David Moyes Unemployed | European Champion

Seveneric said:
Moyes going from being mercilessly mocked by the fanbase to people now watching WH with envy will be the most laughably tragic part of all that's happened so far :wenger: :lol:
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I still hate that cnut though... :lol:
But yeah, imagine Moyes & Conte both getting their teams into the CL, whilst United still back Ole...?!!?
 
LawmanMan said:
Not with RVP's injuries that season.
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Universe doesnt work like that. If Fergie had stayed maybe RVP wouldnt have had those injuries. And even with injuries if anyone could won the league that year Fergie certainly could have do it.
 
Real Name said:
Universe doesnt work like that. If Fergie had stayed maybe RVP wouldnt have had those injuries. And even with injuries if anyone could won the league that year Fergie certainly could have do it.
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True, but he would also have no Paul Scholes.

In addition he would be working with Ed Woodward, who is hands down the worst thing to happen to Man Utd. Blame the managers all you like, but Woodward has been a millstone around the club's neck for years. His absolutely dire performance during Moyes' first window effectively doomed him from the get go. If he had put in a decent bid for Baines and Fellaini we would have solved a big problem, the left back position.

People might blame Moyes for that, but I remember well that Ed was trying to haggle with all the major clubs like he was a market trader and it meant we wasted so much time.
 
LawmanMan said:
True, but he would also have no Paul Scholes.

In addition he would be working with Ed Woodward, who is hands down the worst thing to happen to Man Utd. Blame the managers all you like, but Woodward has been a millstone around the club's neck for years. His absolutely dire performance during Moyes' first window effectively doomed him from the get go. If he had put in a decent bid for Baines and Fellaini we would have solved a big problem, the left back position.

People might blame Moyes for that, but I remember well that Ed was trying to haggle with all the major clubs like he was a market trader and it meant we wasted so much time.
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Scholes barely played in 12/13.

Left back wasn't a huge priority Evra played at a high level for another few years at Juve. Central midfield, centreback and a winger were more needed.
 
He was never given enough time or support by the club and the pressure to succeed was immense, he visibly aged 5 years in10 months.

At West Ham he did a decent enough job first time around but having saved them from relegation he was let go after his temporary 6 month contract expired. A lot off the fans expected him to stay at the time, but the club went for a bigger name with a proven track record, Pelligrini who failed to live up to expectations. Since his return he has rediscovered himself and West Ham are flying and nobody should begrudge him that.

I think it is fair to say that expectations are so high at Utd that any manager who does not win trophies is unlikely to last and the personal pressure is enormous. At West Ham being in contention is a novelty and he is being lauded as the Moysiah by their fans. Good luck to him, he is certainly a better fit with them than us.
 
stevoc said:
Scholes barely played in 12/13.

Left back wasn't a huge priority Evra played at a high level for another few years at Juve. Central midfield, centreback and a winger were more needed.
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Evra was finished as a Premier League left back and Buttner was awful.
 
LawmanMan said:
Evra was finished as a Premier League left back and Buttner was awful.
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Nah I disagree he played another two high level years at Juve, winning the double twice and getting to the CL final. Fergie would have got another year out of him at least. Plus Baines while a good player, at 28 wasn't much of an upgrade on an aging Evra anyway.
 
stevoc said:
Nah I disagree he played another two high level years at Juve, winning the double twice and getting to the CL final. Fergie would have got another year out of him at least. Plus Baines while a good player, at 28 wasn't much of an upgrade on an aging Evra anyway.
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Yeah, in the less intense Serie A. The Premier League is a whole different ball game. If he hadn't been finished he wouldn't have been allowed to leave. The whole defensive unit was in need of replacement due to age.

Sure, he could perform for a lower tier team in the league, but his greatness had rescinded.
 
I always thought of Moyes as a very good manager, better than most in the business, but just clearly not good job for a huge job like the Man Utd one, especially following on Ferguson.

There's no shame in that. Many people could only dream of being good enough to manage clubs like Everton and West Ham anywhere near as well as he has done in the Premier League, or even Preston like he did pre-Everton (he took them from struggling in the 3rd tier to one game away from the Premier League). When he got the Everton job, they looked a complete shambles and were involved in a relegation dog-fight.
 
LawmanMan said:
Yeah, in the less intense Serie A. The Premier League is a whole different ball game. If he hadn't been finished he wouldn't have been allowed to leave. The whole defensive unit was in need of replacement due to age.

Sure, he could perform for a lower tier team in the league, but his greatness had rescinded.
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He wasn't 'allowed' to leave so much as he wanted to leave. The club triggered his extension shortly before he did leave. Plus we were speculating on 13/14 not the season after.

And yeah he had declined from the player he was but Baines was never on that level either. He would have only been a short term signing.
 
Anyone who thinks that Fergie wouldn't have won the league the next year(2013-14), or at the very least have made it close, seriously underestimates him.
 
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It is crazy how everyone turns to shit for us both managers and players. Apart from Bruno has anyone post SAF actually reached their potential with us that we signed for big money or put big faith in?

We have Depay that failed. Mata and Fellaini I say failed a bit although did ok at times.Sanchez massive fail. Lukaku fail. Mkhitaryan fail. Di Maria and Falcao huge fail. Current players like Sancho, Donny, Bailly and Maguire big fail. Pogba a fail even though he got his good moments.

Even the likes of Darmian and Blind did better after they left us.

Moyes obviously failed, but something is wrong with our structure.
 
Paul_Scholes18 said:
It is crazy how everyone turns to shit for us both managers and players. Apart from Bruno has anyone post SAF actually reached their potential with us that we signed for big money or put big faith in?
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Poor current form aside, I think Shaw definitely has justified his(25 million?) price tag. Herrera was also a decent player for us. I don't think he was better before or after leaving us.

As for the academy: Rashford and Greenwood have been good. It's definitely been worthwhile playing them so frequently.

I know that you wrote "potential", but Zlatan and Cavani on a free was good business. The same will probably be true for Ronaldo(although he wasn't free).
 
OleBoiii said:
Anyone who thinks that Fergie wouldn't have won the league the next year(2013-14), or at the very least have made it close, seriously underestimates him.
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Indeed but think about the thread we're in. It doesn't fit into the narrative that Moyes took over a finished/mid-table side that couldn't possibly have finished in the top 4.
 
OleBoiii said:
Anyone who thinks that Fergie wouldn't have won the league the next year(2013-14), or at the very least have made it close, seriously underestimates him.
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Probably the title of 2015-16 as well, with some new faces; eventually, he would have been swallowed up by Pep and Klopp, but he would have triumphed over post-2015 Mou, Pellegrini, Ranieri, Poch, or even Conte with relative ease.
 
OleBoiii said:
Anyone who thinks that Fergie wouldn't have won the league the next year(2013-14), or at the very least have made it close, seriously underestimates him.
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But Moyes was also SAF's first choice to replace him, so his judgement must have been very flawed if Moyes was as bad as many make him out to be on this forum.
 
Maniron said:
But Moyes was also SAF's first choice to replace him, so his judgement must have been very flawed if Moyes was as bad as many make him out to be on this forum.
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Alex Ferguson was a genius but even he got things wrong and towards the end of his career his judgement was suspect at times. His prediction that Phil Jones could be the greatest player in the clubs history, his claim that Nick Powell would definitely be a top player and his belief that Moyes was in any way cut out to manage Manchester United highlight this. But he still way more right than he did wrong.
 
Made some ballsy attacking changes when Zouma went down and took the game to the league leaders.

Moyes the Mad.
 
Done well on the whole against last season's top 7 so far:

Wins:
4-1 v Leicester City (h)
1-0 v Tottenham Hotspur (h)
3-2 v Liverpool (h)
3-2 v Chelsea (h)

Losses:
2-1 v Man Utd (h)
2-1 v Man City (a)

Second half of the season though they're going to be away a lot.
 
He's doing some job over there. Fair play to him, didn't think he had it in him.
 
OleBoiii said:
Anyone who thinks that Fergie wouldn't have won the league the next year(2013-14), or at the very least have made it close, seriously underestimates him.
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I think it's a lot more straight forward than that:

Moyes tried to refresh the club, starting with the staff, from day one. He also didn't get the desired transfers in. So starting off there was massive internal unrest. And frankly, the players didn't trust him or respect him. He was doomed from that day one.
 
I'm honestly really glad for him. This has been an incredible comeback for his career and he deserves it.
 
mu4c_20le said:
Made some ballsy attacking changes when Zouma went down and took the game to the league leaders.

Moyes the Mad.
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Then he quickly senses that it doesn't work and reverts to a back 5 with Rice. His game management is so underrated.
 
Ted Lasso said:
I think it's a lot more straight forward than that:

Moyes tried to refresh the club, starting with the staff, from day one. He also didn't get the desired transfers in. So starting off there was massive internal unrest. And frankly, the players didn't trust him or respect him. He was doomed from that day one.
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Word around the club was that he was pretty arrogant at the time. Maybe he's evolved now, or found his level again.
 
His managerial career nearly ruined by poor choices following Utd.

Utd clearly too big for him but of course he had to try. But after that going to Sociedad and Sunderland were awful career moves for him and they ruined his reputation far more than his time at Utd.

What we are seeing now is Everton part 2 and this West Ham side look even better than his Everton’s teams
 
Damien said:
Done well on the whole against last season's top 7 so far:

Wins:
4-1 v Leicester City (h)
1-0 v Tottenham Hotspur (h)
3-2 v Liverpool (h)
3-2 v Chelsea (h)

Losses:
2-1 v Man Utd (h)
2-1 v Man City (a)

Second half of the season though they're going to be away a lot.
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Also beaten City on penalties this season.
 
mu4c_20le said:
Word around the club was that he was pretty arrogant at the time. Maybe he's evolved now, or found his level again.
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Hes found his level. It's a completely different job being an Everton or West Ham, and punching above your weight, compared to being Man United and expecting to be around the top.
 
can we sue moyes under the trades description act?
 
Said he'd be capable of doing the same thing he did at Everton again at a similar level club if given a little time while he was condemned and derided to hell. Some jobs are a hiding to nothing like Sunderland or his trip to Spain. I argued his time at Everton should not be ignored but some wouldn't have it.
 
The premier league is his bread and butter and he can do a good job over the long term building but let's be honest he is not on the level of a klopp, conte, pep, tuchel or potchettino and even mourinho.
 
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