Yeah they do. I read that he's scored 6 goals in 6 games for Portugal.
Cristiano Ronaldo
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Yeah they do. I read that he's scored 6 goals in 6 games for Portugal.
What is GOAT? I'm thinking a slightly more agile sheep...
He will definitely be in that bracket when he finish.
It is madness, really, that he has kept up his 1:1 record at Real for four years.
Ah, thank you - somehow I think I should have cracked that one. So much for that mensa membership...
At one of the biggest clubs in the world and not even playing as a striker, it truly is one of the most sensational records. He has already scored more than Rooney has at United in less than half the amount of time. Also saying he isn't a truly great footballer is quite frankly ignorant, when he has everything in his locker.
Don't beat yourself up about it. In my Mensa application they asked me what LOL stood for. Hadn't a clue but it did make me laugh out loud.
Regardless whether he may or may not be the GOAT i'd have in back at United in an instance. Superb player.
No need to get your knickers in a twist. No one is saying that he not a great footballer. Just that he is not
great enough yet to be in that top bracket of the likes Pele, Maradona, Cruyff, Beckenbauer, Messi ect.
,
Someone before said there's a difference between being a great goalscorer and being a great footballer, implying he wasn't one, so don't be patronizing.
The implication is a figment of your imagination.The poster quite clearly pointed out, that the difference was between being one of the greatest goal scorers, with being one of the greatest footballers.
Not whether Ronaldo is or not a great footballer.
That's what a 3 day drinking binge does to you, makes you read things quit differently.
It must be JaffyJoes views which got me onto that thought, even though he was referring to his impact in big games.
It must be JaffyJoes views which got me onto that thought, even though he was referring to his impact in big games.
Tis was me.
Is correct. This is exactly what i meant and clearly clarified when I posted - responding to the exact question.
I was corrected, and I accepted it. Let's move on now
2 of them on your list separates from the rest => Maradona and Pele them the rest with the names above then Ronaldo would have to be there as well (fat Ronaldo stays in third place easily).
Ronaldo is better than Van Basten, up there with Muller, but that is his echelon. He could score a thousand goals and that would still be his echelon. True goats have more to their game than what Ronaldo has. Maybe if he re-discovered his 06-07 self that was full of flair and teamplay, kept up his goalscoring and developed his 06-07 like self to an even higher level, he'd be one of the GOATS.
Even then, he'd still be inferior to Messi, but he'd be in the same echelon.
Even then, he'd still be inferior to Messi, but he'd be in the same echelon.
Can't follow the logic in that. I bet you'd say the same about Pele if he was playing today.
No. But I definitely would class Muller in the echelon below Pele and Maradona, no matter how many goals he scored.
Pele made that huge step from a truely great player to greatest of all time in 1970 when he wasn't the main goalscorer but the playmaker, the one the team was built around, the one who made arguably the best nationalteam of all time tick. Pele himself tries to seperate himself from Madonna by talking about his more than 1000 goals, but his role in 1970 is the reason why he's up there with Maradona, the goals wouldn't be enough.
Careful guys, you'll upset the fanbois by bringing a bit of realism and logic to this thread.
Would be some player. I think that sort of Ronaldo would clearly be the best player in the world at the moment to be honest, with him being only a fraction behind Messi of 08-11 in terms of quality.
Still can't believe serious comparisons have been drawn between Ronaldo 06/07 and Bale on here! That player was fecking awesome. I wasn't around for Giggs' early years but I've never seen Old Trafford get like that about a player. He wouldn't need to go further than that flair and teamplay; he'd just need to add it to what he has now, even if was at the cost of 10 or so goals.
Interesting point, which does go against my existing thoughts on Pele.
I've obviously only ever seen the standard highlights, but from what I had gathered a lot of his reputation was linked to goalscoring rather than incredible magical skills - hence why a lot of Brazillians apparently prefer Garrincha, who was meant to be magical. Which is in no way to portray him as some some of lumbering goal-hanger or lineker-esque poacher - he was clearly a genuinely goat and a genius in anybody's book, but I would have put the balance between, if you like "magic" and goals towards the goals in his case, much as you might with Ronaldo. Whereas a Maradonna or a Best might only score a goal every other game or less, but possibly "dazzled" more with their ability.
However, I hadn't really looked at his role in the 1970 team as being defining to his legacy, which is potentially a very good point.
There is certainly the argument that Ronaldo can't be a goat until he dominates and lights up a World Cup, or at least Euro Champs. But it's dodgy ground, as you're ruling Messi out with him on that basis, not to mention Best.
They're not really basing it on solely a WC though tbf. They're basing it on "more than just goals" iirc - all round play, influence, playmaking etc.
That sums it up pretty nicely.
Oh and they don't mean he's a rich man's Mario Gomez when they say that either.
Messi has an entire team playing for him while Ronaldo plays for a team where almost every player plays for himself, that helps widening the gap between Messi and Ronaldo. Messi is better but saying that Ronaldo influence in the game is limited when he has been carrying Real on his back for four years its a bit stupid when he has one goal for game ratio since he joined Madrid and has assists in double digits in the last three or four years too, then you have idiots saying that Gerrard and Kaka are better big game players than Ronaldo FFS, what have those two done in the last four years that make them even close to ronaldo's level?
With Ronaldo its always polemic
With Ronaldo its always polemic
I'm not only talking about "magic", playmaking is so much more than that. Pele was always a very efficient Brazilian, that didn't change in 1970. I once read what made him in 1970 so special was that he mastered the easy things like no one else before and that that simple yet brilliant 5 yard pass to Carlos Alberto for the 4-1 in the final showed perfectly what made him the outstanding player of that tournament. That sums it up perfectly, imo. He was the one player who connected everyone else. As talented as that squad was, they needed someone to turn that magic into success and he was the one in the middle or like someone wrote in this thread a few weeks ago, the catalyst for that team to become the greatest international side of all time. Of course he also was individually brilliant, but his understanding of the game, the way he knew everything about his teammates, about their movement and their abilities was maybe even more important. You can say something similar about Maradona, Cruyff, Beckenbauer, di Stefano.
Ronaldo hasn't done anything like that, in fact, he's not even trying. Since he joined Real, the team looked broken, they lacked a connection between defense and attack and he might not be part of the problem, if you accept that his goals are worth his freedom and the rest of the team should make it work, but he certainly isn't part of the solution either and that simply wouldn't be the case with one of the contenders for greatest of all time in the team. He still has enough time to change it, that's why I really don't like judging players before their career is over. A lot of great players reinvented themselves later in their career.
Ah... so Paul Scholes, basically?
. Go watch some of those games, it's worth it.So, is C.Ronaldo the greatest non playmaking footballer of all time? Or one of?
I have. Light years of distance between the 2 players. Seeing this isn't a Bale thread...
Adding the flair and "team play" to his game wouldn't change a thing about Real's chances at winning La Decima or any other significant trophy in the near future.
Being a better team player would considerably enhance Real Madrid's chances of silverware. Even just tracking back and, for example, not leaving Lahm free to assist Gomez's goal a couple of seasons ago would have helped Real Madrid.
When a team is underperforming, you don't blame the guy who's bagging a shitload of goals as much as you blame the spastics who couldn't defend a sunday league game properly if their lives depended on it
Classic. The one who puts in the most effort and carries the team almost single handedly is the one who is not a 'team player' because he didn't track back in some game where as so many other jokers and prima donnas in that team can't do their basic jobs properly and are more interested in shitty politics, costing team games and hence trophies. All of you going on about this team player thing, I want to hear how many of you think Messi would have scored and influenced more in terms of trophies had he been playing in Ronaldo's role and in the circus that is Real Madrid.Another funny argument: GOATs have that something special additional to their game which Ronaldo doesn't. Like feck they have. What is it? Some mystical thing where you can rubbish the other person in argument by saying, "you won't understand. You got to know the game to truly see it?" If that 's the case I want videos of the so called magic/mystical things these GOATs did on pitch and I will post matching videos of things which ROnaldo has done which those GOATs didn't. He just scores shitload of goals but does nothing else. Yeah, because that is the simplest thing to do in football for a player who is not a striker.
Indeed.
Messi has an entire team playing for him while Ronaldo plays for a team where almost every player plays for himself, that helps widening the gap between Messi and Ronaldo. Messi is better but saying that Ronaldo influence in the game is limited when he has been carrying Real on his back for four years its a bit stupid when he has one goal for game ratio since he joined Madrid and has assists in double digits in the last three or four years too, then you have idiots saying that Gerrard and Kaka are better big game players than Ronaldo FFS, what have those two done in the last four years that make them even close to ronaldo's level?
With Ronaldo its always polemic
I assume that is a WUM because nobody is that dumb. Gerrard's game against West ham ffs as an example.
Mentioning Gerrard in a thread about Ronaldo and GOATs itself is a big joke.There's more to football than just goals. The players considered as some of the best ever have earned that status for more than just their goal scoring records.
It's why talk of Messi or Ronaldo being amongst the best ever is premature, at best.
Yes, the mystical..'more than just goals.' Can you prove it objectively?
There's nothing 'mystical' about it. Ronaldinho never got close to scoring the amount of goals Ronaldo has, yet the majority will consider him as the better player.
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