Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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OpenIntrovert said:
You have to understand that we don't have the players yet for completely dominating a possession heavy team like Liverpool. ETH has shown his influence in terms of the players chosen to start, the compact shape of the entire team and the mentality throughout the whole game. The key thing is that the players followed the instructions that he set and that was seen very well in this game.

As for style of football, it will be dependent on the players who have the attributes that ETH requires. It will take time for that to be implemented.
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I've said the same myself, we don’t have the players to produce the football ETH is known for.

But we have seen that performance from this team before, particularly in big games. I thought it was very similar to the 2-0 win against City in the rain.

To me it's premature to say it's an ETH thing when these players have produced that before.

Pogue Mahone said:
Against Liverpool? Or City? I can’t think of any. The only goals I can remember against them over the last few years were on the counter (and McT’s brilliant long ranger into an empty net)

Goal aside, in the opening spell we pressed high and aggressively. Trying to win the ball high up the pitch. Which all looked exactly like the type of football we were wanting/hoping to see under ETH.

Different story after we went ahead but that opening 15-20 minutes was very encouraging.
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I mean that was poor defending all round from Liverpool so I don't think it matters the name of the team in that sense. If Southampton defend like that next week, which I doubt, we'll be very happy.

But we scored a similar if not better goal in Ole's very first game.

I'm not criticising the team or ETH but we do this with every new manager. We see one thing on the pitch and all want to believe it's the magic of the new manager.

More likely the players just made the correct decisions for a moment. As any group will from time to time, especially if there's some talent there.

I'm not expecting ETH to have transormed the team yet. I've always believed you need the players no matter how good a manager you are.
 
We’ve seen these kinds of performances before yes, particularly in the latter stages of the match, but we did exhibit a better level of control in the first 30 mins than we have previously. We looked a lot more systematic with some of our passing.

Either way, its better to compare against where we were last season. A win against Liverpool has been pretty unthinkable for a long time, so full credit to ETH for getting a result (no matter how we achieved it)
 
There was a bit of Ole ball but there was much more of Ten Hag influence. The decision to drop Maguire and Ronaldo for starters shows he knows how he wants to play and the players needed to implement it and they implemented it. Our pressing was also easily more organised than under Ole. We were slightly more composed playing out from the back. It can only get better with the addition of new players
 
Soo many people are underestimating just how low the teams confidence was before the game.

arguably the lowest the club has been in what 30-40 years, huge pressure, fan protests etc. With all that in the backdrop, to then come out and put in that level of heart, desire and composure (when required) takes a lot of steel, more than I thought this team had.

some green shoots of recovery shown last night, and definitely something to build from.
 
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Glorio said:
No, but we were noticeably pressing Liverpool high up the pitch from the start. That's very different to "Ole Ball". Obviously as the game went on with us in the lead, we started dropping deeper and relying on the counter.

At times even in the second half, we still triggered a press - which surprised them.
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I don't remember saying ole ball. Sorry if someone else said it and it upset you
 
Marwood said:
I've said the same myself, we don’t have the players to produce the football ETH is known for.

But we have seen that performance from this team before, particularly in big games. I thought it was very similar to the 2-0 win against City in the rain.

To me it's premature to say it's an ETH thing when these players have produced that before.



I mean that was poor defending all round from Liverpool so I don't think it matters the name of the team in that sense. If Southampton defend like that next week, which I doubt, we'll be very happy.

But we scored a similar if not better goal in Ole's very first game.

I'm not criticising the team or ETH but we do this with every new manager. We see one thing on the pitch and all want to believe it's the magic of the new manager.

More likely the players just made the correct decisions for a moment. As any group will from time to time, especially if there's some talent there.

I'm not expecting ETH to have transormed the team yet. I've always believed you need the players no matter how good a manager you are.
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I dont think this is entirely true tbh. I remember we murdered City on the break when we beat them 2-0 (Martial, Shaw) at the Etihad. However, the pressing and link up play weren't as impressive as last night.

We looked assured. I cant think of a clear chance that we have Liverpool. Very solid core with a threat on the counter. Its been a while.
 
UpWithRivers said:
Is it though? It tells us we worked our arses off but also we couldn't keep hold of the ball. Not how effective the press was or how we did it. If we run 50 percent less but have 70 percent possession against Southampton and win is that not better?
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The running stats count presses and sprints. Go and look at a team like Citys running stats even when they dominate the ball.
 
Marwood said:
I've said the same myself, we don’t have the players to produce the football ETH is known for.

But we have seen that performance from this team before, particularly in big games. I thought it was very similar to the 2-0 win against City in the rain.

To me it's premature to say it's an ETH thing when these players have produced that before.



I mean that was poor defending all round from Liverpool so I don't think it matters the name of the team in that sense. If Southampton defend like that next week, which I doubt, we'll be very happy.

But we scored a similar if not better goal in Ole's very first game.

I'm not criticising the team or ETH but we do this with every new manager. We see one thing on the pitch and all want to believe it's the magic of the new manager.

More likely the players just made the correct decisions for a moment. As any group will from time to time, especially if there's some talent there.

I'm not expecting ETH to have transormed the team yet. I've always believed you need the players no matter how good a manager you are.
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Nobody is saying he’s transformed them. We’re just looking for early signs of his influence on the team. I mean, they were there in pre-season so it’s hardly outrageous to think we saw similar glimpses of the football he wants his team to play last night.

I agree that getting carried away under a new manager is a time honoured tradition and I think we’ll soon realise that Liverpool are in deep trouble and their incompetence was just as big a factor as anything we did. But, having said all that, Ten Haag definitely deserves credit for getting a team that felt as broken as we did, whose confidence must have been in their boots, to play with that much aggression and effort. And you also can’t ignore the quality of the football that led to our first goal. We’ve all seen the brilliant attacking football produced by his Ajax team, so it’s not a huge stretch to see some similarities when they’re there to be seen.
 
the pressing and transitions were more impressive than anything we managed under Ole, I thought

we’re obviously miles off but some promising signs.. the first major task is getting the mentality right

it’s gonna take us a fair bit of work until we can dominate the likes of Liverpool in possession, so I wouldn’t worry about that bit now
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Against Liverpool? Or City? I can’t think of any. The only goals I can remember against them over the last few years were on the counter (and McT’s brilliant long ranger into an empty net)

Goal aside, in the opening spell we pressed high and aggressively. Trying to win the ball high up the pitch. Which all looked exactly like the type of football we were wanting/hoping to see under ETH.

Different story after we went ahead but that opening 15-20 minutes was very encouraging.
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Yep, we could have been 2-3 up (Elanga hit the post, Rashford had a heavy'ish touch and Allisson just about came out and saved/smothered). Liverpool grew into the game after that but you could also see our players getting visibly tired/gassed. It would have been suicide trying to maintain that intensity in the second half. Pool would have had far too much space.

In fact, kudos to EtH for adapting his tactics to the players and to exploit Liverpools weaknesses against the counter, similar to what Palace did.

Great management and I am happy for EtH after the first two matches. Made some massive calls and got it all absolutely spot on.
 
With 'Ole's tactics' we were utterly humiliated 5 going on 10-0 by Liverpool. Erik just beat them 2-1 so even if he was using 'Ole's tactics' (he wasn't) he's better at them than Ole was!

Of all the stats doing the rounds, possession is the most useless one of the lot without context. All stats need context which is something number spouters dont/wont recognise.

Hopefully the six dropped points don't come back to haunt us but the Brighton and Brentford losses could be two of the best ever! They gave the constant underachievers the chance to hang themselves and they did just that. If Erik had just come in and dropped the likes of Maguire and Shaw then they would've been bleating about not being given a chance with their dressing room mates probably backing them up, causing an immediate manager/player divide. Now he can take the 'we tried it your way and look where that got us. It's my way from now on' approach. I think last night will prove to be a very important match for the club and not just because we got our first win of the season.
 
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UpWithRivers said:
I don't get this running statistics obsession. Is it a real measure of how you are playing? If you have less of the ball then you will run more chasing it. No? So do we want high possession or do we want high run stats. Obviously you want to work hard and obviously we were downing tools at times but just looking at run statistics tells you what exactly? What we need is 70 percent possession and high run stats for the 30 percent we don't have the ball. Non possession run stats would be a more accurate measure.
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This is nonsense. Most of the time Man City have 70% possession they’ve also outran teams and had higher sprint numbers. Just because you have the ball doesn’t mean you’re not running. You generally run more in possession, not less.

Once the defending team has reset, they generally just move yards forward back or sideways. The attacking team buzzes around looking to break the lines.

Obviously not an exact science as it depends what your possession looks like.
 
Simon Jordan having a go at Ten Hag for coming out for his post match interview too quickly, like he was revelling in it, and Liverpool were the best team after the first 20 minutes by far. After last night he thinks Ten Hag proved the job was too big for him.

It’s madness. Shows what this club is up against
 
cyberman said:
Simon Jordan having a go at Ten Hag for coming out for his post match interview too quickly, like he was revelling in it, and Liverpool were the best team after the first 20 minutes by far. After last night he thinks Ten Hag proved the job was too big for him.

It’s madness. Shows what this club is up against
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Why even listen to that nonsense - it's designed to wind up and get people calling in

Adrian Durham or whatever was the only semi decent wind up merchant they had cos he could actually argue even if it was nonsense - the rest crumble under any challenge and go back to the statement
 
ETH hauled the players in and had them each run the 13,8 km Brentford had run more than we did. Tactis aside it was a pleasure seeing United outrun a opponent for once...some deemed it navie for ETH to call them in last sunday for that runing session but he showed the players he would not stand for it and suddenly our players could work a lot harder. It shows the value of having a manager not afraid of setting standards and following through. Benching Ronaldo, Maguire and Shaw showed guts and we seemed to have a team on the field showing a strong team spirit as well.
 
LARulz said:
Why even listen to that nonsense - it's designed to wind up and get people calling in

Adrian Durham or whatever was the only semi decent wind up merchant they had cos he could actually argue even if it was nonsense - the rest crumble under any challenge and go back to the statement
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I have it on in the background to be honest. White looking well for his age I must say
 
ETH:

"It is not always about what I said. I said we have to act and not to talk a lot and make sure you are a team and battle and be brave and give each other options.

"I said to [the players] we have to act, not talk a lot. Make sure you are a team and battle and be brave. It's not only about spirit out of possession.

"Sometimes strikers think they cannot do it because they have to save their energy for offensive actions. Nowadays it's a demand and that is what you saw. It makes me happy Rashford and Sancho scored the goals.

"I am happy with the performance but we have to bring it every game. Don't just bring it against Liverpool. Every Premier League game is difficult, we need to bring it to every game. It starts, once again, with the spirit."
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Our players needed to hear this so much, he said it twice
 
He adapted to both our players and Liverpool style of play.

He'll get there, but it won't be overnight.
 
Black Adder said:
He adapted to both our players and Liverpool style of play.

He'll get there, but it won't be overnight.
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very true. very promising. especially given we won't be competing for the league this season, if he can do this in big games we have a good chance at cups. His best work at ajax was as a underdog
 
Glorio said:
ETH:



Our players needed to hear this so much, he said it twice
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With 5 subs, there is no excuse not to bust a gut running. If you are dead on your feet and can't finish the match, that's ok. Improve your fitness and in the meantime let the subs provide the fresh legs.
 
No coming back for Maguire and Ronaldo now.

Ronaldo will be pissed about game time because he is only still there to be ready for the World Cup.
 
cyberman said:
Simon Jordan having a go at Ten Hag for coming out for his post match interview too quickly, like he was revelling in it, and Liverpool were the best team after the first 20 minutes by far. After last night he thinks Ten Hag proved the job was too big for him.

It’s madness. Shows what this club is up against
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Even Gabby Agbonlahor thinks Simon Jordan is an idiot, and that's saying something :lol:
 
reelworld said:
:lol: no
Ole team never press like this and the composure and structure are different.
It's clear that we are much better coached this time
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I dont get how people are saying this is Ole Ball. Yes, we played a different style, but it was a style to beat Liverpool.

The second goal may be Ole ball counter attack but the first goal was Ten Hag Ball.

The ball in the channel, but Rashford unlike in previous seasons, would have crossed the ball in for the sake of it, instead pulled it back, Bruno found a very good pass and again Eriksen, instead of panic and looking for killer ball recycled it, went back to Lisandro and built up the one two.

That was Ten Hag ball, if the cross isnt on, recycle and try the other side.
 
cyberman said:
Simon Jordan having a go at Ten Hag for coming out for his post match interview too quickly, like he was revelling in it, and Liverpool were the best team after the first 20 minutes by far. After last night he thinks Ten Hag proved the job was too big for him.

It’s madness. Shows what this club is up against
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:lol:

Is he on the booze?
 
Pogue Mahone said:
I’m loving his handling of Ronaldo. Benched, whether he likes it or not. Early days but so important for a manager to show who’s the boss. Something that was sorely lacking in the way Ronaldo was managed last season.
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Ronaldo totally destroyed chemistry last season, and confidence in so many players (Bruno, Rashford, etc.), as well as the preferable playing style of so many other players. We were far from perfect back then, saddled with very questionable manager, but what Ronaldo did was simply toxic on so many levels. Ten Hag's make-or-break point was always going to be the handling of Madeira elephant in the room, i.e. benching him. I hoped we will get rid of him (and his 24 fecking goals) by now, but maybe benching him sends even bigger/better message to others, that they will be mercilessly discarded if they're not up to the standard.

Yesterday was an eye opener, even though we knew the players had this somewhere deep inside them. They needed the real leader, and Ten Hag may be the one. We talked about leaders on the pitch all the time, but we forget that we didn't have a proper leader on the bench since Sir Alex. They were all deeply flawed for United, with either inferiority (Moyes, Solskjaer) or superiority (Mourinho, Van Gaal) complex ruling over their actions. Ten Hag seems tough-but-fair type of general that we need maybe more than any particular player. It's now up to him to choose his leaders on the pitch to enforce spirit, discipline, character, and then style and flair a bit later in the process.

I think we'll be alright. And yesterday I thought we're fecked. Football, bloody hell!
 
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Few usual suspects are again at it, saying its all similar to Ole tenure and they're not seeing anything with ETH at the moment. Luckily, there are few of them.
 
Jordan_mufc said:
I dont think this is entirely true tbh. I remember we murdered City on the break when we beat them 2-0 (Martial, Shaw) at the Etihad. However, the pressing and link up play weren't as impressive as last night.

We looked assured. I cant think of a clear chance that we have Liverpool. Very solid core with a threat on the counter. Its been a while.
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If you watch Newcastle versus City 3-3. It is exactly how we need to play against City. No fear, press and outrun City players. Newcastle exploit Walker and we have Rashford and Garnacho to do that. If the players follow the gameplan we can beat City.
 
r0663664 said:
If you watch Newcastle versus City 3-3. It is exactly how we need to play against City. No fear, press and outrun City players. Newcastle exploit Walker and we have Rashford and Garnacho to do that. If the players follow the gameplan we can beat City.
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Agree
 
So happy for him. We now know we got a manager who know what he is doing. He will given more time to develop his play and squad.

We can fecking play good football at last!
 
Yes, 30% possession, but if that means we'll win against top 6 teams, and especially L'pool, I'll take that any day of the week. We'll see how they play against lesser opposition, but right now it's a massive confidence boost to everyone. And man has cojones to drop the Lazy 3 like that. We've been waiting on it for a long time and I'm extremely happy for Malacia and especially Martinez to show their worth.

One thing I liked as well was that we didnt look shaky after the 2-1 and the fact that the players made tactical fouls all over the pitch in injury time as well. There were many times last year where I had to clench my arse for 15 minutes, but we looked in control yesterday.

I'm confident though we can also beat Southampton the "good" way, playing attacking football. Having Martial back is huge for us (never thought I'd ever say that again) and he's got free real estate over Southampton, I don't recall him ever having a bad game against them.
 
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I think the first 30 minutes were more representative of how we want to play in the long term against the top sides. We faded physically and Liverpool controlled possession from that point. We're clearly not ready to dominate a game for 90mins against a side like Liverpool, so important that we showed we are capable of doing it for period while also be solid when transitioning to a more defensive/compact game later on.
 
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