Could they void the PL due to the Coronavirus? | No | Resuming June 17th

[sullydnl]

The key point here is that footballers aren't being treated like other workers. They're being rushed back to work earlier than those in similar roles (i.e. roles that are totally nonessential and totally incompatable with social distancing) for financial and political reasons. No amount of increased testing (which itself is problematic and only ever so effective) changes that fact.

And pointing to the amount of money they earn as if that means they should be more willing to risk their health is an utterly braindead response. They're paid to be footballers, that's it. They're not paid to take increased risks in the middle of a pandemic.

 

[Lemansky]

If they really want Liverpool to be champions then they can do what other leagues have done and name them champions. It's hardly the most pressing outstanding issue from their POV.

The pressing issue is relegations and Europe places. Can be a lot of legal ramifications after a decision is made. Liverpool, is quite rightly, not a problem at all.

 

[Finn MacCool]

Thread highlights:

Sanity: Safety should take priority over money concerns.
Tory-Liverpool fans: It's not about the money only sporting integrity and public morale.
Sanity: But there is a huge health risk in returning.
Tory-Liverpool fans: But Germany did it.
Sanity: Yes and Germany have handled this virus significantly better than the Tories.
Tory-Liverpool fans: How dare you insult the Tories, besides others are going back to work.
Sanity: Yes largely outside the non-essential entertainment industry, with social distance practices in place. Footballers are playing a contact sport.
Tory-Liverpool fans: But they get paid lots of money.
repeat ad nauseam

Spot on analysis - Liverpool as a city and it’s fan base are well known for their love of all things Tory. Bill Shankly was a massive Tory and now Klopp carries on that tradition - he always votes for right wing parties. Prefers a tax cut to good public services.

All 5 mps in Liverpool are Tory. The city’s shift rightwards gathered momentum in the 80s when Liverpool embraced Thatcherism. Geoffrey Howe even wrote a letter to Thatcher saying how Liverpool was a bastion of Toryism and they must pour more money into it.

And as for right wing newspapers well the city even has a campaign encouraging people to buy a particular one.

Let me know when you’re mixing up politics and football again. Big fan of your take on the city and it’s political leanings.

 

[Buchan]

The cynic in me thinks the Premier League just want to get enough games in to confirm Liverpool as champions and then if it has to be called off it can be.

A1.

These Scouse cnuts have pulled the wool over the authorities’ eyes and all the powers-that-be want to do now is appease that grotesque shower down the East Lancs Road.

 

[christinaa]

The thing is that Integrity has been blown out of the window and the sporting goal posts have been altered with bcd and all the shenanigans just to finish the PL.

So it doesn't mean anything any longer - it ain't football/the PL as we know it and when United won 13 (thirteen) of them.

 

[Buchan]

If they really want Liverpool to be champions then they can do what other leagues have done and name them champions. It's hardly the most pressing outstanding issue from their POV.

They’d love to, I suspect, but they’ve gone down the ‘sporting integrity’ rabbit hole and it appears they are chained to this rhetoric now.

 

[Finn MacCool]

They’d love to, I suspect, but they’ve gone down the ‘sporting integrity’ rabbit hole and it appears they are chained to this rhetoric now.

They’re trying to finish it to get the tv money and fulfil their contractual agreements with the FA and EFL. It’s about money and the path which will offer the lowest risk of legal action.

 

[thegregster]

Spot on analysis - Liverpool as a city and it’s fan base are well known for their love of all things Tory. Bill Shankly was a massive Tory and now Klopp carries on that tradition - he always votes for right wing parties. Prefers a tax cut to good public services.

All 5 mps in Liverpool are Tory. The city’s shift rightwards gathered momentum in the 80s when Liverpool embraced Thatcherism. Geoffrey Howe even wrote a letter to Thatcher saying how Liverpool was a bastion of Toryism and they must pour more money into it.

And as for right wing newspapers well the city even has a campaign encouraging people to buy a particular one.

Let me know when you’re mixing up politics and football again. Big fan of your take on the city and it’s political leanings.

But up to the 70s the city voted Tory. The city became poor and started voting Labour.

Also the owners,Bob Paisley and the players were a mouthpiece for the Tories in the 70s and 80s. Liverpool FC was founded by Tories.

Also Klopp is right wing. He supports Merkel.

Liverpool can't blame Thatcher for its decline. It was a kip long before she came to power.

Also your club in the 80s brought Thatcherism to football. No more gate sharing with smaller clubs and doing your own TV deal with ITV in the 80s. No protest from your fans of course

 

[christinaa]

Not necessarily. Germany also had cases and just went through as envisioned.

Don't think there will be football in May either way though.

Germany were 100 times more organised than us and are testing over 100,000 persons daily.

We just cannot compare to their excellent checking.

 

[Wednesday at Stoke]

I think there's more chance of them giving up the season now and hope this gets under control by August so we can have a football season again. I'm more worried about there being a delayed start at best to the next season. This one's done.

 

[Sandikan]

I think there's more chance of them giving up the season now and hope this gets under control by August so we can have a football season again. I'm more worried about there being a delayed start at best to the next season. This one's done.

What on earth makes you think they'll suddenly bin it now after months of insistence it'll finish and now paying for extended testing?

A tiny amount of players testing positive? If it was 66% rather than 6 people maybe

 

[Wednesday at Stoke]

What on earth makes you think they'll suddenly bin it now after months of insistence it'll finish and now paying for extended testing?

A tiny amount of players testing positive? If it was 66% rather than 6 people maybe

Unless they test everyone prior to every game its ultimately insufficient. Now imagine being a manager picking teams for games that happen thrice a week and before the game finding out that one of your key players tested positive. What if its a game that seals relegation or champions league spot?

Once you start pitting health advice vs sporting, financial incentives its a slippery slope and this is primed for an unsafe work environment lawsuit against the league.

 

[Sandikan]

Unless they test everyone prior to every game its ultimately insufficient. Now imagine being a manager picking teams for games that happen thrice a week and before the game finding out that one of your key players tested positive. What if its a game that seals relegation or champions league spot?

Once you start pitting health advice vs sporting, financial incentives its a slippery slope and this is primed for an unsafe work environment lawsuit against the league.

The league will already have shifted from proper home advantage with a crowd to either neutral venue or home stadium but bcd.
This is just another step like that.
Same for everyone and hard luck unfortunately.

The clubs will vote for playing on so won't be able to sue. Unlike if it had been on a technicality decision.

 

[POF]

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/metr...d-like-lab-rats-project-restart-12729341/amp/



So Danny “what stupid thing am I gonna say this week” Rose reckons PL footballers are being used like lab rats. Honestly, some of these players really don’t help themselves sometimes. They’ve not got a clue beyond their bubble.

It's an incredible lack of self awareness. If he doesn't want to go back to train or play, will he get paid?

Surely if he's willing to take unpaid leave for the period he's not willing to play then he won't get any pressure to play?

I don't think any footballers should be pressured into playing if they don't feel comfortable but if it's deemed safe to do so and they refuse, their employer should have no obligation to pay them.

 

[Pagh Wraith]

Germany were 100 times more organised than us and are testing over 100,000 persons daily.

We just cannot compare to their excellent checking.

1) The UK has tested more per capita than Germany. Germany is conducting about 50,000 tests per day. The number of people tested is lower as some are tested more than once.

2) What relevance does it have as long as all players and staff are rigorously tested?

3) The UK is roughly were Germany was four weeks ago in terms of daily cases which corresponds with a proposed Premier League restart in mid-June, roughly four weeks after the Bundesliga.

It's noticeable how United supporters desperately want to stop Liverpool from winning the league or at least stop them from winning it on the pitch whereas RAWK desperately want to continue at any cost. One side makes absurd arguments as to why continuing is impossible despite the Bundesliga providing the blueprint for it and the other side even mock the likes of Troy Deeney who have genuine health concerns or suspect he may have been set up by Watford's chairman. Has it occured to anyone that neither should be taken too seriously as both are extremely biased? You certainly are.

 

[romufc]

I wonder how it works in tunnels, changing rooms etc.. Can you social distance in changing rooms? when players are taking their tops off etc?

What will happen when Liverpool win the 2 games, will they not celebrate in the dressing room?

Will cameras be allowed in there? I suspect there will be no cameras.

 

[Sandikan]

I wonder how it works in tunnels, changing rooms etc.. Can you social distance in changing rooms? when players are taking their tops off etc?

What will happen when Liverpool win the 2 games, will they not celebrate in the dressing room?

Will cameras be allowed in there? I suspect there will be no cameras.

Never mind all that, they'll be having a right old wrestle for corners!
Impossible to keep apart at those.

 

[Sandikan]

Spot on analysis - Liverpool as a city and it’s fan base are well known for their love of all things Tory. Bill Shankly was a massive Tory and now Klopp carries on that tradition - he always votes for right wing parties. Prefers a tax cut to good public services.

All 5 mps in Liverpool are Tory. The city’s shift rightwards gathered momentum in the 80s when Liverpool embraced Thatcherism. Geoffrey Howe even wrote a letter to Thatcher saying how Liverpool was a bastion of Toryism and they must pour more money into it.

And as for right wing newspapers well the city even has a campaign encouraging people to buy a particular one.

Let me know when you’re mixing up politics and football again. Big fan of your take on the city and it’s political leanings.

I presumed he was just trying to double the insult rather than link the two together.
Ie you're such a tory and even worse a scouser.

I go on a few forums and they always seem to have a real tory hate and labour sympathizing.

Yet when it comes to the polls it's usually a whitewash.

A good sign that the vocal majority on forums do NOT hold the consensus of opinion

 

[golden_blunder]

This.

It's not worth the health of ANYONE let alone players and there family's ECT.

Imagine if someone was to die because they played with another player or trained with them and they had it?

I think the money men are prepared to take that risk because. Money. No other reason. We must make all our money.

 

[Santoryo]

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/metr...d-like-lab-rats-project-restart-12729341/amp/



So Danny “what stupid thing am I gonna say this week” Rose reckons PL footballers are being used like lab rats. Honestly, some of these players really don’t help themselves sometimes. They’ve not got a clue beyond their bubble.

I usually feel that people are harsh on players when they talk about their intelligence or constantly highlight their lack of education but it's statements like the ones made by the likes of Danny Rose the past few weeks that makes it almost impossible to fight against this narrative that players are dumb.

 

[thegregster]

I usually feel that people are harsh on players when they talk about their intelligence or constantly highlight their lack of education but it's statements like the ones made by the likes of Danny Rose the past few weeks that makes it almost impossible to fight against this narrative that players are dumb.

Rose is right.

Every other industry/service/ activity that has returned is able to minimise the risk via PPE and social distancing. Impossible for football.

 

[Finn MacCool]

But up to the 70s the city voted Tory. The city became poor and started voting Labour.

Also the owners,Bob Paisley and the players were a mouthpiece for the Tories in the 70s and 80s. Liverpool FC was founded by Tories.

Also Klopp is right wing. He supports Merkel.

Liverpool can't blame Thatcher for its decline. It was a kip long before she came to power.

Also your club in the 80s brought Thatcherism to football. No more gate sharing with smaller clubs and doing your own TV deal with ITV in the 80s. No protest from your fans of course

The Labour Party didn’t exist when Liverpool was founded. The main choice was Tory or Liberal - not much of a choice. One of the reasons the Tories held Liverpool especially during the first half of 20thc was their stoking of anti Irish anti catholic fears. Some things never change - the Tories will always attack immigrants, people of colour or a different religion. Their 60s campaign poster “if you want a coloured for your neighbour vote Labour” says it all. Pure scum.

Whilst Klopp may respect Merkel (and let’s face it no matter your political leanings it’s hard not to admire her bravery and humanity in taking 1m refugees) he is on record as saying:

“I'm on the left, of course. More left than middle. I believe in the welfare state. I'm not privately insured. I would never vote for a party because they promised to lower the top tax rate.”

Thatcher accelerated the city’s decline and as a party they all but gave up trying to convert it back to conservatism and their covert policy towards the city, only relatively recently revealed, was one of “managed decline”.

It’s true that Paisley and some players didn’t follow in the footsteps of Shankly in regards to politics but at that time they very much didn’t reflect the seismic shift in the city.

Even now the current owners are out of step with the fans and have been forced to climb down on ticket price increases and the furlough scheme - due mainly to fan backlash at a perceived sense of greed.

Nowadays politically Liverpool is lost to the Tories and it’s hard to see them regain a foothold there. Much of the rest of the country have settled for austerity, cuts to those who can least afford it, decimated public services and all mixed in with xenophobic poison. Maybe c19 will make people see sense but I doubt it. Expect a whitewash inquiry blaming anyone but the govt. At Orgreave it was the miners, Hillsborough it was the fans and Grenfell the firefighters.

 

[RobinLFC]

Rose is right.

Every other industry/service/ activity that has returned is able to minimise the risk via PPE and social distancing. Impossible for football.

Which is why they're minimizing the risk through testing all players every other day, which does not happen in those other industries.

 

[thegregster]

The Labour Party didn’t exist when Liverpool was founded. The main choice was Tory or Liberal - not much of a choice. One of the reasons the Tories held Liverpool especially during the first half of 20thc was their stoking of anti Irish anti catholic fears. Some things never change - the Tories will always attack immigrants, people of colour or a different religion. Their 60s campaign poster “if you want a coloured for your neighbour vote Labour” says it all. Pure scum.

Whilst Klopp may respect Merkel (and let’s face it no matter your political leanings it’s hard not to admire her bravery and humanity in taking 1m refugees) he is on record as saying:

“I'm on the left, of course. More left than middle. I believe in the welfare state. I'm not privately insured. I would never vote for a party because they promised to lower the top tax rate.”

Thatcher accelerated the city’s decline and as a party they all but gave up trying to convert it back to conservatism and their covert policy towards the city, only relatively recently revealed, was one of “managed decline”.

It’s true that Paisley and some players didn’t follow in the footsteps of Shankly in regards to politics but at that time they very much didn’t reflect the seismic shift in the city.

Even now the current owners are out of step with the fans and have been forced to climb down on ticket price increases and the furlough scheme - due mainly to fan backlash at a perceived sense of greed.

Nowadays politically Liverpool is lost to the Tories and it’s hard to see them regain a foothold there. Much of the rest of the country have settled for austerity, cuts to those who can least afford it, decimated public services and all mixed in with xenophobic poison. Maybe c19 will make people see sense but I doubt it. Expect a whitewash inquiry blaming anyone but the govt. At Orgreave it was the miners, Hillsborough it was the fans and Grenfell the firefighters.

The Tory claim on the poster is fake. But we do know that a Labour council did put an ad in a newspaper telling immigrants to stay away.



Also the people of Liverpool didnt give a shit about other communities being destroyed to help their own city.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/wales/4354256.stm#sa-link_location=story-body&intlink_from_url=https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-politics-34527379&intlink_ts=1589969921482-sa


Liverpool fans are only moaning about the owners because it doesn't really benefit them on the pitch. When Torypool screwed over the smaller clubs in 80s the fans didnt care. Usual scouse hypocrisy.

 

[christinaa]

1) The UK has tested more per capita than Germany. Germany is conducting about 50,000 tests per day. The number of people tested is lower as some are tested more than once.

2) What relevance does it have as long as all players and staff are rigorously tested?

3) The UK is roughly were Germany was four weeks ago in terms of daily cases which corresponds with a proposed Premier League restart in mid-June, roughly four weeks after the Bundesliga.

It's noticeable how United supporters desperately want to stop Liverpool from winning the league or at least stop them from winning it on the pitch whereas RAWK desperately want to continue at any cost. One side makes absurd arguments as to why continuing is impossible despite the Bundesliga providing the blueprint for it and the other side even mock the likes of Troy Deeney who have genuine health concerns or suspect he may have been set up by Watford's chairman. Has it occured to anyone that neither should be taken too seriously as both are extremely biased? You certainly are.

Do you realise that you're on a United Supporters forum?
Why do you come here - to irk people just for kicks?
It's useless debating with someone like you when you feel that the UK has been better than Germany at testing and the WHOLE Covid-19 situation - for a start see the number of deaths and vide this graph: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/total-deaths-covid-19?country=DEU+GBR+OWID_WRL
and you'll see who is doing the better job.
You try to write like you're Mother Teresa but i can read through your comments and you're certainly one of the most biased in this thread.
I hope you'll be included in the list of those culled from OUR forum.

 

[RobinLFC]

Do you realise that you're on a United Supporters forum?
I hope you'll be included in the list of those culled from OUR forum.

Your standard response when someone calls you out on a bad post, sigh.

 

[thegregster]

1) The UK has tested more per capita than Germany. Germany is conducting about 50,000 tests per day. The number of people tested is lower as some are tested more than once.

2) What relevance does it have as long as all players and staff are rigorously tested?

3) The UK is roughly were Germany was four weeks ago in terms of daily cases which corresponds with a proposed Premier League restart in mid-June, roughly four weeks after the Bundesliga.

It's noticeable how United supporters desperately want to stop Liverpool from winning the league or at least stop them from winning it on the pitch whereas RAWK desperately want to continue at any cost. One side makes absurd arguments as to why continuing is impossible despite the Bundesliga providing the blueprint for it and the other side even mock the likes of Troy Deeney who have genuine health concerns or suspect he may have been set up by Watford's chairman. Has it occured to anyone that neither should be taken too seriously as both are extremely biased? You certainly are.

Would you ask any other worker to do their jobs were PPE cant be used or social distancing is impossible?

Why should footballers be expected to take such big risks?

 

[Finn MacCool]

The Tory claim on the poster is fake. But we do know that a Labour council did put an ad in a newspaper telling immigrants to stay away.



Also the people of Liverpool didnt give a shit about other communities being destroyed to help their own city.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/wales/4354256.stm#sa-link_location=story-body&intlink_from_url=https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-politics-34527379&intlink_ts=1589969921482-sa


Liverpool fans are only moaning about the owners because it doesn't really benefit them on the pitch. When Torypool screwed over the smaller clubs in 80s the fans didnt care. Usual scouse hypocrisy.

It’s true that the poster was never confirmed as being printed by the Tories. But it aligns with their general policy as evidenced recently by Windrush and the go home vans. One theory is the poster was circulated by the NF.

Protesting ticket price increases and the furlough scheme would mean less money for the club so less money for new players so less chance of benefiting the team on the pitch.

 

[christinaa]

Your standard response when someone calls you out on a bad post, sigh.

I wasn't called out on a bad spot - it was bad info from the other person.
Are you his lawyer?

 

[dumbo]

Spot on analysis - Liverpool as a city and it’s fan base are well known for their love of all things Tory. Bill Shankly was a massive Tory and now Klopp carries on that tradition - he always votes for right wing parties. Prefers a tax cut to good public services.

All 5 mps in Liverpool are Tory. The city’s shift rightwards gathered momentum in the 80s when Liverpool embraced Thatcherism. Geoffrey Howe even wrote a letter to Thatcher saying how Liverpool was a bastion of Toryism and they must pour more money into it.

And as for right wing newspapers well the city even has a campaign encouraging people to buy a particular one.

Let me know when you’re mixing up politics and football again. Big fan of your take on the city and it’s political leanings.

Thanks mate. I agree with you too.

 

[RobinLFC]

Would you ask any other worker to do their jobs were PPE cant be used or social distancing is impossible?

Why should footballers be expected to take such big risks?

Conveniently ignored my post that the risk is minimized through extensive testing, I see.

Would you be more comfortable playing a game of football with 21 others who've been tested regularly over the past few days or would you rather work in an overcrowded Primark where social distancing isn't respected either?

 

[Cloud7]

The cynic in me thinks the Premier League just want to get enough games in to confirm Liverpool as champions and then if it has to be called off it can be.

As much as their cronies in the media would have you believe that the Universe revolves around Liverpool, I don’t think this is the case. For the most part I think they just want their pockets to continue being filled, and presumably the more games they can squeeze out, the less money they lose out on.

 

[Pagh Wraith]

Do you realise that you're on a United Supporters forum?
Why do you come here - to irk people just for kicks?
It's useless debating with someone like you when you feel that the UK has been better than Germany at testing and the WHOLE Covid-19 situation - for a start see the number of deaths and vide this graph: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/total-deaths-covid-19?country=DEU+GBR+OWID_WRL
and you'll see who is doing the better job.
You try to write like you're Mother Teresa but i can read through your comments and you're certainly one of the most biased in this thread.
I hope you'll be included in the list of those culled from OUR forum.

Moving the goalposts again when someone calls you out on your false numbers and statements. Your agenda is obvious and there is indeed little point in debating this with you any further. Not just this topic.

 

[rocks12]

Conveniently ignored my post that the risk is minimized through extensive testing, I see.

Would you be more comfortable playing a game of football with 21 others who've been tested regularly over the past few days or would you rather work in an overcrowded Primark where social distancing isn't respected either?

Why don't you just stop talking around things and admit that you couldn't care less about player's safety or how many people die, you simply want Liverpool to win the league whatever the cost? It's not that difficult.

 

[Pagh Wraith]

Would you ask any other worker to do their jobs were PPE cant be used or social distancing is impossible?

Why should footballers be expected to take such big risks?

Footballers get tested every two or three days. I'm sure other workers (essential or not) would enjoy that kind of treatment. I would never claim the risk is zero but it is certainly very minimal. After the first rounds of testing here in Germany, the 20 or so infected players were isolated and there haven't been any cases since (though I totally expect there to be more). We have opened everything up again which means many people are back at work. Waiters and bartenders wear masks but there is certainly a non-zero risk for them as well. It just was no longer justifiable to keep their businesses shut and them from doing their job. I visited a construction site for a new training centre today with more than 100 workers and nobody was wearing a mask or social distancing. Their risk is certainly also much higher than for Bundesliga players. But the infection rate is so low now that there isn't even a debate around that. I saw youth teams training again this week. They sure as hell do not get tested. The list goes on. I just think we are at that point now where not allowing football to continue would equate to giving it special status.

As I said, the UK is roughly four weeks behind (partly due to the handling of the crisis by its government, I don't disagree with that) but you will be in the same situation soon enough. We are managing and living with the virus now and life is returning to normal which includes football.

 

[Ludens the Red]

Do you realise that you're on a United Supporters forum?
Why do you come here - to irk people just for kicks?
It's useless debating with someone like you when you feel that the UK has been better than Germany at testing and the WHOLE Covid-19 situation - for a start see the number of deaths and vide this graph: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/total-deaths-covid-19?country=DEU+GBR+OWID_WRL
and you'll see who is doing the better job.
You try to write like you're Mother Teresa but i can read through your comments and you're certainly one of the most biased in this thread.
I hope you'll be included in the list of those culled from OUR forum.

As a neutral to your discussion, @Pagh Wraith postings in this thread have been a lot more sensible than yours.

 

[Tibs]

The key point here is that footballers aren't being treated like other workers. They're being rushed back to work earlier than those in similar roles (i.e. roles that are totally nonessential and totally incompatable with social distancing) for financial and political reasons. No amount of increased testing (which itself is problematic and only ever so effective) changes that fact.

And pointing to the amount of money they earn as if that means they should be more willing to risk their health is an utterly braindead response. They're paid to be footballers, that's it. They're not paid to take increased risks in the middle of a pandemic.

I agree with you, and think that it be stopped. But it's not, why? Because all the clubs, including us, are in favour of a return. The players for the most part are keeping their head down and doing as they're told.

When we talk about the PL/FA giving zero fecks about threat to players families - the same could be said for us

 

[Dec9003]

Conveniently ignored my post that the risk is minimized through extensive testing, I see.

Would you be more comfortable playing a game of football with 21 others who've been tested regularly over the past few days or would you rather work in an overcrowded Primark where social distancing isn't respected either?

If you have vulnerable family you wouldn’t be happy working in either conditions, obviously. Primark isn’t even open anyway.

 

[cyberman]

If you have vulnerable family you wouldn’t be happy working in either conditions, obviously. Primark isn’t even open anyway.

Footballers arent immune to making this choice. They cant sit out until theres a vaccine so they can either go to work or step aside.
Im not having a go at them or being harsh, its a choice all workers with vunerable relatives must make.

 

[Buchan]