Cop in America doing a bad job, again

Walrus said:
Im just catching up on all this after being shamefully ignorant of what has been going on. Its genuinely a bit upsetting to see some of this - like the twitter thread and the "autistic person lives here" image linked earlier. I dont know what the solution is at this point, and I think its only going to get worse. feck knows where we (they) end up.

One the one hand, the rioting is bad. On the other hand, its understandable, and seeing the difference in policing between certain protests is just another vindication of it, really.
Click to expand...

America is sadly beyond help at this point. It is a complete clusterfeck of a place.
 
Grinner said:
Not at all. The elites have an even tighter grip on power than ever before. It's no contest.
Click to expand...
That much is true, but I was thinking more amongst the people as a whole - boots on the ground, etc.

Outside of the Civil Right's Movement, what have been the biggest mobilizations in the States? The Rodney King riots? Cincinnati, and?

Did anything change of the back of these in the grand scheme?
 
bm606cb3zi151.jpg


seriously feck libs, they've done more to prevent racial justice than every klanmember combined
 
Fortitude said:
That much is true, but I was thinking more amongst the people as a whole - boots on the ground, etc.

Outside of the Civil Right's Movement, what have been the biggest mobilizations in the States? The Rodney King riots? Cincinnati, and?

Did anything change of the back of these in the grand scheme?
Click to expand...

Non-whites in America have always been divided and conquered. It's still going on. Black people have always had it worse though. Unfortunately you don't see an MLK, a Malcolm X, a Jesse Jackson on the horizon to galvanize people. I mean, two of those three got taken out as it is.
 
Carolina Red said:
At some point the cost-benefit analysis of having lots of poorly trained officers doing bad things would have to tip the scale towards taking more time to train people, even if it means fewer officers at a given time.
Click to expand...
Yea I’m supportive of more training. Would have to be mandated by each state’s governing police body (like CA P.O.S.T). But honestly i don’t see that as the biggest issue. After the academy training the new officers go to their respective departments. Some small, some big. Some fast-paced, some slow. Some in rich jurisdictions, some in poor, some with mostly white people in their ranks, some with mostly minority officers, etc.
the problem is each department has It’s own culture and policies. The smaller departments are usually very tight-knit and have a certain “mold” they want their officers to fit and you either get with their program or you risk being shunned out and failing the training program. So the issue is there’s no uniformity across all these different departments. There has to be a way to have consistent policies throughout the state or country. Or give the governing police body more power to investigate serious uses of force/shootings.
 
choiboyx012 said:
Yea I’m supportive of more training. Would have to be mandated by each state’s governing police body (like CA P.O.S.T). But honestly i don’t see that as the biggest issue. After the academy training the new officers go to their respective departments. Some small, some big. Some fast-paced, some slow. Some in rich jurisdictions, some in poor, some with mostly white people in their ranks, some with mostly minority officers, etc.
the problem is each department has It’s own culture and policies. The smaller departments are usually very tight-knit and have a certain “mold” they want their officers to fit and you either get with their program or you risk being shunned out and failing the training program. So the issue is there’s no uniformity across all these different departments. There has to be a way to have consistent policies throughout the state or country. Or give the governing police body more power to investigate serious uses of force/shootings.
Click to expand...
Would you agree that by having a low threshold to join the police, that it leads to a higher probability of getting people into the department that would implement such toxic cultures?
 
Grinner said:
Non-whites in America have always been divided and conquered. It's still going on. Black people have always had it worse though. Unfortunately you don't see an MLK, a Malcolm X, a Jesse Jackson on the horizon to galvanize people. I mean, two of those three got taken out as it is.
Click to expand...
Sadly, there's nothing much to add to this. :(
 
Grinner said:
Non-whites in America have always been divided and conquered. It's still going on. Black people have always had it worse though. Unfortunately you don't see an MLK, a Malcolm X, a Jesse Jackson on the horizon to galvanize people. I mean, two of those three got taken out as it is.
Click to expand...
You wanna talk about a guy that is demonized in the place of his birth. White people in Greenville, SC hate that man.
 
choiboyx012 said:
Didn’t know it was that long. It’s a good thing and how it should be really. But I’m assuming those countries have a central, nationalized police force?

Just did a quick google search. So yea it looks like it’s 2-3 years of police university. If so that explains how feasible it is to have a consistent centralized police force and requisite training. Logistically though it just would not work in the US, which is a shame. No city, county, or state can afford to recruit, hire, and send a police recruit to a 2-3 year academy or police university when they need bodies to fill in and hit the streets asap.
Click to expand...


Of course is possible, once you start with 2-3 years, then is a wheel, every quatrimester you would have freshly graduated policemen/women
 
Carolina Red said:
I'm not saying that's the issue with regards to Minnesota. I'm commenting on the discussion that is currently being had in the thread about the stark difference in police training in the US (a few months) vs. some countries in Europe (a couple to a few years).
Click to expand...

If I use the french system, the main difference is that you guys rely on what we call Police Municipale while in France they are not badly trained they are not equal to the Police Nationale which is the actual police. The Police National school last 12 months for the lower ranks and 18 months for officers. During the first 5 years they are not affected where they want but where the Police needs them, so it's not a great idea to act like a complete ass if you want a future move.
 
Sara125 said:
Apparently a lot of the fires have been started by undercover officers
Click to expand...
Your going to need to prove that otherwise i think this should be deleted.

Cant be throwing around unfounded accusations like that
 
Carolina Red said:
Would you agree that by having a low threshold to join the police, that it leads to a higher probability of getting people into the department that would implement such toxic cultures?
Click to expand...
Not exactly, because the “threshold” is different for each department. I can get hired by one department but rejected by another. Some departments are very selective on hiring. I’ve been to testing events years ago in a auditoriums filled with hundreds of fellow applicants, but the dept will only be hiring 4 bodies for the year. Maybe require a college degree? Though many poorer applicants will be disadvantaged. Or make the academy longer is a feasible idea too.

I really don’t know how to fix the toxic cultures prevalent in departments. I do think a generational shift needs to happen. There’s still a lot of “old school” police officers who came on the job in the 80s and 90s before cellphone videos and social media. You can imagine how the culture was back then. Until these guys are gone from the ranks maybe then it will get better?
 
choiboyx012 said:
Not exactly, because the “threshold” is different for each department. I can get hired by one department but rejected by another. Some departments are very selective on hiring. I’ve been to testing events years ago in a auditoriums filled with hundreds of fellow applicants, but the dept will only be hiring 4 bodies for the year. Maybe require a college degree? Though many poorer applicants will be disadvantaged. Or make the academy longer is a feasible idea too.

I really don’t know how to fix the toxic cultures prevalent in departments. I do think a generational shift needs to happen. There’s still a lot of “old school” police officers who came on the job in the 80s and 90s before cellphone videos and social media. You can imagine how the culture was back then. Until these guys are gone from the ranks maybe then it will get better?
Click to expand...
My county requires a bachelor’s degree to apply, and we just had a similar incident that caused protests a few years ago. It only helps so much.
 
4bars said:
Of course is possible, once you start with 2-3 years, then is a wheel, every quatrimester you would have freshly graduated policemen/women
Click to expand...
And where would the academy be? Which cities would they go afterwards? Would their department pay them their full salary/benefits while in training for 2-3 years?
 
choiboyx012 said:
Not exactly, because the “threshold” is different for each department. I can get hired by one department but rejected by another. Some departments are very selective on hiring. I’ve been to testing events years ago in a auditoriums filled with hundreds of fellow applicants, but the dept will only be hiring 4 bodies for the year. Maybe require a college degree? Though many poorer applicants will be disadvantaged. Or make the academy longer is a feasible idea too.

I really don’t know how to fix the toxic cultures prevalent in departments. I do think a generational shift needs to happen. There’s still a lot of “old school” police officers who came on the job in the 80s and 90s before cellphone videos and social media. You can imagine how the culture was back then. Until these guys are gone from the ranks maybe then it will get better?
Click to expand...

Time can't fix this one as new incidents keeps on ramping up the tension.

Time can heal "One" incident, people will forget over time and move on, but not when new and fresh one keeps coming in every months.

Everytime an incident like floyd happens it sets you back for I don't know how long, at his rate you will never have the trust / respect / obedience from the black community and who can blame them.
 
choiboyx012 said:
And where would the academy be? Which cities would they go afterwards? Would their department pay them their full salary/benefits while in training for 2-3 years?
Click to expand...

Every first world country does it. It would be change the police system and US has the resources. I can't understand american exceptionalism. We can't have police academies, we can't get rid of guns, we can't get universal health care, we can't get affordable post-secondary education.

It is possible, there is no will
 
choiboyx012 said:
Not exactly, because the “threshold” is different for each department. I can get hired by one department but rejected by another. Some departments are very selective on hiring. I’ve been to testing events years ago in a auditoriums filled with hundreds of fellow applicants, but the dept will only be hiring 4 bodies for the year. Maybe require a college degree? Though many poorer applicants will be disadvantaged. Or make the academy longer is a feasible idea too.

I really don’t know how to fix the toxic cultures prevalent in departments. I do think a generational shift needs to happen. There’s still a lot of “old school” police officers who came on the job in the 80s and 90s before cellphone videos and social media. You can imagine how the culture was back then. Until these guys are gone from the ranks maybe then it will get better?
Click to expand...
First part in bold is part of my point... there should be a set universal standard, as without one, Billy Bob who got rejected by the State and by the County can apply to the local town police and probably get in, meaning the people doing the local policing aren't that good.

Second part in bold is exactly what others, including myself, have already suggested, which you previously said was not feasible.
 
Leroy The Red said:
More than half of my team I work with are university graduates, a number of whom studied criminology. I myself am a University graduate.
Below is a PC who I work with in the Met Police.



He’s an Oxford graduate and speaks Arabic. There was a significant influx of graduate officers in this new generation of Police. As you know there was a recession a number of years ago which left a lot of people in the 25-35 age group with degrees but no job opportunities, a lot of them decided to take up policing due to the steady nature of the job and the fact you can progress and go into a variety of different fields. (Newsflash policing isn’t just patrol officers in uniform, it’s much much bigger)

But please feel free to continue to make sweeping generalisations in a condescending arseholeish manner because obviously you’ve spoken to and interacted with the majority of police officers in the U.K. and so are able to conclude that most of them lack intelligence.
Click to expand...

Thanks for this, care to shed some light on why with such an influx of intelligence the force is still rife with racism? You know cause, being black will still disproportionately see people stopped & searched. . . & so on.

Sorry but I find a policeperson calling someone ‘arseholeish’ for making ‘sweeping generalisations’ laughable.

[& no I’ve not interacted with the majority of the force. Nor do I need to.]
 
AFC NimbleThumb said:
Thanks for this, care to shed some light on why with such an influx of intelligence the force is still rife with racism? You know cause, being black will still disproportionately see people stopped & searched. . . & so on.

Sorry but I find a policeperson calling someone ‘arseholeish’ for making ‘sweeping generalisations’ laughable.

[& no I’ve not interacted with the majority of the force. Nor do I need to.]
Click to expand...
Do you need to make a "Bobbies in Britain doing a bad job, again" thread?
 
Carolina Red said:
First part in bold is part of my point... there should be a set universal standard, as without one, Billy Bob who got rejected by the State and by the County can apply to the local town police and probably get in, meaning the people doing the local policing aren't that good.

Second part in bold is exactly what others, including myself, have already suggested, which you previously said was not feasible.
Click to expand...
The bold part is not necessarily true, but I agree there should be a set universal standard.
And it wasn't the making academies longer that I said wasn't feasible. It was having a centralized police force and training in a 2-3 year university-style setting that I don't think is logistically possible. I'm guessing it would be like FBI x100000? How would that look like and work?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.