Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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That you're right about. There is a lot of criticism toward him that pre dates United confirmation. Just took a look :lol:

The poll on ETH they had there, 30% had sack and 30% said wait until end of season to sack.
And people think its only United fans who are entitled...
 


If any of those 4 are given new deals then this is a really bad start for him. It would be similar to how all the England managers thought they could get Gerrard and Lampard to work together. Blind arrogance that they can do something others couldn't.
 
That you're right about. There is a lot of criticism toward him that pre dates United confirmation. Just took a look :lol:

The poll on ETH they had there, 30% had sack and 30% said wait until end of season to sack.

Tough crowd. :lol:
 
I'v seen numerous posters on Ajax forum acting indifferent, eager for a fresh start with a new manager and stating some ETH flaws but I haven't seen some major criticism.
Sour grapes in my opinion.

Ajax/United fans on this thread kind of acted the same when I asked them about how they felt.

Like it was not anything big they were losing.
 
Ajax/United fans on this thread kind of acted the same when I asked them about how they felt.

Like it was not anything big they were losing.
Not sure if thats worrying for us or if they dont recognize the good work he did.

They hadnt won a title for 5 years before he came right? So hes obviously done very well there. Looks like they have a gripe with his chosen players and lack of rotation.
 
Ajax fans are similar to Real Madrid fans, notoriously tough on their coaches and players and have specific standards which they expect to be met. Ten Hag can be a bit pragmatic at times and they don't like that, even though he's the most successful coach they've had in years. They like an idealistic coach who doesn't stray too far from Cruyffian principles. They loved Peter Bosz for this reason.
 
The bolded is not really true anymore. It was previously, but it's exactly the tradition Overmars broke with a couple of years ago in a bid to achieve a stronger presence in Europe for Ajax. Hence Ajax signing people like Tadic and Blind.

I also feel like you're cherry picking a bit the last few pages to hold things against Ten Hag, to make it seem that he's responsible for what doesn't go well and less for what does. I might be wrong, but I don't think this is entirely deserved by Ten Hag.
This is still true. Martinez, Alvarez, Kudus, Daramy, Antony, Neres, Marin, Kristensen, Wober as some more. All young players that were bought. Sure Tadic and Blind were bought for the experience, but most signings are still very young players.
I'm not cherrypicking to hold things against Ten Hag. People are posting blatant lies about Ten Hag, he wasn't responsible for signing players, Overmars was. Ten Hag asked for a few specific players over the years and those he got. But those players usually don't work out(Klaiber, Labyad etc). The way it worked at Ajax was that the manager could ask for a type of player he needed for the squad and then Overmars & team would find a player. NOT Ten Hag, there is no reason for a DoF if the manager still makes the signings, sure Ten Hag was consulted. But the way it works at Ajax is the DoF makes the signings and the board even needs to agree about the players, to make sure it fits the clubs philosophy.

And some people are suggesting that i'm only negative about Ten Hag because he's leaving and that's utter bullshit. I haven't posted that much about him here in the past, but some of the posts here are consistent with i'm saying since he agreed to go to United. He's just a bit to reluctant to use youth players and can't really sub to change a game. But when his tactics work, they reaaaaaaaaaally work. So not that much to worry about for United fans. There were quite a few things that annoyed Ajax fans, because Ajax fans have extra demands for managers/players that usually don't apply to fans of other clubs. For example, most people think Haller is doing a good job at Ajax because he scores many goals, but for most Ajax fans he's just not good enough. Ajax fans(and me included) are a bit elitist :lol:
 
Sounds snobbish to me .. "yes our CF scores lots but he doesn't deserve to play for Ajax"? If a manager makes a player look better than most people expected (top scorer in league, multiple CL goals), I view that as a positive. No-one who saw him at West Ham expected it.

He also said doesn't play enough youth.. I'm not saying he found these players (that's not his or any Ajax managers job) but playing Onana, De Ligt, VDB, FDJ (who'd all have been about what.. 18-21 in ETHs first season?) sounds like playing some youth to me. Your goalie, a CH and two midfielders (probably others I dont about).

Plays Haller "too old, not good enough". Plays young players "expected". There hasn't been a successful club in history who played all youth, even ours. Having a manager who gets a good balance and makes players look better than expected .... that sounds like a positive to me.

I never rate Ajax players to be as good as what lot of people think. This is why ETH got criticised when he lost to Benfica because people thought ETH had top players but in reality losing to Benfica is not big deal given the quality players he had is not that good. IMO Lot of their players are overachieved in performance due to ETH makes him looks good. It's like Cleverley played regularly at United in 12/13 to win the league doesn't mean he's good enough for United, it's just Sir Alex managed to get the best out of him. The same with ETH managed to get the best out of Haller but in reality just like Cleverley, he's not that good.
 
EtH won't play a youth player unless he believes said youth player will contribute to the team at first team level. And that is according to the Ajax fans who run the 'We talk Ajax' YouTube channel.

And I agree with the above, which will hopefully see us steer clear from the mistakes of the past imo. We should want the best young players to be given a opportunity in the first team with a view to adding to the collective and not to make up numbers.
 
EtH won't play a youth player unless he believes said youth player will contribute to the team at first team level. And that is according to the Ajax fans who run the 'We talk Ajax' YouTube channel.

And I agree with the above, which will hopefully see us steer clear from the mistakes of the past imo. We should want the best young players to be given a opportunity in the first team with a view to adding to the collective and not to make up numbers.

The key thing for me is not that he calls up more, or less youth players, but that he has the right discerning eye on those in his setup. Calling up for calling up sake isn't helpful. So whereas he might be more reluctant to use youth players in general, he might also be less reluctant to inhibit youth players minutes if they fit his playing profile and have the requisite abilities.
 
Which coach who manages a club that is expected to challenge for titles consistently plays youth all that regularly, its a luxury that can't be afforded, sure, when someone special comes along he'll be utilized but no way can we do it the LVG way that simply won't work because like LVG youths only Rashford and Lingard went on to have a decent career at United.
 
Ten Hag is giving the youth players a chance as much as Guardiola does at City.. Make of that whatever you want. First priority of both managers is winning not development of players. If a player is ready to go into the first team straight away like Foden he will be played. Otherwise will stay at the bench.

Agree 100%.
We are MUFC, not Ajax or Southampton.
Smaller clubs develop youth and put those players on display so big clubs can come and buy them for big money. This helps balance the books of smaller clubs.
We are not a smaller club so don't need to do this. We can buy young players when they are on the cusp of becoming top class. PSG did this with Mbappe. We did it with Shaw. MCFC did this with Stones.
If we were winning multiple trophies per season, I'd begin to prioritise youth development, but right now we can't win a trophy if our lives depended upon it, so trophies need to be prioritised.
 
EtH won't play a youth player unless he believes said youth player will contribute to the team at first team level. And that is according to the Ajax fans who run the 'We talk Ajax' YouTube channel.

And I agree with the above, which will hopefully see us steer clear from the mistakes of the past imo. We should want the best young players to be given a opportunity in the first team with a view to adding to the collective and not to make up numbers.
None of our managers bar Van Gaal even played youth players that much. I don't really see why this would be an issue. Greenwood was always going to play under any manager, no one else really has come through apart from Scott and that seems largely to be because our club forgot you can buy defensive a midfielder so there are no other options.
How many times have the fans been frustrated with our lineups in league cup or other meaningless games because we put out a team with experienced squad players rather than a young player?
 
Can see the headlines now.

When we lose: Erik Ten Drag.
When we negotiate for a player: Erik Ten Haggle

When he's snapped smoking a cigarette outside a restaurant: Erik Ten Fag
When a page 3 celebrity claims she managed to bed him and leaks the story to The S*n: Erik Ten Shag

We could go on...
 
What's going on? This was meant to be the universally agreed upon appointment of a manager everyone regarded as being on the up. Now I'm seeing they've struggled in all their recent games and that Ajax supporters wanted to sack him!? You can already see people saying we should never have signed him for these reasons when things turn badly, a bit like Jose.
 
What's going on? This was meant to be the universally agreed upon appointment of a manager everyone regarded as being on the up. Now I'm seeing they've struggled in all their recent games and that Ajax supporters wanted to sack him!? You can already see people saying we should never have signed him for these reasons when things turn badly, a bit like Jose.

Nothing changed. He was never getting sacked if United didn't go for him, let's be serious here.

Their level dropped but he was getting more of his squad than their normal level in the 1st half of the season, this was bound to happen sooner or later. They are still unbeaten in the league in their last 7 games.
 
What's going on? This was meant to be the universally agreed upon appointment of a manager everyone regarded as being on the up. Now I'm seeing they've struggled in all their recent games and that Ajax supporters wanted to sack him!? You can already see people saying we should never have signed him for these reasons when things turn badly, a bit like Jose.
It's a risky appointment that may or may not work out, particularly in the short term. No one is a sure thing. Anyone expecting it to be smooth sailing from here on is likely to be disappointed.
 
It's a risky appointment that may or may not work out, particularly in the short term. No one is a sure thing. Anyone expecting it to be smooth sailing from here on is likely to be disappointed.
While true, we seem to go in circles. If a man can unify or if people are unified in their perceptions and expectations then good. It's likely that the whole "standards have fallen" thing will be brought up once again, prematurely, or even unfair criticisms when things are going well is to be expected. One things for sure, the media loop wont stop with regards to their Man Utd tactics. It's just about what the manager can do within the club, and how the fans react to the media negativity and how one will effect the other.

Moyes did bad - SAF's fault. Van Gaal did bad - Moyes set us back. Mourinho did bad - Van Gaal's fault. Ole did bad - Mourinho set us back. Ragnick did bad - Ole set us back. Erik Ten Hag comes in... Ole set us back heavily, that's no excuse this guy isn't any better.

The only thing Ten Hag has going for him is that he has the profile of a long term manager. Van Gaal was supposed to do a longterm rebuild, in a short timeframe with blockbuster signings by Ed with a point to prove after failing Moyes. Shitshow. Mourinho was an appointment in a way of giving up on that project, by a quick fix premise based on the promise of short term success. Shitshow. Ole sort of prolonged our events with the same core players that Mourinho had and got fired pretty quickly after several failed transfer windows and signing on players instead of completing a rebuild. The top management is the one consistent thing here, and a manager can't really do much to alter this trajectory as he'll get marginalised and fired before heads begin to roll above him.

If Ten Hag works out, it has to be due to changes above him. If he doesn't work out, i refuse to believe it's because he is just so horrible. It's the trajectory we're on and it can't be changed by one man alone yo.
 
The only thing Ten Hag has going for him is that he has the profile of a long term manager.

No. The main thing he has going for him is being an expert in coaching high press football, the most successful tactical approach of the last ten years. In retrospect none of those other managers could have finished higher than second simply because their football was outdated. That's become increasingly obvious over time to the point even our board realises it.

But to succeed we need the whole structure of the club to be in tune with that style of play. He can't do it on his own.
 
No. The main thing he has going for him is being an expert in coaching high press football, the most successful tactical approach of the last ten years. In retrospect none of those other managers could have finished higher than second simply because their football was outdated. That's become increasingly obvious over time to the point even our board realises it.
Being an expert helps, if that's an accurate claim but as I said he can't do it alone. Not sure him being perceived as an expert right now is something that will protect him from being judged unfairly based on lack of improvement or success within a certain timeframe? I think it's much more likely that the perception of him will change before that, and it could even be before he realistically could have done any real changes. Really, any discussable weakness is enough to create reasonable doubt, and for that to build it doesn't take much. Especially if the majority of people have the basic instinct of blaming the manager as a digestible way to explain things.

So again, the only thing he has going for him is that he has a longterm profile, so the majority of people might be more lenient with him in terms of accepting undesirable results for a longer time. Without that people wont change their expectations and any credibility he has from management could be teared down in the new climate a lot quicker than he can prove himself in it.

And to reiterate @Leftback99 's comment, it's a risky appointment because even if he gets 10 years, he MIGHT not even be the right guy. Thus me predicting comments like "Standards have dropped", because whether we like it or not any manager taking over this club need time to change anything and that's something we seemingly have a hard time of understanding. If he doesn't do anything in 3 years it might prove he is terrible, it might not have anything to do with him and more to do with Man Utd's trajectory. He might do something great in his 5th year, he might never be good enough. He will be judged within a timeframe and I predict he wont stay if he doesn't win anything within that, despite his expertise, resume or if he is actually building something great. Unless people are seeing it, or we all become very trusting towards that longterm idea without any proof it will pay off, he will see no more time in the job than other managers and leave on no better terms.
 
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Ajax/United fans on this thread kind of acted the same when I asked them about how they felt.

Like it was not anything big they were losing.

Just like many thought when SAF left.
Maximum 2-3 years of readjusting and back to winning ways... :lol:
 
He is not here to give us a quick success. Even pep and klopp started slowly. Our fans have to be patient. I am happy playing in europa. Will give him good opportunity to implement his style. I hope he gets to do his stuff and not have a tiff with the board or media.
 
If any of those 4 are given new deals then this is a really bad start for him. It would be similar to how all the England managers thought they could get Gerrard and Lampard to work together. Blind arrogance that they can do something others couldn't.

I dont think Mata is much worse than the others tbh and Cavani is alright. Lingard and Pogba should be thrown out of the door and/or window though.
 
Am just having a wee giggle at the Dailly Mirror, here is a snippet...

Erik ten Hag's phone call snub with Ralf Rangnick emerges as Man Utd told to "sever ties"

Erik ten Hag has not picked up the phone to call Ralf Rangnick since being appointed Manchester United boss.

The Dutchman will arrive at Old Trafford in the summer to succeed Rangnick who will move into a consultancy role, as well taking the Austria job, following his spell as interim manager.

Rangnick's decision to juggle his position at United with the Austria job has been heavily scrutinised which has thrown doubt over how much influence he will have at the club. United have seemingly distanced itself from Rangnick and it appears Ten Hag has followed suit as he hasn't picked up the phone to call him despite having the 63-year-old's number.

Source: https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/erik-ten-hag-manutd-rangnick-26846414

First and foremost it is important that Erik shows respect to his current team, Ajax... he should be concentrating 100% on them.

I would be disappointed if Erik was on the phone to Ralf now concentrating on next season rather than finishing his current job, that would show a lack of loyalty to his employer and that's not a trait I want our manager to have.

If Chris Doyle things this is Erik snubbing Ralf, then I imagine he thinks Richarlison tried to murder Everton fans by throwing a flare into them yesterday.
 
The others who have echoed those sentiments are Ajaxsuarez and ajaxcunian I think.

I'm not agreeing with any of this, I'm just pointing out several others have said it.

Also I'd rather not have to defend SAF's usage of youth against a manager who hasn't reported for work. It's becoming way too common on here for people to say SAF had all the flaws of whomever is the present manager. Mostly because it's rarely ever true. SAF blooded youth a lot. League cup games were academy players and reserves till we got to the semifinals. He also always brought on young players when we had leads. Players like Jones and Smalling broke into our first team relatively quick. Not only did SAF play youth liberally he was an adventurous risk taking nut who played them out of positions to help guide their development in weak areas. Players like Pogba and Rossi were absolutely not the norm in SAF's handling of youngsters.
Jones and Smalling was bought with (relatively) big money. SAF was always going to give them a chance.
Ferguson give them chances when there's very little risk in the result. That's not neither liberally no adventurous. I'd say he's a pragmatic in giving youth a chance. And to win titles like he did at United, that's the correct thing to do
 
We have to be realistic. We are most likely not winning EPL as long as Klopp and Pep are around. Plus with Newcastle getting unlimitted money, we are lucky if in 2 years we can comfortably always make top 4, since the 4th position may become what Chelsea, Arsenal and ourselves will start fighting for, not to mention Spurs.

ETH will hopefully save us from being the most inconsistent and embarrassing big club, but he is not a magician and I doubt he is Klopp or Pep level either (plus their clubs will continue to be run much better)
 
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