I imagine it's a lot harder for Woodward to justify spending £50M and £40M respectively on two players nearing 30 with no resale value and no marketing value, it's not like you can even say you are buying great players like when we agreed to pay Ibra's crazy wages or if we could get a 31 year old Ronnie for £60M, there's just not enough coming in for what needs to be shelled out on what seems to be 2 of the players Jose wants. it's short term investment in averageness.
Duncan Castles : Jose Mourinho on collision course with Ed Woodward over Manchester United transfers
- Thread starter Maradona10
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Lets hope you're right
To answer your previous question. Inter and Real have one hell of an axe to grind against us. Real are still licking their wounds after that fax 'broke down'. Inter were first ridiculed by Mou (who turned them down for us) and then we went on spending ridiculous money on Pogba which strengthened Juventus position considerably. Juventus came to a whisker from winning the treble which would have stripped away the shine from Moratti's only achievement. I assure you that is quite a devious club (Liverpool in comparision are the care bears). Other clubs want to make a healthy profit out of us but will refrain from taking us to the cleaners.
Real Madrid is playing hard ball on the price. Inter does not want to sell. Monaco does not want to sell, and the rumors of us being interested are not from the best of sources, mostly they seem generated by Fabinho's camp. Chelsea not looking to sell Matic until they have their replacement for him signed.
Just a few guesses off the top of my head.
Sure you can say, just pay what the selling club wants, but then there would be a bunch of people pissing and moaning about us overpaying, etc. It's a no win for Ed, try to do your job and negotiate what you think is the right price and people hate you. Sign players for huge fees that some posters think are too much and people accuse you of being taken to the cleaners.
Probably because most of the said players are being offered to us at a 50% markup.
I can't imagine Bayern buying a player like Perisic for the money we are being linked with him with. Nor could I see a club like PSG buying Morata for 80m.
If we set the precedent that we are happy to pay 50% more for each transfer than other big clubs then we will be fecked in subsequent windows. Ed is therefore right to drag this on so that the selling clubs have something to think about.
As said, by the looks of it he did. Else we would have moved to other targets and Mou wouldn't be panicking as this article hints. Honestly I expect better from a seasoned fox like Jose. Getting players from Chelsea (direct rivals), Inter (we strengthened their rivals considerably) and Real (after fax gate) was always going to be very tough. He might have added Harry Kane, Lionel Messi and Klopp as his tea lady while at it.
Thank god we're signing Ribalta. Hopefully we wont be caught with our pants down next time round.
If you place a decent bid and is rejected. You increase it and yet the seller keeps insisting on asking for crazy money then you'll end up taking the hint.
I understand Real may have reasons, but don't think same about Inter, though. I think Inter just wants to keep Perisic and their new manager seems to want him staying. Their current team don't have many good players and they'll be desperate to keep any good player and they don't have many. It's better for them to keep Perisic and sell the crap players that're filling their squad and they'll get money from both situations anyway. Don't get me wrong I actually hate them a lot ( don't know why but it seems I have a problem with any club wearing blue shirts as Chelsea and Inter
) but I think they just want him to stay.Any club will try to get as much money as possible from you. The selling club is actually unwilling to sell, and you're desperate to sign their player and have lot's of money. Nothing will prevent them from taking the chance and trying to milk us as much as possible.
Based on what? Rumors that may or may not be true at all?
Chelsea, City, Arsenal, and other clubs seem to be pursuing the same targets they have been linked to from the beginning but have not signed yet. Why with two months to go in the window would it be necessary to give up on signing a player we wanted? Just last summer how long did the Pogba deal take to complete? Should we have given up on that one?
Except there is more to it , there are the terms of payment that can be changed (IE we won't increase our bid, but will pay more up front). Somehow I think the negotiations are a bit more complex then just exchanging a number on a piece of paper.
I understand Real may have reasons, but don't think same about Inter, though. I think Inter just wants to keep Perisic and their new manager seems to want him staying. Their current team don't have many good players and they'll be desperate to keep any good player and they don't have many. It's better for them to keep Perisic and sell the crap players that're filling their squad and they'll get money from both situations anyway. Don't get me wrong I actually hate them a lot ( don't know why but it seems I have a problem with any club wearing blue shirts as Chelsea and Inter
Any club will try to get as much money as possible from you. The selling club is actually unwilling to sell, and you're desperate to sign their player and have lot's of money. Nothing will prevent them from taking the chance and trying to milk us as much as possible.
Oh I assure you Inter have plenty of reason to hate us. First Moratti sends his sister like some whore to meet Mourinho only for him to turn her down because United are simply the better club. Then we spend crazy money on Pogba which puts Juventus in a financial position to dominate the league for the next half a decade. Moratti nearly crippled his family fortune to win the god damn treble. If Juventus win it then the only good thing he's done will be forgotten.
That's why I wrote by the looks of it. For all we know, Mou is Ed's secret lover and they are french kissing and exchanging gifts at this very moment. We discuss rumours based on educated guesses
fixed
it is an educated guess although, like any other guess its still a guess.
Again you completely missed the point, just because he is still trying to sign a primary target doesn't mean secondary targets do not exist. It means there is a lot of time left to do deals, it's early July and that's why he hasn't moved to other targets. Do you see Chelsea moving to other targets despite facing difficulties in signing Alex Sandro?
I don't know why buying the players which we want from the clubs you've mentioned would be tougher than signing other player from other clubs. Don't know why you've mentioned Kane and Messi, they are permanent fixtures in the playing XI and the best player at their respective clubs. Morata, Matic and Perisic are not indispensable to their respective clubs. More so in the case of Matic since it's directly strengthening a rival, if we were going for their main stars eg. Ronaldo or Hazard I'd agree with you that it's a waste of time but we are going for their squad players so logically a deal should be doable. Problem is they are asking too much money which they know we have because of the precedent we've set in previous summers. Every club would take us to the cleaners, it's time for fans to accept it.
I don't know why buying the players which we want from the clubs you've mentioned would be tougher than signing other player from other clubs. Don't know why you've mentioned Kane and Messi, they are permanent fixtures in the playing XI and the best player at their respective clubs. Morata, Matic and Perisic are not indispensable to their respective clubs. More so in the case of Matic since it's directly strengthening a rival, if we were going for their main stars eg. Ronaldo or Hazard I'd agree with you that it's a waste of time but we are going for their squad players so logically a deal should be doable. Problem is they are asking too much money which they know we have because of the precedent we've set in previous summers. Every club would take us to the cleaners, it's time for fans to accept it.
The 2 reasons aren't convincing me enough.
I don't think they're that childish if Jose refused to manage them as he's still one of the most successful managers in their history and has no problems with them unlike Chelsea, and Juve was going to dominate the league regardless of selling Pogba and getting his money. The other Italian clubs are at a very far distance from them already even if they hadn't got enough money to buy the likes of Higuain.But who knows. They maybe as you said. I still any club will try to get as good deal as possible from us, away from Inter and Madrid. No guarantee that any deal will be easy, especially if we aimed higher of course.
The 2 reasons aren't convincing me enough.
But who knows. They maybe as you said. I still any club will try to get as good deal as possible from us, away from Inter and Madrid. No guarantee that any deal will be easy, especially if we aimed higher of course.
I've been following the Serie A for 30 years. Yes Inter are childish. They spend alot, they win very little and they do some of the craziest things football has ever seen. Compared to them Liverpool are all Napoleon Bonapartes.
As I told you, I hate them a lot. I'm actually surprised that they have any fans outside Italy. They don't look like a likable club at all tbh.
Inter under Moratti were "childish". Not sure about the new regime.
I would like FIFA and the different federations to sanction an independent committee that would assess and value individual players based on a globally agreed criteria. This would give the clubs and fans a more analytical starting point on the transfer value of each player. I couldn't imagine them putting the price on some players the way their clubs would. 60mil for an average Inter Milan player is fecking criminal. 40 mil for Matic seems fair to me when all things considered. Morata is a 40 mil player tops and I hope Real Madrid get fecked in every contract negotiation, cheeky swines.
I agree with you that Persic is not worth that and hopefully the change in the scouting setup will help us in what I think has been the clubs biggest weakness for some time. Look at recruiting at Dortmund,A.madrid and Juve compaired to us.
I agree with you on Sky but is the next step not getting games through Netflix,Amazon og similar and perhaps that could get a lot of streamers back?
Ed's been in charge of 5 Summer windows. He cocked up the window when Moyes was in charge, but improved after that. It's a bit concerning he's taken a retrograde step this time around (if reports are to be believed).
Mourinho has done Ed no favours to say the least. You want to put yourself in a strong position for negotiations. Any cheif exec with half a brain will play on all this desperation and deadline nonsense. We have a situation where even if they want to sell, they can still shaft us.
To be fair, Ed's not been great. In the last window, the Pogba deal was about brute force rather than clever negotiation; Zlatan was an inevitability with Mourinho at the club; Bailly and Mkhitaryan were decent captures, but relatively straightforward after both players kicked up a fuss to get here.
Jose's the first manager we've had who's been in a strong enough position to call him out. If this means we get a more seasoned and savvy Chief Exec, I think it'll be worth it in the long run.
You are losing this one dev. Mou gave his list with both secondary and primary options, so Woody is not stuck with one target that if he can't get we are knackered. Jose may be stubborn but he is not naive, he knows how things work, and he also knows any list he gives is not certain to be fulfilled. I agree on Perisic, but then i don't believe Jose has asked for him at any price. Morata looks like a player you may have to pay over the odds for, just because he is at RM.
It seems you have a bug to bear with Jose for whatever reason, considering your 'top managers' jibe. He is a top manager, like him or loathe him, and he is a top manager because he brings titles. All clubs pay money out every season, and with probably just as many fails as successes for their efforts. Mourinho is a top manager because he knows what he needs to bring that success, and when he gets it, he delivers. It's really as simple as that.
The Glazers are hardly bastions for responsible finance are they? So it's a bit rich to hire a manager like Jose who has a clearly defined methodology for success, and then moan about it because it may present certain financial risks. He is what he is, and we knew exactly what he was and how he would want to proceed when we hired him. It would be like re-signing CR and then moaning about him not tracking back. If you know what you are getting before you buy it, don't moan when it produces exactly what you bought it to provide.
We wanted mourinho not for his ability to produce teams that stand the test of time, we wanted him because he is a proven winner, with a proven formula for attaining that success quickly. That is Mourinho, plain and simple, and that's what we clearly wanted when we hired him. If the board are somehow surprised by this, then they should all be fired. For they are clearly nowhere near as competent at their own jobs as Jose has regularly proven to be at his.
Sorry I just don't understand how this happens; a club like Manchester United. Surely Ed is a seasoned and savvy Chief Exec? If not why is he in the position he is in?
I'm with Ed Woodward on this one.
We're finished in the transfer market if we start paying £50m for Perisic.
We're finished in the transfer market if we start paying £50m for Perisic.
He's a money-man with little experience in football. Blame the Glazers for this misstep. We should have gone for somebody who had a track-record in the game. Negotiating for players is different from negotiating in business.
Pretty sure Woodward's position is far safer than Mourinho's. I dont think there is any real conflict between the two of them anyway, but if there was there would only be one winner and its the one that has ensured our financial performance has been improving year on year despite things going to shit on the football pitch.
Hopefully with Javier Riabalta joining as Chief Scout from Juventus there will be a better structure in pkace for next season.
Keep Woodward for the commercial side. Bring in some slimy cnut to do the deals for the playing staff.
Edit: not the best visual, I apologise.
I dont disagree with your logic, Im just saying it wont happen. The Glazers are the decision makers and they - I feel pretty sure - are happy with the job Woodward is doing. I dont think they would want to risk pissing him off by essentially demoting him.
Woodward is in the right if the situation is clubs asking stupid money for players.
Our targets looks so underwhelming.
Our targets looks so underwhelming.
It would be worrisome if Jose took a completely hands-off approach. Managers are important in making players really want to come. Jose did say at some point that he is "done with involving himself in transfers" or something to that effect.
Why should clubs who don't want to sell players be forced to let them go for the market price. The main reasons prices are so high is in most occasions don't want to sell, & hype the prices right up if clubs are so insistent in purchasing them.
A lot of people need to take a deep breath and just breathe. We are barely into the window City have signed a GK and Silva that's 1 more player than us. Ffs it's hardly Armageddon.
€70m extra (after Raiola's cut) does not put them in a position to dominate for 5 years. Besides, they wasted that and 20m more on a single signing, Higuain.
José will be on a collision course with himself if you gave him a mirror.
Dare I say it, but there's not a lot of value in the market is there? Not if our targets prices are to be believed.
That collapsed Griezmann transfer really feck things up. Seems like Ed doesn't mind paying a 50% mark up for premium players, because the supply is limited for those kind of players. But paying a 50% markup for the like of Morata and Perisic is not what a good businessman would and should do.