[Iker Quesadillas]

By all means, replace the entire team with "hard workers" who run around a lot and see what happens.

The goals will just materialize, apparently, since that's the easy part.

 

[KeanoMagicHat]

Real Madrid lost him at the same time, and scored way fewer goals (94 to 63). How do you square these two facts? Is Ronaldo the quantum footballer?

I accept that point, I'd say that Ronaldo at Real Madrid had a system based around him for 10 years and didn't have a player to replace him in that system. Juventus he came into a new system and it was disrupted the balance of the rest of the team in favour of him, similar thing is happening at United.

 

[diawl_coch]

I wish he'd never come back.
The shenanigans over the No 7 shirt, the fact the rest of the team is carrying him, the fact he's disturbed the team psychological balance.

 

[Nytram Shakes]

By all means, replace the entire team with "hard workers" who run around a lot and see what happens.

The goals will just materialize, apparently, since that's the easy part.

Or you know be more like Cavani who works hard and scores

 

[Deery]

No Bruno didn't press, Greenwood pressed to stop the ball playing CB'S having a freedom to pick whoever they want in midfield for the first goal.

It is so weird how you are having a go for Bruno for neglecting his position or some shit but nothing for Ronaldo for not pressing. Are you going to blame Ronaldo for neglecting his position too? Because he is doing that you know.

All he has to do is sit between van dijk and the other CB and yet he can't even do that because he was never a full central striker - he was very prone towards the left hand side of the pitch. He can't even position himself as a central striker and block the lanes of the two CB'S because he was never a lone ST in his career, he was a winger playing at an angle. Does Ronaldo get any blame for neglecting his position? Nope. Not from you. It's like Arjen Robben playing as a striker.

Just don't worry. I'm wrong your right. Bruno is the shit player running around whilst Ronaldo can play with a cigar.

Should have bloody kept Rooney still and played him in midfield at his own tempo and you know - let him do his own thing.

Glad you realised I’m right and you’re wrong.

Perhaps you would be happier with an Emile Heskey up front rather than the best goal scorer the worlds ever seen?

I pick out Bruno because in today’s football midfield is key and you can not get your tackles in completely different to playing as a 10 years ago when they didn’t have to press.

I’m not saying Ronaldo lack of pressing can have some kind of impact on a team but your narrative that Ronaldo is to blame for all United’s problems is disingenuous and I think you know it.

 

[evil_geko]

I wish he'd never come back.
The shenanigans over the No 7 shirt, the fact the rest of the team is carrying him, the fact he's disturbed the team psychological balance.

Pretty much, while so many fanboys were happy and over the moon, I was sad over him coming back and benching Cavani just when he was playing great.

 

[sullydnl]

Put it this way: if Ronaldo had gone to City then fitting him in would have caused even Guardiola tactical issues and may well have had enough downside that bringing him in as a first choice CF was viewed as a mistake. But they sure as shit wouldn't be in the state we're in atm.

 

[Strelok]

Have we come to Ronaldo to run a bit more in order to solve our absolutely shambolic situation? Cristiano fecking Ronaldo? Are you serious? One of the greatest players of all time, still scoring goals on regular basis, we surround him with dross like McT and Fred, team is shipping in 4 goals in one half and we need Ronaldo to run a bit more?


Maybe he should come back and track Keita for the first goal?




Really? How many? please refresh my memory? I seem to remember this team being absolute shit at pressing even before Cristiano Ronaldo? Or was Klopp coaching us last season?

Can't you bloody see how it's stupid to ask other players to press on behalf of your GOAT?

Now let me educate you again. Because you seem to know feck all about football. For the last time because I see no point in continuing this discussion with you.

If you have any basic knowledge about football you'd know a highline would never work without a high pressing system. Why? Because with a highline you leave a huge space behind your defensive line. If you allow the opponent to freely play out from their back, and build up their play you're in serious trouble. One pass to their quick forward into the space behind the defensive line and you're more than often dead. The whole purpose of a high pressing system is to prevent that to happen.

Not just the goals from our pressing and quick transition last season. We started to play with a highline from last season. Without a high pressing system we won't finish second. It'll be more a bloodbath every matches we played, just like yesterday. A highline without any high pressing.

Anyway I'll call this a day with the Ronaldo fanboies. Especially with you, my brain hursts having this discussion.

 

[Iker Quesadillas]

I accept that point, I'd say that Ronaldo at Real Madrid had a system based around him for 10 years and didn't have a player to replace him in that system. Juventus he came into a new system and it was disrupted the balance of the rest of the team in favour of him, similar thing is happening at United.

The thing is, how similar is it? Juventus won the league in Ronaldo's first season, they were 20 points clear at the top of the table. They won it in his second season too, though a much narrower victory. It's not like he signed and they became total shit. It was after a few seasons and an accumulation of dubious transfers and appointments that the wheels came off.

At United it's happening in a month and a half.

 

[KeanoMagicHat]

By all means, replace the entire team with "hard workers" who run around a lot and see what happens.

The goals will just materialize, apparently, since that's the easy part.

Man City don't need a striker to score lots of goals and win things, Chelsea won the Champions League without a striker. You can play skilful players that also work hard. Bernardo Silva is one of the best players in the league at the moment because he is an amazing dribbler but also runs all day. De Bruyne has always been like that to. You have Benzema, who is the ideal all-round striker that would really improve United now if he swapped places with Ronaldo. You can get worth out of Ronaldo still, but it has to be in a specific system where the whole team has to change for him. United don't have the players for that.

 

[MrEleson]

The thing is, how similar is it? Juventus won the league in Ronaldo's first season, they were 20 points clear at the top of the table. They won it in his second season too, though a much narrower victory. It's not like he signed and they became total shit.

It was after a few seasons and an accumulation of dubious transfers and appointments that the wheels came off.

At United it's happening in a month and a half.

Not only were they 20 points clear, they were on course to attain record breaking points in the league before they stopped trying around March of that season when they all but won it. They probably would’ve gone all the way in the CL too if not for injuries to key players against Ajax and costly mistakes by 1 or 2 players.

This Ronaldo pressing thing causing an entire club to collapse is one of the biggest myths going right now.

 

[Bebestation]

Glad you realised I’m right and you’re wrong.

Perhaps you would be happier with an Emile Heskey up front rather than the best goal scorer the worlds ever seen?

I pick out Bruno because in today’s football midfield is key and you can not get your tackles in completely different to playing as a 10 years ago when they didn’t have to press.

I’m not saying Ronaldo lack of pressing can have some kind of impact on a team but your narrative that Ronaldo is to blame for all United’s problems is disingenuous and I think you know it.

I never said such a thing at all. Not once.

And again, it's funny in the underlined paragraph if you swapped Bruno's name with Ronaldo - you cannot get your tackles wrong. Thanks for making it so simple.

 

[Deery]

I never said such a thing at all. Not once.

And again, it's funny in the underlined paragraph if you swapped Bruno's name with Ronaldo - you cannot get your tackles wrong. Thanks for making it so simple.

So you think a centre forwards tackling is more important than a midfielders when a forward has to do so much more?

 

[Sviken]

Put it this way: if Ronaldo had gone to City then fitting him in would have caused even Guardiola tactical issues and may well have had enough downside that bringing him in as a first choice CF was viewed as a mistake. But they sure as shit wouldn't be in the state we're in atm.

Ronaldo would wreck the league if he went to City. One problem so far City has this season is that they don't have a goalscorer. Our problem isn't Ronaldo. Put Messi up top, Lewandowski, it doesn't matter. Nothing is changing while we use these incoherent tactics and manager.

 

[sullydnl]

Ronaldo would wreck the league if he went to City. One problem so far City has this season is that they don't have a goalscorer. Our problem isn't Ronaldo. Put Messi up top, Lewandowski, it doesn't matter. Nothing is changing while we use these incoherent tactics and manager.

Ronaldo would have a big negative impact on City's ability to function as a pressing unit though, which is central to how they play.

People blaming him for our collapse our wrong. But he does pose a problem tactically for whoever comes in after Solskjaer and a lot of managers would find the best way to deal with that problem is to drop him from the team.

There's no getting away from the fact that a 36 year old poacher who doesn't press is a problem for any team planning to press a lot. It just isn't so much of a problem that we should be in shambles.

 

[Bebestation]

So you think a centre forwards tackling is more important than a midfielders when a forward has to do so much more?

All are important. If one person doesn't do it at all and is the lowest in the league - it will have consequences on the players that play next to him and behind him.

If a player never passes does it have an effect on the team mates he players with. Ofcouse.

Why do you think a player that is our central striker but does not position himself as a central striker (so the ball playing CB'S of our opposition get all the time in the world) and has the lowest pressing numbers won't have an influence on how the rest of our players play and press?

Is it that complex

Say Cavani starts instead of Ronaldo - he positions himself directly in between Van dijk and their other CB and goes for the press when necessary.

He is blocking 2 players with his positioning and pressing.

what does this do to Greenwood? Greenwood doesn't need to press like we saw in the first Liverpool goal. Neither does AWB go for high press of their fullback which leads to the reshuffling of our CB'S and Luke Shaw.

It's something very very very simple that you refuse to see.

You do not want to see it.

Cavani pressed 10 times a game more than Ronaldo, the opening for Liverpool’s first goal wouldn't have happened because he would be stopping the freedom of the CB's and Greenwood can concentrate on Robertson.

Very simple stuff but something else happened where its everyone else's fault except bloody Ronaldo's. Why oh why the dick riding?

People can't dick ride Ole for being an ex legend of the club and watch how things slowly change for United and people riding Ronaldo like he is perfect like the Ole inners did.

No different.

 

[KeanoMagicHat]

Ronaldo would have a big negative impact on City's ability to function as a pressing unit though, which is central to how they play.

People blaming him for our collapse our wrong. But he does pose a problem tactically for whoever comes in after Solskjaer and a lot of managers would find the best way to deal with that problem is to drop him from the team.

There's no getting away from the fact that a 36 year old poacher who doesn't press is a problem for any team planning to press a lot. It just isn't so much of a problem that we should be in shambles.

I agree, Jesus in particular puts in the donkey work and Foden links up the play in a way that Ronaldo never does anymore. Ronaldo would have bagged himself 5 or 6 goals, but City would have conceded 3 or 4 more overall, possibly costing them a few points, and Foden would be joining their many other stars on the bench.

 

[Sviken]

Ronaldo would have a big negative impact on City's ability to function as a pressing unit though, which is central to how they play.

People blaming him for our collapse our wrong. But he does pose a problem tactically for whoever comes in after Solskjaer and a lot of managers would find the best way to deal with that problem is to drop him from the team.

There's no getting away from the fact that a 36 year old poacher who doesn't press is a problem for any team planning to press a lot. It just isn't so much of a problem that we should be in shambles.

Even in Pep's amazing Barcelona team, which was miles better than current City, Messi was never the particular presser. In Bayern Lewandowski hardly presses. These players know their role. Conte, the most touted manager to replace Ole, for example, used Lukaku to amazing efficiency despite his pressing stats being equivalent to that of Ronaldo. I don't know where this pressing talk comes from. First time i'm hearing we were an efficient pressing side pre-Ronaldo. How is Ronaldo at fault for Liverpool (and every team in the world with much lesser players) carving our midfield and defence like nobody's business? Ronaldo can have prime Rooney workrate's and it wouldn't change absolutely nothing. This individual player blaming, born out of desperation to find the cause of why we play so bad, is simply astonishing to watch given that the obvious answer is staring everyone right in the face. You can't play good football or win matches with a manager whose CV is that of managing Molde and getting Cardiff relegated and has to ASK the players what is wrong with the team rather than figuring it out himself.

Replace our entire team with the World's Best XI, wouldn't change absolutely anything in terms of our play.

 

[Deery]

All are important. If one person doesn't do it at all and is the lowest in the league - it will have consequences on the players that play next to him and behind him.

If a player never passes does it have an effect on the team mates he players with. Ofcouse.

Why do you think a player that is our central striker but does not position himself as a central striker (so the ball playing CB'S of our opposition get all the time in the world) and has the lowest pressing numbers won't have an influence on how the rest of our players play and press?

Is it that complex

Say Cavani starts instead of Ronaldo - he positions himself directly in between Van dijk and their other CB and goes for the press when necessary.

He is blocking 2 players with his positioning and pressing.

what does this do to Greenwood? Greenwood doesn't need to press like we saw in the first Liverpool goal. Neither does AWB go for high press of their fullback which leads to the reshuffling of our CB'S and Luke Shaw.

It's something very very very simple that you refuse to see.

You do not want to see it.

Cavani pressed 10 times a game more than Ronaldo, the opening for Liverpool’s first goal wouldn't have happened because he would be stopping the freedom of the CB's and Greenwood can concentrate on Robertson.

Very simple stuff but something else happened where its everyone else's fault except bloody Ronaldo's. Why oh why the dick riding?

People can't dick ride Ole for being an ex legend of the club and watch how things slowly change for United and people riding Ronaldo like he is perfect like the Ole inners did.

No different.

I think you need to take a step back you are sounding a little irrational now.

You still haven’t answered my question about why Ronaldo against Atalanta was all over the pitch and defending in his own box but two goals were managed to be scored two easy goals at that?

I suggest you watch a few other goal scores like Aubameyang or Lukaku to see how much defending they do but you haven’t got plastics calling for their head because they are among the best in their team and they understand that.

 

[Deery]

Even in Pep's amazing Barcelona team, which was miles better than current City, Messi was never the particular presser. In Bayern Lewandowski hardly presses. These players know their role. Conte, the most touted manager to replace Ole, for example, used Lukaku to amazing efficiency despite his pressing stats being equivalent to that of Ronaldo. I don't know where this pressing talk comes from. First time i'm hearing we were an efficient pressing side pre-Ronaldo. How is Ronaldo at fault for Liverpool (and every team in the world with much lesser players) carving our midfield and defence like nobody's business? Ronaldo can have prime Rooney workrate's and it wouldn't change absolutely nothing. This individual player blaming, born out of desperation to find the cause of why we play so bad, is simply astonishing to watch given that the obvious answer is staring everyone right in the face. You can't play good football or win matches with a manager whose CV is that of managing Molde and getting Cardiff relegated and has to ASK the players what is wrong with the team rather than figuring it out himself.

Replace our entire team with the World's Best XI, wouldn't change absolutely anything in terms of our play.

Good post.

 

[Bebestation]

I think you need to take a step back you are sounding a little irrational now.

You still haven’t answered my question about why Ronaldo against Atalanta was all over the pitch and defending in his own box but two goals were managed to be scored two easy goals at that?

I suggest you watch a few other goal scores like Aubameyang or Lukaku to see how much defending they do but you haven’t got plastics calling for their head because they are among the best in their team and they understand that.

Now answer me.

Why does he choose to do it vs Atalanta and then not against other teams. The lowest in the PL. Why can't he play like that in the PL? He picks and chooses went to use his energy just as much as you pick and choose his one and only match he made a bit more of a run. We actually won the match, didn't lose it.

Cavani also came 67 mins on then Ronaldo got shifted and really helped luke Shaw out alot on the wing.

 

[Deery]

Now answer me.

Why does he choose to do it vs Atalanta and then not against other teams. The lowest in the PL. Why can't he play like that in the PL? He picks and chooses went to use his energy just as much as you pick and choose his one and only match he made a bit more of a run. We actually won the match, didn't lose it.

Cavani also came 67 mins on then Ronaldo got shifted and really helped luke Shaw out alot on the wing.

You said Ronaldo was at fault for the goals I’ve pointed out that is not the case and you still persist with your narrative that Ronaldo is the problem.

Cavani is two years younger that Ronaldo and not fit to play half the time if at all and you think he’s some kind of silver bullet? I can guarantee you he would have made absolutely no difference on Sunday.

 

[Bebestation]

You said Ronaldo was at fault for the goals I’ve pointed out that is not the case and you still persist with your narrative that Ronaldo is the problem.

Cavani is two years younger that Ronaldo and not fit to play half the time if at all and you think he’s some kind of silver bullet? I can guarantee you he would have made absolutely no difference on Sunday.

How did you point of shit?

I just as much pointed out showing Ronaldo was at fault for our goals showing you bloody videos and replays - your saying Ronaldo is not at fault because we let in goals against Atalanta and he actually pressed a bit more that day!

What about his positioning? Was his positioning on the central defenders as highlighted on the videos? I doubt it because he attacks at an angle. Your case is dismissed and back to stage one

One game against Atalant is your proof. Wow. Nothing against anybody else whilst my proof is there vs alot of teams.

Doesn't mean we won't let in a goal because hey this is bloody football but it doesn't mean Ronaldo doesn't give us a problem when he plays.

 

[Sandikan]

6 goals in our absolute sh!t show of a season so far.

The thought of him in a properly functioning team with a quality coach in charge is just

 

[Deery]

How did you point of shit?

I just as much pointed out showing Ronaldo was at fault for our goals showing you bloody videos and replays - your saying Ronaldo is not at fault because we let in goals against Atalanta and he actually pressed a bit more that day!

What about his positioning? Was his positioning on the central defenders as highlighted on the videos? I doubt it because he attacks at an angle. Your case is dismissed and back to stage one

One game against Atalant is your proof. Wow. Nothing against anybody else whilst my proof is there vs alot of teams.

Doesn't mean we won't let in a goal because hey this is bloody football but it doesn't mean Ronaldo doesn't give us a problem when he plays.

His positioning was pretty good for the goal that won us the game yeah.

And I don’t give a shit about a video made by some dipshit on YouTube picking out a couple of screen grabs that try’s to back up an agenda.

 

[snk123]

Martial. He who also doesn't press but people were happy to complain about what his lack of effort caused us. He probably does more pressing than Ronaldo who is probably the lowest in the league this season. Martial also got a red vs Spurs so we were playing 10 men if I remember quite early in the game.

Love how this video was ignored

 

[Bebestation]

Love how this video was ignored

Oh yeah Bailly. Then Bailly Lindelof vs Liverpool.

I never wanted Mourinho as manager so I think I got that right too. My ego is growing like Ronaldo's.

Did you want Mourinho?

 

[Deery]

Oh yeah Bailly. Then Bailly Lindelof vs Liverpool.

I never wanted Mourinho as manager so I think I got that right too. My ego is growing like Ronaldo's.

Did you want Mourinho?

Your ego is growing but for the fact Ole was in charge sums you up today.

 

[Bebestation]

Your ego is growing but for the fact Ole was in charge sums you up today.

Still, I don't see why people are bringing up a match from last year where we lost 6-1 after Martial got sent of in the 28th minute

Purely for the love of Ronaldo.

Amazing stuff.

Should have kept Rooney.

Hell, I'd say the fact that we took the lead on the first half before spurs shows the difference with us with Ronaldo. We can barely do that now, we can barely take the lead in the first half.

There we go, I used your match to show Ronaldo's weaknesses.

 

[Gary_Walsh_Nou_Camp_Hell]

I was thinking about how Fergie would manager the situation with Ronaldo on the pitch.

Yes Ronaldo is immobile and can barely run. But given the chances he will score.

There's an interview with RVP where he says Fergie called a meeting with certain players because RVP wasn't getting any service. He said that Fergie told Rooney, Carrick, Nani etc. That if they don't give him the service to score they will not be playing. He said RvP will win them the league and help home or be dropped.

Ole or a new manage need to have this same conversation with our creative players - service Ronaldo or don't play. Otherwise there's zero point having Ronaldo.

 

[Deery]

Still, I don't see why people are bringing up a match from last year where we lost 6-1 after Martial got sent of in the 28th minute

Purely for the love of Ronaldo.

Amazing stuff.

Should have kept Rooney.

Hell, I'd say the face that we took the lead vs Penalty on the first half before spurs shows the difference with us with Ronaldo. We can barely do that now, we can barely take the lead in the first half.

It’s not for the love of Ronaldo that’s school boy stuff at the back from Maguire and the defence nothing Ronaldo could have done there either.

Bruno should have taken the lead v Liverpool so you’re way off again.

 

[Apokalips]

Even in Pep's amazing Barcelona team, which was miles better than current City, Messi was never the particular presser. In Bayern Lewandowski hardly presses. These players know their role. Conte, the most touted manager to replace Ole, for example, used Lukaku to amazing efficiency despite his pressing stats being equivalent to that of Ronaldo. I don't know where this pressing talk comes from. First time i'm hearing we were an efficient pressing side pre-Ronaldo. How is Ronaldo at fault for Liverpool (and every team in the world with much lesser players) carving our midfield and defence like nobody's business? Ronaldo can have prime Rooney workrate's and it wouldn't change absolutely nothing. This individual player blaming, born out of desperation to find the cause of why we play so bad, is simply astonishing to watch given that the obvious answer is staring everyone right in the face. You can't play good football or win matches with a manager whose CV is that of managing Molde and getting Cardiff relegated and has to ASK the players what is wrong with the team rather than figuring it out himself.

Replace our entire team with the World's Best XI, wouldn't change absolutely anything in terms of our play.

Fully agreed, there is a constant culture of blaming individual players and then switching to the next target once that initial target is dropped or out injured. (Pogba, Martial, now Ronaldo etc.). The real cause of the issues is very clear and needs to be addressed ASAP if we are to progress regardless of some people being in denial.

 

[Bebestation]

It’s not for the love of Ronaldo that’s school boy stuff at the back from Maguire and the defence nothing Ronaldo could have done there either.

Bruno should have taken the lead v Liverpool so you’re way off again.

Probably would have if we kept him as our main goalscorer like last season than rather than turning him to be our creator from deep who has started to cross the ball to Ronaldo like he is Beckham every chance be gets.

Bruno's through balls, runs in to the box, finishes and his penalties have all gone or significantly halved.

We currently see the Portugal version of Bruno. The deeper one.

 

[snk123]

Still, I don't see why people are bringing up a match from last year where we lost 6-1 after Martial got sent of in the 28th minute

Because that's the only way to convince agenda posters like you that our problems have been there way before Ronaldo. I can post videos of shocking, absolutely school boy defending from Maguire and Shaw in the last 3 matches as well but again, you'll spin it to be Ronaldo's fault somehow.

 

[Deery]

Probably would have if we kept him as our main goalscorer like last season than rather than turning him to be our creator from deep who has started to cross the ball to Ronaldo like he is Beckham every chance be gets.

Bruno's through balls, runs in to the box, finishes and his penalties have all gone or significantly halved.

We currently see the Portugal version of Bruno. The deeper one.

Aw don’t get me started on that bullshit you try to spin about Bruno playing deeper when it’s just not true anyone with eyes can see that, if anything Bruno is not deep enough and leaving the midfield exposed. You can’t play 4 attacker all of a sudden after spending two years playing counter attacking football it’s any wonder the players heads are spinning.

 

[Bebestation]

Aw don’t get me started on that bullshit you try to spin about Bruno playing deeper when it’s just not true anyone with eyes can see that, if anything Bruno is not deep enough and leaving the midfield exposed. You can’t play 4 attacker all of a sudden after spending two years playing counter attacking football it’s any wonder the players heads are spinning.

Wholly crap. There is a difference to pressing and where he plays with the ball. Pressing means he does not have the ball

Infact the fact that he leaves his position to press in front of Ronaldo shows he is playing a bit deeper than he should

Never did this well say last season you know before the god joined.

 

[MrEleson]

I agree, Jesus in particular puts in the donkey work and Foden links up the play in a way that Ronaldo never does anymore. Ronaldo would have bagged himself 5 or 6 goals, but City would have conceded 3 or 4 more overall, possibly costing them a few points, and Foden would be joining their many other stars on the bench.

Bullshit. There’s no way Ronaldo’s minimal pressing is costing his team points single-handedly. That’s an absurd claim. he’s the most advanced player on the pitch ffs. If he was at City, Pep (an actual coach) would’ve found a way to make it work like Zidane did, like Allegri did and all the decent coaches that had success with him did despite his minimal effort at the back.

 

[Deery]

Wholly crap. There is a difference to pressing and where he plays with the ball. Pressing means he does not have the ball

Infact the fact that he leaves his position to press in front of Ronaldo shows he is playing a bit deeper than he should

Never did this well say last season you know before the god joined.

I’ve come to the conclusion you know absolutely feck all about football.

If the ball comes in your area you press the ball as a two or three, what you do not do is run 25 yards out of position to tackle the goalkeeper regardless of Ronaldo leading the line or not.

 

[Bebestation]

I’ve come to the conclusion you know absolutely feck all about football.

If the ball comes in your area you press the ball as a two or three, what you do not do is run 25 yards out of position to tackle the goalkeeper regardless of Ronaldo leading the line or not.

Likewise. You know crap all about football.

You are more influenced by a PR team than tactics.

 

[Gehrman]

I dont understand why its difficult to acknowlege that having bought the oldest poorest version of Ronaldo is problematic. You could say with lack of great strikers in their prime we didnt have much of a chance but he turned out to be a panic buy above anything else. Chicharito was a great poacher for us, but he was also freaking fast.