I absolutely hated Maguire 9-12 months ago and wanted him out, but credit where it's due, he has really turned things around and shown tremendous resilience and leadership. I'd happily keep him in this team (where set pieces are important) ahead of basically a nobody in Colwill and Braithwaite (the new Maguire at best)
England Discussion
- Thread starter Samid
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I absolutely hated Maguire 9-12 months ago and wanted him out, but credit where it's due, he has really turned things around and shown tremendous resilience and leadership. I'd happily keep him in this team (where set pieces are important) ahead of basically a nobody in Colwill and Braithwaite (the new Maguire at best)
I'm not sure the job is half as enthralling to "top managers" as you're suggesting to think they're going to attract one. The pool of international managers is nothing special.
If England get rid of Southgate the best sort of name they'll get is someone like Eddie Howe reeling from his inevitable sacking. Which would probably be a slight upgrade.
Top managers want to challenge themselves in top competitions which means club football not babysit England at tournaments once every couple of years. It's only when they're over the hill they go into it.
I don't know if Mainoo is the answer. Don't get me wrong, he looks to be a great talent, but more he's more In the Paul Ince mould than the Michael Carrick.
He looks to me like he's a dynamic, explosive risk taker, rather than a metronom
You'd actually be surprised by their league passing stats this season:
Gallagher 91%
Henderson 89%
Phillips 84%
Ward-Prowse 89%
Garner 83%
Longstaff 82%
Let's be honest, none of them are particularly brilliant. It's not like Barcelona or Real Madrid are going to be checking them out.
Therein lays the issue.
Ward-Prowse, Garner and Longstaff are at West Ham, Everton and Newcastle for a reason.
Southgate gets abuse as it is, can you imagine the ridicule he'd receive if he called up Garner, a player who is just about treating water at Everton and the same with Longstaff?
The simple fact is that you need someone In the engine room that can set the tempo.
Rice is head and shoulders the best English midfield (no 6), but he's more of an anchorman than a playmaker.
The following players are what England (And Manchester United for that matter) need:
De Jong 93%
Rodri 92%
Gilmour 92%
Ugarte 92%
Tchouaméni 92%
Caicedo 92%
Camavinga 91%
Modric 91%
I swear, if England had one of the aforementioned players at the previous Euros, they would've won the final.
He reminds me of a young Roy Keane or even a Bryan Robson and Paul Ince. A typical box to box player.
All three were top class players but all three played on the edge, all three played with risk and rewards elements.
That's all good, but is it really what England need? I say no. They need a De Jong type playmaker.
I'm Scottish. I'm so happy that we have Billy Gilmour. A player who is not sexy or glamorous, but a player who sets the tone and can find a team mate.
I still remember after England met Scotland at the previous Euros and Gary Neville (and Souness) said that England don't have a player like Gilmour. Cut to four years and it's as true now as it was then.
Needs to level up his PR game. So far he's doing alright with his media mates spreading rumors about the "potential" of managing ManUnited, good friends with Ashworth, and all that. But his looks isn't cutting it yet. He's not bald and unable dislocate his jaw at will like Klopp. He needs to be more exotic. If he had Jesus hairstyle and keeps growing his beard he can be a more mythical figure and gain more interests as a result. Too formal means no party. Jesus x Confucius is where it's at.
Spanish NT players would love to have him as a manager. A breath of fresh air, different than what they've got. That squad needs a shake up.
Spanish NT players would love to have him as a manager. A breath of fresh air, different than what they've got. That squad needs a shake up.
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So he’s been using Manchester United to get a better contract? 
What? Did he actually wear his RM jersey? Can't find anything on it.
Or do you just mean he seemed jolly just to see his Real Madrid colleagues more than he did with his England teammates.
It's a fecking friendly. And he's for all purposes still a young kid.
This blood and thunder, wouldn't happen in our day nonsense is old, get over it.
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In fairness, Britain is England.
Lots of people think of Scotland, Wales and N Ireland as regions of England.
Yeah, people with no knowledge.
You're right, and it's not like England need a top level manager to finally win a tournament either.
Tactics don't matter that much in World Cups and Euros. You just need to give your team a good balance and more likely than not, you'll go deep with a squad that England have. If Southgate leaves without winning anything, they'll just need to appoint someone like Pochettino/Mourinho/Potter/Howe, and they'll be even bigger favorites than before.
Capello was hired 1 year removed from winning a hyper competitive LaLiga with Real Madrid over Ronaldinho-Messi Barcelona, Valencia of Villa and Sevilla(winners of EL)
Erikson was hired a after winning serie A with Lazio at a time it was still the top league around
And that's ignoring the fact that top managers nowadays only go into international football as a stop gap, if at all. And mostly only even take the job because their country asks them to. The likes of Guardiola, Klopp, Ancelotti, Tuchel, Emery, etc, etc wouldn't even listen to the english FA's offer right now. It's the guys like Potter England could hire
This. Though I don't see Pochettino or Mourinho being interested either. Poch is working at Chelsea and Mou is pretty clear he still wants a club, not a national team. Howe, maybe...
Granted he has played well in the big tournaments and is particularly valuable at that level where it's more of a set-piece game. However, international managers often run into trouble when they persist with their declining stars from previous tournaments. We can see some of the signs with Maguire making mistakes that lead to goalscoring opportunities fairly frequently now for England. I don't think Southgate has done the succession planning well at all there given the number of low-risk games he has inbetween tournaments to bleed in the next generation. And it's pretty much too late now.
To be honest when I saw England's line-up it was clear they would struggle against Brazil. Same old broken midfield that gets found out against the big teams. And no vision to come up with fresh solutions to resolve this persistent issue. He has no ability to mirror the successful tactical principles that most of these players relish for their clubs.
I completely agree.
If you can’t get a tune out of this star-studded England team, you really should be managing in the Championship. Anything less than a Euro victory would be an abject failure for Southgate.
Seriously what's with such absolute takes , let's Ignore Southgate competence or lack of it for a moment so you really believe England are so much better than other teams participating in Euro's that any thing less than a win would be failure and a disaster .
I'll say you are seriously overrating the Talent in this English team though they are good but they are not so much better than other contenders that they can only lose if they seriously underperform . England can play pretty well and still end up losing .
Tournament victories aren't necessarily the hallmark of a good manager as teams can be unlucky in knockout football.
However, Southgate's football is incredibly dull, even against the minnows it's a rather drab affair. If he could at least engineer wins against the better teams he might have some credit but England 8/10 times fall short against teams who are above decent.
However, Southgate's football is incredibly dull, even against the minnows it's a rather drab affair. If he could at least engineer wins against the better teams he might have some credit but England 8/10 times fall short against teams who are above decent.
Anybody knows why Luke Shaw is around the team? Has he been called?
Injured isn't he? Best option but I don't think Southgate thinks he can rely on him.
Yeah, that's why it's was a bit odd seeing him next to Kane in the stands wearing England clothes. I also saw a video of him meeting Andreas after the game.
After the 2-0 victory over Germany, England fans were hailing Southgate as this tactical mastermind. Emotions are part of football. But people should try to keep things into perspective especially if they want to literally broadcast their opinions. Southgate never had the proper induction to be a top, top coach.
In what universe did that happen?
Hmmm... I'm gonna need exact coordinates to the phantom zone in which Southgate was hailed a tactical mastermind. Even typing that out has given me a giggle.One of the multiverses where England fans aren't entitled?
Please Google the result.
Would rather you back the claim.
Methinks you've thrown that in to give your post more gravitas, but have overshot with the embellishment. Tactical genius!
I want to see which cabal did so call the grey man a tactical genius. What were their aims? demands?
Would rather you back the claim.
Methinks you've thrown that in to give your post more gravitas, but have overshot with the embellishment. Tactical genius!
I want to see which cabal did so call the grey man a tactical genius. What were their aims? demands?
Well I am a fan of live football more than an armchair statistician, and a frequenter of twitter least. But I distinctly remember the doom mongering over the 'defensive' selection turning to shocked glee after the match. Even media not called the Sun were hailing Southgate as a world class coach.
There are fans that even today insist that Southgate achieved more than Sir Bobby Robson, which is correct only in its barest meaning.
Though I think that Southgate is indeed not a great coach, probably a decent man manager. I feel like very few national teams actually play good and exciting football. Most of them are boring and defensive, and even the bigger names struggle to get their teams to play cohesive exciting attacking football.
While I agree he doesn't have the ability, and even if he did, he wouldn't have the time, to get England to play like the best PL teams, I would say that even if he had the time and ability, he still shouldn't try. Liverpool play in a way that's really only possible for them, while City and Arsenal have Rodri, Jorginho and Odegaard. England don't have anybody like those 3. Most of England's best players - really, everyone but Foden - is at their best in fast paced, transition heavy football. There's pretty much no CBs that are good in a high line(are there? Am I missing anyone?), no midfielder that's really good at moving the ball forward, controlling the tempo and organizing the attack. Their best bets are, what, Branthwaithe and Mainoo, or Alexander-Arnold in midfield? Two teenagers and a guy who barely has any experience in midfield?
England right now is basically Argentina 2011-2018 minus a Messi. Fantastic attacking talent, really strong overall, but with a couple glaring flaws that heavily condition what they can or can't do. They should lean into their strenghts rather than try and mimic sides they can't copy
He has gone against a FIFA top 10 ranked country 24 times and won 4 times, is that not the complaint we regularly lodge against ETH? I see no purpose in going for Southgate.
You haven’t travelled around these shores much have you?
Poor. Try harder.
Unfortunately that's the majority of people
Team get together, he's currently injured but unless he's still injured he's going to the EURO's
Any team would fear him being their coach. No balls or any kind of forward thinking. Not that I want Harvey Elliott on the squad but to exclude him in favor of a player who hasn’t done anything is just ludicrous
Need a chef's kiss emojiThe One (no pun intended) where Jet Li killed Lawless
Underrated movie
I agree. Henderson has no place in that England squad.
I agree Henderson should be out too. But Henderson was one of the best players on England somehow. Anyway I hope Southgate isn’t picking players to gain favor with certain clubs as a future reference.
This is true, England aren't massive favourites.
But I think the wider point around Gareth Southgate is how many attempts has he had now? Usually it's 3 strikes and you're out.
He's had opportunity after opportunity that have presented themselves in these tournaments and he has a very, very good set of players. Yes there are holes in the squad but so has every other nation, you mask them as coach and get the job done.
He should have won something by the end of this tournament for his reign to be a success.
He's had a decent set of players, let's not over hype them now.