England Discussion

rpitchfo said:
that’s every england manager ever though
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Well he's not improved them in that regard it has to be said. His previous good tournaments did have an element of luck in the draws.

I think this is a way better squad technically than given credit for and deserves a better manager. I'd much rather watch this team play than England 2006 and the so called golden generation.
 
Jev said:
His selections and tactics have been pretty impeccable this tournament and he's made the right adjustments during the tournament.
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He's very good at setting the team up, tactically he's quite astute when he has time to plan, but during matches he's awful.

He always waits until we surrender any momentum before he makes any changes, and doesn't have much of a plan when we're losing other than bringing on attacking players with a couple of minutes to go.
 
Jev said:
His selections and tactics have been pretty impeccable this tournament and he's made the right adjustments during the tournament.
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Yes, but people will still say that his teams choke against the first decent opponent. They'd be probably right.
 
Watching the game again, England were better than France.

The calls the ref got wrong were dire.

The Upamecano on Saka that lead to the goal was a joke. Then Kane in the first half potential pen but at least a free kick.

On another night with a competent official England would probably go through.

Sometimes you do need a bit of "luck" England didn't have it. France I think are favourites by some distance now, but not entirely on merit.
 
glazed said:
Well I will just list World Cups and since 1966 but Euros are the same pattern. You get the idea.

2018 Croatia
2014 no knock out
2010 Germany
2006 Portugal
2002 Brazil
1998 Argentina
1994 Didn't qualify
1990 Germany
1986 Argentina
1982 no knock out
1978 Didn't qualify
1974 Didn't qualify
1970 W Germany



He's not wrong though.
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Not one of those teams were world champions when they beat us..
 
England played well, dominated most of the game. France seems ordinary with Mbappe n9t having any influence on the game but England still lost. As a neutral, the referee was bad. The foul on Saka before the French goal, Kane should have been awarded a penalty. I don't think Henderson or Foden deserve a start. I think England would have a strong case in 4 years time. There will still be many players around like Rashford, Foden, Bellingham, Stones, Shaw, Mount, Rice and etc.
 
r0663664 said:
England played well, dominated most of the game. France seems ordinary with Mbappe n9t having any influence on the game but England still lost. As a neutral, the referee was bad. The foul on Saka before the French goal, Kane should have been awarded a penalty. I don't think Henderson or Foden deserve a start. I think England would have a strong case in 4 years time. There will still be many players around like Rashford, Foden, Bellingham, Stones, Shaw, Mount, Rice and etc.
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Issue is the beast that is Kyle Walker is 32 right now.

Everywhere else, fine I get it but replacing him in the backline will be hard.

Then maybe Maguire will be out, that's fine but who do we have to replace the experience?
 
TheNewEra said:
Issue is the beast that is Kyle Walker is 32 right now.

Everywhere else, fine I get it but replacing him in the backline will be hard.

Then maybe Maguire will be out, that's fine but who do we have to replace the experience?
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If Tomori carries on his rise with Milan he'll be in the squad.
 
TheNewEra said:
2 words have restored my faith in 2026
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I think I’m less bothered about the loss tonight than I have been in years gone by (as frustrating as it is) because we have so many talented players who will come again. It’s not like previous incarnations of England and the dross that’s pulled the shirt on.

They will always be in the conversation for the foreseeable and at some point things will drop together.
 
TheNewEra said:
Issue is the beast that is Kyle Walker is 32 right now.

Everywhere else, fine I get it but replacing him in the backline will be hard.

Then maybe Maguire will be out, that's fine but who do we have to replace the experience?
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Not a problem. We have Reece James. Him and Hakimi are the best right backs in the world.
 
Foxbatt said:
It's the referee's fault. It always is.
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This time it was actually a large factor in the French first goal, and Kane literally got fouled potentially in the box by Upamecano so those decisions are on the ref.

Neutrals on the likes of Reddit also have the same sentiment towards officials in the QFs.

The ref had a stinker. Against Germany in 2010 the ball actually went over the line so two legitimate claims.

No need to have an agenda, the state of the officiating in the QFs has been shite.

In the Argentina game the official was very bad too, and I wanted Argentina to win.
 
Kane flopped at the second PK. It could have been different.

But France were the better team, even if slightly. Deserved the win.
 
TheReligion said:
I think I’m less bothered about the loss tonight than I have been in years gone by (as frustrating as it is) because we have so many talented players who will come again. It’s not like previous incarnations of England and the dross that’s pulled the shirt on.

They will always be in the conversation for the foreseeable and at some point things will drop together.
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When will things ever come together,absolutely convinced after tonight we are cursed.
 
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TheNewEra said:
This time it was actually a large factor in the French first goal, and Kane literally got fouled potentially in the box by Upamecano so those decisions are on the ref.

Neutrals on the likes of Reddit also have the same sentiment towards officials in the QFs.

The ref had a stinker. Against Germany in 2010 the ball actually went over the line so two legitimate claims.

No need to have an agenda, the state of the officiating in the QFs has been shite.

In the Argentina game the official was very bad too, and I wanted Argentina to win.
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The ref was awful. Can't believe he needed to VAR to tell him the second one was a pen and Saka got fouled about three times outside the box but nothing given as well.
Kane's pen though...Frustrating because I thought we edged it as the better team and it was a big chance to beat them missed.
 
Ok so i'm half drunk since tonight was one of my mate's birthday.

I didn't enjoy the game one bit. Looked like France would win for no real reason, it was pretty bad, England was probably the better team but... intangibles... The whole game seemed so slow as if it was a huge tactical battle but honestly, it was just bad.
 
Why didn't he let someone else take it if he didn't feel confident,DAMN it Kane we now have to wait another 18 months for tournament. Have to put up with those god awful qualifying campaigns.
 
That_Bloke said:
Yes, but people will still say that his teams choke against the first decent opponent. They'd be probably right.
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Although mainly by the sort of people who don't think of Germany or Croatia as a "decent opponent", and whose definition of "choke" amounts to using it as a synonym for "not winning". England certainly didn't choke against France - I thought they played an excellent game, much more confident than I would have expected and arguably deserving of a win against the best team in the tournament. They lost it because Harry Kane missed a penalty. That sounds a lot to me like the manager did his part of the job pretty well.
 
croadyman said:
Why didn't he let someone else take it if he didn't feel confident,DAMN it Kane we now have to wait another 18 months for tournament. Have to put up with those god awful qualifying campaigns.
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Sadly he is our best penalty taker.

I spose you could make a case for Rashford, but kane is more proven.

Doubt anybody will take his place as the first choice penalty taker anytime soon.
 
DevilRed said:
Sadly he is our best penalty taker.

I spose you could make a case for Rashford, but kane is more proven.

Doubt anybody will take his place as the first choice penalty taker anytime soon.
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Can you imagine the outrage if Rashford failed the penalty. The Ingerlund fans would harass him the same way the royal family fans do to Meghan.
 
devilish said:
Can you imagine the outrage if Rashford failed the penalty. The Ingerlund fans would harass him the same way the royal family fans do to Meghan.
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The memory is still fresh of him getting abused very badly after the euros thanks to the superior man management of southgate who threw him on in the 120th minute.
 
DevilRed said:
The memory is still fresh of him getting abused very badly after the euros thanks to the superior man management of southgate who threw him on in the 120th minute.
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for me this WC is a great success. Sure England didn't win and I genuinely feel sorry for our players and most United fans who support it (hence why I tend to support it too). Yet the fact that England was knocked out without one of our players getting the blame is a huge relief.
 
devilish said:
for me this WC is a great success. Sure England didn't win and I genuinely feel sorry for our players and most United fans who support it (hence why I tend to support it too). Yet the fact that England was knocked out without one of our players getting the blame is a huge relief.
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Said it during the match thread.

Never thought we would have gone from struggling against the USA to dominating periods of the game against france. I have no issues with the performances. They've been far better than anything I've seen from us in knockouts.

This team could have won the whole thing on talent. But we bottled it.
 
England should have won that. France were average and Mbappe mostly invisible. Having poor CBs is obviously an issue as is their lack of mentality in these games.
 
We really need a number nine coming through to replace Harry for the next world cup and thereafter. Anyone on the horizon? Nobody springs to mind atm. Toney?
 
amolbhatia50k said:
England should have won that. France were average and Mbappe mostly invisible. Having poor CBs is obviously an issue as is their lack of mentality in these games.
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France had 5 main players missing. How the feck England didnt win is shocking.
 
devilish said:
Can you imagine the outrage if Rashford failed the penalty. The Ingerlund fans would harass him the same way the royal family fans do to Meghan.
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He will get still get more abuse for that free kick than Kane for that penalty.
 
Josh 76 said:
He will get still get more abuse for that free kick than Kane for that penalty.
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I never understood the anti United bias. I remember Beckham being absolutely hammered for the Simeone's mistake only for it fans to applaud Seaman despite making an absolute fool of himself against Ronaldinho. United produce some of the best talent in the UK. It should be within England's interest to encourage that
 
We were the better team and on another night we win that. It's a hard loss to take, with a bit more bollocks and attacking intent we probably would have gone through;

It just feels like another massive opportunity wasted again.
 
Those saying England were the better team - that was only true when you were chasing the game. As soon as you equalised, it was back to the fear based tactics. Unnecessary penalties aside, this was a regular game for France.
 
B20 said:
Those saying England were the better team - that was only true when you were chasing the game. As soon as you equalised, it was back to the fear based tactics. Unnecessary penalties aside, this was a regular game for France.
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We shaded it imo. Stats (goals aside!) tell a similar story. I do agree though that we have a nasty tendency of needing to go behind to stop with the safety first approach.
 
The Hilton said:
He's very good at setting the team up, tactically he's quite astute when he has time to plan, but during matches he's awful.

He always waits until we surrender any momentum before he makes any changes, and doesn't have much of a plan when we're losing other than bringing on attacking players with a couple of minutes to go.
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That is a pretty good summary.
Southgate can be characterised as a strategic thinker. He is good at creating the right environment for a team setting and that type of long term thing.

But during the match when he is under pressure to think tactically, he is very poor at reacting.
 
Judas said:
We were the better team and on another night we win that. It's a hard loss to take, with a bit more bollocks and attacking intent we probably would have gone through;

It just feels like another massive opportunity wasted again.
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Spot on.
 
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