Do you really need me to explain the difference in circumstance between the two signings to you?
Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24
- Thread starter sewey89
- Start date
- Status
It's true that I think we have to temper what is actually possible with these players. Maybe nobody would do substantially better in terms of actually competing for major honours, almost certainly true in fact, but probably a stretch to imagine nobody could have done any better for example. He's just one man of many good managers, no reason to suspect he has done the best that is possible, especially in the league and our dire CL campaign. So his performance could well be somewhere in between.
The issue for me is he has done things and continues to do things which really hurt his credibility to say this is the main we go forward with. What would we grasp onto as an owner to feel confidence about that? For me saying "who are the other candidates" is not reason enough, I would want to know the reasons why ETH is to remain too, he can't survive by default.
Strange tactical setups despite the same consistent leaks in our game. Nonsensical handling of the press which doesn't lend him much credibility or authority, that stuff does matter as a figurehead for the club. Odd signings which while this won't be his primary responsibility going forward do raise questions about some of his judgement. A couple of years of treading water and the players hearing that same voice associated with it, it could well be that a new voice is sufficient enough justification. I think a new manager alongside new owners that have chosen him is better rationale versus same manager by default just because there isn't a candidate leaping off the page.
I don't know why some of our fans pretend this is the toughest job in football.
It isn't. There's such a leniency throughout the club(hopefully INEOS change this going forward) for poor performances/results.
If ETH was in charge of Real Madrid, Barcelona or Bayern this season and produced these results/performances, do you really think he wouldn't have been sacked?
Xavi won La Liga with Barcelona and Culers wanted him out. If ETH won the Premier League here at one point, people would give him a lifetime of support.
It isn't. There's such a leniency throughout the club(hopefully INEOS change this going forward) for poor performances/results.
If ETH was in charge of Real Madrid, Barcelona or Bayern this season and produced these results/performances, do you really think he wouldn't have been sacked?
Xavi won La Liga with Barcelona and Culers wanted him out. If ETH won the Premier League here at one point, people would give him a lifetime of support.
What was your point?
Was it that Klopp didn't have anything to do with VVD being so good because he was a sure thing at £80m?
Well I present Maguire as proof that isn't necessarily the case.
Indeed mate.
But yeah I must admit at the time I'd thought they'd went mad. Imagine paying £80m for a centreback and the subsequent embarrassment if he turned out to be not great or worse
Worst part is, Maguire cost fractionally more. In fact, early days, some on here convinced themselves Maguire was the better of the two.
Yes that perfectly sums up the transfer strategies of our previous 5 managers with the considerable control over trasnfers and finances to fund them they've been given post SAF.
Yeah and who gave them the control and the money? Look at the root cause...
No and the difference in circumstances wouldn't make your point any more valid anyway so no mate you're good.
Then you're biased and ignorant mate.
And no one is denying that, it's all linked and this is what we're pointing out. The Glazers regime has been an incompetent shit show, where virtually everything has been substandard.
So why do you think this circus has managed to hire a gem of a manager that deserves more time despite all available data this pointing towards him not being up to the task?
Especially when the last 4 managers it hired were also failures.
If we actually tried to play the sort of football we did in the first half, where we were actually calm and patient in possession for a change instead of hot potato chaos ball, he wouldn't be on the verge of the sack.
I am serious, yes. We all see football differently and I don’t understand you either which is fine as far as I’m concerned.
Putting the word “literally” in your post won’t suddenly confirm a great truth that the rest of us have been missing. In fact you literally missed the point. The circumstances I’m talking about are the availability and form of players this year, not last year or next year. Erik himself did better last year “literally”. And that’s the point - look at what he had to work with then vs now.
Who are you referring to?
Ironic as you are biased and ignorant to the evidence in front of you.
As well as deluded.
You are such a condescending poster. You always come across with an arrogant I'm always right attitude.
Talk to somebody else.
Don't have time for this nonsense mate, read over the conversation.
Add to the lack of goals that we have conceded 5 goals to championship sides in 2 games. Cant score, cant defend, cant pass. Theres nothing happening on the pitch thats remotely good enough. I genuinely think at this point that regardless of what INEOS do or who we sign, we just get more of this next season if he stays.
I think in the rush to want this to work out our fans are forgetting we basically had a new manager bounce that ended just after a league cup that we mainly won because we played pre Emery Villa, Burnley, Charlton, Forest and Newcastle rather than anything spectacular we did on the pitch. We’ve been a shambles since then. We’ve regressed to end of Ragnick era levels. We need to break back in to the top 4 now let alone talk about how we gain the consistency to try and get into the title race etc. 2 years and all that money for nothing. Back to zero
That's rich considering I'm responding to your rude post. You talk shit, get personal and then play the holier than thou when you get some back.
It's a tedious act.
You seem to be confusing me with somebody who wants ETH to stay.
Yeah, I agree there’s a lot of managers who could get a few more points with this bunch, but to me that’s not necessarily doing a better job. The job is to become the best. This is a huge task with multiple components. Whether we are getting 60 points or 65 is not going to tell us how “the job” (the real job) is going.
I asked a questing any you responded in an arrogant manner so I told you that you were being biased. Facts.
So you think no manager in the world would do better than ETH this season?
+1 GD in the league. +3 GD for the entire season. Last place in the CL group stages. Setting records for poor results by a English side in the CL group stages.
A team that got dominated by Brentford to such an extent that Brentford set records themselves for how dominant they were. Giving up a 3 goal lead vs Coventry. Humiliating home losses to Brighton and Bournemouth. 15th in xPTs.
And you think that's an acceptable job? Not just acceptable, but no manager in world football can apparently best those results/performances.
I mean how can anyone take this opinion serious? It's delusional.
First part of his interview with Wilcox went very well. If we win against Burnley we can’t possibly give up on him. I hope we will be quick to offer him a new deal or else he may walk.
What on earth how ETH shown you that he has the ability to manage us to be the best side in England?
Managers of that level never have seasons like this.
Oh you've changed your mind again, fair enough.
Excellent strategy.
I want each one of those fans sacked
Yeah, I agree there’s a lot of managers who could get a few more points with this bunch, but to me that’s not necessarily doing a better job. The job is to become the best. This is a huge task with multiple components. Whether we are getting 60 points or 65 is not going to tell us how “the job” (the real job) is going
Thanks but you’re wasting your time.
I'm really sorry if I upset you mate.Ah yes a very non arrogant and in no way condescending question
I'm very objective.
Great, so what have I said that contradicts a position of wanting ETH to go recently?
He's already threatened that and certainly won't walk into next season with only a year left on his contract. With Bayern geting desperate, I'm worried they might just pay the compensation and steal him from us.
No, you seemingly took offence to something that was not intended in any way to cause offence.
No it was you that got upset and got personal mate.
But I know the drill well.
Certainly think there's some truth in this. For whatever reason, be it panic for his own job, or whatever, we've not seen that style nearly as much as we thought we would.
I still think its far too little too late however.
You say you want him to go fair enough. But you are still arguing with people and trying to absolve Ten Hag of responsibility
Take their arm off for it.
People cant pretend that taking wins against 2 sides who are an automatic 3 points to any serious side is ‘turning it round’
I didn't take offence to it at all, you were the one who started throwing personal jibes mate because you got upset.
Maybe I get caught up in small details of things but I haven't changed my position.
I think it's inevitable that he goes and I fully expect him to.
I simply try to be objective and give my view but if you argue with someone that is ETH out then to most on here that automatically means you are defending him or being an apologist, which is just silly.
You can think he has got things right in some areas and very wrong in others and come to the conclusion that he isn't good enough overall. Which he probably isn't.
All the stuff about recruitment etc. is all hypothetical and we will never know if things would have been different had we made better, more informed transfers.
- Status