We need him to say he will clear the debt, that any loans will not be attached to the club, that he will build a new stadium and improve training facilities and facilities for United's other teams, not just he will clear the debt and might do the rest, because he there is always the chance he won't.
Club Sale | It’s done!
- Thread starter JB08
- Start date
- Status
We don’t want anything like Clearlake, Ratcliffe can’t even run Nice, he shouldn’t be anywhere near Manchester fecking United. And no thanks to the yanks either, they’re all in it for profit only.
Afaik INEOS simply dont have the liquidity to purchase United at the c. £5b without either borrowing or selling shares or assets elsewhere to fund. The tweet above noted that SJR is approaching Sachs etc seeking the financial backing.... I'm drawing my conclusion from that, others may/will view it differently. I'm no expert btw
If Jim is having to borrow money for the takeover, that's a bit worrying tbh.
A slightly richer Glazer, or 'dirty' oil money? I guess that's our options.
A slightly richer Glazer, or 'dirty' oil money? I guess that's our options.
I'm not looking at it from Ineos's point of view, I'm looking at it from United's. Ineos would want more money out of us to cover it.
Yes @TheReligion that is my assumption, Ineos are a money-making private-equity organisation. There is no chance that Ratcliffe will persuade his fellow owners to give a load of money to pay off United's debt for nothing. They will want a return, paid for by us.
Ratcliffe is just a non starter.
I don’t like Ratcliffe and the more I hear about that particular version of a takeover, the less I’m reassured by it.
Ratcliffe's plan to clear the debt is just to refinance it with more debt 
I'd find it a bit rich if people are ok with Goldman Sachs getting involved but are anti Qatar.
I'd find it a bit rich if people are ok with Goldman Sachs getting involved but are anti Qatar.
What’s up with some Bayern fans lecturing us? Did they care when one of the greatest clubs in the world with one of the biggest revenues in the world was saddled with millions of debt and after almost 2 decades of horrendous ownership you can think of possibly is rendered almost bankrupt?
These are the only owners in the football world who take money as dividends out of the club. They have left our stadium to rot and due to their pure greed and mismanagement we now have no money left in the bank and still have millions of debt to pay. Did they have any sympathy for us at any point and did they show any solidarity? We were the only ones who suffered and suffered and went from being a top club in Europe to a laughing stock due to the incompetence of these owners. What did we get from rival fans? Banter and laugh and ridicule.
Just a mere increase in their ticket prices and I remember those Bayern fans walking out of the stadium in protest against Arsenal. That’s how spoiled you are and that’s how much disconnected you are to our plight.
Lastly, we don’t want any Arab owners to pump their billions to make us relevant again. We just want to be spend the money we earn and be self sufficient again. Do I ideally want any Arab owners? No, not at all. I just want our owners not to be leeches and bleed us to death.
These are the only owners in the football world who take money as dividends out of the club. They have left our stadium to rot and due to their pure greed and mismanagement we now have no money left in the bank and still have millions of debt to pay. Did they have any sympathy for us at any point and did they show any solidarity? We were the only ones who suffered and suffered and went from being a top club in Europe to a laughing stock due to the incompetence of these owners. What did we get from rival fans? Banter and laugh and ridicule.
Just a mere increase in their ticket prices and I remember those Bayern fans walking out of the stadium in protest against Arsenal. That’s how spoiled you are and that’s how much disconnected you are to our plight.
Lastly, we don’t want any Arab owners to pump their billions to make us relevant again. We just want to be spend the money we earn and be self sufficient again. Do I ideally want any Arab owners? No, not at all. I just want our owners not to be leeches and bleed us to death.
If you think that about INEOS, then you should think that about QIA or literally anyone else. No matter who buys us I’d doubt the debt is just paid off straight in full. It would be shifted around.
Thinking there’s a magic money tree out there that will buy the club without wanting to make money off it is delusional. Every prospective owner wants to make money off the club.
It's posts like these that reveal people are either clueless or deluded...
He would expect us to pay off the debt from our books, so basically we'll effectively have what we have now.
This is similar to Boehly who's financing his current splurge with debt secured on his assets or his consortium's assets.
Ratcliffe won't do a Roman and just write off the debt, he'd expect we pay for it and then to get dividends or significant asset appreciation.
"Deliberations are ongoing but there is no certainty Jim will bid"
Of course he will bid, he will submit a bid by fax, 10 minutes after the sale to Qatar is final. The bid will be in Doge coin and funding for the redevelopment of the ground will be raised through a series of exclusive NFT releases. This bid will be announced in front of the maximum number of journalists possible.
Of course he will bid, he will submit a bid by fax, 10 minutes after the sale to Qatar is final. The bid will be in Doge coin and funding for the redevelopment of the ground will be raised through a series of exclusive NFT releases. This bid will be announced in front of the maximum number of journalists possible.
Exactly what we need to hear
Nope. City's don't. Newcastle's don't. Chelsea's didn't when Abramovich was there. I can't believe you don't actually know this.
yes they do. Increasing the value of those clubs make the owners money. You don’t really think these investment firm invest in companies for shits and giggles right?Yeah it really is
Also did I imagine it or Abu Dhabi coincidentally got access to real estate around Manchester?
You are clueless.
You must have imagined it
Ratcliffe is a Brexiteer so that automatically must call his judgement into question.
And I'm not being facetious with that statement, I genuinely mean it. Brexit has been the UK's biggest foreign policy blunder since Suez, and the vast majority of experts advised against it at the time.
Such a poor judgement from Ratcliffe.
And I'm not being facetious with that statement, I genuinely mean it. Brexit has been the UK's biggest foreign policy blunder since Suez, and the vast majority of experts advised against it at the time.
Such a poor judgement from Ratcliffe.
This sounds good, but in reality, there is little difference. Clearly, in order to finance the debt, Ineos/Ratcliffe will need to get cash from somewhere - in other words, higher dividends going forward.
Over the past few years, Man Utd has paid about 20 million pounds a year in interest and another 20 million in dividends. To finance debt of about 1.5 billion at around 8% (interest rates are currently high) would require 120 million annually.
Perhaps Ineos will say that they will not take dividends and instead get "free" sponsorship opportunities- but that would just mean replacing interest expense with lower revenues from other sponsors. I dont see how to square the circle.
Ooh do explain, please.
To then bugger off out of the country to Monaco just added unsult to injury.
If anyone actually believes Ineos will be paying that with their own money and not without Manchester United money then they are naive. It's rearranging chairs on the Titanic.
At the end of the day no contest, lack of investment in the club (off the field in particular) was criminal by the Glazers. The issues would remain from a financed bid.
That would absolutely not be brilliant. Who do you suppose INEOS will look to to service the debt? Themselves? Yeah, no. It will be serviced by the club. Again. And that's before INEOS start taking their dividends. The only difference will be if INEOS decide to sell the club down the line and they will have to deal with the debt themselves and not be able to shift it on the buyer.
This absolutely reeks of Glazer antics. Keep this guy as far away from the club as possible.
Naive perspective.. some people got very rich off of Brexit. He knew what he was doing.
Clever move, inside knowledge. Maybe he will hire Woodward?!
You are just making stuff up at this point.
We're going to have constant nuggets like this fed to us for the next week or so aren't we?
Sounds good to me! Puts to rest the claims that Sir Jim cannot afford the club too.
That's not what's mentioned though? Debt won't be on the club is what tweet says. If it's on INEOs, there is no way club is responsible for clearing it off and it won't come on clubs account. Dividends ? Absolutely. There is no owner who won't take it unless you are state backed.
It was a great judgement if your goal is less environmental and finance regulations while also having better lobbying chance when you have to only deal with one government when it comes to manipulating policies. It was an excellent judgement for him and many of the other industrials and hedge fund owners.
Isn’t that just hiding the debt on their side?
What difference does it make when it has to be repaid?
Fair enough. They key is where does the refinanced debt go. I'd expect any new owners to assume the debt responsibility themselves, thereby clearing it from the club. This leaves United (a business with annual revenues of c.€750m) completely debt free), while Ineos (a business with annual revenues of c.€20 billion) deal with the repayments themselves. A debt free United can compete with any club in the market.
Liverpool don’t pay dividends to FSG. It just depends on the owner.
I mean it’s much better for the debt against United to be removed.
I’m sure no one can say it isn’t?
I highly doubt a takeover will be allowed using bad debt, nor will dividends be taken. The fan base, media and premier league are much more aware and guarding of that nowadays.
It won’t be allowed and there would be riots.
We don’t know enough about what potential bids/takeovers propose yet.
It won’t be allowed and there would be riots.
We don’t know enough about what potential bids/takeovers propose yet.
- Status