Erik ten Hag vs Sancho | Sancho back in full training

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I hope he can turns things around.

I'm glad ETH has done this, put the emphasis on Sancho to sort himself out once and for all or his career is going to nose dive quickly.
 
I doubt he will ever play another game for us again. Sancho has not achieved anything of note and yet he feels entitled enough to refute his manager’s assessment of his overall lack of effort
 
Of course Sancho's mental health will have taken a hit, he's just had a bust up with his manager and has been removed from the first team. He might be on a lot of money, but he is still a human being. The club have a duty of care to make sure he get's the help required, same way we would if he had a physical injury. With that said, none of this changes the situation at hand.

I'm also a little worried the way people are talking as if Sancho now coming out and apologising is some sort of "magic word" that erases his behaviour over the last month. Why would we want someone with his mentality at the club? If we sack ten Hag tomorrow, there should still be no way back for Sancho at United. He's exhibiting the exact rotten attitude that we have all been lamenting for the last 10 years.
 
Didn’t Dortmund have to physically pick him up for training every day?
Another Man-child in the mould of Lingard, Balotelli, et al
 
It’s not odd at all, they will always hate everything we do and want to paint us as the bad guys and see us fail.

They also want Ten Hag out because he’s the best Manchester we’ve had in ten years and arguably one of the best in world football.

It’s the same reason no one seems to give a shit how badly Chelsea are doing after spending a billion pounds in two seasons.

Aye, nobody gives a shit about Chelsea. Utd sells. Bad Utd news sells even nore because so many people love revelling in the turbulence surrounding the club.

I think they see him taking the hardline, for some reason see it as being unfair on the English players. It's Brexit journalism, can't have Johnny Foreigner insulting our lads, it's not on. Like when poor old Harry got an earful off Onana. If it were Dyche and Pickford doing these things they'd be lauded for being hard asses.

But you can almost guarantee these same journalists will have slated other players for downing tools and blame them for managers getting the sack. There's multiple levels to their hypocrisy.

This can only end with Sancho leaving, no doubt he'll end up being somewhat of a journeyman and we'll get the hard luck tell all interview in about 10 years.
 
Non of the mentioned players are wide options (prehaps Mount could do it). And it has already happened since we started the season with potential 5 wide players and now we have two and non of those absences happend due to injury

They're not ideal but the point is still better than Sancho there.

The absolute last thing this team needs is a Sancho type.

So to me this whole thing is a non event.
 
I agree that the manager should stamp his authority on this but that's why I think an immediate meeting would be best. Hag can find out exactly what Sancho's problem is, Sancho gets a chance to explain himself and then the boss decides what to do.
They've apparently had a meeting, but are on polar opposites here - i.e. deadlocked. EtH feels he is owed an apology, Sancho clearly doesn't believe he's a bad trainer plus he's already undermined the manager in public (after fairly innocuous comments from a boss who has previously supported you)....
 
Aye, nobody gives a shit about Chelsea. Utd sells. Bad Utd news sells even nore because so many people love revelling in the turbulence surrounding the club.

I think they see him taking the hardline, for some reason see it as being unfair on the English players. It's Brexit journalism, can't have Johnny Foreigner insulting our lads, it's not on. Like when poor old Harry got an earful off Onana. If it were Dyche and Pickford doing these things they'd be lauded for being hard asses.

But you can almost guarantee these same journalists will have slated other players for downing tools and blame them for managers getting the sack. There's multiple levels to their hypocrisy.

This can only end with Sancho leaving, no doubt he'll end up being somewhat of a journeyman and we'll get the hard luck tell all interview in about 10 years.

Can’t stand that Abramovitch/Boehly project but it’s not like there’s no stories at all:
https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...s-transfers-pochettino-brighton-b2418543.html
 
Given current issues I think it’s safe to assume that his mental issues last year were most likely not associated with depression as everyone had convinced themselves but rather attitude related. Not certain by any stretch of imagination but I think we’d be handling this differently now if he had indeed been suffering from deep depression a mere year ago.

Still find it curious that I was ridiculed endlessly for suggesting he should have been loaned out after 6-12 months to build back some confidence and also realize that he can’t take his position at the club for granted, and it basically turned out that this would have probably saved his career or at least given him a chance to fix a few issues.

I was never comfortable to discuss a player's mental issues on the CAF. The reasons to that are

a- its not my line of expertise
b- I have no direct contact with the guy
c- I am very aware that the club and players hire PR teams that can spin everything to oblivion. While there are genuine cases of mental issues out there I am also aware that are any things that can be buried under that tree including any player's attitude problems, the club trying to weasel itself out of a mess (ex spending silly money on the wrong type of player) etc.

The scope of my original argument was that this situation was unsustainable. A 250k-350k player is expected to perform. Failure to do that would lead to repercussions on every level from admin (who'll flag this as waste of money), right to management (a manager will have to rely on such player) right to the squad as a whole. As we learnt from the Sanchez mess no one likes to do double and triple the work for less pay.

Ultimately there are players who simply aren't suited to play for big clubs. The pressure to perform week in week out is simply not for them. Having said I think that ETH had tackled this brilliantly. He tried the disciplinarian approach, the arm on the shoulder approach and then the nudge in public approach. Its a shame that Sancho seem to refuse to respond to anything
 
Jose just complains about his players to make himself look better.
Repeat a lie a thousand times and it becomes the truth. Jose publicly moans to see a reaction from the player. His whole man management is confrontational. Does not work on current generation of players.
He is at Roma and not a top club is because his football tactics have become old. Not because he moans about his players at press meet.
 
Aye, nobody gives a shit about Chelsea. Utd sells. Bad Utd news sells even nore because so many people love revelling in the turbulence surrounding the club.

I think they see him taking the hardline, for some reason see it as being unfair on the English players. It's Brexit journalism, can't have Johnny Foreigner insulting our lads, it's not on. Like when poor old Harry got an earful off Onana. If it were Dyche and Pickford doing these things they'd be lauded for being hard asses.

But you can almost guarantee these same journalists will have slated other players for downing tools and blame them for managers getting the sack. There's multiple levels to their hypocrisy.

This can only end with Sancho leaving, no doubt he'll end up being somewhat of a journeyman and we'll get the hard luck tell all interview in about 10 years.

Any stories in the media supporting Sancho? Ive not seen any.

I think this ends with Sancho apologizing and him working his way back into the team. I hope that the reality of the situation has now sunk in with Sancho and Ten Hag's stance has taught him that he cant feck about with him.

Like it or not, his salary is a massive hit on our FFP balance sheet. It is not practical to just cut him or leave him in the reserves indefinitely.
 
If I kept turning up late/ missing days then proceeded to call out my manager on social media I'd fully expect to get the sack

It's annoying when we need every body ATM but ETH needs to use Sancho as an example, especially to all the young players, that after far too long there are now standards in place and player power no longer wins
 
Not sure if you’re trying to just be funny but it’s a bit of a woefully ignorant thing to say.

Perhaps. But there is a wider discussion to be had here.

For some folk mental health has turned into a weapon to be wielded in order to validate dogshit behaviour. I can’t help but think Sancho falls into that category. Not that he himself has mentioned mental health, of course. But plenty of others have.
 
I think this ends with Sancho apologizing and him working his way back into the team. I hope that the reality of the situation has now sunk in with Sancho and Ten Hag's stance has taught him that he cant feck about with him.

He might apologise at some point but his career here is over regardless.

It was over even before any of this.
 
We only think there is a "mental health" issue because ETH, who's not a native English speaker said, "Sometimes there are circumstances with fitness and mood. We got a drop of level and sometimes you don't know why or what is causing it. That is what we're doing now to try to get him back there. It's a combination of physical but also mentally."

My sense is that he wasn't talking about Sancho's "mental health" in the medical sense, he was talking about his attitude, mentality, motivation, focus etc. The sorts of thing sports psychologists deal with.

No, I was specifically speaking in relation to video game addiction and oversleeping.
 
At the end of the day, if in my own daily job/workplace, I turned up late constantly, and put in half a shift when i did... Then I would be very very lucky to have a job. And additionally, if after a receiving a warning, I went online to a media source and badmouthed my employers/ superiors, then I prob def wouldnt have a job.

Ten Hag has managed this the best he could really. Sancho is just coming across as an entitled man child in the whole situation. His attitude is coming across pretty bad, add to it hows he's allegedly on fifa at 3am then showing up late for training, its all his own fault really.
 
The equivalences people are making with other industries are pretty much pointless given how unique football is.

How many other industries have the level of publicity? Where else will you find a scenario where employees are earning considerably more than their manager? Player power arguably surpasses all other forms of employee power in this country.
 
Perhaps. But there is a wider discussion to be had here.

For some folk mental health has turned into a weapon to be wielded in order to validate dogshit behaviour. I can’t help but think Sancho falls into that category. Not that he himself has mentioned mental health, of course. But plenty of others have.
That is some heavy metal surrealist punk poetry that bolded part is.
 
Jadon hasn't really managed to perform outside of the Bundesliga, so he should look for a move back to Germany.

Strangely he has never really impressed with England either and international football is dogshit.
 
He might apologise at some point but his career here is over regardless.

It was over even before any of this.

Maybe it is over. But both Ten Hag and the club have reason to get him back into the fold.

They have to get him off the wage bill somehow. Getting him playing to at least show clubs that there is a player in there somewhere, is the only way to do it. Wont be easy because even without this latest episode, there are next to no clubs that would take on his wages.
 
Any stories in the media supporting Sancho? Ive not seen any.

I think this ends with Sancho apologizing and him working his way back into the team. I hope that the reality of the situation has now sunk in with Sancho and Ten Hag's stance has taught him that he cant feck about with him.

Like it or not, his salary is a massive hit on our FFP balance sheet. It is not practical to just cut him or leave him in the reserves indefinitely.

I don't think so.

I think he's done here.

It's what he deserves.
 
I was never comfortable to discuss a player's mental issues on the CAF. The reasons to that are

a- its not my line of expertise
b- I have no direct contact with the guy
c- I am very aware that the club and players hire PR teams that can spin everything to oblivion. While there are genuine cases of mental issues out there I am also aware that are any things that can be buried under that tree including any player's attitude problems, the club trying to weasel itself out of a mess (ex spending silly money on the wrong type of player) etc.

The scope of my original argument was that this situation was unsustainable. A 250k-350k player is expected to perform. Failure to do that would lead to repercussions on every level from admin (who'll flag this as waste of money), right to management (a manager will have to rely on such player) right to the squad as a whole. As we learnt from the Sanchez mess no one likes to do double and triple the work for less pay.

Ultimately there are players who simply aren't suited to play for big clubs. The pressure to perform week in week out is simply not for them. Having said I think that ETH had tackled this brilliantly. He tried the disciplinarian approach, the arm on the shoulder approach and then the nudge in public approach. Its a shame that Sancho seem to refuse to respond to anything
I think this is one of the most reasoned posts of the thread.
This is like saying you are sick of all these muscular injuries because we are not Hamstringchester United.
Hamstringchester United - Samaritanchester City 3-1 a.e.t.
 
Ten Hag should be picking up the phone to his Ajax pals. Loaning him to Ajax may be a way for him to find some form again.

The way Ajax are going, they could use the help.

At this point, its about showing that Sancho can still play football, in the hope that there is a club out there daft enough to take on his wages. Forget getting a big transfer fee for him. He will be harder to shift that Maguire and McTominay combined.
 
Christ, imagine we payed the 120m that dortmund were asking for him a year before we actually got him.

Not that 70m makes it any better, but still.
 
I don't think so.

I think he's done here.

It's what he deserves.

What does "done here" look like?

United wont pay him off for the 4 years left on his contract and there is no suiters out there for him to move to.

Does "done here" mean he trains with the reserves until his contract expires?

I bet you Sancho apologies and in the next month or so, we see him play for the first team.
 
I think he's joking.

He's not & the Daniel Harris understands thing is some weird shit he always does for some reason but yeah he's not joking about the reason, whether it's true or not feck knows
 
Jadon hasn't really managed to perform outside of the Bundesliga, so he should look for a move back to Germany.

Strangely he has never really impressed with England either and international football is dogshit.
They're not interested

 
I hope he can turns things around.

I'm glad ETH has done this, put the emphasis on Sancho to sort himself out once and for all or his career is going to nose dive quickly.

Turn things around? He should be ruthlessly sold as soon as possible.
 
Ten Hag should be picking up the phone to his Ajax pals. Loaning him to Ajax may be a way for him to find some form again.

The way Ajax are going, they could use the help.

At this point, its about showing that Sancho can still play football, in the hope that there is a club out there daft enough to take on his wages. Forget getting a big transfer fee for him. He will be harder to shift that Maguire and McTominay combined.

I am afraid that we're past that. Sancho doesn't trust anything that the manager throws at him and the manager won't risk his reputation at his former club to help out a player who is disrespectful towards his superiors and can't be arsed to train properly.

I know that its clique but United's biggest issue are the owners. Once the manager wants a player out then we need to have the people capable of finding this player a new club and the money to tank the expenses of getting him out. Some players might dig their heels up but most would leave if there's zero chance of them ever playing again. Take Maguire as an example. I very much doubt that he would have stayed at the club if we bought in Kim Min Jae instead of Evans. The thought of being frozen out of the squad for good would probably push Maguire out.

Since we don't have that then players know that all they have to do is to outlive the manager. Once the manager is gone then the usual 'clean sleet' mantra will probably kick in
 
Crossed my mind too...
It should also cross peoples minds that mental health is a serious thing. But being an arrogant brat who is unwilling to take responsibility is also a thing. A more common thing when you think about it.

We shouldn’t confuse the two or let the latter wear the mask of the former. Now I’m not saying anything about Sancho, but suddenly it seems every player that has a falling out with his coach, gets dropped, is playing crap etc has mental health issues. If that’s true and a diagnosis can be made then the common denominator is football. So it’s best they have their contracts terminated. Be given all the support they need by their clubs to get better and find future employment outside the game.
 
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