Casemiro, Mane, Van Dijk, just to name some.
Declan Rice
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What about players the fans didn't want who went on to prove them all right? Of which there are dozens. Including some we unfortunately signed.
i wasn't born there and never have actually visited there either so you're point is rather pointless
I wasn’t talking about you, I was talking about Roy Keane. He’s said Rice is the one player in the PL that reminds him the most of himself. But I guess he wouldn’t know.
This is who I asked for. Give me some names that we didn't want that we did sign that turned out rubbish?
I understand Ole's need for a DM. McT is decent but he can't lead the defensive part of CM on his own. Meanwhile Fred reminds me of Robbie Savage, he'll run, harass and tackle for the entire 90 minutes but there's not much football brains in there. Ole is forced to play them together because they are frankly not good enough to do the DM job on their own.
However is Rice the answer to that? I won't debate his skills etc as that is subjective. What I am concerned about is money. We tend to spend roughly 80m-100m a year and we're crap in selling players for a profit. If we buy Rice then that's around 90% of our transfer budget gone. Considering that Pogba would cost us big either way (either in terms of signing on fees/salaries or by having to replace him) then we'll be putting Rice under a huge spotlight having to 'sort' a half baked CM.
If this club was run effectively run then by next year we would be able to make a decision on the GK and the DM positions and then raise funds by selling Henderson or DDG, Fred or McT etc. There again if this club was effectively run then it would have sold the likes of Lingard, Jones and Pogba this summer and would have used the funds to get someone like Neves in.
Should have enquired about Locatelli whilst Juve were piss-arsing about with Sassuolo.
If we wanted someone that was defensively sound, positionally astute with the technical abilities to be able to receive the ball from our centre-backs, dictate play and find players further up the pitch, then he'd have been the perfect candidate. Of course there's no guarantees, look at Aquilani. But I expect him to be a mainstay in that Juve midfield. Such a classy player.
If he had no desire to play anywhere other than Juve, then understandable. But if we passed up on him, only to then go and spunk £70 - £80 on Rice for twice the price, then words fail me.
If we wanted someone that was defensively sound, positionally astute with the technical abilities to be able to receive the ball from our centre-backs, dictate play and find players further up the pitch, then he'd have been the perfect candidate. Of course there's no guarantees, look at Aquilani. But I expect him to be a mainstay in that Juve midfield. Such a classy player.
If he had no desire to play anywhere other than Juve, then understandable. But if we passed up on him, only to then go and spunk £70 - £80 on Rice for twice the price, then words fail me.
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Haaland is available for about £70 million after new years, and Rice should be for £80-90 million. Of course we can afford both (not saying both players will choose to go to us). Should be no problems for us to raise £50-60 million in sales if that is required
Henderson, Williams, Tuanzebe or Bailly, Martial, v.d. Beek - in addition Matic, Cavani at least will free up wages - maybe even Mata (Can't recall if he signed a 1 or 2 year contract). Jones will go - Lingard will probably go. Those 5 players who will leave on free transfers, will alone free up well over £500.000 in wages a week.
Henderson, Williams, Tuanzebe or Bailly, Martial, v.d. Beek - in addition Matic, Cavani at least will free up wages - maybe even Mata (Can't recall if he signed a 1 or 2 year contract). Jones will go - Lingard will probably go. Those 5 players who will leave on free transfers, will alone free up well over £500.000 in wages a week.
The more I see him, the more I like him but he's not 80m. It's a bit like when you are hungry, you become less fussy about what you eat. Some fans are that hungry, will have anything other than McFred, I think Ole is happy to wait, he's watching what he eats......
This thread just refuses to die and I have no idea why. I just want to cry.
A bit dramaticRice is a good player and would come into our current set-up and improve the team.
Anyway the debate on whether he is 'the one' and if there are better options out there will run and run until he does eventually join us or Chelsea or whoever.
So get used to it. We got all season
Left me standing all alone
Alone and crying
Crying
Crying
Crying
It's hard to understand
But the touch of your hand
Can start me crying
Just hold your court mate, then if we did end up signing him, you can sit back reading the 100s of "this guy doesn't do much does he" posts every week and know you were right.
He's Schneiderlin in disguise. Perfectly decent player in a different system, but probably a 5-8th team not top 4 looking upwards.
Not sure I'd go that far but if Scott was in a West Ham shirt, I genuinely think people on here would be talking about buying him. They are both very similar only Scott scores more goals.
Scott has developed massively this last couple of years.
He's gone from looking like a guy only anywhere near due to his exceptional physical stature, and used as some sort of Mourinho political tool, to by far our most improved player.
I'm still hopeful we can groom him to be the missing player we need, but who knows if something like that is realistic.
No but weve really been through so much with shite players and the cafe is still begging for an expensive one. I dont have much left in me if we sign this guy.
No but weve really been through so much with shite players and the cafe is still begging for an expensive one. I dont have much left in me if we sign this guy.
I dont think he is worth the 80 million, thats for certain.
I think it silly to think Haaland will be available for such a low fee, yes he has a release clause but that doesn't mean he'll cost just that. For example he had a release clause at Salzburg around 20M which meant Salzburg got 20M but Dortmund end up paying around 50M between agent fees and signing bonuses.
I think we'll see something similar, 70M to Dortmund and around 50-60 M between Riaola and Alf Inge Haaland.
A Matic Pogba partnership today and people say that they dont see Rice being used as a 'Pogba holder'
what? did he really say that? never saw that quote or conversation
Said it on Sky at the end of last season I believe
He said on Norwegian TV in April/May this year when he was a pundit. Granted, he probably wasn’t talking about quality, merely about playing style. I guess.
Sky? There too? He must really rate Declan since he probably hates him after ditching Irland.
£80-£90 million for Declan rice, oh lord.
You do not pay that for a holding midfielder, ever.
He’s good but I’d consider it a good deal at £50 million and no more, if not then move on.
Fred, Rice, Mctominay, VDB.
I think the above is decent for a team like our with our attacking power once Pogba leaves which looks likely at the end of the season.
Forwards
Ronaldo, Rashford, Bruno, Sancho, Greenwood,
Midfielders
Fred, Rice, Mctominay, VDB.
That’s a good core to work around, need another forward there to be real solid.
You do not pay that for a holding midfielder, ever.
He’s good but I’d consider it a good deal at £50 million and no more, if not then move on.
Fred, Rice, Mctominay, VDB.
I think the above is decent for a team like our with our attacking power once Pogba leaves which looks likely at the end of the season.
Forwards
Ronaldo, Rashford, Bruno, Sancho, Greenwood,
Midfielders
Fred, Rice, Mctominay, VDB.
That’s a good core to work around, need another forward there to be real solid.
watching again today, yes, absolutely there were a couple of isolated incidents on counters where Rice would’ve been helpful, but feck me, I think Phil Jones in DM would’ve helped out in those situations also.
What we so desperately need in that position more than anything is someone who wants to dictate play and tempo. Someone who can quickly switch play, speed up the tempo and move the other team from side to side and around and out of shape.
That’s what’s missing from our team, not a man to stop counters.
What we so desperately need in that position more than anything is someone who wants to dictate play and tempo. Someone who can quickly switch play, speed up the tempo and move the other team from side to side and around and out of shape.
That’s what’s missing from our team, not a man to stop counters.
Him and McTominay are only similar in that they are oldschool British midfielders, big, physical specimens, that's it, Rice is a much better defensive midfielder who's positional sense is excellent, where as McTominay is often positionally suspect but offers a real goal threat from midfield and presses well higher up the pitch.
Pogba has been doing that for us recently. We just need someone who will mop up behind Pogba and Bruno.
Juventus has a tendency of having everything wrapped out with the player months before they actually place a bid. That leaves the seller with barely any room for negotiation. I doubt that Locatelli would have wanted to join us.
For a player who cant pass the ball, the numbers he keep putting up this season is impressive.
Yesterday was another game where he completed 30 % more passes than any other player on the pitch and with a completion rate way higher than his team average. Not only did he make the most passes into the final third of the pitch, he also completed two passes into the penalty area. Might not sound like a big deal, but DMs rarely do (and no player on the pitch completed more passes into the box).
He was also the player who made most progressive passes for WHU and most passes under pressure. He also made the most progressive carries on the pitch.
His passing stats for the small amount of games this season is significant better than Bissouma, and at a similar level as Rodri and Fabinho. But he is arguably more attacking then all of them in his passing (probably abit due to weak opposition, but he does not play for City/LFC either). He makes more passes into the penalty area, more passes into the final third, has a higher xA and more shot and goal creating passes.
Oh, and he is 22. He will improve.
Yesterday was another game where he completed 30 % more passes than any other player on the pitch and with a completion rate way higher than his team average. Not only did he make the most passes into the final third of the pitch, he also completed two passes into the penalty area. Might not sound like a big deal, but DMs rarely do (and no player on the pitch completed more passes into the box).
He was also the player who made most progressive passes for WHU and most passes under pressure. He also made the most progressive carries on the pitch.
His passing stats for the small amount of games this season is significant better than Bissouma, and at a similar level as Rodri and Fabinho. But he is arguably more attacking then all of them in his passing (probably abit due to weak opposition, but he does not play for City/LFC either). He makes more passes into the penalty area, more passes into the final third, has a higher xA and more shot and goal creating passes.
Oh, and he is 22. He will improve.
I don’t think Pogba has at all.
After watching another porous midfield display yesterday where the opposition were having the freedom of Old Trafford to run at the defence.. Rice would definitely be worth £80mill
Obviously I would want him for cheaper.
But my point is, he is what we need.
Young, talented, hungry, with plenty of scope to improve and has leadership qualities.
If we get rice for 70 to 80 quid I’m sure we will all be delighted
I don't understand the underrating of Declan Rice on here. He's a 22 year old dominating midfields in the world's best and toughest league. Just because he's English and got a boring name doesn't mean he's bad. Do you honestly believe the incredibly exotic Eduardo Camavinga would be able to do what he does at the moment? I'm not saying Camavinga doesn't have incredible potential, but let's be honest here, how many "young midfielder gems" has there been from France the last few years who turned out to be underwhelming?
The CM position and the DM in particular is a position where you only get better with experience. Trust me when I say we're not close to seeing the best of Declan Rice yet.
The CM position and the DM in particular is a position where you only get better with experience. Trust me when I say we're not close to seeing the best of Declan Rice yet.
This is just hyperbole
only thing Delcan Rice dominates right now is his plate of food and his bromance with Mason Mount....
Are you saying he’s fat?
What midfield has he dominated? Exaggerations like these are why people don’t even rate him that highly. Hype job in full effect.
Rice is growing on me by the week. Clearly has talent, a great work ethic and seems to have a great character to go with it too. He’s a significant upgrade on what we have now and I don’t doubt he’d be a fantastic signing for us.
Sell Pogba and replace him with Neves?
no...he's not Frank or Shaw
just having a bit of fun with anyone who claims the guy dominates midfields in the prem
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