Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

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Knightmare7 said:
Ecstatic about this. Next few years will probably my shape up like this if everything goes according to plan;

Year 1: Utter confusion. Starting XI at the beginning of the season likely very different from final match day starting XI as ETH explores who works and fits and works to impose his system (likely a 4-2-1-3 before shifting to his preferred 4-3-3). You’ll see wonky losses and things won’t often look fluid. Inconsistency will be common but there will be a plan, and the players will not look like they just don’t care. ETH will play with different tactics as he adjusts to the EPL. In a low stakes season, ETH’s experimentation will be welcome although many will think he’s out of his depth for going out on a limb with little on the line.
Year 2: Things start to make sense. There’s an established identity and ETH has quite a few players he really likes. The team has a defined playing style and they begin to accumulate results. They’re not world-beaters, but respectable on any given day. The team could go on a run for EFL or FA Cup, and the focus is top 4 football. ETH has mostly adapted his routine and his tactics to the EPL and this confidence is shared by a team that improves weekly.
Year 3: ETH has his team. The plan is in place, formations are drilled, and years of roster building have given him his ideal XI. The team competes as it should and challenges for the league or Champions League. However, United at this point are likely a team built around a strong XI and a super sub or two. The team can play, but the question is how far they go with whatever depth they have. Tactics are not so much the issue as filling in the edges to compete with the super teams (Madrid, Barca, Bayern, Liverpool, City). ETH likely drops a player everyone loves while simultaneously making a stunning signing that makes everyone clap and say ‘Yup that’s why we picked ‘em!’
Year 4-Forever: ETH has his men, a filled out bench, and the ability to rotate properly. Everything is on the table and United are competing for every bit of silverware. They combine a mixture of strong veterans in ETH’s system with youth who have come up being prepped to fit in and now United are in the proper business of flipping older players for cash and investing in promising youth to create a cycle of success. These are golden days


OR

It all comes crashing down after a year or so and we all head down to the pub for a pint and watch Liverpool/City win yet another league title while we wonder whether it’s worth living on this good earth any longer
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Great post. There are reasons to be optimistic.

I think year 1 will be about experiments, learning about the league, discovering a style, and understanding what to do and what not to do in games. We will be extremely inconsistent throughout. End of year one, we review what areas still need massive improvement. Sign 3-4 key players and go again in year 2.

Year 2 should be massive in many ways because by that time a lot would've changed. There would still be ups and downs, we would lose games we should've won, etc. But I would think that by end of year 2, we should know what the final pieces of the jigsaw are and expect to actually mount a title challenge in year 3 with the 1 or 2 correct signings. Most of the gaps should have been plugged by then. I'd imagine a decent 3rd place finish 10-12 points behind the winners in year 2.
 
Spark said:
I get it's a gamble, but feck me the one thing this club needs - and something everyone who watches United can surely agree on - is a total revolution in playing style. We have technically gifted players, but there is zero fire/fecks given when we lose 5-0 and 4-0 to Liverpool/2-0 and 4-1 to City. No bounce back, no nothing.

ETH might fail, but at least he's a coach with a clearly modern way of playing. If you want a manager who can get the best out of players previously considered not good enough for top clubs, ETH has previous - most recently Haller, but arguably Tadic and our own Daley Blind too. You could argue that Klopp has done similar with Liverpool (turning Robertson - as an example of many - into a truly world class defender).

The reason why it's a gamble is that currently United do not fit ETH. However, that's because we are a bunch of lazy useless cnuts who don't give a feck and ETH runs a team in Ajax who are ruthless. I'd much rather bring in a manger like ETH and give him free reign to pull the rug from under the feet of our useless twat of a team - much like Fergie in his first couple seasons - and see how we get on, rather than bring in a safer bet in Pochettino who hasn't really managed to do anything of note with PSG.
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Agree. We have taken the SAF option route, then the big name but past their best route, then the easy route, about time we took a real gamble.
 
sglowrider said:
Listening to the initial comments, its sounds like LVG re-visited. the level of details almost made the players' heads explode. Instead of praising them, LVG would go into detail on how they should improve themselves by correcting this mistake or that. The players felt that they were always under a microscope.

I worry that with our Gen Z players, I don't know if they can handle such levels of 'criticism' as opposed to 'analysis'.
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It’s absolutely nothing to do with Gen Z players or other nonsense. If the man management is atrocious as it clearly was with LvG and (and has been under Ralf) then you’re not going to get positive results.

If you frame the same message in a different way you can get thousands of times better results, it was ever thus. Boomers blaming everything on ‘kids these days’ ignore the fact that their parents and grandparents said the exact same thing about their generation going back and back and back.
 
RiqCantona said:
Great post. There are reasons to be optimistic.

I think year 1 will be about experiments, learning about the league, discovering a style, and understanding what to do and what not to do in games. We will be extremely inconsistent throughout. End of year one, we review what areas still need massive improvement. Sign 3-4 key players and go again in year 2.

Year 2 should be massive in many ways because by that time a lot would've changed. There would still be ups and downs, we would lose games we should've won, etc. But I would think that by end of year 2, we should know what the final pieces of the jigsaw are and expect to actually mount a title challenge in year 3 with the 1 or 2 correct signings. Most of the gaps should have been plugged by then. I'd imagine a decent 3rd place finish 10-12 points behind the winners in year 2.
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If they had any foresight, they'd listen to RR and they'd already know where to sign 3-4 key players. But, this is United so they won't.
 
Please, please! This is supposed to be a happy occasion! Let's not bicker and argue about who wanted who.
 
phelans shorts said:
It’s absolutely nothing to do with Gen Z players or other nonsense. If the man management is atrocious as it clearly was with LvG and (and has been under Ralf) then you’re not going to get positive results.

If you frame the same message in a different way you can get thousands of times better results, it was ever thus. Boomers blaming everything on ‘kids these days’ ignore the fact that their parents and grandparents said the exact same thing about their generation going back and back and back.
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Yes, there is always generation gaps. But in this context, your argument is that being and millionaire and global celebrity as a late teen has no effect. I'm not so sure.
 
Long Time Red said:
He thinks he can improve a lot of the squad according to the Guardian:

Erik ten Hag will not be backed with a lavish budget to rebuild Manchester United but will receive what the club regard as adequate funds to enhance a squad the new manager believes he can vastly improve with his coaching.

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...-hag-appointed-manchester-united-manager-ajax
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I hope he can, but this squad looks like it couldn't give a shit and if he can't get them playing will he be allowed to get rid of them?

Something tells me that rashford, Shaw, maguire...are just too important to the brand and will never be called out or culled.
 
sglowrider said:
Listening to the initial comments, its sounds like LVG re-visited. the level of details almost made the players' heads explode. Instead of praising them, LVG would go into detail on how they should improve themselves by correcting this mistake or that. The players felt that they were always under a microscope.

I worry that with our Gen Z players, I don't know if they can handle such levels of 'criticism' as opposed to 'analysis'.
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I will never understand these points. Older players also needed man-management and it wasn't rare for them to not be receptive to it. The way people are talking about generations you would think that former footballers were very professionals, had no egos and were receptive to all coaches.
 
Has this been shared yet? It’s a great read. Exciting stuff.

Erik ten Hag changes your club, your team, yourself. Your vision on football, on cooperation, on the importance of new methods, of professionalism.

You even get a new idea of your own qualities. I was an attacking midfielder for a long time but under him I became a centre-back. I was already 28. I became captain and gained so much more insight into the game – a whole new world opened up.
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moses said:
Yes, there is always generation gaps. But in this context, your argument is that being and millionaire and global celebrity as a late teen has no effect. I'm not so sure.
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So why hasn’t it had an effect at Liverpool? Or City? Or Chelsea (who in fact were much worse in the last generation)?

It’s a cop out for something that’s always been the same.

 
Ranchero said:
Lots of words. But no key experience in any top world league unlike Klopp before he went to Liverpool, Pep before City. Tuchel before Chelsea, Conte before Spurs.

Let's get real and not get all blinded by hope...It is a massive gamble as was Ole.
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I mean, if you can't get behind the new manager the day after his appointment... I have nothing to say. Its literally the least you could do as a supporter.
 
phelans shorts said:
It’s absolutely nothing to do with Gen Z players or other nonsense. If the man management is atrocious as it clearly was with LvG and (and has been under Ralf) then you’re not going to get positive results.

If you frame the same message in a different way you can get thousands of times better results, it was ever thus. Boomers blaming everything on ‘kids these days’ ignore the fact that their parents and grandparents said the exact same thing about their generation going back and back and back.
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Err...., you don't think the communication is different between the Gen Z versus Gen X, Y and The Boomers? There was a difference between the Internet natives versus Internet migrants. The social media set versus those who arent?

There profiles are quite different.
 
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JPRouve said:
I will never understand these points. Older players also needed man-management and it wasn't rare for them to not be receptive to it. The way people are talking about generations you would think that former footballers were very professionals, had no egos and were receptive to all coaches.
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Everyone needs man-management. The thing is that term itself is quite generic. How you communicate, approach them and motivate the different generations are quite different.
 
sglowrider said:
Err...., you don't think the communication is different between the Gen Z versus Gen X, Y and The Boomers? There was a difference between the Internet natives versus Internet migrants. The social media set versus those who arent?

There profiles are quite different.
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Who said there wasn’t a difference? Understanding that difference and being able to get a message across a broad spectrum is in fact the key aspect of man management.

Just because Louis Van Gaal was poor at man management it doesn’t mean that “Gen Z players can’t handle criticism”
 
sglowrider said:
Everyone needs man-management. The thing is that term itself is quite generic. How you communicate, approach them and motivate the different generations are quite different.
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But you said nothing here, that's true for all generations but also people from different background, cultures and ages within the same generation. You don't communicate with an 18 years old the way you will with a 30 years old, you don't communicate with a stubborn individual the way you will with someone that is open minded. That's what man-management entails, you are supposed to adapt your management to the people you are interacting with, you are not supposed to act as if everyone is the same and it's not a new concept that's as old as humanity.
 
phelans shorts said:
So why hasn’t it had an effect at Liverpool? Or City? Or Chelsea (who in fact were much worse in the last generation)?

It’s a cop out for something that’s always been the same.

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Just because it's not destroyed the whole of humanity doesn't mean it's not a factor. Fergie predicted it years ago.
 
Sky are so cringeworthy. They sent this guy out to Amsterdam 2 weeks ago only for Ajax to reject any British journalists so he had to stand on the road outside their stadium like a lemon. Now he’s back again.

 
JPRouve said:
I will never understand these points. Older players also needed man-management and it wasn't rare for them to not be receptive to it. The way people are talking about generations you would think that former footballers were very professionals, had no egos and were receptive to all coaches.
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Of course, they were arguably less professional, but throwing teen celebrity and huge largesse at kids does not necessarily make them more receptive students.
 
moses said:
Of course, they were arguably less professional, but throwing teen celebrity and huge largesse at kids does not necessarily make them more receptive students.
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But they are more receptive students and it's not even debatable. There is significantly more tactics, instructions and video sessions today than their used to be. If your argument is that they are not receptive students or less likely to be than you will have to bring something to the table.
 
Zoo said:
Sky are so cringeworthy. They sent this guy out to Amsterdam 2 weeks ago only for Ajax to reject any British journalists so he had to stand on the road outside their stadium like a lemon. Now he’s back again.

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That's brilliant.
 
JPRouve said:
But they are more receptive students and it's not even debatable. There is significantly more tactics, instructions and video sessions today than their used to be. If your argument is that they are not receptive students or less likely to be than you will have to bring something to the table.
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I'm basing it mainly on our group and the reports of how they greeted Ralf. And reportedly belittled him and according to him, ignore him.
 
Revaulx said:
It’s not unreasonable to expect things have changed. Ralf still on board, Murtough with actual power, analytics-based scouting and no Woodward should make the process more streamlined as well as more robust. Even if there are still delays getting sign-off from Florida, the main parts should involve a good deal more focus and less dithering.
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Time will tell my friend…
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Has this been shared yet? It’s a great read. Exciting stuff.
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This is what lot of people, maybe me included are missing too.


People keep saying this lot get him finished, but Ive no doubt he will get a tune out of the ones he will keep, he be properly coaching the players he wants to keep, re-educating them and building confidence.


Some speak like it's football manager, you need to buy whole new team or he doomed for next season this lot will finish him off.



I hoping he can turn rashford around, insane his drop of this season
 
Knightmare7 said:
Ecstatic about this. Next few years will probably my shape up like this if everything goes according to plan;

Year 1: Utter confusion. Starting XI at the beginning of the season likely very different from final match day starting XI as ETH explores who works and fits and works to impose his system (likely a 4-2-1-3 before shifting to his preferred 4-3-3). You’ll see wonky losses and things won’t often look fluid. Inconsistency will be common but there will be a plan, and the players will not look like they just don’t care. ETH will play with different tactics as he adjusts to the EPL. In a low stakes season, ETH’s experimentation will be welcome although many will think he’s out of his depth for going out on a limb with little on the line.
Year 2: Things start to make sense. There’s an established identity and ETH has quite a few players he really likes. The team has a defined playing style and they begin to accumulate results. They’re not world-beaters, but respectable on any given day. The team could go on a run for EFL or FA Cup, and the focus is top 4 football. ETH has mostly adapted his routine and his tactics to the EPL and this confidence is shared by a team that improves weekly.
Year 3: ETH has his team. The plan is in place, formations are drilled, and years of roster building have given him his ideal XI. The team competes as it should and challenges for the league or Champions League. However, United at this point are likely a team built around a strong XI and a super sub or two. The team can play, but the question is how far they go with whatever depth they have. Tactics are not so much the issue as filling in the edges to compete with the super teams (Madrid, Barca, Bayern, Liverpool, City). ETH likely drops a player everyone loves while simultaneously making a stunning signing that makes everyone clap and say ‘Yup that’s why we picked ‘em!’
Year 4-Forever: ETH has his men, a filled out bench, and the ability to rotate properly. Everything is on the table and United are competing for every bit of silverware. They combine a mixture of strong veterans in ETH’s system with youth who have come up being prepped to fit in and now United are in the proper business of flipping older players for cash and investing in promising youth to create a cycle of success. These are golden days


OR

It all comes crashing down after a year or so and we all head down to the pub for a pint and watch Liverpool/City win yet another league title while we wonder whether it’s worth living on this good earth any longer
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I'll be sure to cite this post when "he's not good enough/he's out of his depth/he's a Pep Guardiola is my idol" crowd crawl out of the woodwork a month into the season.

Also promote this guy already.
 
Escobar said:
My point was how can he say the dressing room when he has not spoken to all of them? Maybe one or the other dont like it, but thats not the dressing room. Thats why this tweet is pointless
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Of course he can. Just like in any workplace, it just takes one mole to expose everybody.
 
FrankDrebin said:
Please, please! This is supposed to be a happy occasion! Let's not bicker and argue about who wanted who.
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Thank you.

Can we all for once please just get behind the manager without any agendas or "This is why Poch would have been better" nonsense.
 
moses said:
I'm basing it mainly on our group and the reports of his they greeted Ralf.
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But surely you realize how problematic that is? You are generalizing an issue when you have little information about what is the issue, who are the players he was talking about, what is the actual context? In fact I will tell you something, if there is an issue that is widespread at United than the culprits are most likely the management team, the vast majority of our players come from other clubs where as far I know none of them had particular issues. So when that issue happens at United repeatedly with different groups of players than the issue is within United.

For me it's quite obvious that we mainly hired managers that weren't top managers or not at their top. And it's something that happens in all sports including the ones where athletes are not millionaires as teenagers and at all levels.
 
JPRouve said:
But surely you realize how problematic that is? You are generalizing an issue when you have little information about what is the issue, who are the players he was talking about, what is the actual context? In fact I will tell you something, if there is an issue that is widespread at United than the culprits are most likely the management team, the vast majority of our players come from other clubs where as far I know none of them had particular issues. So when that issue happens at United repeatedly with different groups of players than the issue is within United.

For me it's quite obvious that we mainly hired managers that weren't top managers or not at their top. And it's something that happens in all sports including the ones where athletes are not millionaires as teenagers and at all levels.
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I hope you are right.
 
Zoo said:
Sky are so cringeworthy. They sent this guy out to Amsterdam 2 weeks ago only for Ajax to reject any British journalists so he had to stand on the road outside their stadium like a lemon. Now he’s back again.

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:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

I love how he extends his arm towards Ten Hag with the mic as the car is speeding away.
 
Zoo said:
Sky are so cringeworthy. They sent this guy out to Amsterdam 2 weeks ago only for Ajax to reject any British journalists so he had to stand on the road outside their stadium like a lemon. Now he’s back again.
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:lol: I love that.

Erik looks awesome with those sunglasses too :drool:
 
Zoo said:
Sky are so cringeworthy. They sent this guy out to Amsterdam 2 weeks ago only for Ajax to reject any British journalists so he had to stand on the road outside their stadium like a lemon. Now he’s back again.

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That is a journalists job.
 
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