[Adam-Utd]

Do you have any standout examples of when he lost the ball in possession, since he does it so much? Smalling actually holds on to possession pretty well, the complaints here about his ability on the ball. Rojo has a pass completion rate per game of 81%. Jones has 91% and Smalling has 87% for the season so far in the league.

It's not the fact he loses it, he plays extremely safe. But that's the problem, neither he or Jones wants the ball. They pass it back and forth to eachother until they both concede and give it to DDG, who then hoofs it forward and we lose it.

If he played more positively, looked for the forward pass and got his feet sorted much faster it would be OK. He's quick and strong he should really be driving the ball forward into space, but he rarely does that either.

 

[haram]

It's not the fact he loses it, he plays extremely safe. But that's the problem, neither he or Jones wants the ball. They pass it back and forth to eachother until they both concede and give it to DDG, who then hoofs it forward and we lose it.

If he played more positively, looked for the forward pass and got his feet sorted much faster it would be OK. He's quick and strong he should really be driving the ball forward into space, but he rarely does that either.

Last time he did he decided to take a dive.

 

[Adam-Utd]

Last time he did he decided to take a dive.

Which signifies the problem even more. A professional that isn't comfortable dribbling the ball 10 yards.

He's actually a very good defender, great in the box or 1v1. But his defending isn't THAT much better to make up for his lack of ball skills. For a mid table club that's OK, but for a team that should be dominating possession you need defenders comfortable on the ball.

While Pep went a little OTT with it, he's got the balance right now and it's showing. We need Bailly and Rojo back on top form.

 

[Van Piorsing]

How do you even dive near your own box ? This is borderline experimental decision even for game like football.

 

[RedPed]

Don't worry guys, he'll be gone in the summer!

 

[Craig Ward]

Which signifies the problem even more. A professional that isn't comfortable dribbling the ball 10 yards.

He's actually a very good defender, great in the box or 1v1. But his defending isn't THAT much better to make up for his lack of ball skills. For a mid table club that's OK, but for a team that should be dominating possession you need defenders comfortable on the ball.

While Pep went a little OTT with it, he's got the balance right now and it's showing. We need Bailly and Rojo back on top form.

agree, but Rojo isn't much better in truth. he is also poor on the ball and I would argue, even more likely than smalling to make a costly error

 

[Adam-Utd]

agree, but Rojo isn't much better in truth. he is also poor on the ball and I would argue, even more likely than smalling to make a costly error

I dont agree, Rojo has much better technique but he often forces a pass. If he cuts out the long balls and sticks to trusting a team mate with their feet he is fine.

 

[devips]

Smalling will stay. Maybe Bailley would be gone in the summer, who knows?

 

[Ekeke]

Knee jerk? Maybe I've not expressed this on the forum here often, but my friends in real life are probably tired of me moaning about Smalling the past two seasons.

I thought he'd turn the corner for awhile during Van Gaal's time, but it's looking increasingly like that was a purple patch.

Then thats even worse. Smalling isnt the one who needs to turn the corner its you.

 

[Isotope]

Which signifies the problem even more. A professional that isn't comfortable dribbling the ball 10 yards.

He's actually a very good defender, great in the box or 1v1. But his defending isn't THAT much better to make up for his lack of ball skills. For a mid table club that's OK, but for a team that should be dominating possession you need defenders comfortable on the ball.

While Pep went a little OTT with it, he's got the balance right now and it's showing. We need Bailly and Rojo back on top form.

We dominated the possession against Newcastle. 65%. Adding a ball playing defender won't win us that game.

We also used to dominate possession under LvG. Possession mean shite if you can't score goals.

 

[podurban2]

We dominated the possession against Newcastle. 65%. Adding a ball playing defender won't win us that game.

I really fail in seeing that logic.

 

[Isotope]

I really fail in seeing that logic.

It's head scratching, isn't it?

People watched the Newcastle game, then made conclusion that we need to overhaul the defence. What the..? I'd agree if they're talking about the lack of attacking contribution from fullbacks, though.

 

[podurban2]

It's head scratching, isn't it?

People watched the Newcastle game, then made conclusion that we need to overhaul the defence. What the..? I'd agree if they're talking about the lack of attacking contribution from fullbacks, though.

Well if our CBs could start the play players like Pogba wouldn’t have to come deep to retrieve it.

 

[Red_toad]

Well if our CBs could start the play players like Pogba wouldn’t have to come deep to retrieve it.

Any examples of pogba dropping deep to collect the ball in the toon game? For me he played his left side attacking midfield role, very poorly.
Shame we don’t have a player anywhere near as good as Scholes, as he made Rio & Vida’s time at United so successful. Even they’d struggle with Matic and Pogba in front of them.

 

[diplomat]

It's head scratching, isn't it?

People watched the Newcastle game, then made conclusion that we need to overhaul the defence. What the..? I'd agree if they're talking about the lack of attacking contribution from fullbacks, though.

Smalling is the epitome of player that only passes sideways or backwards to the keeper. In the Newcastle game, out of 50 passes in total, he had 0 to Lukaku, 3 to all attackers, 6 to the midfielders and the rest, well, it's kind of obvious.

He's also nervous on the ball, players are nervous passing the ball to him as he is uncomfortable dribbling with it and making any use of it.

That's why he was always a starter for LVG - king of sideways passes, because he can do feck all in any other way.

 

[Adam-Utd]

We dominated the possession against Newcastle. 65%. Adding a ball playing defender won't win us that game.

We also used to dominate possession under LvG. Possession mean shite if you can't score goals.

Unfortunately it seems it's you that doesn't understand.

It doesn't matter how much you have the ball, it's what you do with it. Can't you see how much vital time is wasted in the transition with our defence messing around on the ball, especially Smalling/Jones.

With good confident ball playing defenders the whole team can push up 10 yards. Pogba and Matic sit SO DEEP because nobody behind them can feed them the ball properly. It makes us much easier to press and isolates our forwards. It's a huge fundamental flaw.

 

[NinjaZombie]

Then thats even worse. Smalling isnt the one who needs to turn the corner its you.

 

[Antonedwin]

We dominated the possession against Newcastle. 65%. Adding a ball playing defender won't win us that game.

We also used to dominate possession under LvG. Possession mean shite if you can't score goals.

I really fail in seeing that logic.

We dominate posesssion during lvg era, smalling as main defender but we didn't made much chances are we ?


Actually the logic is very simple
Here is the analogy :
A student with IQ 100 can solve 10 math problems in 30 minutes
A student with IQ 140 can solve 30 in the same time
Conclusion :
A clever students can solve more in the same amount of time

More possession = more time on the ball.
With 65% posesssion , donkey smalling can do less on the ball , sideways , back pass , side pass , 5 yards pass etc.

When you have ball playing defender such as let's say matt Hummels , knows what to do with the ball on their feet , you will play on enemy's half most of the time so your attacker has more opportunities to attack

We dominate possession against Newcastle but we didn't dominate the game , we didn't launch wave after wave cornering them in their own half

This isn't only our mid or attack fault , cause everything start from the back

smalling would be more useful when we had less possession , when we park the bus since he is okay when he didn't have the ball

He is best used as sub , 5 minutes left on the game when we are only leading with 1 goal , when opponent desperately pumping the ball into our penalty box ,Cause he is good in the air. Other than that situation , he should stay away from the pitch

 

[Isotope]

Unfortunately it seems it's you that doesn't understand.

It doesn't matter how much you have the ball, it's what you do with it. Can't you see how much vital time is wasted in the transition with our defence messing around on the ball, especially Smalling/Jones.

With good confident ball playing defenders the whole team can push up 10 yards. Pogba and Matic sit SO DEEP because nobody behind them can feed them the ball properly. It makes us much easier to press and isolates our forwards. It's a huge fundamental flaw.

Was it also the CB's fault when John Shelvey looked like Maradona in that game? And we might watch a different game. I don't see Pogba AND Matic sit that deep when we are attacking, though.

 

[Antonedwin]

Was it also the CB's fault when John Shelvey looked like Maradona in that game?

He dive because of shelvey



Just watch how our team play football & attack with Bailly in behind ( ffs i hope he is fit till the end of season ) , that's the only way for you to notice how bad smalling is in affecting our whole play

 

[Isotope]

Just watch how our team play football & attack with Bailly in behind ( ffs i hope he is fit till the end of season ) , that's the only way for you to notice how bad smalling is in affecting our whole play

Nah. Our CBs were the last thing that you could blame from our defeat to Newcastle. Toothless attack was the first, clueless midfield was second, and average attacking fullbacks as third.

 

[izec]

Can we sell him before getting a testimonial here? Thanks.

 

[diplomat]

We dominate posesssion during lvg era, smalling as main defender but we didn't made much chances are we ?


Actually the logic is very simple
Here is the analogy :
A student with IQ 100 can solve 10 math problems in 30 minutes
A student with IQ 140 can solve 30 in the same time
Conclusion :
A clever students can solve more in the same amount of time

More possession = more time on the ball.
With 65% posesssion , donkey smalling can do less on the ball , sideways , back pass , side pass , 5 yards pass etc.

When you have ball playing defender such as let's say matt Hummels , knows what to do with the ball on their feet , you will play on enemy's half most of the time so your attacker has more opportunities to attack

We dominate possession against Newcastle but we didn't dominate the game , we didn't launch wave after wave cornering them in their own half

This isn't only our mid or attack fault , cause everything start from the back

Actually it's other way around , smalling would be more useful when we had less possession , when we park the bus since he is okay when he didn't have the ball

Completely agree with your post and you make some very interesting points. Everyone can see the problems with their own eyes, stats show enough to further prove people's thoughts on Smalling.

 

[Adisa]

Imagine Pep was his coach.
Would probably have set him on fire.

 

[Loublaze]

It's not the fact he loses it, he plays extremely safe. But that's the problem, neither he or Jones wants the ball. They pass it back and forth to eachother until they both concede and give it to DDG, who then hoofs it forward and we lose it.

If he played more positively, looked for the forward pass and got his feet sorted much faster it would be OK. He's quick and strong he should really be driving the ball forward into space, but he rarely does that either.

Ok, these are pass completion rates for some highly rated CBs in the league this season so far, including our own, i've also included forward pass percentages per game and average pass length, for some context. It appears Smalling's passing is not as bad as many suggest (statistically), and I find it surprising that Lindelof, considered the best passer among our CBs, has the lowest percentage of forward passes per game and the shortest average pass length (this is not saying he's not a fine passer of the ball, I think he is, but these are the stats). Make of it what you will. Taken from Squawka

Vertonghen: pass completion: 86% forward passes 75.3%, average pass length 22m, average duels won 60% 27 appearances

Davinson Sanchez: pc: 88% fp 79.9%. average duels won 48% average pass length 21m, 21 apps

Toby Alderweireld: pc 86% fp 77.4% average duels won 41%, average pass length 25m, 10 apps

Otamendi: PC 92% FP 78.3% average duels won 51% average pass length 18m, 26 apps

Andreas Christensen: PC 94%, FP 77.8%. average duels won 61%, average pass length 19m. 20 apps

Kompany: PC 92% FP 76% average duels won 51%. average pass length 19m, 10 apps

Gary Cahill: PC 88% FP 77.2% average duels won 58%, average pass length 18m, 20 apps

Bailly: PC 86% FP 80.6% average duels 54%. average pass length 20m, 8 apps

Jones: PC 91% FP 77.1% average duels 61%, average pass length 19m, 21 apps

Lindelof: PC 89% FP 69.9% average duels won 37%, average pass length 17m, 10 apps

Rojo: PC 81% FP 85.8%, average duels won 52%, average pass length 24M, 7 apps

Smalling: PC 87% FP 77.4% average duels won 56%, average pass length 19m, 19 apps

 

[Antonedwin]

Ok, these are pass completion rates for some highly rated CBs in the league this season so far, including our own, i've also included forward pass percentages per game and average pass length, for some context. It appears Smalling's passing is not as bad as many suggest (statistically), and I find it surprising that Lindelof, considered the best passer among our CBs, has the lowest percentage of forward passes per game and the shortest average pass length (this is not saying he's not a fine passer of the ball, I think he is, but these are the stats). Make of it what you will. Taken from Squawka

Vertonghen: pass completion: 86% forward passes 75.3%, average pass length 22m, average duels won 60% 27 appearances

Davinson Sanchez: pc: 88% fp 79.9%. average duels won 48% average pass length 21m, 21 apps

Toby Alderweireld: pc 86% fp 77.4% average duels won 41%, average pass length 25m, 10 apps

Otamendi: PC 92% FP 78.3% average duels won 51% average pass length 18m, 26 apps

Andreas Christensen: PC 94%, FP 77.8%. average duels won 61%, average pass length 19m. 20 apps

Kompany: PC 92% FP 76% average duels won 51%. average pass length 19m, 10 apps

Gary Cahill: PC 88% FP 77.2% average duels won 58%, average pass length 18m, 20 apps

Bailly: PC 86% FP 80.6% average duels 54%. average pass length 20m, 8 apps

Jones: PC 91% FP 77.1% average duels 61%, average pass length 19m, 21 apps

Lindelof: PC 89% FP 69.9% average duels won 37%, average pass length 17m, 10 apps

Rojo: PC 81% FP 85.8%, average duels won 52%, average pass length 24M, 7 apps

Smalling: PC 87% FP 77.4% average duels won 56%, average pass length 19m, 19 apps

statistics can be the biggest BS


Let's just get rid of smalling once and for all , you will see the difference in our football as a team , good thing is this is probably his last season here , hopefully

 

[Loublaze]

Do you know that 5 yards pass to our midfielder is counted as forward pass as well ?
Let's just get rid of smalling once and for all , you will see the difference in our football as a team

Smalling's average pass length is 19m compared to Lindelof's 17. Why is Smalling also attempting more forward passes regardless of the length? Use your head man.

 

[Antonedwin]

Smalling's average pass length is 19m compared to Lindelof's 17. Why is Smalling also attempting more forward passes regardless of the length? Use your head man.

statistics can be the biggest BS
I can do random 19m pass as well but it won't be good if it put the receiver in difficult position.
He is out in the summer , you can be his fans in stoke / west ham kind of team later

 

[haram]

This guy is looking at stats trying to deceive his eyes

Where are the stats for the nervousness he might spread throughout the defence. Where are the stats to show him ambling on the ball. Where are the stats that show him slowing down the tempo of play. Where are the stats that show how some passes may put other players in a difficult position on the ball. Where are the stats to show the degree of effectiveness of him stepping into any sort of midfield area.

 

[Velvet Revolver]

smalling doesn't bring confidence at all. He is nervous on the ball, makes hurried decisions even when there are no attackers on the stadium in the next city. He has been with us for what 6-7 years now? he is at his peak for a defender, he should have been captain leading the fight from the back. But he is not even close to any of this and personally, i dont think he has it in his locker. He is a good defender but not in a team like United.

people are quick to dismiss young player's by framing them 'mentally feeble' Smalling is an epitome of that and he gets away every single time. He can do the simple jobs well, but if you ask him to do even a little bit out of his comfort zone he becomes a nervous wreck!

maybe LVG calling him Mike was a genius idea he started playing well after that! split personality maybe?

 

[RedPed]

Ok, these are pass completion rates for some highly rated CBs in the league this season so far, including our own, i've also included forward pass percentages per game and average pass length, for some context. It appears Smalling's passing is not as bad as many suggest (statistically), and I find it surprising that Lindelof, considered the best passer among our CBs, has the lowest percentage of forward passes per game and the shortest average pass length (this is not saying he's not a fine passer of the ball, I think he is, but these are the stats). Make of it what you will. Taken from Squawka

Vertonghen: pass completion: 86% forward passes 75.3%, average pass length 22m, average duels won 60% 27 appearances

Davinson Sanchez: pc: 88% fp 79.9%. average duels won 48% average pass length 21m, 21 apps

Toby Alderweireld: pc 86% fp 77.4% average duels won 41%, average pass length 25m, 10 apps

Otamendi: PC 92% FP 78.3% average duels won 51% average pass length 18m, 26 apps

Andreas Christensen: PC 94%, FP 77.8%. average duels won 61%, average pass length 19m. 20 apps

Kompany: PC 92% FP 76% average duels won 51%. average pass length 19m, 10 apps

Gary Cahill: PC 88% FP 77.2% average duels won 58%, average pass length 18m, 20 apps

Bailly: PC 86% FP 80.6% average duels 54%. average pass length 20m, 8 apps

Jones: PC 91% FP 77.1% average duels 61%, average pass length 19m, 21 apps

Lindelof: PC 89% FP 69.9% average duels won 37%, average pass length 17m, 10 apps

Rojo: PC 81% FP 85.8%, average duels won 52%, average pass length 24M, 7 apps

Smalling: PC 87% FP 77.4% average duels won 56%, average pass length 19m, 19 apps

Dear Lord!

 

[Red_toad]

statistics can be the biggest BS


Let's just get rid of smalling once and for all , you will see the difference in our football as a team , good thing is this is probably his last season here , hopefully

We've been there and all of a sudden would couldn't defend corners or set pieces. So many on here only see what they want to see. Unless we get a ball playing centre half who excellent in the air, we really can't afford to dispose of him. None of our current group are anywhere near as effective as him when it come down to winning headers.

 

[Loublaze]

statistics can be the biggest BS
I can do random 19m pass as well but it won't be good if it put the receiver in difficult position.
He is out in the summer , you can be his fans in stoke / west ham kind of team later

This guy is looking at stats trying to deceive his eyes

Where are the stats for the nervousness he might spread throughout the defence. Where are the stats to show him ambling on the ball. Where are the stats that show him slowing down the tempo of play. Where are the stats that show how some passes may put other players in a difficult position on the ball. Where are the stats to show the degree of effectiveness of him stepping into any sort of midfield area.

Dear Lord!

The only stats that matter to you people are the ones that back up your opinions.

 

[Kapardin]

VAR might just end his career as a defender.

 

[Jaybomb]

He got off there. Would have been his fault AGAIN.

 

[M Bison]

Ffs, we’re 7 minuets in, he’s the absolute definition of scapegoat

 

[goons]

Nice handball. You guys got lucky there.

 

[Jaybomb]

Ffs, we’re 7 minuets in, he’s the absolute definition of scapegoat

7 minutes in and could have easily cost us a penalty with a brain dead decision.

 

[Samid]

Hopefully Bailly is ready to start on Wednesday. Sick of this clown.

 

[Paxi]

Smalling > Sanchez