Eden Hazard

Rito said:
It's all hypothetical how he would have peformed in Real with a prime Ronaldo. Robben went to Real from Cheslea and he wasn't exactly successful.

Also, all top players need not play for only Real, Barca, Bayern and Juve.

Hazard is already an EPL legend, and has enough time to establish himself in La Liga as well. He also has a stellar career in NT level.
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Hazard needed to leave Chelsea to push on, he's never reached his potential while playing there. As a Chelsea fan it's obvious why you would argue that point

He's not a PL legend either but that's a completely different argument entirely
 
Rito said:
Also, people go way overboard on this inconsistency thing. Apart from one season, he has mostly played consistently good, as shown by his inclusion in the EPL TOTY 4 times in 6 seasons, and most probably 5 in 7, including this year.
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Depends on what you expect from him really. A player of his talent and ability should be dominating the league, not having several months per season where he’s not scoring. Even in his best seasons, his output was far from elite level. Look at someone like Salah and the season he had last year. Hazard is a different level to him ability wise but has never had a season consistent enough where he wrecks teams every week.
 
That was a Messi-esque performance. The guy could be so good
 
charlenefan said:
Hazard needed to leave Chelsea to push on, he's never reached his potential while playing there. As a Chelsea fan it's obvious why you would argue that point

He's not a PL legend either but that's a completely different argument entirely
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He hasn't left yet. I don't get this thing about players reaching their potential in La Liga. Ronaldo significantly increased his goals to games ratio by leaving Utd but I thought he played to his potential at Utd. Playing in an easier League doesn't help you reach your potential and the opposite could be argued. What could be argued is that you get more chances to score and protection from the officials. Hazard should have had a hat-trick last night had he taken the obvious penalty the referee got wrong.

We do our League a disservice by putting La Liga on a pedestal. We have more top quality players and more good teams than other leagues and to do well here is more of a challenge. For me Hazard has proven his worth here by being the most exciting and entertaining player in the Premier league for the last 4 to 5 years and if he does or doesn't do well in the La Liga doesn't mean he hasn't played to his potential in his time here.
 
blue blue said:
He hasn't left yet. I don't get this thing about players reaching their potential in La Liga. Ronaldo significantly increased his goals to games ratio by leaving Utd but I thought he played to his potential at Utd. Playing in an easier League doesn't help you reach your potential and the opposite could be argued. What could be argued is that you get more chances to score and protection from the officials. Hazard should have had a hat-trick last night had he taken the obvious penalty the referee got wrong.

We do our League a disservice by putting La Liga on a pedestal. We have more top quality players and more good teams than other leagues and to do well here is more of a challenge. For me Hazard has proven his worth here by being the most exciting and entertaining player in the Premier league for the last 4 to 5 years and if he does or doesn't do well in the La Liga doesn't mean he hasn't played to his potential in his time here.
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I don't think he would be judged more on his CL performances there. Ultimately that is what clubs like Madrid and Barcelona care about.
 
charlenefan said:
Hazard needed to leave Chelsea to push on, he's never reached his potential while playing there. As a Chelsea fan it's obvious why you would argue that point

He's not a PL legend either but that's a completely different argument entirely
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I know this all comes down to how people define legend, but on what basis would Hazard not qualify?
  • 4 times in the PFA team of the season (and counting - likely to make it 5 this year and you'd back him to add more to that)
  • 3 times in the top two of the PFA Player of the Year (only 4 players have won it more than once)
He'd certainly get more recognition at Barca, Real or City. He'd also benefit from playing in a far more attacker-friendly environment conducive to boosting his output. He currently plays in a side that averages less than 70 league goals a season over the current decade. Barca and Real are pushing 50% more than that every year and it would be no surprise to see Hazard inflate his goal tallies by the same measure. But I think it's possible to separate that environment from what he has been working with at Chelsea in how we analyse his performances compared to his peers from those clubs. He's been brilliant for years and has a solid claim to be the Premier League's player of the decade for the 2010s.
 
Gio said:
He's been brilliant for years and has a solid claim to be the Premier League's player of the decade for the 2010s.
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He is certainly among the top 3.

Silva, Hazard, Aguero in no particular order (all came between 2010 - 2012). And you could definitely argue that both Silva and Aguero benefited from a more functional and attacking system as you already pointed out.
 
charlenefan said:
Hazard needed to leave Chelsea to push on, he's never reached his potential while playing there. As a Chelsea fan it's obvious why you would argue that point

He's not a PL legend either but that's a completely different argument entirely
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Real Madrid is a different animal, and it's likely he would have won more had he joined Madrid, simply because they've had a better team. Having said that, I can't imagine anyone can really say he has been unfulfilled in his time at Chelsea.

Had he spent the last 7 years at United, lighting up Old Trafford, would you still suggest he has been unfulfilled?
 
RochaRoja said:
Depends on what you expect from him really. A player of his talent and ability should be dominating the league, not having several months per season where he’s not scoring. Even in his best seasons, his output was far from elite level. Look at someone like Salah and the season he had last year. Hazard is a different level to him ability wise but has never had a season consistent enough where he wrecks teams every week.
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Only when you look at stats like this sport is a math course can you claim he is not consistent. Any Chelsea fan will tell you that Hazard has been the main threath for Chelsea, consistently, for the majority of his Chelsea career.
 
Gio said:
I know this all comes down to how people define legend, but on what basis would Hazard not qualify?
  • 4 times in the PFA team of the season (and counting - likely to make it 5 this year and you'd back him to add more to that)
  • 3 times in the top two of the PFA Player of the Year (only 4 players have won it more than once)
He'd certainly get more recognition at Barca, Real or City. He'd also benefit from playing in a far more attacker-friendly environment conducive to boosting his output. He currently plays in a side that averages less than 70 league goals a season over the current decade. Barca and Real are pushing 50% more than that every year and it would be no surprise to see Hazard inflate his goal tallies by the same measure. But I think it's possible to separate that environment from what he has been working with at Chelsea in how we analyse his performances compared to his peers from those clubs. He's been brilliant for years and has a solid claim to be the Premier League's player of the decade for the 2010s.
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He should've won it the second time. To me the decision to give it to Kante wasn't based on merit. It seemed like they hadn't quite gotten over Leicester's title win, so they rewarded Kante for snubbing him the year before.

You don't win titles without winning games, and to win games you need to score goals. And in a naturally pragmatic Conte team, Hazard was the threat that was creating and scoring goals for them.
 
Makelele said:
Only when you look at stats like this sport is a math course can you claim he is not consistent. Any Chelsea fan will tell you that Hazard has been the main threath for Chelsea, consistently, for the majority of his Chelsea career.
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Stats and numbers are the whole point of the sport. People don’t win matches or hand out trophies for looking threatening.
 
RochaRoja said:
Stats and numbers are the whole point of the sport. People don’t win matches or hand out trophies for looking threatening.
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No winning games is the point. You can contribute to that without direct goals. Depends on the type of player you are.
 
He is phenomenal. The dumbest thing we ever did was not pay the agent fee at the time. That dribble yesterday was mouth watering.
 
blue blue said:
He hasn't left yet. I don't get this thing about players reaching their potential in La Liga. Ronaldo significantly increased his goals to games ratio by leaving Utd but I thought he played to his potential at Utd. Playing in an easier League doesn't help you reach your potential and the opposite could be argued. What could be argued is that you get more chances to score and protection from the officials. Hazard should have had a hat-trick last night had he taken the obvious penalty the referee got wrong.

We do our League a disservice by putting La Liga on a pedestal. We have more top quality players and more good teams than other leagues and to do well here is more of a challenge. For me Hazard has proven his worth here by being the most exciting and entertaining player in the Premier league for the last 4 to 5 years and if he does or doesn't do well in the La Liga doesn't mean he hasn't played to his potential in his time here.
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Oh please, everything you've just said is because you're a Chelsea fan and it pains you to admit the likes of Real Madrid are a different animal to your club. It's nothing to do with playing in an easier league, it's the playing with better players and at a club that has higher expectations which would have either taken Hazard to another level or found him out
 
Gio said:
I know this all comes down to how people define legend, but on what basis would Hazard not qualify?
  • 4 times in the PFA team of the season (and counting - likely to make it 5 this year and you'd back him to add more to that)
  • 3 times in the top two of the PFA Player of the Year (only 4 players have won it more than once)
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I don't honestly think him being in PFA teams of the year means a lot, I mean Aguero's only made it into one

To me if you name your all time PL XI would Hazard make it into it? For me there are several names I would put in before I even thought about him
 
I do admit Real Madrid is a different animal. Although pressure in Spain can affect different players in various ways. Bale and Coutinho have been hit and miss despite clearly being world class. Suarez though has transitioned very well.

Thing about Hazard is that he has happy go lucky attitude and prefers enjoying the game over hitting bazzilion goals or assists. From what I see, Madrid fans are not very forgiving so for me its not a given that he will be a mega hit there despite clearly being worldclass.
 
Makelele said:
Only when you look at stats like this sport is a math course can you claim he is not consistent. Any Chelsea fan will tell you that Hazard has been the main threath for Chelsea, consistently, for the majority of his Chelsea career.
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Most fans listen to pundits like Souness or read The Sun etc.

Repeat a lie enough times and it gets a pretty good foothold.
 
BridgeBanter said:
Real Madrid is a different animal, and it's likely he would have won more had he joined Madrid, simply because they've had a better team. Having said that, I can't imagine anyone can really say he has been unfulfilled in his time at Chelsea.

Had he spent the last 7 years at United, lighting up Old Trafford, would you still suggest he has been unfulfilled?
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My opinion on Hazard would be the same regardless of who he played for. He's never reached his potential. Obviously had he been playing at United like the Chelsea fans I wouldn't care though
 
charlenefan said:
Oh please, everything you've just said is because you're a Chelsea fan and it pains you to admit the likes of Real Madrid are a different animal to your club. It's nothing to do with playing in an easier league, it's the playing with better players and at a club that has higher expectations which would have either taken Hazard to another level or found him out
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RM is a different animal to probably every club in the world, certainly to every club from the EPL. No shame in that.
 
We used to have these endless debates about Hazard vs Sanchez on Arsenal forums. Luckily you guys don’t have to endure this ;)
 
charlenefan said:
Oh please, everything you've just said is because you're a Chelsea fan and it pains you to admit the likes of Real Madrid are a different animal to your club
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That's the case for every single club in England, including United.
 
Dancfc said:
That's the case for every single club in England, including United.
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You say that like I suggested otherwise?

It's like a game on one-upsmanship with you Chelsea lot. Just waiting for the 'yeah I know I am but what are you' insults next
 
charlenefan said:
You say that like I suggested otherwise?

It's like a game on one-upsmanship with you Chelsea lot. Just waiting for the 'yeah I know I am but what are you' insults next
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Sounds like it pains you to admit the likes of Real Madrid are a different animal to your club.
 
charlenefan said:
You say that like I suggested otherwise?

It's like a game on one-upsmanship with you Chelsea lot. Just waiting for the 'yeah I know I am but what are you' insults next
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Your post made it sound like we delude ourselves we are on the same level as Real Madrid. We are a very big club now but i've not seen one fan suggest we have parity with you lot and Barca let alone Real.
 
Dancfc said:
Your post made it sound like we delude ourselves we are on the same level as Real Madrid. We are a very big club now but i've not seen one fan suggest we have parity with you lot and Barca let alone Real.
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The Chelsea fan I quoted quite clearly did, given the only reason why he thinks a player would go to La Liga is because it's an easier league to get your goals scored numbers up
 

Such a simple move but such class.
 
Mastadon said:
We used to have these endless debates about Hazard vs Sanchez on Arsenal forums. Luckily you guys don’t have to endure this ;)
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Don't know why they were never close.
 
SportingCP96 said:
Don't know why they were never close.
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That’s unfair, at a point Sanchez was fantastic in his own right. He’s completely fallen off the cliff now which is dissapointing, but it doesn’t change he was a top player. He was also a big game player scoring every match at Wembley, big game mentality.
 
Adam-Utd said:
That’s unfair, at a point Sanchez was fantastic in his own right. He’s completely fallen off the cliff now which is dissapointing, but it doesn’t change he was a top player. He was also a big game player scoring every match at Wembley, big game mentality.
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Great player I never said he wasn't but Hazard was well the better player and the more talented. That does not mean Sanchez was a bad player.
 
SportingCP96 said:
Great player I never said he wasn't but Hazard was well the better player and the more talented. That does not mean Sanchez was a bad player.
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What I mean is I can see why they compared them as at one point they were a similar bracket. Both LW, both playmaker, both scored goals etc. Yes hazard probably has the best top level, I agree.
 
Adam-Utd said:
What I mean is I can see why they compared them as at one point they were a similar bracket. Both LW, both playmaker, both scored goals etc. Yes hazard probably has the best top level, I agree.
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Ahh ok cheers !
 
charlenefan said:
My opinion on Hazard would be the same regardless of who he played for. He's never reached his potential. Obviously had he been playing at United like the Chelsea fans I wouldn't care though
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Never reached his potential?


Individual accolades due to supreme performance

 
Stacks said:
Never reached his potential?


Individual accolades due to supreme performance
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He has in his mind "several" names even before considering Hazard for EPL team of the decade or whatever, and doesn't consider him a PL legend.I respect different opinion but I sense a strong bitterness rather than objective assessment. I maybe wrong though.

Also, as somebody pointed out, he should have absolutely won the second POTY ahead of Kante. Literally carried Chelsea to the title at the business end of the season.
 
Rito said:
He has in his mind "several" names even before considering Hazard for EPL team of the decade or whatever, and doesn't consider him a PL legend.I respect different opinion but I sense a strong bitterness rather than objective assessment. I maybe wrong though.

Also, as somebody pointed out, he should have absolutely won the second POTY ahead of Kante. Literally carried Chelsea to the title at the business end of the season.
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You are
 
charlenefan said:
To me if you name your all time PL XI would Hazard make it into it? For me there are several names I would put in before I even thought about him
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Quite an exacting criteria to be a legend. Realistically only a handful of spots in a post-92 PL XI are nailed down - Henry, Ronaldo, Rio and arguably Cole - the others are all up for grabs and depend on your club allegiance. It would also hinge on you set it up - a 4-4-2 and Giggs gets the left-mid berth, a 4-3-3 and Hazard is in the mixer, unless you crowbar Henry to the left to accommodate Shearer/Aguero and Ronaldo in your attack.
 
For some reason I do not see a thread about it. But Madrid have agreed a deal for him. Reported to be 100 mirrion.
 
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