Nah, I’m not having that. There’s no way a 29 year old defensive midfielder is suddenly over the hill. Not when the majority of them barely show any decline until their mid thirties.
Cody Gakpo
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Jamie (@Vault Dweller) are here to talk about United's dreadful home defeat at the hands of Big Ange's Tottenham Hotspur. Should this have been the end of Ten Hag? How long does he actually have left? And does Nik finally want ETH out?!
Nah, I’m not having that. There’s no way a 29 year old defensive midfielder is suddenly over the hill. Not when the majority of them barely show any decline until their mid thirties.
What's his best position? Wide forward? 9 or 2nd striker?
He didn’t mug us off
There was a time where new signings under Klopp would be phenomenal right from the start, mane, salah vvd etc. It is very clear that effect is gone now. They went from nearly winning the quadruple last season to being absolutely shit!
And I haven't been saving the nickname, so all's well.
Their system asks for something completely different from their midfield. It needs to be high energy and work hard, closing opposition players down before they can look up and get passes away through their high line.
They don’t do it fast enough anymore. It’s definitely not a narrative, it’s pretty clear in the numbers and the type of chances they are conceding.
Plenty of time for him to improve but so far his performances have confirmed what some of us said when we were linked to him: that he's a budget version of Rashy. He has a good shot on him, okay technical ability and can cut in from the left but I don't think he has the athleticism to be truly effective in the PL. He's the exact opposite of Darwin Nunez.
He's not a striker and he's making all the idiots who were desperate for him to be our centre forward signing look totally clueless.
Havent seen any of his games so far for Liverpool, but if I take the word here that he's been awful - I backed him before he was bought and I still expect he'll be a good player in the premier league even if its not instantly.
Jordan Henderson's weird running style finally catches up with him!
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Gakpo has a record of underperformance in European matches. Basically, whenever PSV went against stronger opponents, his strengths that excelled in the Eredivisie suddenly became non-existent.
It is far too early to judge him while he is trying to adapt to the Premier League (similar to Antony) but I don't think he is at the desired level expected in the EPL at a club like Liverpool
Half the people who wanted him thought he was a forward because they watched the WC and never seen him play for PSV
From when we first became interested to today, I still haven't seen anything from this lad that makes me convinced he's worth the money Liverpool spent on him or that he improves anything. He's a bench warmer for their second string.
TBH, 40m only gets Gakpo type players these days. The exciting ones seem to go for twice that.
Its correct though. They have an ageing squad full stop really. To suggest Henderson is in his prime is fanciful to say the least, to compare Liverpools midfield to Casemiro, Kroos and Modric is outrageous!
Allison 30
VVD 31
Matip 31
Milner 37
Thiago 31
Henderson 32
Salah 30
Firminho 31
Fabinho 29 (30 this year)
Now it doesn’t matter as much when there’s a few sprinkled out, infact every team needs some experience, but here you’re looking at the bulk of the squads better players.
The club very much need to nail their next few windows (unless you rate Keita, Ox etc) otherwise it’s going to get messy for them. Thiago is the only one I see having the skill set to play on a while but he’s also the most injury prone.
Spending 100m on Nunez was stupid within their budget and they’d have been better served looking to address the midfield and getting a cheaper forward.
As someone else said, he'll score a 30 yard goal a bit like elliot did last night and then the media will say he's the signing of the season.
He'll then get a tap in or easy header in the next game and he'll be b'allon dor favourite, only to then go 6 without scoring and lose his place when Jota or Diaz return.
Seen this so many times over the years.
He'll then get a tap in or easy header in the next game and he'll be b'allon dor favourite, only to then go 6 without scoring and lose his place when Jota or Diaz return.
Seen this so many times over the years.
Diaz was only bought last season and he hit the ground running and Konate will be good for them....don't know what he was doing with donkey boy though.
Such a strange player. He’s 6’3 but he plays out wide and his best trait is his crossing. I still see him levelling out somewhere in a level between Memphis and Bergwijn
Don't know why this tickled me
Surely 99.9% of humans are a year older this year? We're on the 18th of January !You're right though, I'm surprised Liverpool have declined so much already as the players aren't that old, but they do need to start a major rebuild and I don't think they've been proactive enough in that. They had a great team but got complacent and didn't look to keep pushing on. When you're at the top, you need to keep things fresh and still try to improve. Even if it's just to keep the changing room dynamic fresh.
Yep. I was wondering if all other players had their bdays in JanuaryDon't know why this tickled me
You're right though, I'm surprised Liverpool have declined so much already as the players aren't that old, but they do need to start a major rebuild and I don't think they've been proactive enough in that. They had a great team but got complacent and didn't look to keep pushing on. When you're at the top, you need to keep things fresh and still try to improve. Even if it's just to keep the changing room dynamic fresh.
Don't know why this tickled me
You're right though, I'm surprised Liverpool have declined so much already as the players aren't that old, but they do need to start a major rebuild and I don't think they've been proactive enough in that. They had a great team but got complacent and didn't look to keep pushing on. When you're at the top, you need to keep things fresh and still try to improve. Even if it's just to keep the changing room dynamic fresh.
Ha ha fair point!
Tbh I don’t think they ever really replaced Wijnaldum. I think they very much underrated what both he, and Mane, brought to the Klopp style.
Signings like Keita have been huge disappointments and for big money. They got a good deal on Thiago but also must have know his age and injury record was going to require careful management and as such it would be near impossible to structure a team specifically around him and his skill set.
Honestly think they should have picked up Eriksen for free.
I’m talking specifically about central midfield. Where they are nowhere near as geriatric as you’d think from all the moaning about them desperately needing investment in that area. I don’t know what’s going wrong but age is a poor excuse.
I don't think Eriksen suits Klopps fast paced, high intensity game tbh.
I'm surprised they haven't / weren't in for players like Bissouma though. Could have picked him up for a very reasonable price from Brighton and he'd suit them well. Thiago is obviously a good player, but I don't think he really suits them either. Also think signing Gakpo was a bit weird when he's a winger. They have tonnes of wingers that can "Do a job" as a striker.
About time they made some dodgy signings though, their recruitment has been far too good the last few years.
I was talking more of having an option with Thiago (Eriksen). They’ve lacked the ability to recycle the ball in the midfield and a creative spark. Eriksen would have given them so much more than the signing of Arthur instance.
Wasn't Matic washed out at 27/28 or was he older when he couldn't play successive matches or move around the pitch?
It does vary on the player and I do tend to agree with @Pogue Mahone in that the Caf can be obsessed with the 30 mark.
You're looking at age as a number as if it means anything. Look at their performances instead.
Can you explain why their pressing has fallen off a cliff, why their midfield has huge gaps? individually they aren't 'finished' but they're struggling to press with intensity like they used to.
Maybe Klopps magic inhaler has finally ran out, who knows.
You only have to look at the stats in each game, they've gone from barely having their goal touched to going 1-0 down in most matches.
I'm not jus saying this because he went to Liverpool but was genuinely never excited about us buying this guy.
He looked decent at the World Cup but not someone who would light up the Prem every week.
I guess you get what you pay for though. £40m, he'll have a few great games and will be a good squad player.
He looked decent at the World Cup but not someone who would light up the Prem every week.
I guess you get what you pay for though. £40m, he'll have a few great games and will be a good squad player.
Just wait for him to score a couple of goals - probably from the left. All of them will be piping up again, it doesn't need to make sense for some to have a good whinge.
Christ, I forgot about the Arthur signing.
Gakpo looks like Matip playing out on the left wing. Uncoordinated and gangly.
They don't really play with the intensity they did in Klopp's first couple of seasons. It's like a cliche that's stuck with them.
Agreed they’re all at good ages for a centre mid and the too old narrative doesn’t quite fit. It’s obvious they’re not running anywhere near as much as they did in the past though, so it feels like a natural interpretation. Maybe it’s age + injuries? Henderson, Keira and Thiago have all had consistent or chronic injury problems over a significant period, which were surely exacerbated under Klopp’s style. I’m not sure that applies to Fabinho, but he started picking up some muscle injuries in the last year.
Bissouma is a big flop himself.
Very strange. To be honest United (rightly) get stick here but some of the short term signings Liverpool have made are far worse than Ighalo.
Caulker
Pearson
Kabak
Arthur
There could be others
Yeah, that’s possible. It’s certainly as good a theory as any! I also wonder if Thiago is part of the problem, even though he puts in eye catching performances, maybe he’s not as disciplined as he should be. It’s not as though their problems suddenly started this season. And last year the geriatric excuse made even less sense.
Yeah I’d guess it’s mental burnout as much as anything, and just a general squad malaise. If you’re playing behind Mane running around like a maniac I’m sure you can’t help feeling energised. Thiago was definitely always going to shift that dynamic too. I thought it implied they were trying to change the style of their midfield because obviously Thiago can’t replicate Wijnaldum’s workhorse role, but it seems a bit like they got stuck halfway between the old style and the new one.
Fabinho’s the really baffling one for me. He’s a defensive midfielder so he’s disciplined by default. He was never really one of the crazy pressers, he just covered a lot of ground diligently, used the ball intelligently, and generally looked like the best midfielder in the league at times. For the last year or so he’s looked like a pub player quite often. Just seems like he couldn’t be arsed any more. Which makes it even better that Casemiro’s just strolled in and showed what to expect of a centre mid around their 30s!
Liverpool can’t press because their striker barely touches the ball and fails to hold it up if he does. The ball keeps coming back quicker and quicker through the middle and they haven’t a chance to organise.
You simply can’t press if Salah is taking shots from stupid angles because he’s pushed so wide and giving the ball away coupled with their number 9s actions mentioned above.
You simply can’t press if Salah is taking shots from stupid angles because he’s pushed so wide and giving the ball away coupled with their number 9s actions mentioned above.
After a very serious knee injury. His decline wasn’t due to age.