Yeah partial investment doesn’t really benefit the Glazers in any realistic way.
I think the only danger to the club not being sold is they overplay their hand and drive away the bidders they do have.
Club Sale | It’s done!
- Thread starter JB08
- Start date
- Status
Yeah partial investment doesn’t really benefit the Glazers in any realistic way.
I think the only danger to the club not being sold is they overplay their hand and drive away the bidders they do have.
Agreed. And they would annoy one of the few buyers.
Also, with new regulations coming in, it'll potentially be harder for people from ME to come in and purchase the club.
Time will tell. But to call it nonsense is short-sighted. There have been many reports that Avram is one of the siblings who doesn't want to sell and if there is a viable path to maintaining ownership it is quite possible he will take it.
Just my thoughts on the process:
1. What is happening right -- the reports about how the Glazers are reconsidering selling etc -- does in no way deviate from what could have been expected in a process like this. Negotiations is all about leverage. Nothing helps a negotiation like a bidding war. But if you cannot get that -- the only other leverage you can obtain is through creating a deal/no deal situation. Time is another factor, if you want it done today, up your bid. Otherwise, the seller can just keep fishing for a better bid for 6 months or whatever
2. The Glazers -- and probably especially Joel and Avram -- cannot be trusted to do the logical thing. Just by looking at how the club has been run, it is very obvious that they are in over their head and that they do not realize it. I think that everything -- points towards a sale of the club taking place. I think it will be closed during Q1 2023. Why? It is as simple as that it is very obvious that the Glazers would be taking a very big financial risk, for a limited upside. The Glazers are not rich at all. They cannot finance the club. Sure, they can increase the Club's value by building a new stadium and ride ETHs magic and improve the club's reputation -- but what is the result? They could -- possibly -- get 10bn in 6 years instead of 5bn today? If that -- best case scenario -- occurs, the Glazers profit would of course not be 5bn. They need someone external to come in and finance the new arena etc etc etc. At most, the Glazers' share of the increase in value from 5 to 10bn, is 3bn. That is just 7.5% return per year, over 6 years, in what is a "best case scenario".
If you have resources, you can save the club if things go wrong during this period. But they have no such resources. They could just as well take in investors of 2bn, and end up getting 6.5bn in 3 years. Then they will have pissed away 500m. It cannot be worth it.
1. What is happening right -- the reports about how the Glazers are reconsidering selling etc -- does in no way deviate from what could have been expected in a process like this. Negotiations is all about leverage. Nothing helps a negotiation like a bidding war. But if you cannot get that -- the only other leverage you can obtain is through creating a deal/no deal situation. Time is another factor, if you want it done today, up your bid. Otherwise, the seller can just keep fishing for a better bid for 6 months or whatever
2. The Glazers -- and probably especially Joel and Avram -- cannot be trusted to do the logical thing. Just by looking at how the club has been run, it is very obvious that they are in over their head and that they do not realize it. I think that everything -- points towards a sale of the club taking place. I think it will be closed during Q1 2023. Why? It is as simple as that it is very obvious that the Glazers would be taking a very big financial risk, for a limited upside. The Glazers are not rich at all. They cannot finance the club. Sure, they can increase the Club's value by building a new stadium and ride ETHs magic and improve the club's reputation -- but what is the result? They could -- possibly -- get 10bn in 6 years instead of 5bn today? If that -- best case scenario -- occurs, the Glazers profit would of course not be 5bn. They need someone external to come in and finance the new arena etc etc etc. At most, the Glazers' share of the increase in value from 5 to 10bn, is 3bn. That is just 7.5% return per year, over 6 years, in what is a "best case scenario".
If you have resources, you can save the club if things go wrong during this period. But they have no such resources. They could just as well take in investors of 2bn, and end up getting 6.5bn in 3 years. Then they will have pissed away 500m. It cannot be worth it.
I will listen to the podcast later today. Twitter quotes, to be fair, can be misleading given their brevity. That said, I believe there is a non-negligible chance that the Glazers will maintain ownership for now, and that tweet doesn't do anything to allay those concerns.
It is nonsense. It was very obvious what he meant.
The other three Glazers probably just want to cash out. The biggest danger for me is that Joel and Avram crash the deal. Not sure what hapens if the other three sell and they don't. Maybe their shares turn into non voting shares if they sell outside the family. Don't under-estimate how horrible intra-family money rows can be. They could just be holding the deal to ransom for a bigger cut.
Definitely from any rational perspective they will sell, there is just that slight chance they act irrationally and want the price they were probably expecting if the ESL had gone through.
All the talk is of what Joel and Avram want but it’s in theory a collective decision and most likely outcome is common sense will prevail. If the Qatari’s go elsewhere it could be very tough to find someone to much their current offer let alone better it in a year or two.
Last edited:
Could see them stretching this out to the end of the season to see if we win anymore trophies which drives the price up.
Good summary but I think we are overlooking the fact Qatari walk away due to Glazers "Negotiation tactics" and invest in another club which they are clearly ok with risking..
I've been beating this drum for weeks and nobody has an answer for it.
United need investment to retain it's huge current value, we've reached the end of the road where they can just burn through United's money. So they either sell and make close to $1bn each on a club they didn't spend cent on to buy. Or they'll have to inject enough into the club to keep it competitive with the oil clubs on and off the pitch, in which case they're losing money now and have no guarantee they'll get an offer in the region Qatar are offering now (and Qatar will move on if Glazers don't sell now)
Minority is simply a non-starter and I don't know why smart journalists run with it and don't think about it logically.
They want 6/7 billions? That seems crazy greedy considering suitors will take on the debt and have to foot for a new stadium as well
The Glazers aren't going to dilute their holdings and put the money into the club. That would be a huge change from how they have have always operated and no minority investor is going to put in billions and watch the leeches siphon them away and then leave the club without fresh cash.
And also no sane investor is going to buy out Darcie Glazer and Co then watch their shares turn into useless Class A shares. Debt to buy out the other siblings will cripple the club as a going concern and only result in a massive loss of value as we lose our competitiveness and eventually relevance with regard to big sponsors - we have had 3 successful (top 4 finishes) out of the last 5 but we are taking ages to replace Teamviewer, for example. Imagine the sponsorship carnage when the Glazers announce they are staying, fans revolt and the team eventually goes on a lean run for a decade.
If they have secured debt or equity investment for the stadium and training ground and an investor that doesn't demand a considerable say then fair play. But in this climate, I dont see how anyone can entrust over a billion to them unless its crippling debt that will see them lose it all for a song a few years down the line especially if this Ten Hag cycle turns into a continuation of our on 'boom and bust' cycle.
They also wouldn't need the Raine Group to tie themselves to a vulture like Elliot, I am not sure they have seen anything thatthey haven't seen and rejected over the past 18 months of searching for an investor.
Maybe its all wishful thinking but I don't currently see a situation in which they get funds and stay in control.
Are people seriously worried that 50% of the Glazers that "apparently" really want to stay showed up at a cup final?
If they had all showed up it may have meant something.
If they had all showed up it may have meant something.
Are people seriously worried that 50% of the Glazers that "apparently" really want to stay showed up at a cup final?
If they had all showed up it may have meant something.
4 out of the 6 apparently want to sell. So already Avram and Joel are outvoted.
Last edited:
The 50% that did turn up might have had their enthusiasm reinvigorated, perhaps they've also been watching Welcome to Wrexham. This new found enthusiasm may encourage them to want to stick around and seek investment rather than selling outright.Are people seriously worried that 50% of the Glazers that "apparently" really want to stay showed up at a cup final?
If they had all showed up it may have meant something.
And what about the other 5 that couldn't be arsed?
This has been my take on it all along, If they want 6 billion that would mean they need 4 billion to buy out the rest of the family. They are just attempting to get the highest possible amount of money.
That should settle down the doomsday crowd/pessimists for a few days
Wears a United shirt for five a side
I heard that Ratcliffe wears a half blue, half red shirt.
They're getting it all for free on here, twitter and reddit.
He should have bought some touted tickets and sat in the United end with 20 mates and a Glazers Out banner made from green and spun gold. STATEMENT.
Just plain greedy owners!
Agree it was a good summary, and walking away is my main worry now, that when the Qataris say, as they will, 'this is our final offer' the Glazers will be too stupid/greedy to know they mean it, and the Qataris then buy someone else. We're going to struggle to compete with well-funded clubs as it is, another would seriously limit our chances of winning the league for the foreseeable future.
I like the theory that they could use investment to buy out their siblings and invest in the stadium and the training ground. Would love to know how that would work as it sounds like complete and utter nonsense.
That should settle down the doomsday crowd/pessimists for a few days
I struggle to understand the though process of this crowd. HAHA
Forgot about the ownership shite for 48 hours there.
Man is hardcore. But by that metric I’m a huge fan of the Colombian National team circa 2016
Code for you’re buying the Colombian National team in a consortium with @bazalini ?
Valderrama Vibes
I find it illogical that the Glazers stay any longer. They are 6 siblings who owns 11.5% each of the club sharing the dividends with each other and with the other shareholders. Financially, owning the club is not that lucrative with the idea it is very difficult to take out dividends. They were afraid to take dividends this year and it will continue to be even more difficult in the coming years with how the club is in difficulties financially. The only thing that makes sense for them is to sell. Unless they are in it for other reason than money, like prestige and status of owning Manchester United.
Last edited:
Yeah, 100%, and normally in business, you get to a certain level by being “rational”. By playing a game. Sure they can be bold/crazy or whatever — but they draw up a game plan and follow it.
The Glazers are not rational. We can just look at how they have run the club. It is not rational. It’s incompetent and irrational. I don’t think they take advice.
This has always been the X factor in the sale. All of a sudden everyone are telling Avram to sell, the advisors, his siblings, the fans — and he goes ‘nah, I think not’.
With that said, I think it’s very likely that the sale will go down.
The press are just having a laugh and milking every angle.
Why would it be going to round 2 if they decided they want to stay?
It reminds me of a transfer Saga, only x100
Why would it be going to round 2 if they decided they want to stay?
It reminds me of a transfer Saga, only x100
I’m not even following it too closely anymore. I have a look now and then. What will happen will happen..
Fairly easy when nothing is happening or going to happen soon though
Once there’s some news it’ll blow up again
- Status