A for effort, but another player that has stayed too long at the club.
Martial - started with a bang and finished with a fizzle. I love his ability to dribble around people and other than Sancho seems to be the best with the ball at his feet. I love his potential, but i question his work ethic and desire. That would be a coaches decision, but to me could be a bench player for united.
Baily - Love his intensity, but he is accident prone and seems to make a lot of careless mistakes. I would prefer intelligence over athletic ability from time to time when defending.
Cavanni - Last year I loved the guy, this year I feel as if he is not even in our club. Its almost like United said to him, "you did so well last year, take this season off with pay"!"
Shaw - I want to like Shaw. When he broke his leg, he became a sentimental favorite to me, but this year has made me realize that he is just too inconsistent to be a starter. Another squad player but doesnt appeal to me as a starter.
Telles - Potential but as time goes on.. I am leading more towards a squad player and nothing more
Bissaka - Depending on how we are going to play... this guy is such a wild card. Great defense but horrendous with offense. He slows our attack and really doesnt seem to offer much.
Mcguire - Got a ton of flack this season, but he is to blame for some of it. Shouldnt be our captain, but in defense is asked to play further up the pitch exposing his pace issue.
That is a ton of players on our squad now that very well could be gone next year. Ten Hag has his work cut out for him, but getting rid of some of the dead weight is the starting block.
This whatabouttery isn't helping you. You were talking out of your ass when you wrote he cannot play in a possession based system, and painted him as a liability as if he is in mould of Lukaku/Benteke with a bad touch and non-existent passing. He's scored goals under pretty much every manager, regardless of what kind of system they are playing. He is that good and adaptable, which was the original point.
That's what you were called out on. "Hindrance" to a possession based team
If you presented your argument that it'd be a short-term approach given his age, then that has more weight. But, Ronaldo at his age is still very dangerous around the box and can score plenty goals, if a functional system is put in place where a lot of chances can be generated, then the eventual transition from Ronaldo to next CF would be easier. This is basically what van Basten was saying, that you build your attack around him, so rest of the team is already functional and in-tune with the managers philosophy in attack and you can phase him out after next season.
I don't think a simple evolution is enough to fix this bag of shite....
Evolve from shite to what? Slightly less putrid shite?
Evolve from shite to what? Slightly less putrid shite?
If this is true then we might as well bin him off now.
We need at least six players, probably more.
What a bunch of wankers.
We need at least six players, probably more.
What a bunch of wankers.
We all feel like that now but it's amazing what a new manager, coaching team and captain can do for a team.
These players are much better than what we've been seeing. The season just needs to be put to bed and move on.
Him? Like ETH? This sounds like it's the Glazers imperative
Yes, Ten Hag. If all he’s getting is three players then he’s fecked.
I had the same line of thinking but Jesus look at this guys ,they're done, this is their level. Even klopp had to revamp the whole thing and and they weren't this shit.
How many players do you genuinely think have a future here, hell one of our best performers this season might not have one because he's shit with his feet.
When old man who are on their last playing season are your best performers, you need to get worried.
It very difficult to recover from everything that's happened this season. It's been an absolute shambles there's no denying it. I still think we will see a reaction from a few of them under Ten Hag.
Top coaches and coaching teams will find a way to make it work. Not all of them will recover but I think a good chunk of them will.
The season effectively finished when we decided to not appoint a proper manager but an interim one. Ralf never stood a chance as the players haven't bought into him. He's also not really changed anything as he's had no authority.
I hope you're right but its just so hard to recover from such things.
They're damaged goods at this point, you simply can't lose 5_0 to pool at home and suddenly become a winner , they're sullied , the mentality isn't there , it wasn't there even in our last season when we finished second.
Some of the players might stick around and find success but our core definitely needs to be revamped .
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It does matter
A- RB and CB are not the same role especially in today's football were the FB role had evolved into one of the most important roles in football. Trent Alexander Arnold and Robinson are 2nd-3rd top assist men in the EPL while Reece James has as many assists as Bruno Fernandes
B- Timber will be needed as CB. Varane is injury prone, Maguire is shit, Lindelof is meah while Bailly and Jones are on their way out (hopefully)
On other words dont expect.any challenges for any cup or title any time soon. An excuse for mediocrity.
Great, if he ended up at CB so be it. But if he didn't then he's miles better than AWB and Dalot.
So what ? every FB in the PL is better than them, doesnt mean we should just go for something that is better. We need fullbacks with potensial to be the better ones in PL and that fits in with Ten Hags vision.
If he's good enough to be first choice RB now and he has the potential to be first choice there or anywhere else in the team in future then it doesn't matter. Games now at RB, games wherever in the future.
"New players" could easily mean "newly integrated players" which includes some of the Academy lot.
I think 3/4 new players that are paid for this summer alongside the addition of the aforementioned academy players, with the 10/11 outs that are expected is a sufficient foundation to move forward with.
The squad is bloated AND crap, we can fix one of those quite easily, the other won't be fixed in a summer.
I think 3/4 new players that are paid for this summer alongside the addition of the aforementioned academy players, with the 10/11 outs that are expected is a sufficient foundation to move forward with.
The squad is bloated AND crap, we can fix one of those quite easily, the other won't be fixed in a summer.
The same team finished 2nd last year and topped the table in comeback points won. Even if you bring up Liverpools injuries, they're still good enough to finish ahead of Chelsea this year. What you see right now is a total lack of structure, tactics, and identity. Rangnick was literally brought in to steady the ship and limp to the finish line. With an actual manager and a defined playing style we will see them playing to their level again.
This same team lost to pool when it very well could have stopped them from qualifying to Europe and potentially not adding another cl to their name, it failed to at least keep the pace with city and push them a bi and it also failed to beat vila real.
How much can you lose before it becomes ingrained in your mentality, even if they had potential its gone by now, the mentality won't ever return, look at martial he can't even be bothered to put a shift in sevila who are very well run.
Fergie took 6 years to get rid of all the dead meat our team had back then , hag may need to do the same.
May be you need to take into account about no fans in the stadium. This could be one of the main reason we finished 2nd last season because fans weren't allowed in the stadium which helps us to stay unbeaten in away matches despite of worse home form. When there is pressure, they collapse.
I wonder if he still feels the same or not
We can evolve from 7th to 6th.
A revolution is what is needed.
A revolution is what is needed.
If its only 3 first team signings this summer United can feck of. Ten Hag are destined to fail as well then.