So you think that Alli didnt know what sort of wages top players can earn at the biggest clubs in Europe? You don't think he might have already known this? I'd imagine Alli has an agent. All this shows Alli is that Utd are prepared to pay top wages to incredibly average players who wouldn't get a start at his current club. That is hardly a winning endorsement of Utd now is it?
Dele 'Muhammad' Alli | Walker takes the finger from Dele | FIFA open disciplinary proceedings
- Thread starter theyneverlearn
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So you think that Alli didnt know what sort of wages top players can earn at the biggest clubs in Europe? You don't think he might have already known this? I'd imagine Alli has an agent. All this shows Alli is that Utd are prepared to pay top wages to incredibly average players who wouldn't get a start at his current club. That is hardly a winning endorsement of Utd now is it?
He probably did know - in fact the fact we know guarantees anyone involved in football will.
Perhaps it's not a winning endorsement at United, but at the end of the day what do you think the majority of footballers would rather? 50k a week at Spurs whilst finishing 2nd, or finish 6th at United but earn say 180k a week, whilst winning the league cup and potentially the europa.
Money is everything in football sadly. I think it'd be great for the league if Spurs managed to keep a hold of their team and maintain a challenge, but at the end of the day, money talks.
I'm not disputing that, I'm disputing the suggestion that Alli will suddenly look to leave Spurs because Lindgard got a new contract. It's absolute tosh.
You could also look at it another way - Spurs are a team flying at the moment, Utd are a team struggling to get back to the top (at the moment). You could earn 50k this season at Spurs and look great in a team working well - get a new contract next season at 100k with Spurs (as has been happening) and stay another year - potentially if Spurs continue to improve then maybe the next year he could get £150k there - OR move and get £200k+ at the likes of Madrid, etc. who will no doubt be calling then.
Or you could go to Utd now for £150k per week, in a team that might still struggle, maybe it doesnt work out for him there (every move is a risk) or Utd continue to find it tough to get to the top for another season or two - he might still get that big move to Madrid but will he have had a better experience at Spurs or at Utd until that point?
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Maybe I'm in the minority, but I don't see Real Madrid or Barcelona needing him. They got better players. If he continues to improve, then maybe in the future, but he would be on the bench at those clubs imo.
The situation with Alli is also different from Berbatov, Modric, Carrick and Bale who all outgrew the club. Right now I don't think many would say Alli is our best player, most promising talent perhaps (with Kane), but not close to being too good or 'left down' by his teammates.
In fact, I'd argue that at 21 he is in a perfect place to develop, and there is no guarantee that he would be as successful if he moved so soon. Martial is a talent who took the money and look to have stagnated, Shaw as well (for whatever reason). Rashford was played out of position imo until Zlatan got injured. (There are examples everywhere, but since this is a United forum I used these players).
I completely understand that Alli will be looking for your wages more comparable to his value to the team. And I fairly certain he will be getting a wage close to our top earners next season. What happens later will depend on how he develops compared to the team. If there is a mismatch then he may leave, similarly if he doesn't eventually get paid close to what he can get he may leave.
However, I fully expect Alli to stay for another 3 years, and if we continue to improve, and Levy breaks the wage structure, possibly more.
The situation with Alli is also different from Berbatov, Modric, Carrick and Bale who all outgrew the club. Right now I don't think many would say Alli is our best player, most promising talent perhaps (with Kane), but not close to being too good or 'left down' by his teammates.
In fact, I'd argue that at 21 he is in a perfect place to develop, and there is no guarantee that he would be as successful if he moved so soon. Martial is a talent who took the money and look to have stagnated, Shaw as well (for whatever reason). Rashford was played out of position imo until Zlatan got injured. (There are examples everywhere, but since this is a United forum I used these players).
I completely understand that Alli will be looking for your wages more comparable to his value to the team. And I fairly certain he will be getting a wage close to our top earners next season. What happens later will depend on how he develops compared to the team. If there is a mismatch then he may leave, similarly if he doesn't eventually get paid close to what he can get he may leave.
However, I fully expect Alli to stay for another 3 years, and if we continue to improve, and Levy breaks the wage structure, possibly more.
Right now I only care about next season. And in the words of Pochettino today, "All the players that we want to stay here next season will stay ..."
So there you have it - you can believe Pochettino (and in the intent of Levy to stand behind him) or you can engage in wishful thinking and believe in the rumour mill. The managers and fans of rival clubs can huff and puff all they want, can bang on endlessly about mega wages etc, but it's just so much hot air.
When the next season begins the Spurs squad will be just as strong as it is now, and probably stronger.
Where would United be now if you'd kept Ronaldo? Where will you be next season if you lose de Gea? Where will Arsenal be next season if they lose Sanchez? Where will Liverpool be next season if they lose Coutinho?
To read the views of some on here you'd believe that Spurs are the only top 6 club to ever lose star players or ever to be at risk of losing star players ... when clearly that's not the case. Like any club - including United - if a star player really wants to leave and if enough money is offered, then eventually you will sell.
So the issue is how well (if at all) you push on from that. I'd say Spurs have pushed on pretty well and are stronger now than ever we were when Modric or Bale were in the team.
Ronaldo often gets brought up and it was his dream to play for Real, we didn't lose him because we couldn't match his goals, he just wanted something different. We had the titles, the Champions league, the money, the fans. He just wanted something different. Every other big star we actually booted out on our terms, like Beckham, Keane etc.
There is a difference between losing one star and consistently losing players like Liverpool and Spurs do because they can't offer what the top players want, surely you can see that? You can't honestly compare Manchester United losing Ronaldo, to Suarez or bale leaving? Nobody can be that deluded
Again you're not following.
Post Ronaldo United have won 2 league titles, 2 league cups and an FA cup. In Europe we were champions league runners up twice.
Without him our success continued but we may have won another European Cup with him.
Post Bale, Modric etc what have Spurs done? It's took you several years to get the title of challengers. If you were to lose your best players again you'd undoubtedly drop a few steps back again. If you want to start being at the top you must keep your best players, build on a squad and only let them go on your own terms otherwise you just become a feeder/selling club.
You serious? It's not like United fell apart after Ronaldo left.
The problem with United was Fergie leaving not Ronaldo or someone else.
Alli rejected Liverpool knowing very well he could get paid more there, he is also a Pool fan? We maybe offered him more initially but long term if it was money he was after he would have signed for Liverpool.
Liverpool wouldn't pay him more than others at similar ages.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...g-American-owners-pay-21-wage-4-000-week.html
Ur missing the point, long term he would have had a much higher wage ceiling with them.
It depends, because I could say that he is motivated by money becasue he chose Tottenham over his boyhood team because they were offering more money at that point in time.
Or we are in a better position as a club, have a better training program and a manager who brings through young talent? There are arguments for every case and only Ali knows. We will see in the summer.
You could argue that a young player would be dubious of Jose and may think twice signing for United, the truth is as fans we have no idea.
At the time of him signing though I thought we were referring to? Not the current situation. Which I agree with you btw.
At the time Liverpool had finished 2nd in the league previously whilst you finished 6th, the season at the time there was very little between the two of you.
It may have been MP who sold the idea of Spurs to him that Rodgers couldn't do for Liverpool. Or it may have just been the extra money.
I still think that players of his quality will want to look back at their careers and have trophies to show for it. This is where Spurs will need to step up if they're to keep their better players.
Even Kane was saying that trophies is what he wants and if in a few years time he doesn't have any it would be interesting.
Won't argue wit you at all we need at least the LC or FA next season, that's minimum if we don't then il worry.
Yes, you did: his goal was to play for the biggest club in the world.
When Spurs lost Bale to RM it's cast as one thing, but then United fans like to cast Ronaldo's departure to RM as something totally different. I expect you'll try and say the same if de Gea follows suit.
Nor have Spurs fallen apart since Bale left for the same club.
We've become title challengers in the 3.5 years since Bale left.
And if letting Bale go only when offered a (then) world-record fee is not doing it on our own terms, then I don't know what is.
Dele Alli will stay for another season, but that will probably be it.
No point for any English club bidding for him since Levy would not entertain offers lower than £100m.
So either he goes abroad or he downs tools, next season is too early for him to down tools, but give it another year without trophies and with sub standard pay and he'll kick up a fuss.
Btw, all of our scouts with the English market as a focus should be sacked. It was bleeding obvious that the kid would be brilliant after he tore us a new one for MK Dons.
No point for any English club bidding for him since Levy would not entertain offers lower than £100m.
So either he goes abroad or he downs tools, next season is too early for him to down tools, but give it another year without trophies and with sub standard pay and he'll kick up a fuss.
Btw, all of our scouts with the English market as a focus should be sacked. It was bleeding obvious that the kid would be brilliant after he tore us a new one for MK Dons.
That comparing Ronaldo to Madrid and Bale to Madrid is fecking hilarious.
One left his club after having won everything while one left to win something.
One left his club after having won everything while one left to win something.
You've still won nothing. One could say you're no better off.
Fact is to be the best you build on the good you have. It's naive to think your star men could go and you'd be fine. You simply wouldn't.
Exactly
only one mistake: won -> win
Ronaldo joined a club that had just got their pants pulled down by Liverpool in the CL.
I haven't said otherwise - I've simply said that IF one of our star players left the impact wouldn't be that big. But none of our star players are about to leave, far less one of them, so the question doesn't even arise.
It's the same old tired narrative from some United fans when it comes to Spurs, except the rationale changes to suit their wishful thinking. When Spurs were mostly finishing outside the top 4 we were supposedly going to have a mass exodus of our best players because we couldn't offer CL football - when in fact we lost only 4 such players over a period of more than 9 years. And now, when we'll be in the CL for the 2nd season running, we're apparently going to have a mass exodus because we don't pay big enough wages.
No doubt if Spurs stay in the top 4 and do start to pay higher wages (following income increase from the new stadium etc), then story will be that we'll face a mass exodus because there are bigger clubs around, or maybe because the year-date contains the number "1" in it , or perhaps because some famous astrologer has predicted it.
No, if you become a regular in the top 4 and start paying PL market wages for your talent then there are no reason they won't stay with you, only reason they might leave would be for a club that almost can guarantee a run at the CL trophy each season like Madrid etc.
You are trying to portray it as if it is us being unrealistic and clutching at straws, but at the same time you are trying to argue that £250k+ talent will be happy with £50-100k, all due to some stadium and the excitement of a project.
Thing is you always argue from the viewpoint of a fan, the players views this as professionals.
Even United back in the day when we were the dogs bollocks wouldn't be able to keep our stars if we paid one third of their market value.
You're obsessed with United and United fans. Genuinely unable to have conversation without mentioning the club.
It's bizarre
If Alli wasn't happy at Spurs he wouldn't have signed a new contract - simple as that. He will be at Spurs next season - and no doubt happy to sign the likely new contract he'll be offered, and no doubt happy to continue with Poch and have another crack at the CL.
All this guff about Alli being unhappy, or soon to leave Spurs, is based on precisely nothing - not even one shred of evidence.
I've said that I'm willing to bet that Alli steps out for Spurs when we start playing in the new stadium ... but there have been no takers so far. How curious.
And the headlines of this morning's rags?
"Eric Dier, Kyle Walker and Danny Rose all want to leave Spurs, with the England trio being targeted by Manchester clubs willing to double their pay packets - and all three are said to be keen to go."
Not saying it was to settle Dele Alli in particular but as i orginally said, it can unsettle all similar players if other clubs cannot/will not pay them what they feel they can earn elsewhere. It's a dirty tactic but gives them the picking of English talent and outprices the owners
In the meantime Ali loses £5m a year by staying at Spurs.
The reality is since the game went professional footballers have followed the money.
Spurs will have to pay up or lose him.
Firstly, this is the sun we are talking about here. Secondly, we are entering silly season when all our players will be linked to other clubs by the media - this happens every year unfortunately and is something as a Spurs fan I have had to get used to. Thirdly, let's wait and see what happens instead of pontificating about things that haven't and may not occur.
Transfer forum will be closed if that is followed. There will be a mass Muppet suicide.
Heh perhaps but that might be better than constantly having to respond to the same stuff every single day due to the media AGAIN trying to sell off our best players to other teams. If they leave they leave, then we can chat about it.
Who the heck is comparing Ronaldo leaving to Bale leaving Spurs? Ronaldo had won everything when he left. Spurs didn't win then and still don't.
You don't have to man, you don't have to respond to rumours posted here.
Fair point.
I will bet with you £100 for this. Deal?
I think Spurs could lose those three without it being disastrous, as they certainly have two good reserve wingers in Davies & Trippier, & Dier isn't that great. Lose Alli or Ericson though & the wheels could start coming off.
I think people here are highly exaggerating the gap between Spurs and the rest of the world when it comes to wages. And if, as seem likely, he does get a deal that puts him in line with the highest earners at the club (around 100k) I don't see how people can claim he is grossly underpaid. Looks to me that even though United pay some ridiculous salaries at the moment, and although some other clubs do this as well with particular players I don't understand the claim that 200k is 'the going rate' for his talent. In fact, only a select few players are earning that kind of money.
Based on what I found only around 20 players in the world earn that type of money, this list is from january 2017:
1 Carlos Tevez Shanghai Shenhua £615,000
2 Oscar Shanghai SIPG £400,000
3 Cristiano Ronaldo Real Madrid £365,000 (after tax)
4 Gareth Bale Real Madrid £350,000
5 Lionel Messi Real Madrid £336,000 (after tax)
6 Hulk FC Barcelona £320,000
7 Paul Pogba Manchester United £290,000
8 Graziano Pelle Shandong Luneng Taishan FC £290,000
9 Neymar FC Barcelona £275,000
10 Wayne Rooney Manchester United £260,000
11 Robin Van Persie Fenerbahçe £240,000
12 Yaya Toure Manchester City £230,000
13 Sergio Agüero Manchester City £230,000
14 Luis Suarez FC Barcelona £230,000
15 Asamoah Gyan Shanghai SIPG £227,000
16 Zlatan Ibrahimovic Manchester United £220,000
17 Ezequiel Lavezzi Hebei China Fortune £220,000
18 David Silva Manchester City £210,000
19 David De Gea Manchester United £200,000
20 Bastian Schweinsteiger Manchester United £200,000
All of them seasoned professionals at a select few clubs. And for other highly rated players, you're more likely to find star players (even in their prime) earning somewhere between 100k and 150k. This includes Griezmann at Atletico, who has survived well on his £112k a week. Robben, Ribery and Levandovsky who are on around £136k a week at Bayern.
In fact, if he does receive this 100k a week contract he will be in line with players like Pedro (100k), Willian (100k) and Kante (110k) at Chelsea. If we speak about other talents then Dybala is on around £51k a week at Juventus, at Real Madrid Morata is on 80k a week, and at Manchester City Lleroy Sane is on 55k a week.
It looks to me like people just assume everyone else pay the type of wages United pay, when the reality is in fact a little different, even for top talents at top clubs. Of course you can find examples of players who are overpaid, but just because Lindgaard suddenly get 100k a week, it doesn't mean Alli would get 200k somewhere, although to be fair, I'm sure he would be offered that at United.