[Deery]

Another way to look at it is to forget what Ronaldo has or hasn't done this season and instead to project ahead.

Imagine we create a title-challenging team asap from the bones of where we are now, one on par with the likes of Liverpool & City. Imagine what that team would likely look like given the attributes those sides share. And think about how Pep/Klopp brought them to that point and the degree to which they did/didn't compromise their approach early on to cater for the players at their disposal when they took over.

With that in mind, is Ronaldo a starter in the side we'd built? If so, how? Given his very short remaining shelf-life and the weaknesses he already brings I find it hard to see how he would be.

And if he won't be a starter in that side for those reasons, to what extent would continuing to start him in the first team going forward slow our ability to progress to that point? Because if you play a 36 year old poacher up front ahead of younger players better able to adapt to a pressing game, you invariably have to compromise the way you play.

My suspicion is that if Pep/Klopp took over our side they would start implementing the style of play they're looking to build towards from day one. And if they were faced with a choice between compromising that approach early-on to keep Ronaldo's goals in the short term or jettisoning Ronaldo's goals entirely in favour of players who better fit the approach they're building towards, they would choose the latter.

Do I have to remind you James Milner starts midfield for Liverpool?

 

[troylocker]

Do I have to remind you James Milner starts midfield for Liverpool?

No, but please remind us anyway. I thought he only started when Hendo, Fabinho or Thiago were injured or needed resting. How is Milner being a squad/rotation player in the midfield for Liverpool relevant here?
Are they building their team around him?
Is he playing 90 minutes every time they lose too? Are Liverpool crap when he plays too? How is his workrate?

 

[horsechoker]

Big Ronnie fan but if dropping him is necessary then do it. Tbf, I don't think he's above being dropped if need be, I don't think we are in "my captain shall always play" territory.

 

[sullydnl]

Do I have to remind you James Milner starts midfield for Liverpool?

He actually doesn't start in midfield Liverpool though. He's a squad player who has played less league minutes than all of Henderson, Fabinho and Thiago, just 11 minutes more than Oxlaide-Chamberlain and 70 minutes more than Keita. Big difference with Ronaldo, who has the fourth most minutes of all our outfield players despite not having been here at the start of the season.

And back when Milner was a starter, his style of play perfectly suited Liverpool's work-rate heavy approach.

But sure, if the plan is to play Ronaldo as much as Liverpool play James Milner then you're right, there's no issue. Seems a weird comparison to me though.

 

[Deery]

He actually doesn't start in midfield Liverpool though. He's a squad player who has played less league minutes than all of Henderson, Fabinho and Thiago, just 11 minutes more than Oxlaide-Chamberlain and 70 minutes more than Keita. Big difference with Ronaldo, who has the fourth most minutes of all our outfield players despite not having been here at the start of the season.

And back when Milner was a starter, his style of play perfectly suited Liverpool's work-rate heavy approach.

But sure, if the plan is to play Ronaldo as much as Liverpool play James Milner then you're right, there's no issue. Seems a weird comparison to me though.

You’re trying to imply Klopp or Pep wouldn’t start an older player when both start Milner and Fernandinho so I think you’re being a little disingenuous or mistaken.

 

[Deery]

No, but please remind us anyway. I thought he only started when Hendo, Fabinho or Thiago were injured or needed resting. How is Milner being a squad/rotation player in the midfield for Liverpool relevant here?
Are they building their team around him?
Is he playing 90 minutes every time they lose too? Are Liverpool crap when he plays too? How is his workrate?

So Klopp would start an older player in a title challenging squad, like he just did in his last game against Chelsea?

 

[Rossa]

He's not bad, but the team is terrible at the moment. Give him chances and he will score. Will he take the ball from deep in his own half and run with it to score a screamer? No he will not. Will he twist and turn players? No he will not. Can he still get in behind defenders? Most definitely, and he is still a lethal finisher. Look only to the header he scored against Wolves - it's a foot off side. That goes in and Bruno scores, and we are suddenly in little trouble.

The biggest issue is that the team is outplayed at home to Wolves. Ronaldo actually works pretty hard. I'd dare say he runs around at least as much as Cavani does these last couple of matches - there is probably stats that tell otherwise, but Ronaldo does a fair bit of pressing, only he's not really good at it. Greenwood can't press if his life depended on it. McTominay was rubbish, and Sancho looked more like he found their players than ours.

Ronaldo will bounce back, I'm sure of it!

 

[troylocker]

So Klopp would start an older player in a title challenging squad, like he just did in his last game against Chelsea?

You’re trying to imply Klopp or Pep wouldn’t start an older player when both start Milner and Fernandinho so I think you’re being a little disingenuous or mistaken.

Remind us one more time how that is relevant and please tell us what logic you apply to make that relevant.

The discussion in here has been 100% related to Ronaldo and his impact here. None in here has mentioned anything about the general use of experienced players in a team.

 

[Deery]

Remind us one more time how that is relevant and please tell us what logic you apply to make that relevant.

The discussion in here has been 100% related to Ronaldo and his impact here. None in here has mentioned anything about the general use of experienced players in a team.

That’s what sullyni is implying and I simply informed him Pep and Klopp regularly use older players so why wouldn’t they use Ronaldo?

 

[troylocker]

He's not bad, but the team is terrible at the moment. Give him chances and he will score. Will he take the ball from deep in his own half and run with it to score a screamer? No he will not. Will he twist and turn players? No he will not. Can he still get in behind defenders? Most definitely, and he is still a lethal finisher. Look only to the header he scored against Wolves - it's a foot off side. That goes in and Bruno scores, and we are suddenly in little trouble.

The biggest issue is that the team is outplayed at home to Wolves. Ronaldo actually works pretty hard. I'd dare say he runs around at least as much as Cavani does these last couple of matches - there is probably stats that tell otherwise, but Ronaldo does a fair bit of pressing, only he's not really good at it. Greenwood can't press if his life depended on it. McTominay was rubbish, and Sancho looked more like he found their players than ours.

Ronaldo will bounce back, I'm sure of it!

How will he bounce back, when he has lost so many of his tools?
Read this and tell me I’m wrong:

Sorry, all, this will be a long post.
I'll explain how Ronaldo is the biggest problem we have and how he no longer is what he used to be.

I'll start with the simple stuff: How is he doing as a striker when we have the ball compared to average strikers in the PL.

- Does he get enough service/is he good at finding himself in good scoring positions to finish off chances?

Ronaldo has the 3rd highest npxG90 in the League with 0,58 npxG90 (non penalty expected goals per 90 minutes. Calculated from every chance a player has had during this season and how many goals an average finisher in the top 5 leagues is expected score from those chance using different matrix), only beaten by Salah (0,75) and Jota (0,67), in the PL. In other words Ronaldo seems to get both good service and still be good at making himself available for service. Not like in the good old days, and his npxG90 has had a negative trend since his golden years at Real Madrid, but still good. Since 2014 his npxG90 has varied from 0,6-0,94 at Real Madrid and Juventus.

Let's compare his output with some random strikers in the PL (all the numbers given are per 90 minutes on the pitch):

Non penalty goals and full 90s played/Shots per 90/Shots on target per 90/nxpG90/non-penalty goals per 90/diff (goal - npgX90)

Ronaldo: 6 non penalty goals in 14,8 full 90s / 3,80 (56 shots)/1,29 (19 shots on target) /0,58 (npxG90) /0,41 (np Goals90)/ -0,17 (Underperforming his npxG90 by 29,3%)
Antonio: 8 non penalty goals in 18,4 full 90s / 2,93 (54 shots)/0,92 (17 shots on target)/0,44 (npxG90)/0,43 (np Goals90)/ -0,01 (Underperforming his npxG90 by 2,3%)
Dennis: 8 non penalty goals in 14,5 full 90s / 2,42 (35 shots)/1,38 (20 shots on target)/0,24 (npxG90)/0,55 (np Goals90)/ +0,31 (Overperforming his npxG90 by 129,2%)
Maupay: 6 non penalty goals in 14,3 full 90s / 2,24 (32 shots)/0,92 (9 shots on target)/0,36 (npxG90)/0,42 (np Goals90)/ +0,06 (Overperforming his npxG90 by 16,7%)
Watkins: 5 non penalty goals in 15,1 full 90s / 2,31 (35 shots)/1,06 (16 shots on target)/0,38 (npxG90)/0,33 (np Goals90)/ -0,05 (Underperforming his npxG90 by 15,1%)
+ dream target from Bundesliga:
Haaland: 10 non penalty goals in 10,0 full 90s / 4,10 (41 shots)/1,80 (18 shots on target)/0,65 (npxG90)/1,0 (np Goals90)/ +0,35 (Overperforming his npxG90 by 53,8%)

Ronaldo has the 2nd most finishes per 90 in the league (beaten only by Salah), the 3rd highest npxG90 and still sits on just 6 non penalty goals (shared 10th with 5 other players in the league). He is getting 2nd most service in the league, to claim anything else is just a lie. He has hit a couple of brilliant goals this season, but he misses more chances than most in the league.

Assists and setting up teammates inside the box:
PPA90 (completed passes into the penalty box excluding set pieces per 90)Assists/xA90/A per 90

Ronaldo: 0,41 completed passes into the penalty box per 90/3 assists/0,11xA90/0,20 assists per 90.
Antonio: 0,92 completed passes into the penalty box per 90/5 assists/0,24xA90/0,27 assists per 90.
Dennis: 0,62 completed passes into the penalty box per 90/5 assists/0,17xA90/0,34 assists per 90.
Maupay: 0,77 completed passes into the penalty box per 90/1 assists/0,11xA90/0,07 assists per 90.
Watkins: 0,66 completed passes into the penalty box per 90/1 assists/0,06xA90/0,07 assists per 90.
+ dream target from Bundesliga:
Haaland: 1,3 completed passes into the penalty box per 90/5 assists/0,31xA90/0,50 assists per 90.

Dispite a couple of brilliant headers to teammates he rarely looks for teammates when closing in on goal, compared to other forwards. Ronaldo and Dennis' teammates have made them look better than they are at creating chances by massively overachieving their chances from passes from them. His link up play simply hasn't been very impressive for us.
Bruno for instance has been let down by bad finishing from his teammates this season (0,28xA90 /0,18 assists per 90)

Now to the most depressing part: Pressing

Pressings per 90/successfull pressings per 90/pressings in the attacking 3rd

Ronaldo: 6,28 pressings per 90 / 1,69 successfull pressing per 90/ 2,84 pressings in the attacking 3rd per 90 (!!)
Antonio: 13,3 pressings per 90 / 3,97 successfull pressing per 90/ 7,01 pressings in the attacking 3rd per 90
Dennis: 20,8 pressings per 90 / 4,76 successfull pressing per 90/ 7,31 pressings in the attacking 3rd per 90
Maupay: 19,9 pressings per 90 / 5,73 successfull pressing per 90/ 10,49 pressings in the attacking 3rd per 90
Watkins: 15,43 pressings per 90 / 4,17 successfull pressing per 90/ 7,48 pressings in the attacking 3rd per 90
+ dream target from Bundesliga:
Haaland: 12,6 pressings per 90 / 3,6 successfull pressing per 90/ 8,5 pressings in the attacking 3rd per 90

His pressing is historically bad, that is why it is an issue and why we talk about it. If he just did the minimum, maybe the story would be different, but he doesn't even do half of the minimum in the attacking third. When we lose the ball he moans and throws his arms up in the air instead of chasing the ball. Most chances in football are created when you catch the opponent when it is unorganized, and the closer you get to the opponents goal when you gain possession the more unorganized the opponent is. The same goes for the faster you gain possession after you lose it the more unorganized the opponents are. Now look at the numbers above and explain to me how his workrate when we lose the ball or when we in general do not have the ball doesn't affect our general play and chance creationrate.

Playing a striker like him means the following:
- We win the ball when the opponent is unorganized less often
- We play against organized defenses more often
- We let our opponents enter our half with the ball more often
- All our outfield player except Ronaldo gets a higher workload and must cover larger areas to cover for him, which leads to more room for our opponents and our players getting more pumped and plays worse football.

....and when, as showed above, he doesn't even add more goals or isn't more effective than an average PL striker.
What's the point!?

 

[sullydnl]

You’re trying to imply Klopp or Pep wouldn’t start an older player when both start Milner and Fernandinho so I think you’re being a little disingenuous or mistaken.

I asked whether Ronaldo would be a starter under Klopp/Pep (as in a first choice player), not whether he would get any gametime or starts whatsoever.

If you're saying they might deem him valuable when relegated to the very limited squad roles Milner and Fernandinho (513 minutes in the league this season) have then sure, that's an entirely different argument. That's still approximately a 60% decrease in his league gametime though, so quite a long way from where we currently are.

Also, Ronaldo's age is only relevant insofar as it limits how long he would be here for anyway and as a cause of (some of) the weaknesses in his game. The question is how Pep/Klopp would deal with a player who doesn't fit their approach, not how they deal with older players generally. We saw players a lot younger than Ronaldo get jettisoned because they weren't part of their plans.

 

[Scarlett Dracarys]

Scapegoat FC

 

[Deery]

I asked whether Ronaldo would be a starter under Klopp/Pep (as in a first choice player), not whether he would get any gametime or starts whatsoever.

If you're saying they might deem him valuable when relegated to the very limited squad roles Milner and Fernandinho (513 minutes in the league this season) have then sure, that's an entirely different argument. That's still approximately a 60% decrease in his league gametime though, so quite a long way from where we currently are.

Also, Ronaldo's age is only relevant insofar as it limits how long he would be here for anyway and as a cause of (some of) the weaknesses in his game. The question is how Pep/Klopp would deal with a player who doesn't fit their approach, not how they deal with older players generally. We saw players a lot younger than Ronaldo get jettisoned because they weren't part of their plans.

It’s hard to say until he was part of the setup, many believe Ronaldo would score goals for fun other believe he would be on the bench.

 

[djembatheking]

It must be incredibly frustrating for Greenwood, Sancho, Rashford, Cavani, Bruno and even Martial and Lingard knowing that no matter how well they play the chances are they will be substituted or dropped in the next match when Ronaldo always plays, that has got to cause some animosity. Ronaldo could be a great asset if he was used like every member of the squad and got substituted, rested and rotated but if the club continues with this mentality that he always plays every minute we are well and truely fecked.

 

[troylocker]

It’s hard to say until he was part of the setup, many believe Ronaldo would score goals for fun other believe he would be on the bench.

He does get more chance for us than any City-player does, would you say he is scoring for fun?

 

[Deery]

He does get more chance for us than any City-player does, would you say he is scoring for fun?

Two totally different setups tbf, Harry Kane isn’t scoring many this season and I believe he’d score for fun at City as well and Ronaldo has more goals than him this season.

 

[Mayhem]

It must be incredibly frustrating for Greenwood, Sancho, Rashford, Cavani, Bruno and even Martial and Lingard knowing that no matter how well they play the chances are they will be substituted or dropped in the next match when Ronaldo always plays, that has got to cause some animosity. Ronaldo could be a great asset if he was used like every member of the squad and got substituted, rested and rotated but if the club continues with this mentality that he always plays every minute we are well and truely fecked.

I think this is one of the main reasons we’ve been so desperately poor.

 

[jesperjaap]

He's not bad, but the team is terrible at the moment. Give him chances and he will score. Will he take the ball from deep in his own half and run with it to score a screamer? No he will not. Will he twist and turn players? No he will not. Can he still get in behind defenders? Most definitely, and he is still a lethal finisher. Look only to the header he scored against Wolves - it's a foot off side. That goes in and Bruno scores, and we are suddenly in little trouble.

The biggest issue is that the team is outplayed at home to Wolves. Ronaldo actually works pretty hard. I'd dare say he runs around at least as much as Cavani does these last couple of matches - there is probably stats that tell otherwise, but Ronaldo does a fair bit of pressing, only he's not really good at it. Greenwood can't press if his life depended on it. McTominay was rubbish, and Sancho looked more like he found their players than ours.

Ronaldo will bounce back, I'm sure of it!

I agree with most of this. I dont know what people were expecting, as if we would get the old Ronaldo. He is still a great striker and a great example and his goals record in this side which is creating sod all is still very commendable.

He was dreadful against Wolves, little denying that, so was Cavani who has quite rightly had nothing but praise in his time here.

Whether it was the right decision jumping in for Ronaldo when we already had Cavani and desperately needed midfield reinforcements which is without doubt our main problem is another thing altogether.

The only rergret I have personally on us signing Ronaldo is I really wanted to see Greenwood playing up front as I think hsi future is there or even possibly in the Fernandes position and Ronaldo coming stunted that.

But people talking about dropping him.....and then doing what exactly? Our only other option really is Cavani who has been superb buy does have nigling injury worries and he is going to go. I really want to see Greenwood there like I said but then who plays out wide, Martial wants and should go, Rashford and SAncho have so far both been abysmal generally so far (never saw the hype in Rashford anyway personally).

Lets face it, ROnaldo has already given the club payback financially on the field, we would probabl have not even made the Europa League from our champions league group games if it wasnt for his ruthless finishing.

 

[ThierryHenry14]

I am not a Ronaldo fan boy but he is the least of your problem. He is a striker in the penalty box and he is very good at it. His positioning, movement, shooting and heading are still top quality. I believe Man Utd's issue is else where. Harry Kane can't run with the ball, can't dribble past any players, super slow and drop extremely deep as well.

 

[redcafe_reader]

But people talking about dropping him.....and then doing what exactly? Our only other option really is Cavani who has been superb buy does have nigling injury worries and he is going to go. I really want to see Greenwood there like I said but then who plays out wide, Martial wants and should go, Rashford and SAncho have so far both been abysmal generally so far (never saw the hype in Rashford anyway personally).

I think Greenwood in place of Ronaldo and Dalot as a winger may work. Dalot offers better pressing/defending and work rate than Greenwood anyway.

I am not a Ronaldo fan boy but he is the least of your problem. He is a striker in the penalty box and he is very good at it. His positioning, movement, shooting and heading are still top quality. I believe Man Utd's issue is else where. Harry Kane can't run with the ball, can't dribble past any players, super slow and drop extremely deep as well.

Yea but tbf Kane is a great passer and he holds the ball well.

 

[Bobski]

We can can keep playing Ronaldo, finish 6th, he gets his 25-30 goals and the players we may be moving forward with are maginalized and don't develop as necessary this year. We need to know if Greenwood can play up top, if Rashford and Sancho can find their game, if Diallo has something to give going into next season, better long term for the club if we find that out. Unless we are in the chase for winning something I don't see the point of Ronaldo, would rather finish 9th giving young players a chance than 5th-6th getting Ronaldo goals.

The club aren't going to give up on top 4 though, so he will stay in the team. Lingard should have been playing this season, as soon as Ronaldo was coming there should have been a realization that the lack of running up front was going to be a major problem, needed someone prepared to sacrifice for the team instead of holding back for their individual glory, just to balance Ronaldo.

 

[Giant Midget]

Romanticism aside, he’s bloody awful. He looks so stiff when he gets the ball, his link-up play consists of immediately passing the ball backwards or losing it.

Zero hold up play, can’t beat a man, selfish play, and pretty average shooting.

He basically plays like a shit Darren Bent or Icardi these days.100% focus on poaching, no contribution otherwise whatsoever to our play. It’s not good enough and he needs to drop to the bench.

 

[Rossa]

I agree with most of this. I dont know what people were expecting, as if we would get the old Ronaldo. He is still a great striker and a great example and his goals record in this side which is creating sod all is still very commendable.

He was dreadful against Wolves, little denying that, so was Cavani who has quite rightly had nothing but praise in his time here.

Whether it was the right decision jumping in for Ronaldo when we already had Cavani and desperately needed midfield reinforcements which is without doubt our main problem is another thing altogether.

The only rergret I have personally on us signing Ronaldo is I really wanted to see Greenwood playing up front as I think hsi future is there or even possibly in the Fernandes position and Ronaldo coming stunted that.

But people talking about dropping him.....and then doing what exactly? Our only other option really is Cavani who has been superb buy does have nigling injury worries and he is going to go. I really want to see Greenwood there like I said but then who plays out wide, Martial wants and should go, Rashford and SAncho have so far both been abysmal generally so far (never saw the hype in Rashford anyway personally).

Lets face it, ROnaldo has already given the club payback financially on the field, we would probabl have not even made the Europa League from our champions league group games if it wasnt for his ruthless finishing.

Greenwood is still very young. Having Ronaldo should only be a compliment to Greenwood and someone to learn off. Greenwood seriously needs to up his workrate and pressing. He's much worse than a 37 year old Ronaldo in that sense. He's young and learning, but his decisions on field are also left to be desired at this stage. I have little doubt that he will be a great player as he is a terrific prospect, but he needs to be humble and continue learning.

 

[Rossa]

How will he bounce back, when he has lost so many of his tools?
Read this and tell me I’m wrong:

If I wanted to read that many words, I'd much rather the Lord of the Rings.

 

[Thelongsleevesofblomqvist]

Ronaldo is for sure the biggest change since last year's second place. Yes, he is still a very good goal scorer and wants to win more than some others on the pitch. But it messed up whatever squad planning Solskjaer was pretending to have control of.

 

[United in sin]

Romanticism aside, he’s bloody awful. He looks so stiff when he gets the ball, his link-up play consists of immediately passing the ball backwards or losing it.

Zero hold up play, can’t beat a man, selfish play, and pretty average shooting.

He basically plays like a shit Darren Bent or Icardi these days.100% focus on poaching, no contribution otherwise whatsoever to our play. It’s not good enough and he needs to drop to the bench.

I think this encapsulates everything wrong with him at United.

 

[LARulz]

I don't think this system we play suits him or anyone else in the team. His general play has been poor recently but has found himself in good positions (eg the chance Sancho had to pass to him but instead skied it)

He is used to having teams feed him the ball but none of our players except Bruno will do that. Rashford, Sancho and Greenwood are more than happy to try for glory themselves and is their instinct. I think Ronaldo has to do some adapting himself too and realise it's better he gets into positions it's impossible not to pass to him than just expect the ball to arrive

 

[kagawa_mufc]

Romanticism aside, he’s bloody awful. He looks so stiff when he gets the ball, his link-up play consists of immediately passing the ball backwards or losing it.

Zero hold up play, can’t beat a man, selfish play, and pretty average shooting.

He basically plays like a shit Darren Bent or Icardi these days.100% focus on poaching, no contribution otherwise whatsoever to our play. It’s not good enough and he needs to drop to the bench.

I don't think you are watching the same games. Selfish play? Greenwood and Rashford are what you call selfish, playing mid but hardly passing and always looking to shoot.
Current version of Ronaldo doesn't even take random long range shots like before, he hardly holds on to the ball like most players around, and passes it quickly. Only place you can call him "selfish" is in box where as no 9 he should be..even then he has 3 assists.

As about average shooting..well this "average" shooting resulted in numerous points both in PL and CL, without his 6 goals in CL we would likely finish 4th in the group..how many goals did your Darren Bent scored in CL? He has done very well in terms of goal scoring considering how little chances we create throughout the game.

We signed a no 9 and he plays like a no 9 should, if you have expectations that he should run around all over the pitch and dribble past players then probably you should ask that question to the wingers Sancho, Greenwood and Rashford not the no 9. Sure if a manager wants to play with a playing style where a more mobile striker is required than yes we should not play him or just sell him.

 

[Bebestation]

Just got to wait until the end of the season guys.

Finish off at 6 on the table and he will think that he is too good for this.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

I don't think you are watching the same games. Selfish play? Greenwood and Rashford are what you call selfish, playing mid but hardly passing and always looking to shoot.
Current version of Ronaldo doesn't even take random long range shots like before, he hardly holds on to the ball like most players around, and passes it quickly. Only place you can call him "selfish" is in box where as no 9 he should be..even then he has 3 assists.

As about average shooting..well this "average" shooting resulted in numerous points both in PL and CL, without his 6 goals in CL we would likely finish 4th in the group..how many goals did your Darren Bent scored in CL? He has done very well in terms of goal scoring considering how little chances we create throughout the game.

We signed a no 9 and he plays like a no 9 should, if you have expectations that he should run around all over the pitch and dribble past players then probably you should ask that question to the wingers Sancho, Greenwood and Rashford not the no 9. Sure if a manager wants to play with a playing style where a more mobile striker is required than yes we should not play him or just sell him.

That's what we should do.

 

[the_cliff]

I don't think you are watching the same games. Selfish play? Greenwood and Rashford are what you call selfish, playing mid but hardly passing and always looking to shoot.
Current version of Ronaldo doesn't even take random long range shots like before, he hardly holds on to the ball like most players around, and passes it quickly. Only place you can call him "selfish" is in box where as no 9 he should be..even then he has 3 assists.

As about average shooting..well this "average" shooting resulted in numerous points both in PL and CL, without his 6 goals in CL we would likely finish 4th in the group..how many goals did your Darren Bent scored in CL? He has done very well in terms of goal scoring considering how little chances we create throughout the game.

We signed a no 9 and he plays like a no 9 should, if you have expectations that he should run around all over the pitch and dribble past players then probably you should ask that question to the wingers Sancho, Greenwood and Rashford not the no 9. Sure if a manager wants to play with a playing style where a more mobile striker is required than yes we should not play him or just sell him.

The stats would disagree with you there mate, as I mentioned earlier he's taken the 3rd most shots in the league and nearly double the amount of the closest player for our team. Maybe you're thinking because he hasn't scored many open play goals in the league he's being less selfish when that's not the case. He has 6 open play goals which is tied 5th with 5 other players.

Now in terms of his finishing. He has a 19% goal conversion which is the lowest out of the 20 top scorers in the league and only Maupey, Jota and Raphinha have a lower shot accuracy percentage in the same top 20.

So yes he is taking shots. He's taken 57 in the league which is behind only Salah (Who has taken 80) and Mane (Who has taken 61) both have played around played 550 more minutes.

He has missed 8 big chances which is double Cavani in second place with 4.

So yes his shooting has been average and no he hasn't been doing 'very well' in terms of goal scoring with the 'little' chances we create.

Stop with the romanticism this Ronaldo is a shadow of the Ronaldo that left.

If a player was putting in the exact same performances with the exact same numbers but a different name he'd be abused in here.

 

[Nordmore]

The stats would disagree with you there mate, as I mentioned earlier he's taken the 2nd most shots in the league and double the amount of the closest player for our team. Maybe you're thinking because he hasn't scored many open play goals in the league he's being less selfish when that's not the case. He has 6 open play goals which is tied 5th with 5 other players.

Now in terms of his finishing. He has a 19% goal conversion which is the lowest out of the 20 top scorers in the league and only Maupey, Jota and Raphinha have a lower shot accuracy percentage in the same top 20.

So yes he is taking shots. He's taken 42 in the league which is behind only Salah (Who has taken 59) and played 550 more minutes.

So yes his shooting has been average and no he hasn't been doing 'very well' in terms of goal scoring with the 'little' chances we create.

Stop with the romanticism this Ronaldo is a shadow of the Ronaldo that left.

If a player was putting in the exact same performances with the exact same numbers but a different name he'd be abused in here.

Spot on.

If it was not for his name he'd be benched long ago. He's been our worst forward for a while, both based on the eye test and the stats.

 

[troylocker]

Greenwood is still very young. Having Ronaldo should only be a compliment to Greenwood and someone to learn off. Greenwood seriously needs to up his workrate and pressing. He's much worse than a 37 year old Ronaldo in that sense. He's young and learning, but his decisions on field are also left to be desired at this stage. I have little doubt that he will be a great player as he is a terrific prospect, but he needs to be humble and continue learning.

What Greenwood can pick up from the old fox is his movement and positional awareness when going forward and in the box, and maybe some tips regarding taking care of yourself to stay fit and injury free through a long career in football. Other than that it's not much to learn from him: Greenwoods finishing is already better, his close control and ballhandling is better, his workrate and pressing is a lot better (Ronaldo has the solo worst pressing numbers in the top 5 leagues for forwards with more than 500 minutes, Greenwood almost doubles Ronaldos' pressing numbers and still finds himself below average) and by all means do not copy or pick up any of Ronaldo's body language, diving or general moaning. The humble and learning part we can agree on, which he obviously cannot learn from Ronaldo....

 

[KeanoMagicHat]

So yes his shooting has been average and no he hasn't been doing 'very well' in terms of goal scoring with the 'little' chances we create.

Stop with the romanticism this Ronaldo is a shadow of the Ronaldo that left.

If a player was putting in the exact same performances with the exact same numbers but a different name he'd be abused in here.

Yep, he's actually missed a few chances from being sluggish to get the shot away and could have got sent off at least twice, as well as the bad general play. This is just in the PL though, he's been notably better in the CL. But that begs the question, is he only trying/saving himself for the CL? And in that case, why are we playing him 90 minutes of every PL game?

His WhoScored rating for CL in 7.95, his rating for the PL is 6.94. 6.94 makes him the 71st best player in the PL this year, not exactly 'GOAT' level at all that his reputation gives him and around the rating of the likes of solid PL forwards like Lacazette, Demarai Gray, Vardy, Watkins. His rating is even worse than out of form Harry Kane, never mind Mo Salah, who is several levels ahead.

 

[D. Mungai]

at least many people are seeing he is the problem.

He doesnt score much which should cover his all other deficiency.

Ronaldo is the main problem, he is not as good as we thought. Even Buffon & Bonnuchi said so. As another poster as said, from stats and eye test Ronaldo is soo poor to which is very true.

The main question is, is ronaldo better than cavani? in movement, pressing, scoring, body language, cost (salary), well being of the club?

 

[stoinz]

Actually I'm not sure if this is such a black and white problem. Yes Ronaldo is not playing well whether you look at stats, 'eye tests' or however you want to use to gauge but the I think RR's problem is if not Ronaldo, who? From his post match interview, he mentioned he put on a team he thought deserves to play and will put in the effort. So say if he thought Rashford or Martial is not putting in the effort in training and or have some behavioral problems, what do you do if you are RR? Play them despite believing they don't deserve to start?

There is another thread on 11 players wanting to leave / or disillusioned, do you play them even though they are not buying in your ideas or producing the work ethic that you want? On top of that RR is an interim manager which makes it hard for him to motivate the players. It seem like we are in such a big mess that there is no easy solution to.

 

[the_cliff]

Yep, he's actually missed a few chances from being sluggish to get the shot away and could have got sent off at least twice, as well as the bad general play. This is just in the PL though, he's been notably better in the CL. But that begs the question, is he only trying/saving himself for the CL? And in that case, why are we playing him 90 minutes of every PL game?

His WhoScored rating for CL in 7.95, his rating for the PL is 6.94. 6.94 makes him the 71st best player in the PL this year, not exactly 'GOAT' level at all that his reputation gives him and around the rating of the likes of solid PL forwards like Lacazette, Demarai Gray, Vardy, Watkins. His rating is even worse than out of form Harry Kane, never mind Mo Salah, who is several levels ahead.

I have no problem with his UCL performances, I think European football suits him more than the prem does and he's been very good. No complaints. My problem with him is we can't continue giving him the benefit of the doubt in the league. We won't make top 4 if we continue like this and that's a fact. I think he can't take the physicality of the prem anymore and struggles against any team that's in a low block.

 

[VP89]

I like Ronaldo but I do want to see a system with young energetic players pressing in tandem from the front.

 

[Thelongsleevesofblomqvist]

Just got to wait until the end of the season guys.

Finish off at 6 on the table and he will think that he is too good for this.

He will stay for his two years. Who else in Europe would buy him? PSG?

 

[the_cliff]

He will stay for his two years. Who else in Europe would buy him? PSG?

I agree, there isn't a team serious about winning trophies that would take him. Madrid and PSG already passed on him this summer.