Erik ten Hag | 2024/25

[Judas]

How have we ended up in a position where we look so much better with a fit and healthy Eriksen than without him, and we have absolutely zero backup for him, or someone with his skill set of a younger age? What sort of squad building is that?

 

[Borys]

It appears in pre season (so I'm assuming that carries over, why else wouldn't it) that RvN took over the offensive part of our training. Melissa Reddy said this when she spent time watching our drills and had days with the team. That's why I'm crediting RvN for the way we are interchanging moreso. Maybe it's a team effort but he surely has good influence.

You didn't answer my question though.

We had the game under control and created enough changes in the first half (even despite Bruno trying to do his thing completely off sync with the rest of the team). Once Rashford and Hojlund entered the pitch, we apparently lost the groove and played very much like last season, bypassing the midfield and going long way too often, and played ping pong between the CBs a lot (without pushing the game forward). So the more difficult part of the game we somehow had under control, and yet somehow Palace picked themselves up in the later stages of the game. Why do you think that was?

So, back to the point on "coaching impact" - either only Eriksen Zirkzee Mainoo and Amad are soaking it up, or the improvement doesn't actually come from coaching and it's rather the players being able to play a different style than what ETH wanted to implement last season?

It's not a dig at you btw, just trying to figure out the impact of coaching 6 games into the season vs actually having better players.

 

[NewGlory]

How have we ended up in a position where we look so much better with a fit and healthy Eriksen than without him, and we have absolutely zero backup for him, or someone with his skill set of a younger age? What sort of squad building is that?

Do you love complaining just for the sake of it?

Eriksen plays the same role as Bruno and Mount. Except Mount is injured and Bruno is in bad form + Bruno loses balls all the time, while Eriksen doesn't. But from the perspective of squad playing the three can play same roles.

It's not that we don't have backup for Eriksen, it's that he is the backup! Bruno and Mount are ahead of him in packing order but not delivering

If Bruno was doing great, yesterday's midfield could have been Bruno-Mainoo-Ugarte

Also worth mentioning that Mainoo is not exactly tearing it up, as well. So Erik needed to add creativity and it was brilliant move from him to start Eriksen, since nobody thought it would work. It did.

If anything, Erik should have taken Bruno off in the second half but he didnt have the balls to do it

At the end of the day, with everything that could have been done, we didn't win yesterday mostly because we were not lucky. If any of those shots that hit woodwork went in, if Dean Henderson didn't make on of the saves, we could have been 2 or 3 up in the first half and it would have been over

Many of you dont realize how much football a tthe top level is about thin margins and how much luck can still play a role

 

[Judas]

Bruno is nothing like Eriksen. One knows how to control things and set the tempo, the other is literally always in a rush. How can you not see that? Eriksen being a back up to Bruno says how poorly managed the squad is. We simply look better with more control, control that Bruno doesn’t give us.

 

[Leftback99]

How have we ended up in a position where we look so much better with a fit and healthy Eriksen than without him, and we have absolutely zero backup for him, or someone with his skill set of a younger age? What sort of squad building is that?

I remember saying at the time what a disaster it was for us when Eriksen got injured, some didn't agree but truth is we've never been the same since. The fact that Ten Hag hasn't done anything about it in three transfer windows since says it all.

 

[crossy1686]

I do think its a bit rich to talk about fallacy when you claimed easy chances werent created, then you claimed we weren't set up correctly, and then backtracked on a different point again just yesterday.

I'm not sure why you're so obsessed with taking every discussion into the weeds, it's like you're desperate to move the discussion to something that you can spin as a positive or distract from the actual issues. You're in here again, after a shitty result, acting like Ten Hag's mother because we had a good 60 minutes of 'domination' against Crystal Palace, where we didn't score a goal but we won on xG, doing your best to gloss over a piss poor 30 minutes where we could have conceded at least one goal after Palace had the best chances of the game.

If this is good enough for you then I don't have anything else to say other than you deserve this. Whatever happens, you deserve it, it's on you. Just because your standards and expectations are on the floor doesn't mean the rest of us have to get down there with you.

 

[Zumbi]

We're both frustrated by our poor finishing, no doubt about that, but it seems a bit reductive to write off an excellent half due to poor finishing.

Still, perhaps we can agree that it's a promising sign that we put in such a dominant performance, poor finishing aside, away to a team that battered us last season?

That’s not reductive. It’s a recurring theme and it’s a huge problem that’s regularly costing us points. So again - not excellent in my view.

Yes, it was a big improvement on getting battered 4-0 by Palace. But again, how far hve our standards fallen!? Because a good half where we don’t score and then a frustrating half where we don’t score and give up big chances that could have lost us the game against a currently poor and 16th placed Palace side, is still so far off where we should be. We have much tougher tests coming up and several key aspects of that game do not give me confidence that we’re going to see the requisite improvement in results.

 

[Leftback99]

Do you love complaining just for the sake of it?

Eriksen plays the same role as Bruno and Mount. Except Mount is injured and Bruno is in bad form + Bruno loses balls all the time, while Eriksen doesn't. But from the perspective of squad playing the three can play same roles.

It's not that we don't have backup for Eriksen, it's that he is the backup! Bruno and Mount are ahead of him in packing order but not delivering

If Bruno was doing great, yesterday's midfield could have been Bruno-Mainoo-Ugarte

Also worth mentioning that Mainoo is not exactly tearing it up, as well. So Erik needed to add creativity and it was brilliant move from him to start Eriksen, since nobody thought it would work. It did.

If anything, Erik should have taken Bruno off in the second half but he didnt have the balls to do it

At the end of the day, with everything that could have been done, we didn't win yesterday mostly because we were not lucky. If any of those shots that hit woodwork went in, if Dean Henderson didn't make on of the saves, we could have been 2 or 3 up in the first half and it would have been over

Many of you dont realize how much football a tthe top level is about thin margins and how much luck can still play a role

I wonder whether some of you even watch us.

 

[CM]

The first half performance was a lot more encouraging but it's still concerning that we weren't able to make any of the chances count. It was poor game management in the second, we lost all momentum after the subs and Palace finished the match as the stronger team.

We shouldn't still be having these issues in season three with a manager who has been backed unconditionally.

 

[Zumbi]

This is the exact point I made to @Zumbi

The table is not conclusive after the first five games, but I never claimed it was? All I ever said was that results and points are always one of the relevant factors when assessing where we’re at. Points dropped in the first five games still count as points dropped.

 

[The Irish Connection]

Relax, we can qualify for CL by winning EL, no pressure. Forget about PL, it's for the ego.

Not sure if being serious or not.

 

[Olecurls99]

If this is good enough for you then I don't have anything else to say other than you deserve this. Whatever happens, you deserve it, it's on you.

This will be worth keeping if we do continue to improve.

 

[crossy1686]

This will be worth keeping if we do continue to improve.

There's always a caveat isn't there? If this, if that. The if never happens mate. Time to get real and stop living on hope.

 

[Shark]

This will be worth keeping if we do continue to improve.

He clearly said "if this is good enough" which would imply that if ETH started performing to the standard he's expecting, he wouldn't have any problems. I'm not sure why every post criticizing where we are currently as a club, has to used as some kind of "gotcha". It's just childish, we're all fans of the club here.

 

[King7Eric]

Do you love complaining just for the sake of it?

Eriksen plays the same role as Bruno and Mount. Except Mount is injured and Bruno is in bad form + Bruno loses balls all the time, while Eriksen doesn't. But from the perspective of squad playing the three can play same roles.

It's not that we don't have backup for Eriksen, it's that he is the backup! Bruno and Mount are ahead of him in packing order but not delivering

If Bruno was doing great, yesterday's midfield could have been Bruno-Mainoo-Ugarte

Also worth mentioning that Mainoo is not exactly tearing it up, as well. So Erik needed to add creativity and it was brilliant move from him to start Eriksen, since nobody thought it would work. It did.

If anything, Erik should have taken Bruno off in the second half but he didnt have the balls to do it

At the end of the day, with everything that could have been done, we didn't win yesterday mostly because we were not lucky. If any of those shots that hit woodwork went in, if Dean Henderson didn't make on of the saves, we could have been 2 or 3 up in the first half and it would have been over

Many of you dont realize how much football a tthe top level is about thin margins and how much luck can still play a role

Bruno, Mount and Eriksen play nothing like each other.

As for your last couple of paragraphs about luck, it's amazing how it only seems to adversely affect average teams. The whole point of being a top team is you should be able to overcome the opposing GK having a worldie and hitting the post, and still win the game!!

The whole frustration of the fan base stems from the fact that we are still nowhere near being a top team despite spending hundreds of millions and being in the 3rd season under Ten Hag.

 

[Leftback99]

There's always a caveat isn't there? If this, if that. The if never happens mate. Time to get real and stop living on hope.

I think this is why many are clinging on defending the indefensible, desperate for their "I told you so" moment based on blind hope.

If we did we the league we'd all be delighted and no one would care who said what.

 

[Sarni]

The first half performance was a lot more encouraging but it's still concerning that we weren't able to make any of the chances count. It was poor game management in the second, we lost all momentum after the subs and Palace finished the match as the stronger team.

We shouldn't still be having these issues in season three with a manager who has been backed unconditionally.

Yeah what it boils down to for me. Even if we were good in the first half, it’s still concerning that this was yet another of these games where we somehow managed to upend its flow by making subs that we could have easily predicted were going to do just that.

 

[AshRK]

I am usually not a fan of these tacticos but for eth to succeed he has to stick with what was produced for the first 45 mins. Results will follow.

 

[Olecurls99]

He clearly said "if this is good enough" which would imply that if ETH started performing to the standard he's expecting, he wouldn't have any problems. I'm not sure why every post criticizing where we are currently as a club, has to used as some kind of "gotcha". It's just childish, we're all fans of the club here.

He said 'whatever happens he'll deserve it'. I just thought it would be quite funny if we did succeed and get back on top. Calm down. We're allowed have fun here.

 

[daba]

Spurs is a must win.

7 points in 5 matches..wow! High probability of 7 points in 7 matches if this continues...

A loss to Spurs would make Villa a must-win for ETH in my opinion. Lose both and I could see that being his end unfortunately.

 

[Sarni]

I am usually not a fan of these tacticos but for eth to succeed he has to stick with what was produced for the first 45 mins. Results will follow.

It kind of reminds me of how we were in awe with the first 30 minutes against Spurs last year, or first half against Wolves. I’d be inclined to wait a bit before getting too excited. Palace have been quite bad this season.

 

[Sarni]

A loss to Spurs would make Villa a must-win for ETH in my opinion. Lose both and I could see that being his end unfortunately.

We can lose both and he will be in no danger. He’s already done enough in between international breaks to feel safe.

 

[Zumbi]

This is another reason why my broader point to the poster was that looking at the PL table is bollocks. Palace are obviously not a harder opponent than Everton - they've had a troublesome start but are a stubborn side and chronic game raisers in performances - having got a point at Stamford Bridge the game before Leicester. Theyve also strengthened in areas whilst losing certain players (I think Anderson hurt them more, and they are adapting to it).

My point is, fixtures vs Fulham (H), Brighton (A), Liverpool (H) and Palace (A) is a harder set than Leicester (H), Everton (A), a weakened Arsenal side (H), and Brentford (A).

And we sit on the same points. We cannot say Spurs are fecking better than us. Their performances leave a lot more to be desired and theve had the same points. They might take off and we might implode, or the vice versa, its far too early to claim shit right now from games where the sample size of tested teams is too small.

I’m still not sure how you you missed the actual point so badly in that whole back and forth. Because the point wasn’t about the table, even though it was referenced.

The point was that based on our seasons so far, expecting us to beat Spurs didn’t seem that well founded. That the game could go either way, because it’s hard to be confident in either team’s results given what they’ve shown so far this season.

 

[diarm]

I am usually not a fan of these tacticos but for eth to succeed he has to stick with what was produced for the first 45 mins. Results will follow.

He can be whatever he wants tactically but it’ll mean feck all of he can’t motivate footballers to execute his tactics.

Yesterday proved once and for all that he isn’t capable of the levels of man management needed for a job of this size.

He doesn’t understand his players and what makes them tick. All the fancy formations and instructions in the world can’t cover for that inability.

 

[NewGlory]

Bruno, Mount and Eriksen play nothing like each other.

As for your last couple of paragraphs about luck, it's amazing how it only seems to adversely affect average teams. The whole point of being a top team is you should be able to overcome the opposing GK having a worldie and hitting the post, and still win the game!!

The whole frustration of the fan base stems from the fact that we are still nowhere near being a top team despite spending hundreds of millions and being in the 3rd season under Ten Hag.

Wrong. Luck does not affect just average teams. Citu, Madrid, and Liverpool are all losing some games they dominate in but dont have luck. It happens to everybody. The difference us - they dont have shitty games and we do

Of the 5 games we played only yesterday we were inlucky in, in other games we were just shitty

 

[Longshanks]

Spurs and villa might be the end for ETH we shall see.

I don't have alot of faith is us getting a positive result out of either game, but you never know and I really hope I'm wrong and am surprised, but I can't see it.

Spurs at home might be ok, spurs don't have a great record at Old Trafford, but I think Villa away will be a horrible experience for us all.

 

[The Hilton]

That’s not reductive. It’s a recurring theme and it’s a huge problem that’s regularly costing us points. So again - not excellent in my view.

Yes, it was a big improvement on getting battered 4-0 by Palace. But again, how far hve our standards fallen!? Because a good half where we don’t score and then a frustrating half where we don’t score and give up big chances that could have lost us the game against a currently poor and 16th placed Palace side, is still so far off where we should be. We have much tougher tests coming up and several key aspects of that game do not give me confidence that we’re going to see the requisite improvement in results.

Of course our standards have fallen, we've spent over a decade in the wilderness due to mismanagement and a complete lack of any foresight.

We're far off where we should be, but it's undeniably an improvement that we were so dominant against a team that battered us at the end of last season. Can we keep that rate of improvement up? That remains to be seen.

 

[CM]

A loss to Spurs would make Villa a must-win for ETH in my opinion. Lose both and I could see that being his end unfortunately.

Why would it be unfortunate? Losses to both would mean consecutive seasons of failure.

 

[Andy_Cole]

Aren't we at home against Chelsea. Chelsea away is later in the season. And we'll whoop their arses both home and away.

My mistake - Chelsea’s got a 100% away record. Ugh.

 

[Bocca9978]

A loss to Spurs would make Villa a must-win for ETH in my opinion. Lose both and I could see that being his end unfortunately.

There’s no unfortunately about it, if we do indeed lose another two games this early in the season.
Unbelievable records being set by Erik every season.

 

[AshRK]

It kind of reminds me of how we were in awe with the first 30 minutes against Spurs last year, or first half against Wolves. I’d be inclined to wait a bit before getting too excited. Palace have been quite bad this season.

It is not about getting excited but if we continue to stick to the performance like in the last 3 games then results will follow. This is not to say we are some world-class side but I did see some encouraging signs. Of course it could all lead to nothing if we resort to same old like last season.

 

[NLunited]

Based on xG created and big chances created, it’s hard to argue Ten Hag is doing badly.

 

[Zumbi]

Of course our standards have fallen, we've spent over a decade in the wilderness due to mismanagement and a complete lack of any foresight.

We're far off where we should be, but it's undeniably an improvement that we were so dominant against a team that battered us at the end of last season. Can we keep that rate of improvement up? That remains to be seen.

Just to be clear, overall, our results have not improved so far this season. We’re currently on a lower average points per game ratio than last season, despite having a fairly generous start to the season.

Yes, our performances and play have improved in some aspects. I am incredibly sceptical the improvements will result in the dramatically improved results we need for Ten Hag to stay in position. I think he has too many flaws and we’ll still end up too far off the pace under him.

 

[Olecurls99]

Should be looking for 2 wins at home against Tottenham and Brentford and a draw away to Villa. 14 from 8 games would be something to work with. Considering we would have had tough games away to Villa, Brighton, Palace and Liverpool at home it would be acceptable once we kick on from it.

2 losses in the next 3 and he would rightly be looking at the door.

 

[Zumbi]

Based on xG created and big chances created, it’s hard to argue Ten Hag is doing badly.

Based on goals scored, matches won and points gained, it’s hard to argue Ten Hag is doing well.

Which of those metrics are ultimately more important in football?

 

[Malone_Post]

Based on xG created and big chances created, it’s hard to argue Ten Hag is doing badly.

And back in the real world, based on results, league position, goal difference & point tally…he’s doing very badly.

This 45 minutes against palace in a 0-0 draw is going to be the new 45 minute against spurs isn’t it? Just the latest desperate reach for the ETH crowd to cling onto. We played well for a half, in a match we didn’t even win, against a winless, 16th placed Palace team. This must mean, after two & a half years, ETH is finally onto something.

 

[Apokalips]

I often wonder about Ten Hag's motivational skills and his standards being low, as I don't feel like we ever see much of a reaction to poor performances on the pitch. Most top teams hate losing and go into the next game with a level of fire to win that we do not have in our next match after a drab performance or loss. The fact that we have people rating yesterday's performance and result is testament to our severe drop in standards. I feel like I am on a Palace forum at times with the way people here seem content with Ten Hag's tenure, I can't see how anyone can have even an ounce of excitement for our future under Ten Hag as he has not shown us anything to be excited about.

 

[Top_Bins]

It's not good when you're looking at games against Spurs and villa and hoping to get draws from them. Our squad is easily as good if not better than both, yet the uncertainty over how we will play says so much about our lack of identity these days. To his credit, we are more of a blank slate and our squad could be adaptable to a new manager.

 

[UnofficialDevil]

And back in the real world, based on results, league position, goal difference & point tally…he’s doing very badly.

This 45 minutes against palace in a 0-0 draw is going to be the new 45 minute against spurs isn’t it? Just the latest desperate reach for the ETH crowd to cling onto. We played well for a half, in a match we didn’t even win, against a winless, 16th placed Palace team. This must mean, after two & a half years, ETH is finally onto something.

Also, we had 500m worth of players on our bench, and Palace sold their best player from last year.

 

[mu4c_20le]

This is the exact point I made to @Zumbi

You did not just quote a Sarni special and say thats what you meant