Chido Obi Martin

Oh, okay then. Great point well made.

There’s no point to make. It’s moot. You could argue either way.

When a team is struggling there’s less chance to blood young players as results are precious and the club spends more money to turn it around.

Or you could argue your version.

United are world renowned for having one of the most productive youth academy’s in history and hold various records in doing so.
 
There’s no point to make. It’s moot. You could argue either way.

When a team is struggling there’s less chance to blood young players as results are precious and the club spends more money to turn it around.

Or you could argue your version.

United are world renowned for having one of the most productive youth academy’s in history and hold various records in doing so.

We do, I'm not disputing that. But look at the quality of the players that have come through and the appearances they've made in recent years. The bar is lower.
 
Why is everyone talking like it's a done deal, him to United? Have I missed something? I know there is interest in him from Germany.

Edit.

Oh wow, talk about timing.

 
let's go. Money might have played a role, but the likes of Mainoo and Garnacho are just the latest examples that show that there's a path here and I have no doubts that young players see that.
 
Quite the deal, Arsenal fans must be gutted.
Absolutely distraught. Was excited for the new season but now what's the point... Many Arsenal fans are thinking about switching to support United because of this and who can blame them.
 
You don’t rate any of the players I’ve listed?

A few. But not many. And even the best ones have question marks. Rashford has had the best career since breaking through, but even he comes with doubts. What kind of role would he have had in our team if we had the quality to be challenging for titles.

Garnacho and Mainoo are promising, but it's still early.

All of them have had their pathway accelerated because we are not good enough.
 
Exciting young signing, and another impressive effort from the new regime.

After doing so well with the U18's last season, I imagine he'll spend the first half of the season mostly with the U21's and then assess how things stand in January.
 
Yes and no to this, from a United perspective. Amad and Pellistri are really different types of signings. Pellistri is very similar to how Arsenal signed Martinelli, approximately 6m for each at 18 years old. Amad is in another bracket, having cost an initial 17m, but was seen as a special talent having already broken into the Atalanta first team.

Other than that, the only significant outlays for youth players in recent memory are: Kambwala, 3m incl. add-ons at 16, Hannibal 5m euros initial at 17, and Garnacho 420k at 15. They’ve always scoured the continent to try and pick up good talent from other academies and compensation fees are often involved. It’s how we got players like Jurado and Alvaro recently, and Rossi and Pique historically. We also do the same with other academies around the country, as all the top teams do. As well as attempting to hoover up the best young local talents.

What’s really phenomenal about United is the pathway offered to these players at such a massive club, and the quality of youth development going on. It’s one of the bright spots in an otherwise bleak landscape over the last decade.

If it wasn’t for off the field issues, United could easily be lining up with a hugely promising front three all from the academy. Two of whom are local lads (Rashford, Garnacho and Greenwood). There isn’t another big club around that can say anything like that. It seems right now that we are getting a new major talent coming through and being integrated every 1-2 seasons, which is frankly ridiculous. We’ve had Mainoo, Garnacho and Greenwood alone in the last four years, all of whom could, should or are starting players.

United’s philosophy with young players seems to be to integrate them and give them the time to prove their quality and worth to the squad. To properly assess their adaptation to men’s football. It’s an approach that works well in terms of bringing actual usable talent into the first team squad - a reason why we hold the frankly preposterous record we do on having an academy graduate in the squad for every match day for more than 85 years without a single break. But it’s not the best for generating profit through sales.

Other clubs sell players based on their potential promise. Buying teams taking a gamble on a potentially big talent, who hadn’t yet made the full transition to men’s football. They get top dollar as a result, because the promise is seemingly limitless. United, however, either develop a player into the squad who is good enough to stay and contribute, or eventually decide that he is best moved on, at which point the promise is very much limited and exposed to potential buyers, and the profits aren’t as good. This latter part has been the case for players like Garner, Alvaro and Kambwala recently, and will be for Hannibal soon enough. In the grand scheme of things though, I want us to develop young players for our team, not to turn a profit. The profit part is just a nice bonus when a player doesn’t meet the grade, but to focus on that defies a genuine mission to develop homegrown talent for the first team squad.

There are more huge talents coming through over the next 2-3 years. The U18s are absolutely stacked, and I would imagine at least one of those is going to turn out to be a star, and maybe a couple more will become good squad players. Which would be frankly, another amazing outcome. This season it looks like Collyer will get some proper minutes. This after signing from Brighton a couple of years ago as an 18 year old. He’s a player that moved from another highly rated academy, has struggled with some injuries, and has been decent for the u23s, without setting the world alight. Yet here he is, being given some real opportunities as part of the squad in pre-season, much like Mainoo, McTominay and others before him.

I’d imagine potential recruits seeing these examples, and the real pathways and dedication from the club to give young players opportunities, and thinking that United is the right place for them. Even the players who decide to leave because they can’t kick on and find a way into the first team squad picture, go on to have great careers elsewhere. And a lot of that is not just talent, but also how the club trains its players. I can’t remember who it was (someone will chime in) but recently a well respected coach was talking about his experiences of taking young players on loan, and development internships, from Premier League clubs, and he said that you could always tell the United players apart. They were just different, in terms of their professionalism, dedication, emotional intelligence etc. And it’s a testament to the emphasis the club has been putting on youth for nearly a century.

People will always look to boil things down to money. Fair enough. Money makes the world go round, and who is going to deny it’s a factor? Not me. But what United offer through their academy goes so far beyond the appeal of money. They may not turn a player into a Manchester United player, but they will almost certainly turn you into a premier league or top division player.
Great post. Can you enlighten me with the current u18 players? How many gems and how many has a chance of making it ?
 
Absolutely distraught. Was excited for the new season but now what's the point... Many Arsenal fans are thinking about switching to support United because of this and who can blame them.

So much sarcasm on this forum right now, but I still wouldn't blame you if you felt the need to do this.
 
Thing is United haven’t just done this now and again. The club is built on it.

Again, many clubs have a history bringing through youth players. However, with the Busby Babes and the Class of 92, yours is most obviously the most storied.
 
Looks like an adult playing against kids in most of the clips of him at U18 level. Hopefully there's more to him than the physical advantage from early development - seems like a bit of a coup for the club if so.

Very interested to see how he does at U21 against lads who might be his own size.
 
A few. But not many. And even the best ones have question marks. Rashford has had the best career since breaking through, but even he comes with doubts. What kind of role would he have had in our team if we had the quality to be challenging for titles.

Garnacho and Mainoo are promising, but it's still early.

All of them have had their pathway accelerated because we are not good enough.

Tough to please. Which other PL clubs have brought through better?
 
Absolutely distraught. Was excited for the new season but now what's the point... Many Arsenal fans are thinking about switching to support United because of this and who can blame them.
Obviously gutted or distraught are strong for something like this. But I never like when we lose a promising young player

Probably been covered and I’ve missed it but why did he leave Arsenal? Saka is only a recent example that you’ll break through there when you’re good enough
 
Again, many clubs have a history bringing through youth players. However, with the Busby Babes and the Class of 92, yours is most obviously the most storied.

Just a snippet..

The Manchester United youth team is statistically the most successful in English football, with nine players in the English football Hall of Fame (Duncan Edwards, Sir Bobby Charlton, George Best, Nobby Stiles, Mark Hughes, Paul Scholes, David Beckham and Johnny Giles). Manchester United also have the best FA Youth Cup record, winning on ten occasions out of 14 final appearances.
 
Absolutely distraught. Was excited for the new season but now what's the point... Many Arsenal fans are thinking about switching to support United because of this and who can blame them.

Only if you promise not to start any shitty youtube channels when you get here.
 
He must be delighted to be signing for a big team
 
Absolutely distraught. Was excited for the new season but now what's the point... Many Arsenal fans are thinking about switching to support United because of this and who can blame them.
I wonder where @rimaldo stands in this regard.
 
I get Utd have a proud record of Academy products in the past, and there’s much to be admired there, but is it really more enviable compared to your peers the last decade or so?

I think Chelsea wins hands down in terms of players that it churns out the academy, I don't think anyone can argue there. Obviously the new ownership might have muddled the waters a bit there, so will need to see what it's like going forward.

City too have started producing top players. Foden, Bobb, Lewis in around the current squad, guys like Palmer, Sancho, Lavia, Morgan Rodgers, Tosin, James Trafford just some of the names that's came from there.

Ourselves, we've got Saka and Martinelli (if you count him) as main first team players, Smith-Rowe broke through until he had fitness problems, and behind them Nketiah and Nelson were in and around the squad. Guys like Patino, Ruell Walters, Cozier-Duberry, Bireth unfortunately didn't make it here but will hopefully carve careers for themselves, but in behind them we have a couple of players we have really high hopes for in Nwaneri and Lewis-Skelly who are only 17, but the former especially will be in and around the first team this season, especially after impressing in pre season.

I also get that Ten Hag has helped give the likes of Mainoo and Garnacho opportunities and more importantly trusted them to stay in the team, (helped because some of the signings like Antony and Mount have disappointed), but you've also invested big on 2 centre forwards, 1 who is 21 and 1 who is 23, so that would be a concern to me if I'm a striker most concerned with a pathway to the first team.

Anyway, only the player will know why he's chosen to leave and sign for Utd. It could be for a variety of reasons, Utd's track record like you say, promises made of being fast tracked, money, even something simple like the coaches he works with etc can all sway a young player. I certainly wouldn't dare say it's purely a money thing for those reasons, that's just lazy. Good luck to the lad, he's entitled to go where he thinks is best.
Yes it really is enviable compared to the vast majority of our peers. The club has been poorly run otherwise, but the academy has produced so much talent that has been integrated into the squad. There’s hardly anyone else that has come close. Chelsea obviously have a great academy, but I don’t agree that it’s better “hands down”.

Chelsea have produced some great players, but United has more academy graduates playing in the top division of Europe’s top five leagues, than any other English team. Which speaks volumes for not only its quality, but also its consistent quality. There’s another bumper crop coming through too, that just won everything at u18 level.

As other posters have said, bringing through academy players isn’t a bonus for United, or side hustle for bragging rights; it’s a fundamental and quintessential component of the principles the club is built on. It’s non-negotiable and essential to the past, present and future of the club. And always will be. It just means more at United than almost anywhere else, because of what it means to the club, and the role it’s had in our success. The Busby Babes, a team built from the academy, eight of whom were killed in Munich, being the first English team to compete in Europe. 1968, a team of academy products (9 out of 11 starting, and all four goals scored) becomes the first British team to win the European Cup. 1999 Fergie’s Fledglings, another great Manchester United team built on the foundation of the academy, become the first European team ever from one of Europe’s top five leagues to win a treble. And that’s just for starters. It just who United are…..

And no, you can’t count Martinelli as an academy product. Signed as an 18 year old that was already playing first team football :lol:. Cheeky bugger! But I admire the effort,

Anyway, thanks for your reply.