Lets be honest he needs to do quite a few wins on the bounce with convincing performances. I don't think a potential good W against Southampton will ease the pressure. He needs to do it vs them + Palace and make a statement against Spurs/Chelsea/Villa.
Erik ten Hag | 2024/25 | Sacked
- Thread starter Cheimoon
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Yes that run by Mainoo was odd. It must be instruction because if you see Mainoo losing the ball for 3rd goal, Collyer was standing where i would assume a Left forward would be standing
And I can see ten Hag simply talking his way out of trouble as he tends to do.
Ten Hag invited it by his initial response, asking the journalist to explain the mistakes United make regularly.
you watch that video for the first couple of minutes and you notice two things right off the bat....at least i did
1. I hate how for some reason EtH has the CB's going into the middle of the pitch YET the fullback doesn't drop into a deeper position to create a third CB ESPECIALLY when the Winger has stepped inside to press
2a. The CM's never or rarely receive on the half turn.....which leads to 2b. the CM rarely play one touch negative diagonal bounce passes after pulling in the defender for the CB or CM partner to play forward
These are two clear staples of being able to play out of the back...Liverpool's press honestly wasn't great. It was organized, yes. Had some intensity, Yes. They left easy gaps to play into but our CM's just were so poor on the ball with how they received and our CB's were in too much of a hurry to play forward and rarely recycled the ball once Liverpool jumped the press high.
I agree that Collyer's introduction had messy instructions. He was clearly instructed to go join the attack like McTominay was.
Broadly speaking though, Mainoo and Casemiro have been holding the fort together with less isolation - this was seen vs Fulham and Brighton and credited as a positive change by pundits.
I think the squad is actually pretty decent so I'm optimistic once this joker fecks off we'll improve quite quickly. Sooner the better.
If you wanted to keep him after the cup final but want him to go after yesterday, then I'm sorry but you are stupid. Nothing has changed that should alter your position. We lost to a better team yesterday because they have a very good midfield and we don't. It's pretty much that simple. ETH was not the one handling summer recruitment.
I really hope he doesn't refuse to play Ugarte and/or play him in the wrong role as self-sabotage to spite INEOS for signing a player he didn't want.
The video goes in quite a deep analysis. I suggest that you see it if you've got the time
Wilcox won't stand for that.
Ashworth it would be no?
I thought Wilcox was ETH's immediate boss. I can't keep up though so I'll defer to you.
Same. Anyone who ETH genuinely wanted has mostly been rubbish. Martinez and Hojilund the only exceptions, but even at that there's question marks. Antony, Anrabat, Eriksen, Mount, Onana, Weghorst and Malacia all found wanting for one reason or another. Zirzkee looking questionable early on also.
Yea. Why would it be Wilcox? It most probably will be Ashworth and Berrada.
Nope. I'm looking forward to seeing how Ugarte and Yoro do when they're both available as I think they're good signings but that's it.
Nah it would be Dan, he's the sporting director.
What does Wilcox do then?
Technical director
So the chain of command is Ashworth on top, Wilcox in the middle and Ten Hag at the bottom?
But we knew that after 2 seasons. That's the whole point, it's nothing new. Should this be acceptable? Surely not, that's why Ineos talked to other managers last season even after the cup win.
I don't think Wilcox is between Ashwort and Ten Hag. Ashworth is ETH's boss and Omar Berrarda is Dan Ashworth's boss. Wilcox branches off from Ashworth in a slightly different remit.
Ashworth himself described himself as the centre of a wheel with the spokes coming off it.
I watched it up to the Collyer bit and didn't see where Mainoo left casemiro completely isolated. There are times where there's a wider gap between the two vertically but mainoo is still in his own half, and Casemiro can play safer passes when he chose not to.
Wondering if Ineos has been in meetings today. Should swallow their pride and pull the plug.
You would hope they’re having a crisis meeting and sounding out replacements during the break.
feck no. Was out with the family yesterday and didn't even rush home for the match. Missed the first 20 minutes and didn't give a flying feck.
Though tbh, it's been this way since Fergie left barring some spells here-and-there. At one point under Ole, I genuinely enjoyed watching us. Early days Jose was interesting, and ETH had us playing well for a brief period in his first season.
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I see. A new concept for United than. I hope it works.
Very true, I made a similar point.
After the Brighton game I was pissed at all the players/coaches for not concentrating for 2 extra mins...that stupidity turns the Liverpool game into a far more difficult match. Which has now created a media frenzy for the next 2 weeks.
Will any of them learn? don't hold your breath.
I'm also baffled at how they kept him but it's no my team so now I want to see how long are they gonna keep this lunacy going on.
United will officially announce their plans to build a new stadium at the end of 2024
I reckon they’ll tactically sack Ten Hag shortly before that, to take the news off the sacking a little. And so that the stadium announcement has a bit of a “building for the future” and “fresh start” feel about it
In the first half, Casemiro was the '1' in the 3-1 buildup. Sometimes Mainoo would join him to make it a 3-2, sometimes it would be one of the fullbacks(less so iirc).
In the second half, Mainoo became the '1', because we needed someone technically secure in that role. Collyer couldnt have been that player. Dalot would often invert to make that 3-2 shape :
Maz--MDL--Martinez
---Mainoo-Dalot
Something like this. Probably because Collyer was not trusted in the double pivot to keep the ball. I can see something similar with Ugarte/Casemiro from now onwards if ETH in sensible. Its also why I think our squad needed another midfielder comfortable in the first phase.
Never too late/early to rectify a mistake. It would show decisiveness regardless of what people think.
Subscribing to sunk cost fallacy would be the worst option here
ST Mary's is a bogey ground for us and the players will be under a lot of pressure plus we cant score goals, we have scored only 1 goal so far from 3 games and you dont win matches if you dont score goals.
Its funnier when it happens to other people (ie chelsea), but i totally get itI'm also baffled at how they kept him but it's no my team so now I want to see how long are they gonna keep this lunacy going on.
He's going to be the biggest mistake post Fergie. I said this last season but he's going to do more damage than any of our other managers and we'll waste more time on him.
I think we played proper 4231.
There were two aspects yesterday. One is the midfield was tasked to progress the ball more bravely (mainly Casemiro) and second is Liverpool were pressing our midfielders like crazy. The result was too obvious.
There's a universe in which we play 3 man midfield in those games to make sure we're not getting overrun, but this isn't the one we're living in. Still, even if we have 3 midfielders, I don't think we have any idea how to attack as a team, and Salah probably would squeeze in a goal anyway.
Like you said, Casemiro had other options to play the ball, but he chose not to play it safe. There's part of Casemiro and part of the coaching aspect there.
Who do you think has the upper hand here? Is the management or the manager? One party is hired by the owner to run the club and is here to stay and the other had a lifeline thrown to him over the summer?
Southampton played a good brand of football in the championship last season. They've absolutely dominated possession in their first three games, don't be surprised if they do something against us.
INEOS have decided to back this guy. But they didn’t want to. This isn’t their man. I think they’d prefer their own guy but they decided to back him because there was no one suitable to take over. At the first possible chance they’ll get rid and bring in their own man. But it has to be someone who can play what they want and play with the squad we’ve currently got.
Someone quite sometime ago did a great post on it that clearly made the distinction between the two roles.
Of course I can’t find it now but basically it was saying the sporting director tends to have a broader, more strategic role, focusing on overall club development and recruitment.
The technical director is more involved in the specific technical and tactical elements of football operations once all those people are within the club.
So based on that it would be Ashworth pulling the trigger
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