Erik ten Hag | 2022/23 & 2023/24

Status
Not open for further replies.
Marwood said:
He's dropped everyone except Bruno. There aren't anymore combinations of players to try.

Yeah you can always argue individual decisions can be better but ultimately its just not a very good team. Not good enough and massively inconsistent as well.
Click to expand...

The personnel maybe…. But the system? Rarely… if at all.

We have barely seen a double pivot in midfield all season. Its nearly always been a single, completely isolated DM, then a cavernous expanse before you get anywhere near the two attacking midfielders.

We have 4 players in the squad capable of playing the deep roll proficiently in a double pivot. Mainoo, Casemiro, Amrabat, and Eriksen.

How many times have we seen combinations of those players??… hardly any. And I know injuries have played into that. But Mainoo and Amrabat have both now been fit for weeks, and he never plays them together. Because he believes (wrongly) in his god awful 4141 system.
 
Revan said:
I think Moyes had. I remember cause I was one of the very few who was voicing dissent since the early days, while the majority were wanking themselves over him.

LvG for most part did not have, or at least not as much as Moyes, Mourinho or Ole. Ten Hag is just another level, you would have thought that he is Fergie and Pep together by the way how this forum worshipped him (and some still do), when he is essentially Frank de Boer 2.0.
Click to expand...

They were all quite bad tbh. Mourinho, Ole and ETH have been another level though.
 
siw2007 said:
I don’t think so and we can’t just install any manager under the guise of ‘not ETH’. It worked when we brought in Ole but didn’t when Ragnick came in. This is a difficult group of players to manage and it could easily get worse if we don’t get it right.

For me, ETH’s ultimate failing is that after all the money that he has spent, that is the best team selection that he can make. Funnily enough, it’s the same failing as other coaches before him.
Click to expand...
That's not his biggest failing. The players out there are not worse than Bournemouth players. His failing are his tactics getting destroyed, time and time again
 
VP89 said:
Yes. And that to me points to fractures in squad quality. Garnacho shouldn't be depended on to start this many games, Antony yes was a mistake and Hojlund is too raw.

Who's fault is this really? JUST our manager? What should he do? Should he spend his 200m of the summer on a brand new front 3? Should he have got a different striker? Which one?


Also, you keep going on about goal difference but a big part of that is how leaky we are. And you keep ignoring the fact that he had a lot of players out for a long time, during which we did lose a lot of goals this season.
Click to expand...

It's everyone's fault and everyone should be thrown to the wolves. Sir Jim should be throwing them all out and gutting the squad.

I honestly think the injuries excuse has been overplayed. We didn't suffer many injuries post League Cup Final and yet we still struggled badly. This season we haven't had our forwards out injured, the only attacking miss we've had is Eriksen (can't really say Hojlund has been a miss given he hasn't even scored in the league for us. It's just excuses at this point, it's certainly hampered our defense at times but we aren't scoring the goals. Honestly, I think it's a crap excuse to stop us looking at the bigger picture which is Ten Hag cannot set us up properly in the League.
 
Sarni said:
I see funny trend among his devotes fan base, whenever we lose it’s because players have downed tools and let the brilliant mind Erik down, however the good games are strictly because of his immaculate tactics. :lol:
Click to expand...

Not really surprising. The guy got full credit for last season top 4 and League Cup and now the same people are blaming the players alone for the bad results.
 
At this stage he is just a bald LVG. Absolutely clueless on the coaching side coupled with brain dead management and transfer decisions. Sadly there should be no way back after this.
 
Ole’s reign went all wrong when he wanted us play a more proactive way. This season is all similar but he continues trying. I think it’s good thing, even though it just means we have been so bad for so many games. It’s a procedure. I would give him the whole season to do it.
 
PlayerOne said:
You just have to look the swing of votes for keep after Chelsea. Some United fans are clueless
Click to expand...
The fans have always been the problem.
We used to have the best players in the world and the best manager in the world. As soon as the standard dropped they should have stopped putting money in the club and got the owners out by force while putting pressure on the managers and players on the pitch but they consumed the Mediocrity and swallowed the false rhetorics that were coming out from the club . You are not allowed to judge any manager until they have 3 years and spend 500m/600m. You are not allowed to call out any player early even if they are blatantly below the standard of the club. They will attack you and accuse you of being toxic for holding the standards of the club yet will put the same said player they lauded and put on a pedestal in the trash bin after years of mediocrity and multiple humiliations while using the rare good showings as justification to attack you in between. They are highly insecure individuals that only care about being proven right about their favorites.


They cannot complain now. It's deserved.
 
JoeyJoJoJrShabadoo said:
If he survives the next week ill be amazed. I'd rather keep him as he needs to get shot of so many players
Click to expand...

We won't lose against Bayern. Can see it a draw or even a win while still getting KOed as one of the other two teams will win.

We'll be battered against Liverpool but everyone expects this anyway.

He'll survive. I'm pretty sure, though, that he won't be our manager comes next season.
 
golden_blunder said:
Lvg and ETH played/play tactics suited for anywhere but the PL. I think they underestimated the strength of the opponents in the league.
Moyes was probably out of his depth but maybe could have been given more time.
Mourinho was past his best when we got him. He’s also a short termist
Ole did well first season and he’s the one you could argue he should have had a support system
Click to expand...

I don't disagree with any of that, but if you searched some variation of "hire a qualified manager" you'll see a set of posters who seem convinced that the only issue at the club is that we've hired the wrong manager, five times on the bounce.

Moyes was a proven PL manager with a reputation for getting the best out of a limited budget.

van Gaal was a CL winner, and had won league titles with Ajax, Barcelona, Bayern Munich and even AZ Alkmaar, hired off the back of an impressive World Cup as Netherlands manager.

Mourinho was a multi-time CL winner, multi-time PL winner, as well as having won Serie A and La Liga.

Ten Hag had won multiple Dutch titles and taken an unfancied Ajax side a 97th minute goal away from a CL final.

All of these managers were qualified on paper.

If you rule out managers like Moyes, who have done well with "lesser" sides, managers like van Gaal and Ten Hag, who's success has only come outside of the PL, and managers like Mourinho (who had won the PL a year before he was hired) because they're past their best, then who is qualified?

Last season's PL winning manager?

You're even ruling out hiring Guardiola from Bayern and Klopp from Dortmund on those metrics.

You can't even really hold the "short-termist" thing against Mourinho, given that the set of posters I'm referring to will regularly use the short tenures of managers at successful sides these days as a reason to sack whoever we have in charge after the first dip in form.
 
el3mel said:
We won't lose against Bayern. Can see it a draw or even a win while still getting KOed as one of the other two teams will win.

We'll battered against Liverpool but everyone expects this anyway.

He'll survive. I'm pretty sure, though, that he won't be our manager comes next season.
Click to expand...
Just lower the expectations. Then there will be higher chance to be surprised.
 
JoeyJoJoJrShabadoo said:
If he survives the next week ill be amazed. I'd rather keep him as he needs to get shot of so many players
Click to expand...
What makes you want to keep him? Yes we need to replace players. That's not his job. That'll be the DOF. His job will be to coach. His coaching is actively making us worse and causes problems for us on a weekly basis, and routinely gets exposed by any well coached team (which we are not).

I try not to make judgements over his signings. It shouldn't be his job, and we can't be clear over who is the driving force in identifying and purchasing. His job is coaching and he should be judged on how he coaches, the system he implements, and how that stacks up to the competition. He is failing at that. So he should go.
 
Raoul said:
Spare Martinez, his signings alone are a sackable offense.
Click to expand...
What's worse is he had previously coached quite a few of them and still thought they'd be good enough for the level we aspire to.
 
I've been rooting for Ten Hag for a long time but unfortunately this can't go on.
The worst thing is that he doesn't seem to have any type of solution and looks bewildered most of the time.
But then who do you get IF anyone wants to get in at this point in time?
 
el3mel said:
We won't lose against Bayern. Can see it a draw or even a win while still getting KOed as one of the other two teams will win.

We'll battered against Liverpool but everyone expects this anyway.

He'll survive. I'm pretty sure, though, that he won't be our manager comes next season.
Click to expand...
His only saving grace right now is the ownership situation. He could lose 5 in a row, but because we are in the midst of a takeover from a sporting control perspective, he won't be sacked. It doesn't make sense for the current people to do it anyway, it has to be Ratcliffe, the new CEO, the DOF that comes in, etc that handle that change. Or at least in terms of hiring who is next.
 
bosnian_red said:
What makes you want to keep him? Yes we need to replace players. That's not his job. That'll be the DOF. His job will be to coach. His coaching is actively making us worse and causes problems for us on a weekly basis, and routinely gets exposed by any well coached team (which we are not).
Click to expand...
Curious to whether you thought we were well coached last year when you continually defended him? This isn’t a dig, just wondered what you think has changed for the results and performances to get so badly worse
 
The scariest thing is how many wins have been deserved and/or convincing so far this season?, please tell me because I’m struggling, even Chelsea could have been very different, Everton was far from convincing, the score wasn’t a reflection of the game, at no point are we in control of any situation , literally anything could happen at anytime, and that’s unfortunately down to the tactics or lack of .

I like many thought and hoped we’d found the manager to move us forward but I’m seriously questioning that now, even when we win it doesn’t bring joy as I know it’ll be short lived .
 
Just a reminder that this man was too arrogant and stubborn to have a meeting and listen to Ralf Rangnick about the state of some of these players and the squad.

Another reminder that he said “Eras come to an end” when asking about pep and klopp.

Yours one didn’t even get started mate.
 
bosnian_red said:
His only saving grace right now is the ownership situation. He could lose 5 in a row, but because we are in the midst of a takeover from a sporting control perspective, he won't be sacked. It doesn't make sense for the current people to do it anyway, it has to be Ratcliffe, the new CEO, the DOF that comes in, etc that handle that change. Or at least in terms of hiring who is next.
Click to expand...

Exactly. The current ownership is hardly bothered by the team results, and they pretty sure aren't interested in searching for a new manager or paying anyone to come. We're stuck with him till the new owners come, but he won't be our manager next season. That much is obvious. He needs an absolute miracle to change fortunes and it's not gonna happen.
 
kaku06 said:
Just a reminder that this man was too arrogant and stubborn to have a meeting and listen to Ralf Rangnick about the state of some of these players and the squad.

Another reminder that he said “Eras come to an end” when asking about pep and klopp.

Yours one didn’t even get started mate.
Click to expand...
Because the fraud Rangnick who is even more arrogant and achieved less than ETH should be listened to..
 
Please send him back to Ajax, he's a great coach Man Utd's team is just shite
 
Raoul said:
Spare Martinez, his signings alone are a sackable offense.
Click to expand...
Martinez - great
Casemiro - good when fit
Malacia - decent backup
Eriksen - great when fit
Antony - jury’s out
Onana - jury’s out
Hojlund - will be great
Amrabat - looks to be getting up to speed now
Mount - god knows what he saw here tbf

We overpaid for a few of those but the last time I checked that isn’t Ten Hags fault. I would also add that a lot of the time he’s had to take emergency loans like Reguilon, Sabitzer, Weghorst as well because the club is so badly run.

Many of the players signed have had long term injuries, and the ones that haven’t even arrived injured like Amrabat and Hojlund. Martinez, Casemiro, Malacia, Mount and Eriksen are all currently unavailable. How is he meant to get the remainder of what’s left playing with any sort of cohesion in that state?

Only thing I’d blame him for is picking Scott in midfield when it’s obviously costing us.
 
hobbers said:
Without McTominay's 5 goals we'd be 14th. 19 points from 16 games. -8 goal difference.

Let that sink in.
Click to expand...

Maybe if we replaced him with a central midfielder who could do the actual basics of central midfielder things like passing, tackling and not hiding from the ball (except in the attacking third running in late), we'd have a greater amount of team goals and have conceded a lot less

Players like McTom, Martial and even Maguire are examples of 'every dog has its day' but we've seen them underdeliver countless times and somehow some people are kidding themselves that the odd comeback win is worth keeping them about. They need ripping out, they're not consistently good enough for a club of this size
 
Zlatan 7 said:
Curious to whether you thought we were well coached last year when you continually defended him? This isn’t a dig, just wondered what you think has changed for the results and performances to get so badly worse
Click to expand...
I don't think last year we played quite the same way, and there were mitigating circumstances with the squad limiting him in terms of what we assumed he wanted to do. Fair enough, you give allowances. But we didn't abandon the midfield last season and just leave 1 player to handle all deep build up alone, for one. We did share that with Casemiro and Eriksen mostly, which made it easier for us to move through the lines.

It was nothing amazing, but it was much more functional than now, and with better players to enable taking the next steps tactically, we should've seen a big step up.

Instead we've repeatedly seen us completely out coached. I don't buy this shit about players losing the manager or not working hard. Players aren't that dumb, and professionals don't just give up (for the most part). They'll work hard, but you subconsciously lose belief when you find yourself repeatedly in bad positions and chasing back, covering too much ground to close down, surrounded by too many players, having to work too hard to actually pass the ball through the lines and not having easy to use options.... It's all coaching. They'll get frustrated and it makes them look worse than they are. Some things ok, yeah, some players lack some basic skills and some players make brain dead decisions. But those are reduced through good coaching and easier to spot. This is repeated patterns of tactical failure.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.