Club Sale | It’s done!

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The issue with this kind of binary, dogmatic stance is that no Utd fan ‘hopes to become a sportswashing club’, and you know that.

Some don’t care, outright, about any human rights issues one way or the other.

But many of the fans who will support the bid by a Qatari man (until it’s proven it’s a state bid, we shouldn’t talk of it as such) will disagree strongly with some of the Qatar regime’s stances on things like the treatment of gay people and human rights, and I would hope that those people CONTINUE to oppose those issues if Jassim is successful in his takeover of Utd.

I started supporting Utd during Ron Atkinson’s last season, and I’ve found myself in recent years unable to wish success on the Glazers, not because of America, but because I think they are greedy, repulsive INDIVIDUALS who hurt Utd and are bad for Utd.

If Jassim takes over, I hope very much that Utd makes clear our stance as a club is not that of the Qatar regime regarding gay issues (via continued vocal support for LBGT issues), but I will not judge Jassim for anything other than what HE SHOWS for Utd.

I always hope that issues like this get light shone upon them and dialogue - if Jassim came in and banned rainbow flags from OT, I’d want him out, immediately.

That’s what infuriated me about the WC - it was the censorship, the authoritarianism which I think is lowly.

And I hated how it turned into a West vs ME thing rather than a proper conversation.

I think Utd being owned by Jassim would provoke more discourse than any other ME / Western franchise crossover and I’d welcome that.

I disagree strongly with certain things about the Qatari regime, but I would never let that stop me dating a women from Qatar, or to listening to a musician from Qatar, or appreciating a piece of art made by a Qatari artist.

I used to have a really binary take on this but when Newcastle got bought by Saudi I thought and read a lot more on it and I essentially hold the view that anything that provokes thought and discourse is good - if that conversation gets censored I lost respect immediately, but I personally think Jassim should be given a chance as an owner and not dismissed from the start.

I would hope that his takeover sees Utd fans come together again. We should celebrate the removal of the Glazers.

If it happens - the Glazers removal - I will cry, I know I will. Be that a full purchase by Ratcliffe or Jassim or anyone.

The day they are properly gone Utd fans the globe over should celebrate - and whoever removes them should at least be given a chance.
Great post you hit the nail on the head. I respect anyone else’s opinion and understand why they might object but for a large number of fans football is our escape and we want to compete. The glazers have represented failure as city and liverpool have lorded it over Utd for far too long. It’s time to get on a level playing field and that means Qatar in my opinion just for the fact they want a full takeover and glazers gone. Also they have laid out plans while Jim has been pretty cagey.
 
I might log in just to remind you what United have truly become, the way I do with my city supporting colleagues.

The rest of their lives is pretending black is white, left is right, up is down and all so their favourite football team can win a trophy or two. Some freely admit it's tainted. Deep down, they know. The majority live in the aforementioned universe, though and by God it's sad to witness.

That will be your lot soon enough, whenever the autocratic regime of qatar add United to their portfolio, with your consent.

A sad little world


It's what sportswashing for political entities winds up doing.



How sportswashing work



Brilliant post. Keep it up mate.
 
Oh don't worry. I will do.

Some things are more important than football. It's why last Saturday hurt so much.

Coupled with a certain someone potentially playing for us again, I'll be finished with the club.

The last game where I'll potentially have any emotional investment will be a cup final defeat against the divs. Depressing

Sorry about that mate. I feel very similar and it’s a massive shame.
 
I will when people get off their bs high horse and accept that shit they are whining about for Qatar is what their countries were built on.
There are two side to this and the people who just take a side and stick to it are not particularly helpful. I am against the Qatari bid and the potential of us becoming a super powered sportswashing project, but I'm also not naieve and am aware of the fact that the UK has blood on its hands historically.

You don't even need to go far back to see some of the atrocities committed by a British leader, yet Churchill is actually held up as a hero by many. That still doesn't mean we have to give oppressive regimes a free pass today.

The damage has already been done by the likes of the Chelsea, City and Newcastle takeovers anyway I guess. We face the choice now of becoming another sportswashing vehicle to stay competitive or likely fading and becoming irrelevant on the world stage. Neither one is particularly attractive, but we can at least see which one has slightly more moral integrity. Some people genuinely don't care and will just root for their favourite 'brand' regardless. I'm sure some fans would be fine with a joint Putin and Trump takeover bid as long as it meant we could sign Mbappe and win something bigger and shinier than the League Cup.
 


Complete crap, can the media decide which angle they are going for. We have been fed for years the glazers are just money grabbers. Now we are to believe they are sceptical of the source of the money as if they care.

So many stories being printed with a clear angle on the outcome they would prefer.
 
He’s*

He’s sporting director at Nice & it’s gone god awful judging by league standings…..

Thank you for correcting me :)

I have read a great deal about a method to improve people and he is known to be exceptionally good at this method. I have also read specifically about him and how he wants a process to be. For my own part, I can say that he impresses me greatly.

In my opinion, I think it will be a bit easy to take Nice to judge whether he does a good job or not. We are all aware that not absolutely all projects are always 100% perfect. It is not possible to achieve.

I think Brailsford will fit in very well with Erik ten Hag. I base this on the fact that both are engrossed in details. Improve the little things to get better habits and improvement over time.
 
Complete crap, can the media decide which angle they are going for. We have been fed for years the glazers are just money grabbers. Now we are to believe they are sceptical of the source of the money as if they care.

So many stories being printed with a clear angle on the outcome they would prefer.
Surely they can be skeptical about WHERE this money is coming from? I.e: how long it’s going to take for them to get their money if it’s from a source they don’t believe
 
Surely they can be skeptical about WHERE this money is coming from? I.e: how long it’s going to take for them to get their money if it’s from a source they don’t believe
If they’d have accepted a bid 3 months ago it would probably be sorted by now
 
Thank you for correcting me :)

I have read a great deal about a method to improve people and he is known to be exceptionally good at this method. I have also read specifically about him and how he wants a process to be. For my own part, I can say that he impresses me greatly.

In my opinion, I think it will be a bit easy to take Nice to judge whether he does a good job or not. We are all aware that not absolutely all projects are always 100% perfect. It is not possible to achieve.

I think Brailsford will fit in very well with Erik ten Hag. I base this on the fact that both are engrossed in details. Improve the little things to get better habits and improvement over time.

Doping?
 
Surely they can be skeptical about WHERE this money is coming from? I.e: how long it’s going to take for them to get their money if it’s from a source they don’t believe

Sceptical the premier league released a statement saying that Saudi Arabia kingdom is not involved with the newcastle takeover.

It would be the least of the glazers worries. Let’s not pretend the premier league have any moral standing.
 
There will be no announcement about the sale over the weekend.

Go out and do something less boring instead.

What we need is an announcement the same hour if city win the Chamions League. Would be immense and put their efforts in the shade however unlikely it seems.
 
The Glazers.

The problem for the Glazers is that, whereas previously they were taking dividends and undertaking the odd share sale, moving forward there is not much room for manoeuvre.

If they reduce their ownership, selling shares, by even a few percent then they no longer enjoy majority ownership (2/3 of the shares).

Accordingly they don't have many options if they still want to live off United.

We know that, last year, they looked at bringing in equity partners but the terms were not attractive.

However they did see the Chelsea stampede and probably realised that it may be a good time to cash out for an obscene value.

Unfortunately within a few months the whole financial scene has changed and when they mooted the sale there were very few interested parties, and certainly no stampede. Liverpool, an equally attractive jewel in the football world crown, recognised this and decided to withdraw from their sale.

This left the Glazers with very few options and therefore they had to introduce their own
leverage to fire up the willing bidders.

Here, they introduced the narrative that A and J want to remain. The obvious reason for this is so that a bidder who wants full ownership realises that they have to pay over the odds to get rid of these 'club lovers'.

They also introduced an extremely opaque bidding process where nobody knows where they stand or at least nobody other than the Glazers.

However it seems clear that there is definitely a difference of opinion amongst the siblings.

If A and J hang around in the expectation of a greater reward then the other four, who are clearly not stupid, will not want to sell their shares for less knowing that A and J will receive more than a couple of years.

They also must realise that by getting a bidder to pay more in the future is, obviously, the same as them paying less now, so why are they receiving less now surely they would receive more now if the bidder wasn't being forced to pay an OTT sum in the future.

All the parties must know this and that may be one reason it's still being dragged out.

The Glazers have few options. If they keep the club, they may strike lucky with future TV revenue however that is no guarantee and the real money in a European Super League is no longer there. Dividends will be hard to take when the club is in a financial pickle. They have tapped out on share sales and risk losing their majority ownership if they sell too much (also doesn't Woodward own 1% of shares, class A or B?).

Conclusion, I'm guessing that they want a full sale but the leverage isn't quite working for them. The two bidders despite over paying realise that they are both equally close to the right deal the only question is whether one of the parties will either walk away or will simply just trump the other unless the Glazers actually decide.

The shares on the NYSE.

The shares on the exchange seem to be worthless. They only appear to have a speculative value.

If SJR wins then those shares will be sink, literally like parking your money where you receive negative interest. There can be no real movement in those shares for at least a decade. It begs the question as to why anyone would have purchased them. It seems that someone is going to be sued, some serious misrepresentation somewhere.

Great points made here.

Been trying to figure out who leaked the news yesterday about Nasser Al-Khelaifi meeting with the Glazers.

Glazers/Raine - I can't see the benefit of doing it. Maybe to say to the Qataris (who have come out to publicly to say they are frustrated) that they've tried to push negotiations? Ornstein/Stone articles go on to say that Qatar didn't up their bid post the meeting.

Qatar - Again I don't see the benefit of the news. Maybe part of their exit strategy to show that the sellers are just money hungry by going to an intemdiary to try an extract more money.

INEOS - To me it seems most likely the initial story was leaked by them. Exclusive came from Athletic/Ornstein who we know have links to INEOS. What benefit is it for INEOS to put this out there? To starting pushing the agenda that this is state linked and not a group of private investors. Ornstein's story states that Premier League clubs now want source of funds to be investigated. Does this imply a swing in favour of Qatar and INEOS are starting to get worried? It was interesting that the stories that came out later from James Ducker at the Telegraph contradicted certain points of the initial athletic reports, so you'd imagine that was Qatars rebuttal.
 
Great post you hit the nail on the head. I respect anyone else’s opinion and understand why they might object but for a large number of fans football is our escape and we want to compete. The glazers have represented failure as city and liverpool have lorded it over Utd for far too long. It’s time to get on a level playing field and that means Qatar in my opinion just for the fact they want a full takeover and glazers gone. Also they have laid out plans while Jim has been pretty cagey.

I think that's the point for a lot of fans. Politics and sport rarely mix and a lot of people watch football to get away from the day-to-day nonsense in life.
Too many fans on here try to take the moral high ground and start coming out with things like 'if you support Qatar then you support their regime..'.

No.

I support the Qatar bid because I think it will be the best for United. It doesn't automatically translate that I'm in favour of their human right views. They are two totally separate things and I have the ability to do that.

I've also learned in life that every single person on this planet is a hypocrite by default, regardless of their moral shouting, especially on here, so I completely ignore their BS.
The same people going on about Qataris human rights are the same people buying cheap tut from Amazon made in China. But they never see the connection, or they do but conveniently choose to ignore it.

Nobody lives in a perfect bubble. Even if you lived vegan, carbon, human rights free in a small white room with nothing purchased from kid abusing sweat shops, there would still be some fecker who would point out 'the rooms all white, there's nothing black in it, so you're racist..'

Feck off.

I support Qatar all the way and I don't give one flying feck who it offends and if that triggers anyone then I've only one thing to say.

Awww...diddums, get a life.
 
Ok, this place is genuinely fecking bonkers. Some of you lot aren't living in the real world.

It's just a theory but it's possible

Jim has been on record as having met the Glazers in the past and his comments obviously didnt go down well with many United fans

"I've met Joel and Avram and they are the nicest people, I have to say, they are proper gentlemen."
 
We should lock this thread over the weekend as nothing is going to happen due to stock exchange closure.

saves us having to troll through about 30 pages before Monday when nothing else will happen
 
I think that's the point for a lot of fans. Politics and sport rarely mix and a lot of people watch football to get away from the day-to-day nonsense in life.
Too many fans on here try to take the moral high ground and start coming out with things like 'if you support Qatar then you support their regime..'.

No.

I support the Qatar bid because I think it will be the best for United. It doesn't automatically translate that I'm in favour of their human right views. They are two totally separate things and I have the ability to do that.

I've also learned in life that every single person on this planet is a hypocrite by default, regardless of their moral shouting, especially on here, so I completely ignore their BS.
The same people going on about Qataris human rights are the same people buying cheap tut from Amazon made in China. But they never see the connection, or they do but conveniently choose to ignore it.

Nobody lives in a perfect bubble. Even if you lived vegan, carbon, human rights free in a small white room with nothing purchased from kid abusing sweat shops, there would still be some fecker who would point out 'the rooms all white, there's nothing black in it, so you're racist..'

Feck off.

I support Qatar all the way and I don't give one flying feck who it offends and if that triggers anyone then I've only one thing to say.

Awww...diddums, get a life.

Yeah, who gives a feck about meaningless shit like human righta when you could have Mbappe and Greenwood ripping up the league at the Qatar Airways Arena. feck off back to Twitter.
 
I think that's the point for a lot of fans. Politics and sport rarely mix and a lot of people watch football to get away from the day-to-day nonsense in life.
Too many fans on here try to take the moral high ground and start coming out with things like 'if you support Qatar then you support their regime..'.

No.

I support the Qatar bid because I think it will be the best for United. It doesn't automatically translate that I'm in favour of their human right views. They are two totally separate things and I have the ability to do that.

I've also learned in life that every single person on this planet is a hypocrite by default, regardless of their moral shouting, especially on here, so I completely ignore their BS.
The same people going on about Qataris human rights are the same people buying cheap tut from Amazon made in China. But they never see the connection, or they do but conveniently choose to ignore it.

Nobody lives in a perfect bubble. Even if you lived vegan, carbon, human rights free in a small white room with nothing purchased from kid abusing sweat shops, there would still be some fecker who would point out 'the rooms all white, there's nothing black in it, so you're racist..'

Feck off.

I support Qatar all the way and I don't give one flying feck who it offends and if that triggers anyone then I've only one thing to say.

Awww...diddums, get a life.

This is how the cnuts of the world get away with it. Stupid whataboutery from the willfully ignorant.
 
It's just a theory but it's possible

Jim has been on record as having met the Glazers in the past and his comments obviously didnt go down well with many United fans

"I've met Joel and Avram and they are the nicest people, I have to say, they are proper gentlemen."
He was probably on a charm offensive at the time. In retrospect, it was the right way to proceed, knowing how complex negotiations with the family would end up being.
 
Ok then. We as Man Utd fans should just keep our mouth shut and wait for this saga to drag all summer and then we missed out on important signings. We should not voice out our opinion even though we are at risk at not getting ready for next season. Next season is going to be another season wasted. We need to be very efficient this summer in order to challenge in top competition.

Can people stop with this tripe too?! Do you expect us to just take the summer off if we are not sold? This deal only feels like it is dragging on to some as they have attached some sort of made up significance in the process to the transfer window (unsurprisingly) - a window that continues to come around twice a year until the end of time. Whenever a deal goes through, there will be a transfer window on the horizon.
 
This feels like an episode of The Wire somehow. "Tell your mans price of the brick has gone up"

Fantastic show. May decide its worth rewatching.

Imagine Michael Scott is Nasser and the old man is Ratcliffe

the-office-steve-carell.gif

:lol: You've smashed it with the posts in this thread lately mate.

Mate give it 10 years and a lot of the clubs will be sportswashing playthings.

I see this comment but seriouslywhat other countries can competewith the likes of UAE/Saudi?,

Interesting that all of this dropped before INEOS' usual Friday brief. Pre-emptive strike.

Maybe the Qataris have learned the trend Brexit Jims team have put out.
Least we have a bit of moral fibre though.
Manchester United are a cultural symbol for England, a country that has committed every known atrocity to man, if utd can have global fans with no one complaining about how supporting utd is supporting english actions, i think most can live with supporting utd and it not being support for Qatari actions.

This is an uncomfortable truth a lot of people cant accept so look to deflect and say "look at the other country they are bad" forgetting their own countries history- How conveniant eh. Thankfully, despite the biased british media narrative angle, its looking promising still for the Qataris or else the Glazers would have accepted Brexit Ratty Jim cowardly bid weeks ago.
 
He was probably on a charm offensive at the time. In retrospect, it was the right way to proceed, knowing how complex negotiations with the family would end up being.

Ye I don't personally have an issue with it, he's hardly going to show up on TV and call them a bunch of cnuts

However, I think this was the start ( these comments came at the time of his late bid for Chelsea) of sections of our fanbase turning against Jim when initially he was painted as the Red Knight saviour of the club
 
The fact people keep bringing up Brexit as a stick to beat Jim with shows just how out of their depth they are with this debate.

Qatari policy in their own country makes Brexit seem like Disneyland. You'd know this if you actually bothered to read about it.

I can understand wanting the debt gone and the Glazers totally gone. That's all perfectly sensible. However these BS arguement about Brexit and other such things are such a front and BS excuses. You just want that Qatari oil / gas money. That's all it's about so don't pretend it's anything else.

I have more respect for the pro Qatar lot on here who are just honest about their intentions and don't hide behind this nonsense.
 
This is an uncomfortable truth a lot of people cant accept so look to deflect and say "look at the other country they are bad" forgetting their own countries history- How conveniant eh.

Nobody is forgetting Britain's history. It's simply irrelevant to the sale of United. This is because Britain's government isn't trying to buy us. Qatar's autocratic regime is.

In Britain you can remove the government via democracy. Brexit, despite being shit, was also democratic (I voted remain and still would). To attempt to remove the Qatari regime is to incur either a lengthy prison sentence or death. Even speaking out about them is dangerous.

When you provide your 'whataboutery' (a device created to subvert fact by rendering it an opinion), that is all you are doing. It's incredibly transparent.

Unbelievably depressing a sizable portion of our support care more abour the summer transfer market than actual human rights. Qatar's state bid triumphing will be a deeply shameful episode in our club's history which will taint us forever.
 
f
The fact people keep bringing up Brexit as a stick to beat Jim with shows just how out of their depth they are with this debate.

Qatari policy in their own country makes Brexit seem like Disneyland. You'd know this if you actually bothered to read about it.

I can understand wanting the debt gone and the Glazers totally gone. That's all perfectly sensible. However these BS arguement about Brexit and other such things are such a front and BS excuses. You just want that Qatari oil / gas money. That's all it's about so don't pretend it's anything else.

I have more respect for the pro Qatar lot on here who are just honest about their intentions and don't hide behind this nonsense.
To be fair I think a fair few of us have said we don’t care about the morality side in our sports teams and just want to compete and the glazers gone. If sir Jim had come in and laid out his plans openly and not got into bed with the glazers I’d be all for him. I think keeping glazers around in any capacity was a red line for a large number of fans and not clearing the debt or making any reassurances around the stadium and facilities was the cherry on top. Like I have said before either he is very bad at PR or he is deliberately holding back such information because he knows it won’t go down well when compared to Qatars promises. I’m inclined to believe it’s the latter because the man is obviously no fool.
 
The big thing to understand is that the Glazers have absolutely no interest in Man Utd whatsoever as a football club. They use the club as an investment vehicle with no emotional attachment.

if they can bleed more money and it fc*ks the clubs transfer opportunities for next season, they do not give a fig. If their intention is to remain with part of the ownership, it’s not that they actually want to oversee any club activity, it’s purely to see if there is more money to drain at possibly a better share price later. They are the equivalent of what was called asset strippers, just have been able to draw dividends from an almost free vehicle which basically was used to fund income, thanks to the evil muppet Woodward.

so we have to get used to terrible timing and management under these awful American shopping centre owners.
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Surely, at worst, the source of the funds will be no worse than City's or Newcastle's owners?

The problem is if they trace the funds back and it becomes apparent it is state backed it becomes an issue due to the fact they already own PSG. That said Ratcliffe also owns Nice but nobody seems to care about that, although the latest tweets suggest he may sell up if his bid to buy us is successful.
 
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