Weill said
David de Gea has left Manchester United
- Thread starter Tom Van Persie
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I wonder if it's simply a case of him enjoying an extended long honeymoon and possibly being advised by his agent to be patient as an offer will come matching the salary and project he's looking for (and I'm assuming he's being realistic in that).
It is slightly baffling that no one has signed him up on a free yet though as he's still got plenty too offer a club. In theory he's got what, 5-8+ years left in him as a keeper.
Given that Madrid is now off the table, my bet would be a short term contract with Bayern given that they are also in need of a keeper until Neuer sorts his leg issue out.
And as @RVN1991 said, the slating of him on here is pathetic. Seemed a nice bloke, never caused any issues and produced some memorable moment
It is slightly baffling that no one has signed him up on a free yet though as he's still got plenty too offer a club. In theory he's got what, 5-8+ years left in him as a keeper.
Given that Madrid is now off the table, my bet would be a short term contract with Bayern given that they are also in need of a keeper until Neuer sorts his leg issue out.
And as @RVN1991 said, the slating of him on here is pathetic. Seemed a nice bloke, never caused any issues and produced some memorable moment
I haven't followed the thread but I keep reading from certain posters who uses phrases like ddg haters and ddg bashing like we saw thrown around on the performance thread last season ? I honestly don't see that.
Unless we're equating pointing out his weaknesses as bashing / hating / agenda again?
He was a good servant for us, but that is only half the story. He wanted to leave in 2015 right? And because that didn't happen he was given a new contract.
The issue was incompetence by united to give him that next (last) contract on those wages (there wasn't really big interest in him around this time either and no need to offer him more than double of what the next keeper was earning) which Basically made us stuck with him. I remember Jose questioning this as a pundit on sky too.
2018 was the right time for him to leave / be transitioning out.
His 2014-17 run was really good. 11-13 was potential for what I thought was moving to a ball playing keeper because his passing was decent at the time under Fergie (it has regressed a lot since then, I think mostly due to coaching)
A lot is said about GK role changing which is a problem for ddg, but the main fundamentals are still there for any top keeper to have and apart from shot stopping (which has declined) ddg was always below par on the other parts.
He did well for himself and he got some good achievements with us. But he's been very lucky that we've gone through a huge number of managerial changes post Fergie. It's not a surprise he hasn't been snapped up straight away, and the potential wage demand is only one part of it
Unless we're equating pointing out his weaknesses as bashing / hating / agenda again?
He was a good servant for us, but that is only half the story. He wanted to leave in 2015 right? And because that didn't happen he was given a new contract.
The issue was incompetence by united to give him that next (last) contract on those wages (there wasn't really big interest in him around this time either and no need to offer him more than double of what the next keeper was earning) which Basically made us stuck with him. I remember Jose questioning this as a pundit on sky too.
2018 was the right time for him to leave / be transitioning out.
His 2014-17 run was really good. 11-13 was potential for what I thought was moving to a ball playing keeper because his passing was decent at the time under Fergie (it has regressed a lot since then, I think mostly due to coaching)
A lot is said about GK role changing which is a problem for ddg, but the main fundamentals are still there for any top keeper to have and apart from shot stopping (which has declined) ddg was always below par on the other parts.
He did well for himself and he got some good achievements with us. But he's been very lucky that we've gone through a huge number of managerial changes post Fergie. It's not a surprise he hasn't been snapped up straight away, and the potential wage demand is only one part of it
It simply highlighted our bad management of overrating players contract demand.
We're too scared they move on and giving them astronomical wages. While in truth nobody would want them on that salary.
We're too scared they move on and giving them astronomical wages. While in truth nobody would want them on that salary.
Please no need to slate him. He walks away tall. Its over. Lets start slating Onana at least the man is still here.
Not all that baffling when you look at how his goalkeeping stats compare to other keepers in the league. He’s bang average (at best) and will have to take an enormous pay cut if he is going to be paid the same as other keepers with the same quality. Hence the stand off.
I reckon a bid from Saudi is inevitable. They will value him as a big name far higher than whatever he brings in a football sense. Just remains to be seen if he’s willing to move there.
He’s probably waiting until the end of the window. As we’ve seen, if big clubs get an injury to their number 1, they’re willing to jump in the market for a quick fix where possible. De Gea has largely been overlooked so far but he’ll probably land something mid table somewhere at some point, either than or Saudi Arabia and he’s holding out for that.
Ddg has already left and people are still going after him. Mct Fred maguire, when they all go, most of us, not all of course ad evidenced by this thread, will wish them well and any criticism of how they aren't good enough for united will stop, because they no longer play for united.Same for McTom.
Wonder if any here supporting de Gea are slagging off McTom in his transfer thread?
Last season he had the most clean sheets in the league . Others weren’t even close re that stat .Only City and Newcastle let in less and sorry your defence really wasn’t the best .
Yes he will no doubt have to take a pay cut but the suggestion he is bang average beggars belief . Yes he has mistakes in him , just as is every keeper does and maybe he isn’t the best with his feet but he is a very decent keeper who for me whose only real problem was his confidence
He is literally bang average. Look up his stats (individual stats, not team stats)
Average for a premier league goalkeeper maybe, but some in here mither on like he's non league standard.
I think clubs don't want him because he'll be on a massive wage and he's been on decline for years now. He's an expensive short term solution and for a GK that's not worth it.
Only Saudi move makes sense.
Only Saudi move makes sense.
He's on £0 a week right now after being on £375k a week for the last 5 years. I don't think he's looking for silly money anymore unless he's going to Saudi Arabia.
Clean sheets are really not that relevant to judge a performance of a goalkeeper. Think about it for just over a minute and you will find out.
Goalkeepers that have the best balance of relatively preventing goals, and creating goals are the best (just as any other position really). Clean sheets are quite a poor way of measuring that.
Goalkeepers that have the best balance of relatively preventing goals, and creating goals are the best (just as any other position really). Clean sheets are quite a poor way of measuring that.
Didnt we offer him a lower contract? I feel like if he was fine with it and being the 2nd choice he would still be here while we offload the other GKs.
Going by your logic, nobody can slate vdb, fred, bebe or any footballers at all off because “they accomplished more in their trade than any of the buffoons slating them off.”
It’s just football, to quote yourself. Get a grip.
On a scale of 1 to 10 how happy you would have been with him being signed on let us say 150-200k as a first team GK for Chelsea?
Not to pick on you, it is just that I noticed that there were plenty of opposition fans who said how well Ole performed and then how good Ronaldo still was and how misused he was at United etc etc - but very few of them would take either of them as manager/striker even on much reduced wages that their respective clubs could pay (even if their clubs were weaker than United). I sense that it might be the same with DDG.
De Gea doesn't even play for us anymore and there's still people going at him, it's the same thing whenever anyone brings up ole, you know there's going to be an asshole commenting on how "he's the worst manager ever", it's disgusting especially since it overshadows everything positive he did for the club as a player.
Don't mind players or managers getting criticized for poor performances, but do we really need to continue once the player or manager leaves the club? Especially when they've been a fine servant for a decade plus?
Try reading my post again.
My comment was disagreeing with the suggestion that his stats were poor and that he is a bang average goalkeeper.
The simple fact Is save two games where Liverpool scored 7 and City scored 6 in 36 league games he let in 30. Those two games were more about how poor Utd were as a team and not him as just one part of that team
No doubt there are all sorts of stats and numbers that can be produced to highlight how poor he performed but no matter how you interpret the numbers their primary job of a keeper is to stop the opposition from scoring
Were there better keepers ? Without doubt. Was he worth the pay ? Probably not but at the point the contract was signed Utd clearly thought he was
As for him being Chelsea’s number one I can think of far worse options as for what he would be paid based wouldn’t be happy with the sort of numbers he was said to have been paid at Utd but as I said I my earlier post a pay cut seems likely
That’s such a simplistic take. Keeper A faces 20 shots and makes 18 great saves, conceding two goals. Over the same number of games, Keeper B faces 5 shots, makes 4 easy saves and lets in 1 goal. Your logic has Keeper B as the better player.
Which is exactly why we have much more useful stats to analyse keepers, taking factors like these into account. Stats that prove DDG really was a bang average PL keeper. And that’s being kind. His stats were closer to the statistically worst keepers than they were to the best.
This is not "De Gea appreciation thread". Maybe you should go there instead of coming here and forbidding people to give their opinions on a bad football player just because he's richer than them. Ever thought maybe those so-called "losers" accomplished much more than you in real life ? IMHO people who thought De Gea was a fantastic servant don't possess the ability to think rationally, therefore cannot accomplish much in their trade.
No you are using stats that likewise can be read another way
For instance Keeper A plays for the worse team in the league and as such faces 30 shots the majority bread and butter saves but in letting two in by way of mistakes his stats when read in a certain way which some say are better than your Keeper B who again plays for a for better team meaning he doesn’t get called Into action as often and those bread and butter saves just don’t exist in the same number makes so faces five bread and butter saves but is beaten by a penalty.
I am pretty sure that Ramsdales current stats at Arsenal ,the sort you are relying on were better at Sheffield Utd than they are at Arsenal.
What amazes me in this is that I as a Chelsea supporter am standing up for a Utd player who has been a very decent player for Utd. Was he world class ? Probably not but I go back to my point to tag him as having been bang average is just wrong on so many levels for one and totally disrespectful for someone who played in excess of 400 first team games at Utd and 40+ games for Spain
But you did mind when his poor performances were criticised. You were adamant the was still a top keeper, adamant he’d be kept as number one and adamant if he did leave he’d get a top club. You and quite a few others were quite vocal with anyone who dared criticise him, so now all of their predictions seem to be coming true don’t be surprised to see people in this thread essentially saying ‘I told you so’, after being treated like they’re clueless for months.
Yeah, i agree with a lot of that. He has been a great servant of the club and he has given us the best years of his career. During that time, he was one of our top performers the last time we won the league (behind RvP and Carrick) and he saved at least two underperforming managers' arses with his saves.
I believe that he really missed a trick when LvG wanted him to add things to his game and he didn't like it a bit. It would have helped him significantly now. A friend of mine described him (not in a degrading way, but in terms of style) as a small club keeper who plays at a big club. He'll give you the big saves, enough to be seen as a hero for a team that's struggling on the pitch (and we've been that more often than not), but offer no actual relief to his teammates. I saw a post the other day claiming that United should have conceded about 10 more goals in the xG models and Dave, unlike previous seasons, barely contributed to that. So, you must understand the need for a change.
I also think that the "hate" he gets is more than anything else a sign of irritation for the way the club has been run in the last decade. It was bad judgement on the club's behalf to make him the highest earner (as a goalie) in the world when it was pretty clear that the role of the GK had changed. Maguire's predicament is similar. It was also wrong to indulge his every wish to keep him here instead of urging him to improve as a player. Again, he's not the only player who has been "cuddled" too much in the post-SAF era. Anyway, wish him the best. I would like to see him in Spain or in Italy.
I believe that he really missed a trick when LvG wanted him to add things to his game and he didn't like it a bit. It would have helped him significantly now. A friend of mine described him (not in a degrading way, but in terms of style) as a small club keeper who plays at a big club. He'll give you the big saves, enough to be seen as a hero for a team that's struggling on the pitch (and we've been that more often than not), but offer no actual relief to his teammates. I saw a post the other day claiming that United should have conceded about 10 more goals in the xG models and Dave, unlike previous seasons, barely contributed to that. So, you must understand the need for a change.
I also think that the "hate" he gets is more than anything else a sign of irritation for the way the club has been run in the last decade. It was bad judgement on the club's behalf to make him the highest earner (as a goalie) in the world when it was pretty clear that the role of the GK had changed. Maguire's predicament is similar. It was also wrong to indulge his every wish to keep him here instead of urging him to improve as a player. Again, he's not the only player who has been "cuddled" too much in the post-SAF era. Anyway, wish him the best. I would like to see him in Spain or in Italy.
Its sad that DDG stock has fallen so much that he is not being able to sign anywhere on a free. United didn't handle this well at all, and its on us as well.
Typically, clubs tell players around Feb-March that the contract will not be renewed. We offered DDG terms, which he was considering, and we never told him to find another club. The most that was said on the topic is that, next season, he may not be automatic no.1 because we will bring in a goalkeeper that can compete. We need 2 players for each position.
The fact that DDG accepted the lower wages, and then we rescinded the contract would have been the point where his agent would have started looking for an alternative. Given all the public drama that played out with his contract, any club will now think a bit before getting him on, and DDG has to also see if he wants to play his football at that club. These things take time, and I will be surprised if he signs somewhere before the last week of the window.
Typically, clubs tell players around Feb-March that the contract will not be renewed. We offered DDG terms, which he was considering, and we never told him to find another club. The most that was said on the topic is that, next season, he may not be automatic no.1 because we will bring in a goalkeeper that can compete. We need 2 players for each position.
The fact that DDG accepted the lower wages, and then we rescinded the contract would have been the point where his agent would have started looking for an alternative. Given all the public drama that played out with his contract, any club will now think a bit before getting him on, and DDG has to also see if he wants to play his football at that club. These things take time, and I will be surprised if he signs somewhere before the last week of the window.
These people are still trying to convince themselves that they were right.
I wanted him gone for ages, was sick of looking at him avoid all contact, not bother to come take claimable balls out of the air and just generally be poor at everything aside from pulling off the odd wonder save.
DDG will probably not get to be first choice at a top club, because no top club needs him and nobody wants a keeper with his style and quite obvious limitations anymore. I'll be very suprised if he does and even more surprised if he all of a sudden changes his whole style to become a more vocal and proactive keeper.
He's either going to end up in SA on a huge contract or he'll end up at some mid table Spanish team on about a quarter of the wages he had at Utd.
If people are happy to see gushing praise and rose-tinted reminiscences in this thread, they can't be upset when they see a bit of criticism in response.
De Gea these days is an above average shot-stopper who is poor at sweeping, distribution, communicating with his defence, worst in the league at dealing with crosses, and has a nasty habit of making mistakes in the bigger games.
He had a good five or six year where he was probably one of the best shot-stoppers in the history of the sport, so good that most would agree it made up for his weaknesses. But he hasn't been remotely the same since he utterly shit the bed for Spain in the 2018 World Cup. The fact that it was such a sudden drop of form means you may well be right that the issue was confidence (or lack thereof) rather than any physical or technical issue, but the fact that it's now went on for five years means that this is how he's judged now. Hell, in at least two of those years he wasn't even 'above average' in his shot-stopping, albeit he's recovered slightly in the last two seasons. Other than perhaps Spurs, every other team in the top 10 last season would have laughed in our faces if we'd offered a direct swap with their #1, even ignoring the wages.
I appreciate the good times we had with De Gea from 2013-2018, but I'll also acknowledge how much of a weakness he's been since. As much as it saddens me it's not a surprise at all that he's struggling to find a new club.
His stats are actually surprising compared to Onana's. As in Onana isn't as good as actually goalkeeping in comparison to a declining De Gea.
That’s the crux of the issue though right, what is a modern goalkeeper and what do they need to be good at? De Gea definitely isn’t a modern keeper.
I read somewhere that he's looking for at least 150k and he's rejected an offer around the 80k mark.
Btw as he is no longer a United player shouldn't this topic be in another forum?
Btw as he is no longer a United player shouldn't this topic be in another forum?
Very well put.
Some excellent points here. I blame the club a lot more than him for allowing Hoek to be pushed out and his mate brought in. Of course, that coincided with bringing in a manager who wasn’t interested in retaining possession and simply instructed him to hoof the ball hard and long; something that he hadn’t been inclined to do up to then.
I think that ETH genuinely believed that there was a chance that the bad habits that had become established since Jose’s appointment could be coached out. Sadly they seem to have become too deeply ingrained.
Not sure he will get 150k in Europe. For that, i think he needs to look to a different continent. Money or football.
Onana’s stats are as good or better across the board.
Crux of the matter is De Gea at this stage is a Bang Average Keeper who was always lacking in basics which just can't be ignored anymore due to his decline in the areas where he used to excel , A good keeper with sound fundamentals can still be accommodated had De Gea being one United could have easily deferred Buying Keeper for another year or so .
That is true (if by goalkeeping you simply mean shot-stopping) if looking purely at their league performances last season. Open it up to their performances in Europe as well and it swings back Onana's way.
What should be remembered is that because of his ban and then issues at Ajax, Onana had barely played for 18 months at the time he joined Inter. My hope is that his drop in shot-stopping last season (his stats were always much better in his full seasons at Ajax) is due to him taking a while to get going after that 18 months out, and that now he'll be back to his earlier form. Obviously though I'm going purely off stats as I never really watched him play at either Inter or Ajax.
I don't think that's true. Fbref has Onana down as a better save % last season, as well as better PSxG-GA
Onana is better across the board statistically.
Some of you have a very distorted view of current day De Gea.
Save percentage yes, but De Gea had better PSxG-GA when looking just at the league (in the 61st percentile compared to Onana only being in the 42nd). When including Europe then Onana improved significantly up to the 80th percentile while De Gea rises to 70th.
Onana only played 24 league games, which is why it could change so dramatically when including those extra 13 games he played in the CL.
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