Haven't followed much of the whole story. When can we expect official news ?
Club Sale | It’s done!
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Notoriously, some of the messiest legal matters involve division of property of one sort of another angst siblings, whether selling to each other or cashing out...insiders have already alluded to parallels between the Glazers and the Roys in 'Succession', and not just in terms of managing 'family' built enterprises after their father's death...I am finding it all baffling to be fair.
You don't. People should stop expect things that even the actors can't be sure about.
Ten Hag has already given hints that he is annoyed by this and at this stage it’s going to have a huge impact on the summer transfer window.
Think someone said Malcolm went to war with his sisters over their mothers estate. Not a nice bunch.
Something does prevent the other 4 from selling. It's been suggested there's a condition for unanimous agreement (or perhaps a certain percentage) between the family to transfer Class B shares to a third party. The rest of the time they can sell on the stock market as they see fit, but then the shares become Class A, and obviously sell for less than a private investor would pay. This is most likely done to prevent siblings from betraying one another and suddenly bringing other parties into the boardroom. I don't know what's their situation in the family, but I'd call this a sound approach when billions are involved. So as it stands the other 4 can sell to Qatar or Ratcliffe, but they'd be getting Class A shares. Obviously not going to happen. If Joel and Avram don't budge, it's not entirely unreasonable to think Qatar or Ratcliffe might walk away eventually. They can't just deal with the other 4 alone if they want a majority stake.
I'd speculate 3 more years to get the superleague or get the new CL money priced in
Defeat from the jaws of victory!
But the stipulation that the debt must be almost immediately repaid in full within a certain timeframe after a certain amount of family members sell their shares kills this theory as well though?
‘A spokesman for Ineos's bid declined to comment.” (from the article)
OK! So far all leaks is coming from either the RG or the local hero.
Why leak “details” if you have confidence in your bid. Scoring “sympathy” points among worried supporters at this stage of the process just make the bid weaker because the other bidder can easily if necessary adjust his bid if he think he needs to make both bid financial insensitive’s from future buyout clauses or similar.
Similar from the RG’s perspective.
The only purpose of leaking “details” like this is to put pressure on the other bidder, but it can also easily backfire. This breathes a bit of desperation from my perspective. The potential buyer with the better bid at this stage has often the most to gain by only staying silence and await the next step of the process.
Why ruffle feathers when in pole position?
OK! So far all leaks is coming from either the RG or the local hero.
Why leak “details” if you have confidence in your bid. Scoring “sympathy” points among worried supporters at this stage of the process just make the bid weaker because the other bidder can easily if necessary adjust his bid if he think he needs to make both bid financial insensitive’s from future buyout clauses or similar.
Similar from the RG’s perspective.
The only purpose of leaking “details” like this is to put pressure on the other bidder, but it can also easily backfire. This breathes a bit of desperation from my perspective. The potential buyer with the better bid at this stage has often the most to gain by only staying silence and await the next step of the process.
Why ruffle feathers when in pole position?
Cant help but notice pendulum swinging to SJ the day after Qatar PM meeting. Cynic in me.
The article also just says the first window to exercise the option will be within three years, with subsequent windows after that. So if neither they nor INEOS exercise the option it could be a longer timeframe than that.
30
Literally would have nothing to do with this. I still see Brexit Jim as the favourite, he just needs to strike a deal with A&J in regards to keeping them on.
Nothing prevents them from selling and the sell process included minority shareholders. The idea that the other siblings will be left upset makes no sense because minority shareholders have been part of the process from day one. Both type of sales have been part of the process from the beginning, SJR is trying to compete with the hedge funds and Jassim at the same time by making an offer that bridges both sides. Whatever happens the 4 sibblings that allegedly want to sell will be able to sell whether it is by selling to several funds, one fund or if it's a full sale.
The issue with SJR offer is that while it's a smart move, it's also a complicated one because the hedge funds from what I understand allow the ones that don't want to sell to keep control of the club while also providing resources, presumably for infrastructure investments. And the ones that want to sell get their money. SJR has to pay the ones that don't necessarily want to stay to take management power over them which is fair but generally costly.
Either way, the likes of Elliott are going nowhere until they are told that the club is sold to someone else and the likes of SJR and Jassim are going nowhere until they are told that the club has been sold to someone else. The three alleged remaining bidders offer three different options and all of them suit the 4 siblings.
There should be a new rule: no twitter blue shitheads
Depends on what the bids actually are, but if Ineos are offering based on a 5bn, but would give Joel and Avram what they would earn if it was based on a 6bn valuation, that's a 20% premium, which would roughly come out to 50-70m additional for both Joel and Avram (depending on the exact number of shares each has). But it could be that Ineos are offering them an even higher premium than that.
Remind me what that stipulation was? I have forgotten.
Should've known this drag on. Everything about United during their ownership has been defined by indecision and incompetence. It'll be a damn fine day when the rotten old scum bags leave
it’s not indecision. It’s the exact opposite - the decision to prioritise their own personal greed above absolutely anything else, consequences to the club be damned. It really can’t be emphasised strongly enough how disgusting the whole family is.
When talking about the Joel and Avram hanging on for the club to increase in value versus taking an incentive from Ineos to leave in 2-3 years, it's important to note that as soon as Ineos take control (if they win the bid and take 51%), Joel and Avram's shares become MUCH less valuable if they were to sell them on the open market. Since those shares would have no control, they would not be worth much more than the NYSE price.
Ineos bid is essentially more than double the NYSE share price. So the share price would have to double just for Joel and Avram to be able to to cash out on the open market at what they're being offered now, let alone what the premium is.
Ineos bid is essentially more than double the NYSE share price. So the share price would have to double just for Joel and Avram to be able to to cash out on the open market at what they're being offered now, let alone what the premium is.
As soon as someone takes control of the Glazers' shares of the club -- it will trigger the so called Change of control-clauses of the plc's debt agreements. This means that within stipulated time frames, that debt becomes immediately repayable. So in terms of the actual debt agreements, the Glazers debt will not survive a takeover.
This offer made sense if Avram/Joel weren't forced to sell at a given time. Thus the whole process would turn into some sort of gamble with the 4 siblings leaving with a guaranteed amount of the money while the rest deciding to stay because they believe in the project. This offer makes zero sense whatsoever. You see, 3 years is not a long period of time. Thus INEOS can't offer a huge premium on the shares without irking the other 4 siblings who would want a piece of that more delicious cake. On the other hand if INEOS offer a slight small premium then it would probably get the nod by the 4 other siblings but it would irk Avram and Joel. That's because it would make more sense for them to sell those shares now and then reinvest the money on something that offer a better return
I'm struggling to understand what your point is? I told you what prevents the other 4 from ignoring Joel and Avram and dealing directly with Qatar/Ratcliffe. It's not possible. The other 4 will want as much money as possible for their shares. But they also need Joel and Avram to agree to that deal. Just as Joel and Avram need the other 4 to agree to what both of them want. Elliot, Ratcliffe, Jassim - each bidder offers a different path, but they all have to agree to a deal. None can make a deal without the other, by design. And while they sit on their hands and bicker, it is not unreasonable to assume Qatar or Ratcliffe might decide to stop wasting their time, particularly Qatar.
If the Glazers do sell to Jim for five billion I wonder how it gets divided up between them especially if Joel and Avram stay involved
Based on the shares that each own. Some have sold bits off over the years. This is current breakdown of the voting power:
Joel Glazer 19.11%
Darcie Glazer Kassewitz 18.15%
Bryan Glazer 17.23%
Avram Glazer 14.38%
Kevin Glazer 13.77%
Edward Glazer 12.99%
Edward Woodward 0.05%
My point has been stated several times and you quoted it. Nothing prevent the 4 siblings from selling their shares, something prevent certain buyers to get full control but nothing prevents the 4 siblings from selling and some bidders aren't looking for full control, the nature of the share isn't relevant to them.
I don't see what that has to do with anything I said. There cannot be a takeover without all of them agreeing to it, because Class B shares are presumably non-transferable without unanimous approval. Even if the other 4 decided to fly to Doha today and sell directly to Qatar, there won't be a change in control, because Qatar will be buying Class A shares, leaving Joel and Avram in control. Needless to say Qatar won't even consider this idea. That is what I was saying.
I'd take the Jim Ratcliffe take over all day over no take over or one of the hedge funds.
I agree, it's utterly ridiculous. Brinkmanship nowt else.
Kevin?
Just accept the Ineos bid already..
Now, correct me if I'm wrong here. You are saying the other 4 will ignore Joel and Avram, walk up to Elliot, sell their shares for far less money, and Elliot will agree to a bunch of useless Class A shares with 0 representation on the board and 0 fine print with which to entrap Joel and Avram?
Kevin.
wen gas
No, I'm saying that the Glazers from day one explored all options which includes a partial sale. Elliott are one of the bidders that Raine and the Glazers approved up until this point. In fact you tell me, do you think that Elliott have passed several rounds of bids while no one is okay with the terms of a potential sale, Elliott will at the last minute refuse to be minority owners?
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