Or, performances have deteriorated when we've played against teams with midfields? Blaming Ronaldo is batshit insane.
7
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Can’t be bothered to dig everything up but:
1- Pep had a press conference on Ronaldo day saying that there are only 2 players in the world who choose their next club, as opposed to their next club choosing them.
2- Sam Lee (most reliable City journo there is) put out a tweet around that time saying to not get sucked into City PR and that they were definitely in for him but in the end Ronaldo chose United.
Deteriorated because we are trying a new style of front foot football that will take a little time to adjust to, Ronaldo is the one pulling us through that period and will score even more when the team starts clicking.
I'm not sure what style you're referring to we're trying to implement. Yes, Wednesday was a slight tweak, but besides that, it's been much of a muchness.
We’re are trying to hold and pass the ball more progressively and fast get it to the front men quickly which is causing gaps in midfield and leaving us open because we are less reliant on counter attack which isn’t sustainable long term.
Citing Ballbag as a source for anything, ever
This was one of the earliest stories that were reported about Ronaldo's involvement with City
Are you actually a red?
City wanted Ronaldo, they approached him but we came in and the rest is history.
No proper red would go with your theory.
He has his flaws and limitations, but our performances this season are tumescent.
also If we didn’t have him this season we would be a lot worse off.. already!
One of Ronaldo or Ole will be gone by next season. Absolutely zero chance Ronaldo is going to accept this level of managerial mediocrity at this late stage of his career.
I agree with you.
This is the one thing I was thinking when he came back to the club. If we're not performing to the standard to which we should be performing, how is he going to act. There is absolutely no way he's going to accept these performances. And while you can say that about any player in the team, I don't think it's to the same extent. He didn't come here to finish 4th and dick around a bit in the Champions League. He came here to win the Champions League and the Premier League. However foolish that may appear to anyone who actually watches United, that's why he's here.
I don't think he's going to accept it quietly.
I don't think he's going to accept it quietly.
He was really pissed walking off the pitch maybe fed up with Fred already or Ole?
He looked properly fecked off after the game today.
Strode down the tunnel on his own muttering under his breath before anyone else.
With a bit of luck he’ll manage to get a new manager in.
The point still remains that you could pass the ball to RvP in pretty much any position and he could something with it. Inside the box, outside the box or anywhere on the pitch. He was an option, brought others into play and created as well as scoring goals. Ronaldo does not do that.
And whoever his coach is at this point will have a headache dealing with it. Even Pep.
Basically, this:
Yeah, and this is the thing with signing him. People can make the excuses all they want about us not having the midfield (which we don't), but when you sign someone of that calibre, those excuses aren't going to fly. And they aren't going to fly with someone like him. Again, he's not going to accept second best, however foolish that may sound to others. He didn't come here at the end of his career for a feck about.
Why he doesn't get involved in build-up play ? Also how he became so ineffective in it ?
Solskjaer talking absolute crap after today's game. There is no way Ronaldo wanted to be sat on the bench at the start of the game. You can see when he walked off he was fuming. To get Ronaldo back at the club and then to bench him is nonsense.
With ole in charge he’s really not going to enjoy much of this season.
Neither will I for that matter
If being a 'proper' red means turning the blinders on and thinking everything is always purposely poised to guarantee a positive outcome for united then I'm not that. Ronaldo was in 11th hour negotiations with City before we even got into the picture and 'proper' reds believe he wanted us and only us from the get go. Believe what you will
At the end of the day, what is the point in having him if you don't give him chances?
The team has been like that way before Ronaldo.
Winning against Leeds is our regular 1 out of 20 good performances. Not that I am Ole out myself.
As I said, if Ronaldo keeps missing sitters after sitters, it is fair. We don't even create good chances which has been like that forever. Blaming any 9 for that is silly.
He came here because he ran into the same problems at his previous club, and they were mutually dissastisfied with what they were able to achieve together. He can't walk in here praised as the potential saviour and then walk away bemoaning the poor supporting cast, without taking any responsibility himself. Not twice in a row. It's pretty obvious that as well as solving problems he creates problems for teams. Maybe he needs to accept second best if he's no longer good enough to enable teams to be the best.
This is exactly what we are doing at least since last season. Only thing changed with the first game of Ronaldo was a tendency to cross more. Thats about it. And the gaps in midfield aren't really connected that approach - they appear because our offensive players usually tend to run away from the ball to "attack" space - while our defense is sitting rrather deep - nothing to do with any supposedly change in style I am afraid.
I agree with the bold.
It doesn't take away from what I said though. He came here to win. It's as simple as that. And he's not going to accept anything other than that. Now how that is going to manifest in terms of his behavior, time will tell. But that's the issue you get when signing someone like that, especially when they're coming to the end of their career.
He is simply not going to accept second best. Thinking that is slightly naive.
It's hard to tell, isn't it? I'm not seeing much passing of the ball to Ronaldo. When it happens, tho' rarely, he usually "does something with it". Maybe we should change the way we play to accommodate him -- give him the ball in dangerous places, cross the ball to him, and (best of all!) figure out how to kick a ball on a corner to him & Pogba standing open in the middle of the box.
It's hard to tell if it's the coaches who can't plan for new players, or the players who are refusing to change their play. It's odd.
Pretty much. I'd say this trend was even there in the last days of Real Madrid. Ronaldo is one of the best strikers in the game, no doubt about that, but as a team, you have to compensate for a player like him. That isn't a dig at Ronaldo, he is surely worth it, but when the team isn't able to compensate it, the cracks appear pretty fast. For me, there were no indicators at all, that we would be such a team. We weren't even holding ourselves all that well without Ronaldo. I am glad, we went in for him - to avoid seeing him in a sky-blue shirt but it was an emotionally driven thing with the potential to really screw us over. That said - I think, there is a myriad of things we could try and experiment with to bring Ronaldo into play on a consistent basis, I hope we will do so and be proactive about it. Just waiting for things to fall into place magically won't cut it I am afraid...
It has everything to do with a change in style the manager obviously has attacking talent and is trying to get the most out of them the team has a less solid mindset because we are in attack mode we should have had 3 goals in the first half and Ronaldo would have had two at least (Martial and Cavani headers). But with Fred and McTominay both playing progressive it meant the solid base of a 4231 wasn’t there.
Spot on. I hope we don’t stunt Greenwood’s development for his sake.
If you accept that he just left a club that was second best, with his help, and he's moved to a new club where he's second best, with his help, then believing he won't accept second best is just describing him as delusional. Delusional in the most basic sense.
McFred and the solid base they can provide were a huge factor to solidify our position as top club again. That, Bruno, Maguire and Shaw - these are the pillars. So it isn't them magically why we can't create chances all of a sudden. Since Bruno has been brought in, we try to exploit is unbelievable talent in vision, passing range and courage to release balls as soon as possible to our strikers. Ole called it "fast, direct, vertical play" I think. Bruno is made for that and Pogbas long passing isn't shabby either. Add the abilities to run for long balls from Rashford, Cavani and Greenwood and you have the attack that score so many goals last season. That is the recipe this season as well. Again, add a few more crosses to it to make use of Ronaldos air superiority but apart from that, nothing at all has changed. It is visible plus it hasn't been noticed anywhere, no pundits no tactics or data channels. The logical conclusion for me is, there is no change. Which then concludes to you describing what we are seeing as "teething issues" that we will "grow out of soon" as based on nothing but hope. Which is fine of course, but the majority are looking for more substantial things to look at.
The delusion is with someone who thinks he's going to sit back meekly and accept second best. I'm also not advocating for him to kick off and perform. I actually agree. We're simply not good enough to win the major honours. That doesn't mean to say that he came here thinking that. Because that's not the case.
You're saying he was delusional. That's all I'm saying. If you connect the dots - his expectations, his capabilities and the reality he was stepping into - based on your own description of those, things he was delusional. Those delusions aren't very helpful to a team.
I don't know why people pander to it, even lionise it. Not accepting second best sounds like a nice inpsirational phrase but when it's matched up against the facts, it's a little laughable, IMO. People used to say it about Mourinho, until it became a little tragic. I don't think that's so far way for Ronaldo.
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That’s counter attacking your talking about. I didn’t say Fred and McTominay were not a solid base in the past i said the mentality has changed and they’re not playing solid now. Fred was robbed well above the halfway line a few times which set up counters and McTominay was driving forward with runs to create attacks which left Wan Bissaka and Lindelof exposed more than once. Rightly or wrongly we are playing a far more attacking football and that’s why we are leaking chances but once a balance is found things will be totally different.
Just because you say he’s delusional doesn’t make it even remotely true you know or are you in fact the delusional one?
Thats not just "counter attacking". You don't have to "counter attack" only with long ball, am I right? Because there are teams who doing it differently. On the contrary the change, you are describing can well be nothing else than a description of other teams approaching us no in contrast to last year or even the year before. We don't have to change a style whatsoever but when teams stop playing into our cards, than things will look as they do right now. Our style didn't change at all. We brought in Bruno and now we brought in Ronaldo. I would be celebrating if there would be some sort of style change but it just isn't there.
Add to that, that McTominay makes drving runs 4 times a year - against Leeds and sometimes against city. The rest is good PR.
But hey, if you think, things will fall into place eventually, good for you. Nothing wrong with it.
No, I just told you what I said.
I'll state it again: now he's here, he is not going to accept not challenging or winning the major honours. He is not a man who will remain quiet and meekly accept the situation. It has the potential to be a big problem.
I don't think we're good enough (mainly due to the manager), but that's irrelevant. Now he's here (however it came about) he's going to want to win. I'm not lionising it or pandering to it. I'm stating it based on his past and his personality. You saw it today! Of course, any player can be disappointed when we lose points, but it's different with him. And of course it has the potential to be detrimental to the team - that's what I was implying in my other post. Again, I'm not lionising it and saying that this is what should be admired in an individual. I'm simply stating what is likely to be the situation if this form continues.
I don't think this Ronaldo Kid is going to make it. Failed to score and wears shin pads with his own picture on. Championship quality at best.
Problem is we have a limited number of players who can create for him. The only full back who can really cross is Telles. Shaw is little better than AWB. He gets forward a lot, but his contributions with the ball are very low quality. The only midfielders who can pick a pass between the lines are Pogba and Matic, who gets little game time. Bruno's usually too far up the pitch.
I am looking forward to Rashford being back with him though. He impressed me last season with some of his creativity.
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