Club ownership | Senior management team talk

Escobar said:
To keep him in summer was an ok decision at the time and I can see why they did it. However, now is time to be ruthless. Another 3-0 loss at OT is the final nail
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Yeah I think it was fair enough. But the rope this season has to be short and he's hung himself almost from the outset.
 
Plant0x84 said:
‘Beloved’ press officer? Really? Does any other club have a ‘beloved’ press officer?
What a pathetic way to report this story that is. Feeding into the INEOS are evil ABU narrative.
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That the guy responsible for squad order in the matchday lineup tweets?

More proof the online fans rare driving the management decisions, imo.
 
I’m assuming Jim’s still out in Barcelona watching the sailing. Perhaps we’ll have to wait for that to finish before he’ll make a decision on the football.
 
Every day that passes that they don’t sack ETH makes me lose a little bit of faith in them. They botched the decision in the summer to sack him. They better not botch this one.
 
Plant0x84 said:
Ruud is less proven than Erik. If we are to make a change it needs to be an improvement not just for the sake of it.
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Proven doesn’t mean anything when all hell is breaking lose. We went from Mou, the grand master and proven of all things football to Ole and that went quite well up to a point. Sometimes that change can do us good at least in the ST till the season is over.
 
El Zoido said:
Even INEOS’s worst nightmares couldn’t have imagined this horror start to the season. They gave him a chance this summer, bought players for him, changed most of the coaching staff, and invested a lot behind the scenes to establish a direction for the team this season. It’s difficult to tear that up by October even though now they surely are looking for a way to move on from Ten Hag. I think that going forward they’ll be much more trigger happy when things aren’t working.
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It was predictable though, ETH was inept for the vast majority of last season and we’d been poor since the Carabao Cup win in his first season.

The sensible thing to do was to part ways in the summer as the most likely outcome was a bad start and the manager instantly being under pressure. For whatever reason they decided to persist with him and it was a big mistake.

I accept sorting the club out will take years but again that’s another reason not to start with a manager who was only a bad result or two away from being favourite for the sack. They’ve also done well clearing players out and improving finances and a lot of that is now going to be undone by having to shell out a fortune for someone they could have sacked for less a few months ago.
 
Not only was I full of expectation and excitement when we appointed ETH, I was equally delighted when Ineos came in and started implementing changes and a structure. ETH has failed and will drag us into a relegation battle this season - without a doubt. Ineos have failed in both the new contract and the support they give him today. I’m amazed that footballing people have watched us this season alone and thought he was taking us forward, let alone last season. Disasterous from both ETH and Ineos. We are fecked and more chance of playing in the championship in 2028 than winning tbe league. Clueless.
 
Sir Jim's team messed up big time when they failed to sack Erik in the summer despite interviewing other candidates for the job, now they are going to after admit they made a mistake and let Erik go before things get even worse.

I wonder what the Glazers are thinking about the mess Sir Jim has made, they are probably laughing about it.
 
RedRocket9908 said:
Sir Jim's team messed up big time when they failed to sack Erik in the summer despite interviewing other candidates for the job, now they are going to after admit they made a mistake and let Erik go before things get even worse.

I wonder what the Glazers are thinking about the mess Sir Jim has made, they are probably laughing about it.
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Don’t think they’d even bat an eyelid to even bring themselves to laugh about it
 
Roboc7 said:
It was predictable though, ETH was inept for the vast majority of last season and we’d been poor since the Carabao Cup win in his first season.

The sensible thing to do was to part ways in the summer as the most likely outcome was a bad start and the manager instantly being under pressure. For whatever reason they decided to persist with him and it was a big mistake.

I accept sorting the club out will take years but again that’s another reason not to start with a manager who was only a bad result or two away from being favourite for the sack. They’ve also done well clearing players out and improving finances and a lot of that is now going to be undone by having to shell out a fortune for someone they could have sacked for less a few months ago.
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I see many people touting this 'it will take years mantra' and forgetting what exactly is it? What will take years is to re-establish United as a title challenging and regular CL semi finalists who can win it if we hit form at the right moment. Getting into the top 4 shouldn't take years given the level of investment poured in.

At the centre of our woes is lack of accountability at all levels. It starts on the pitch, ETH has his untouchables who play noatter what and this lowers standards. If players paid for loose passes, not tracking or lack of commitment to we wouldn't see the first Spurs goal regularly. If ETH knew the club won't tolerate the nonsense he is putting out he would be more ruthless and if the management knew the fans would absolutely crucify them for bad decisions they wouldn't play around.
 
Ichabod Ferguson said:
disappointed. The most obvious is the backing of ten Hag, but also the sacking of staff because it's INEOS's playbook to come in and chop 25% and stuff like abolishing WFH and complaining about mess just strike me as petty vindictiveness dressed up as a management philosophy,
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They didn't back ten Hag. They spent all summer courting alternatives, but found no available upgrade.

As for the chopped administration staff, it figures. city run a much more sophisticated administration system using under half the staff numbers we do.

Abolishing WFH is pettiness. Such I'll grant you.
 
INEOS starting to show a few flaws in their strategic decisions, the lack of consensus on whether to continue with the present manager was already a warning sign and the extension of Fernandes contract (despite him having decent time remaining on his pre-existing deal) compounds the issue.

Glazers were purportedly criticized for not being "football" people and despite Ashworth / Berrerda / Wilcox etc being relatively profound in footballing circles, surely if fans could discern that last season was not just down to injury but largely the managers incompetence, how could they not have realistically envisaged a scenario where the team would replicate the same disfunctions as a we are seeing now without the same conditions to the squad (injuries) as the former season.

There's more rumblings through the media about their judgment and I think they'll attract more negative feedback as results continue to remain inconsistent. They have done well in the market but as others have stated the managerial decision remains amiss in showing some form of diligence and prudence.

One could even argue selecting the right manager is even more pivotal to development than a 10/10 window, they've still got much to prove over the next few months and weeks even given the state of affairs with the team.
 
Problem is, even if we get 4 points from our next two games, does that make him the right man for the job again?

They bottled making a decision today. This team has a habit of raising their game here and there. They don't completely crumble like they did with Ole, with ETH it's a slow burn.
 
Someone said:
Problem is, even if we get 4 points from our next two games, does that make him the right man for the job again?

They bottled making a decision today. This team has a habit of raising their game here and there. They don't completely crumble like they did with Ole, with ETH it's a slow burn.
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He could get 6 points and win both games 10-0 and he'd still be the wrong man for the job. Absurd decision.
 
This lot are just as bad as the Glazers when it comes to making a decision.
 
We are 13th in the table and in no man’s land. Following defeat to Villa this weekend we will sit just above the relegation zone after a pretty easy set of fixtures if we are being honest.
With all the stats pointing to how poor we’ve been under ETH with an almost new squad, then SJR deserves to lose his money…and we will. A campaign fighting relegation and fans dissatisfaction at the ownership and management will be costly and a long road back.
 
soapythecat said:
We are 13th in the table and in no man’s land. Following defeat to Villa this weekend we will sit just above the relegation zone after a pretty easy set of fixtures if we are being honest.
With all the stats pointing to how poor we’ve been under ETH with an almost new squad, then SJR deserves to lose his money…and we will. A campaign fighting relegation and fans dissatisfaction at the ownership and management will be costly and a long road back.
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Everton and Palace have tough fixtures so we should be able to stay 15th at least going into the international break.
 
Someone said:
Problem is, even if we get 4 points from our next two games, does that make him the right man for the job again?

They bottled making a decision today. This team has a habit of raising their game here and there. They don't completely crumble like they did with Ole, with ETH it's a slow burn.
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The first part is a big concern.

The second part is another one, especially after also bottling their decision in the summer
 
A likely defeat away at Villa this coming weekend, with us then hovering just above the relegation zone, means the management team will have no choice but to take action.

If they don’t, looking at not only our coming fixtures, but those of the other teams below us, we are in danger of slipping down even closer to that drop zone.

The climb back out of that situation will be a very tough and prolonged task, with the prospect of a top 6 finish, gone before December.

Backing ETH this week, doesn’t mean they won’t change their position next week.
It’s almost unthinkably that alternative arrangements are not being prepared for that eventuality.
 
Plant0x84 said:
In fairness to them they made one, just not the one that you wanted/thought was necessary.
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I’m not sure maintaining the status quo after looking around for managers is that decisive. They certainly didn’t set high standards with the decision.
 
Fortitude said:
I didn’t understand blind-backing anything to do with this institution or believing INEOS were some Moses-esque figure that would lead us into the light - show and prove should always be the case.

Was not going to comment on them, instead waiting and observing how they operate and giving them time to make their impression.

At the moment they look like incompetent people who are flailing around in the deep-end before knowing how to swim. They’re tanking morale and if they keep this up, are going to tank the season.

They were supposed to be the real deal: decisive, exacting, composed and most importantly of all, competent.

Nothing about how they have handled the last few months screams best in class, and now with the biggest decision of their tenure, they are making themselves look weak and amateurish.

Can we do nothing right as an institution?
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It's not blind backing. Most of us just recognize that they've hired highly rated people within the game since taking over the club.

As I've said time and time again, Ashworth and Berrada are not tied to the decision to keep ten Hag. They both made that clear in recent interviews. Ratcliffe and Brailsford made that decision with input from Wilcox who was likely the one in favour of sacking him. Ratcliffe has basically said in interviews that he will sit back and allow the people under him to make the day to day football decisions which is what the club needs. Ratcliffe learned the hard way at Nice.

This is a new board and directors. We need to give these guys time to turn around the club. It's not going to happen overnight but I am confident they know what they're doing. I want ten Hag gone as much as anyone and if the decision was up to me I would've sacked him this morning but that doesn't mean I'm going to be ignorant and act like all these guys we hired are clueless when their track records speak for themselves.
 
Thanks for all replying in good faith, and not just flaming me with sarcasm or spamming me with abuse. It’s certainly interesting to get inside and understand a different POV. I was all in on ten Hag, but I have shifted somewhat, so while I don’t actively want him out I would be neither surprised or upset if he does get moved out. More just disappointed as usual!
Ichabod Ferguson said:
My feeling is that after 10 years of United being shit with numerous false dawns I simply want to be actively convinced of a group, manager or a player. I've got too caught up in the cycles of optimism and pessimism, so for me I've tried to put aside all of the self aggrandising PR and focus on what they've actually done, not what they've said they want to do.

All of which brings me to how I feel about them currently which is that, whilst they're better than the Glazers, and significantly better than being a Qatari toy, the bar was so low that it would have been a challenge not to pass it, but I will need to see a lot more from them to be actively convinced they're going to be able to bring success back to us.

Maybe just call it a trauma response that I'm slow to trust when it comes to United.
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I agree entirely with the bolded bits. I too get wrapped up in PR and optimism, but maybe I am too slow when it comes to writing someone/something off. I really wanted Jose to prove everyone wrong and dispel the 3 year thing. I also wanted Ole to be the second coming of sir Alex, and win the lot. I actually wanted Poch over ETH originally but given he got the gig I want him to do well. It takes me a while to realise it’s not going to happen. It certainly doesn’t seem promising right now!
pocco said:
It's not that I necessarily have a 'dim' view, I just feel like there could be some warning signs. Almost how there were warning signs for practically everything that has gone wrong here, with a bit more scrutiny it is easy to find signs of where it is heading.

Perhaps I'm talking more in anger at the moment, but I can't lie when I say that some of the things INEOS have done have made me take notice. Just some things seem a bit amateurish. I'll give you a list of the things that I have caught my eye, but like I said, I was very pro-INEOS for the takeover and I have no agenda here. They're the guys I wanted, but like I said a long time ago, it's not nailed on that their initial recruits are even the right ones, ie Berrada, Wilcox, Ashworth etc. I just hope that they have the foresight to recognise things that aren't working and act accordingly. This, in my opinion, has been the biggest problem with our club.

Some of the things I've not been impressed by, or have made me take notice at least:

1) SJR saying that he doesn't believe that gardening leave is legally enforceable. Now this guy works in business, and from my lay persons view, gardening leave is a well known mechanism in contracts. So how does he not know this? Seemed odd to me that it almost came across as something he'd never heard of before when talking about Dan Ashworth.

2) The leaked emails between Ashworth and Berrada. Amateur hour. And also dispels the idea that they weren't working behind the scenes, as these emails were sent whilst both were still in post at Newcastle and City. So to also now try and claim also that they aren't responsible for any of the changes, or non change at the club (ETH), as they weren't in post, is a bit daft.

3) The firing of staff behind the scenes, particularly taking a stance against WFH. I can't criticise this as I don't know the in's and out's, but again it seems a bit of an archaic approach and isn't a good look.

4) Some of their handling of the women's team. They took a lot of criticism for this.

5) Their whole approach to ETH's future last season. It was widely briefed that he was getting sacked about a week before the final, and I don't think that every journalist woke up one day and decided to make up the same story. I do believe this had been leaked. So to get from there, to seemingly backtracking after a 'review' that dragged on for far too long, seemed like they had no idea what to do. Then there's stories that they were interviewing candidates whilst ETH was still in post, quite publicly. I've never seen this happen before, and again it seems amateurish and disrespectful. To top this off they seemingly fail at the last hour and rush to meet ETH whilst he's on holiday to save the situation. Again, it just looked ridiculous from my point of view. And the end outcome - we seemingly end up with a coach that we have no faith in. Have you ever heard of this before?

6) The fact that they are still willing to let ETH continue now, even after all of the above is taken into consideration. Are they that short of ideas? Have they pissed the money up the wall and can't even afford to sort out the most crucial position in any team - the coach? It just feels like we'll be in a constant cycle of '2 more games' etc, until it is at absolute breaking point. By this time, the next coach has a huge task, again, to lift the team, and ETH's reputation is in tatters. It just lack decisiveness and flies in the face of this idea that they are looking for 'best in class' etc.

They've only been here a short time but already there's a growing list of questionable things. And that is without analysing their approach to buy the club, the mistakes with thinking that they wouldn't have to buy and Class A shares etc. It all just seems like they're winging it right now.
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Fair points in the main, although I’m not sure about the amateur stuff. I also think personally that the things you mention don’t detract from the bigger picture and don’t mean they aren’t worthy of the benefit of the doubt at this point.
Insanity said:
I expected them to be more decisive on two things:

- #1 the managerial decision after the season we were having.
- #2 I didn't want them to acquiesce to ETH's demands and fill the squad with more Dutch/mediocre players.

Results are secondary in the scheme of things. I think they needed a fresh managerial appointment to start their regime. By first dithering with the "review" and then ultimately giving ETH the vote of confidence they have backed themselves into the corner and are up for criticism whatever decision they make now.

I didn't say nothing has improved. I merely pointed out the missteps that they have made, imo. They did some good work in getting the people they wanted in, they recruited (although I may not agree with all the signings) without dragging things on too much and they did a good job on the outgoings. However, they did handcuff themselves by giving ETH and Bruno extensions when both should have been let go in the summer. Now we are in the situation that anyone who isn't wearing red tinted specs expected us to be in. They basically decided to write-off another season when they made those decisions.

Mistakes were made, but it's not too late. It is up to them to accept it and try rectify the situation. We are only 6 games in the league and have all to play for in the cup competitions. Instead of waiting for ETH to dig a bigger hole for them, they should put an end to this now and try to fill the hole.
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I feel like maybe right now the manager and league position isn’t the focus (which admittedly is a weird thing to say) but They instead want to lay some foundations in the structure of the club to build on, and let’s be honest after 17/18 years of Glazer rule it’s a mighty deep pile of shite they are wading through and clearing up.
Yakuza_devils said:
I will try to make this post short as other posters had responded to you with very good points.

These are the words SJR briefed the media when they take over:

"Sir Jim Ratcliffe insists Manchester United's new power brokers will settle on a style of play that the coach will have to execute as part of a three-year plan.

United's form under manager Erik ten Hag has improved of late, with five successive wins, yet they remain reliant on counter-attacks and have failed to master the controlling style Ten Hag was appointed to implement.

In a briefing with journalists at the Ineos office in Knightsbridge, Ratcliffe suggested Ineos sporting director Sir Dave Brailsford, incoming chief executive Omar Berrada and potential sporting director Dan Ashworth would agree on a specific style that any United coach would be expected to embrace"

I am not expecting instant results but there must be signs that we are improving or implementing the new "Ineos style of play". In fact we are worse after spending another 200M.

Whether you want to admit it or not, it's safe to say that we are still playing ETH's style of play rather than the Ineos style as SJR promised to implement. There is no change at all in style of play from last season, in fact we are getting worse. SJR and team promised attacking football but half the fans fell asleep watching our game.

In other words, they have failed in the most important appointment at the club which is the manager and they have failed in the most important aspect of the club which is to entertain the fans on the pitch (with proper style of play). These 2 are the core objectives when they take over.

They need to act fast to correct these mistakes and lead the team back on the right path. They are supposed to be the best in class to steer us proactively to the right direction instead of wasting another season. Implement your style of play now!
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Just my opinion , but I think up until the spurs game we have looked better. Even ignoring the Barnsley game as an obvious outlier against much inferior opponents we have put on good performances without scoring the goals necessary to win.
Only other point id make is perhaps ETH style of play IS the same as INeos preferred style of play. We don’t know because they haven’t told us what the expect, but it isn’t necessarily different.
 
acnumber9 said:
I’m not sure maintaining the status quo after looking around for managers is that decisive. They certainly didn’t set high standards with the decision.
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Fair, although they have certainly backed him decisively since with the backroom reshuffle and all the hires there, and also with the TM and all the squad building they did this summer. I can certainly agree it’s time for Erik to swim
Or sink and get washed away. Not looking great right now and I don’t see that changing vs Porto or Villa. Infact I expect it to get much worse.
 
Tom Van Persie said:
It's not blind backing. Most of us just recognize that they've hired highly rated people within the game since taking over the club.

As I've said time and time again, Ashworth and Berrada are not tied to the decision to keep ten Hag. They both made that clear in recent interviews. Ratcliffe and Brailsford made that decision with input from Wilcox who was likely the one in favour of sacking him. Ratcliffe has basically said in interviews that he will sit back and allow the people under him to make the day to day football decisions which is what the club needs. Ratcliffe learned the hard way at Nice.

This is a new board and directors. We need to give these guys time to turn around the club. It's not going to happen overnight but I am confident they know what they're doing. I want ten Hag gone as much as anyone and if the decision was up to me I would've sacked him this morning but that doesn't mean I'm going to be ignorant and act like all these guys we hired are clueless when their track records speak for themselves.
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Like I said, I've kept completely out of it and not said a word because people can believe in whatever they want, plus they may actually be right and INEOS are this saviour figure that can be believed in, but what I didn't and don't understand is backing them so absolutely, before they've done anything or we've gotten a chance to see with our own eyes what they're about.

I also feel like as a fanbase, haven't people been burned enough to learn not to put all eggs in one basket before someone or some entity proves their worth?

I've felt they've done a number of questionable things that should raise eyebrows, but prolonging ETH's stay of execution is the absolute worst and should give cause for doubt, as no giant of the footballing world conducts themselves in this manner. It doesn't matter where they're coming from or what they've done in the past - we know clubs far more successful than ours would not be conducting themselves like this and INEOS are being derided for their actions across the board. These are not the actions of a competent setup; where is the mapped out contingency? Plan of execution? Everything should be set up and ready to roll as and when it's time for that course of action to take place. Sending out bizarre PR junkets that make no sense worsens their position and makes them look like an organisation that isn't organised.

Time should be on their side given they've just got here, but they are drawing extremely negative attention to themselves with how they're going about things - I wouldn't even be in this thread or commenting on them, but for scratching my head wondering what they are playing at to the point I have concerns to voice. They are not leaving a good impression, in the slightest.
 
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