Chelsea 2023/24 season thread.

How many years does it need for Chelsea to miss out on CL football for financial issues to be apparent?

I'm saying it as I remember reading there were penalty clauses in the Man. United adidas kit deal if they missed CL for two seasons running.

Now it could be inept way Woodward did deals or just specific to Adidas but despite Man. United woes post Fergie they haven't actually as of yet not qualified for CL two years running, it's always been missing out one year, predicted apocalypse and then next manager gets them back into the top 4.

Chelsea however with their start and flaws is already looking a massive task to even finish 5th which may be enough this season.

I assume that would impact on FFP in the long run. Also not sure how motivated those guys on 7-8 year deals would be if it was just a diet of Europa Conference league for 2-3 seasons.

That's something to consider when Arsenal didn't play in CL for six successive seasons. If it can happen to Arsenal it can certainly happen to this Chelsea.
 
Amadaeus said:
No need for me to give examples when another chelsea support on this forum just confirmed what I stated that he does hold the ball too long at times. You just have to watch the game.
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Ah yes, shocking that you would shirk away from actually offering any evidence for your idiotic assertions
 
TheMagicFoolBus said:
Ah yes, shocking that you would shirk away from actually offering any evidence for your idiotic assertions
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Read the posts above. Evidence is watching the game, I m not going to clip moments when he does that unless you want to pay me to do that. I m not going to waste my time doing that when everyone that understand football and watches that game would notice that.
 
Amadaeus said:
Read the posts above. Evidence is watching the game, I m not going to clip moments when he does that unless you want to pay me to do that. I m not going to waste my time doing that when everyone that understand football and watches that game would notice that.
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Yeah so as per usual you're spouting bullshit. Citing forum posts as evidence is low even for you, good grief.

I suppose if I find one of the many posts on here saying that Poch isn't literally the greatest thing since sliced bread you'd accept that as gospel truth given the standard of evidence you are apparently abiding by?
 
TheMagicFoolBus said:
Yeah so as per usual you're spouting bullshit. Citing forum posts as evidence is low even for you, good grief.

I suppose if I find one of the many posts on here saying that Poch isn't literally the greatest thing since sliced bread you'd accept that as gospel truth given the standard of evidence you are apparently abiding by?
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I said evidence is watching the game. Supporting evidence is from post above. Excessive evidence is for me to clip moments and make a data sheet of the time he spent on the ball but, I do not have to do that because there is already ample evidence.
 
Amadaeus said:
I said evidence is watching the game. Supporting evidence is from post above. Excessive evidence is for me to clip moments and make a data sheet of the time he spent on the ball but, I do not have to do that because there is already ample evidence.
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So you somehow simultaneously watched attacking players who were in good positions not receiving the ball due to Thiago Silva not passing quickly whilst the cameras were focused on Thiago Silva because he had the ball? How did you manage to observe all of these things simultaneously, most of which were not actually broadcast?

It's extremely funny that you think it's "excessive" to actually present something that is evidence and not an opinion - but then again it's very clear you abandoned anything even remotely resembling objectivity years ago.
 
Why's Chilwell struggling, I thought he'd be tailor made for Poch system? Fitness?

He came on and straight away hit a cracking cross that Jackson didn't position himself correctly. After that he was a bit off.

Seems I've been saying this for 12 months but Chelsea would be o.k if they could ever get him and James on the pitch at the same time for 5-6 games straight.

Gusto gets into good positions but dosen't quite have the end product.
 
FootballHQ said:
Why's Chilwell struggling, I thought he'd be tailor made for Poch system? Fitness?

He came on and straight away hit a cracking cross that Jackson didn't position himself correctly. After that he was a bit off.

Seems I've been saying this for 12 months but Chelsea would be o.k if they could ever get him and James on the pitch at the same time for 5-6 games straight.

Gusto gets into good positions but dosen't quite have the end product.
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He's been playing as a left midfielder / winger for the most part. Despite the way every broadcast suggests Chelsea are lining up, in practice we are using a 4-2-3-1 with Colwill at LB, Silva / Disasi as CBs, and Gusto at RB.

Don't think it's fair to say he's been struggling. He's not been great as a goal threat himself but in terms of chance creation he's been (I believe) the 2nd best at that position in the league behind Estupinan. This past weekend we tried Mudryk there as a more attacking approach given that Colwill has been adapting well to playing LB but don't think this is necessarily an indictment on how Chilwell has played. A lot of Chelsea fans have been up in arms about it without realising that having asymmetrical formations can have benefits - Chilwell as more of a runner out of possession, Sterling on the opposite flank staying higher off ball typically (this past weekend aside when Mudryk played and Sterling had to be a lot more diligent in tracking back).

I think both our fullbacks have less margin for error as we have no aerial ability in our attack whatsoever - so they're limited to specific types of crosses even when they are not ideal for a given situation. Gusto in particular often receives the ball in good areas but seems to realise that a lofted cross wouldn't make sense so he has to adjust.
 
TheMagicFoolBus said:
So you somehow simultaneously watched attacking players who were in good positions not receiving the ball due to Thiago Silva not passing quickly whilst the cameras were focused on Thiago Silva because he had the ball? How did you manage to observe all of these things simultaneously, most of which were not actually broadcast?

It's extremely funny that you think it's "excessive" to actually present something that is evidence and not an opinion - but then again it's very clear you abandoned anything even remotely resembling objectivity years ago.
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Bro, you do know that the camera on the pitch doesn't just focus on defenders? When Thiago has the ball, you could easily see midfield players ahead of him. I don't know what camera you watch your games on, but the camera I watch, I could see defense and midfield and even attack (if defenders are pressed up high) in one capture. Typically most cameras you could see mid and defense. That is a weird argument that seems like clutching at straws.

All opinions can't be excluded as evidence. There are certain type of opinions that are admissible. Expert opinion is definitely one (which includes opinions derived of data or facts), and if you do your homework and just watch the game like others, you would see that Thiago do spend more time on the ball, weighing his passing option. Not sure why you arguing this when other has confirmed this.
 
Amadaeus said:
Bro, you do know that the camera on the pitch doesn't just focus on defenders? When Thiago has the ball, you could easily see midfield players ahead of him. I don't know what camera you watch your games on, but the camera I watch, I could see defense and midfield and even attack (if defenders are pressed up high) in one capture. Typically most cameras you could see mid and defense. That is a weird argument that seems like clutching at straws.

All opinions can't be excluded as evidence. There are certain type of opinions that are admissible. Expert opinion is definitely one (which includes opinions derived of data or facts), and if you do your homework and just watch the game like others, you would see that Thiago do spend more time on the ball, weighing his passing option. Not sure why you arguing this when other has confirmed this.
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Bro, you do know that passing the ball to a midfielder hardly constitutes brilliant attacking play that you keep alluding to him ruining?

If you can easily see it then please by all means show examples of what you are asserting. You are the one making the allegation and it's up to you to provide evidence beyond "that guy also said so and therefore it's true"
 
TheMagicFoolBus said:
Bro, you do know that passing the ball to a midfielder hardly constitutes brilliant attacking play that you keep alluding to him ruining?

If you can easily see it then please by all means show examples of what you are asserting. You are the one making the allegation and it's up to you to provide evidence beyond "that guy also said so and therefore it's true"
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Passing the ball to an open midfield player rather than keeping the ball longer than he should constitute better circulation of ball movement which would result in better attacking play. It is not rocket science to me. What Thiago is accused of doing in moment was the zombie passing that doesn't progress the attacking play. When the ball can be played more directly and quicker to midfielder especially to a player like enzo, it creates better scoring opportunities than keeping hold of the ball.

Regardless, I m not saying Thiago is a terrible football, just that I notice that in his game and it seems I m not the only one. But for me, I believe it is a structural issue as well. Even though chelsea defense has been solid (they are third in xga chart) I believe that Thiago role in the team is hindering chelsea attacking play (not saying that he is the main cause).

The role that Thiago playing, I would prefer to see colwill play that role or even chelsea play a three man midfield and see lavia or Caceido drop between the defensive line and make those passes that build up the attacking play.

Pochettino seems to value his experience in defense and I understand why seeing how solid they have been so far. But, my preference is that Pochettino should drop Thiago and continue using the three center back in

Diasi - colwill - Badishelle

Like i mentioned should happen in the levi colwill thread Or use three in midfield with natural fullback

-------------------------Diasi - colwill/Badishelle
James-----------------Lavia/Caceido --------------- chilwell/matsen
-------------caceido/Gallagher - enzo/carni

I understand the experience he brings to the back four, but chelsea ball circulating would be better, I believe in such a set up. It hasn't been done yet, so I may be wrong about that. But it is something Pochettino needs to consider. Even though their statistical numbers are as good as Brighton, Manchester city, liverpool and Arsenal at the moment, I fell that they can be superior when all their players are fit and have the right players in their system. Unfortunately, I do not see Thiago as one of those players.
 
Amadaeus said:
Passing the ball to an open midfield player rather than keeping the ball longer than he should constitute better circulation of ball movement which would result in better attacking play. It is not rocket science to me. What Thiago is accused of doing in moment was the zombie passing that doesn't progress the attacking play. When the ball can be played more directly and quicker to midfielder especially to a player like enzo, it creates better scoring opportunities than keeping hold of the ball.

Regardless, I m not saying Thiago is a terrible football, just that I notice that in his game and it seems I m not the only one. But for me, I believe it is a structural issue as well. Even though chelsea defense has been solid (they are third in xga chart) I believe that Thiago role in the team is hindering chelsea attacking play (not saying that he is the main cause).

The role that Thiago playing, I would prefer to see colwill play that role or even chelsea play a three man midfield and see lavia or Caceido drop between the defensive line and make those passes that build up the attacking play.

Pochettino seems to value his experience in defense and I understand why seeing how solid they have been so far. But, my preference is that Pochettino should drop Thiago and continue using the three center back in

Diasi - colwill - Badishelle

Like i mentioned should happen in the levi colwill thread Or use three in midfield with natural fullback

-------------------------Diasi - colwill/Badishelle
James-----------------Lavia/Caceido --------------- chilwell/matsen
-------------caceido/Gallagher - enzo/carni

I understand the experience he brings to the back four, but chelsea ball circulating would be better, I believe in such a set up. It hasn't been done yet, so I may be wrong about that. But it is something Pochettino needs to consider. Even though their statistical numbers are as good as Brighton, Manchester city, liverpool and Arsenal at the moment, I fell that they can be superior when all their players are fit and have the right players in their system. Unfortunately, I do not see Thiago as one of those players.
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Ya know, I don't really disagree with a lot of what you are saying - but I thought the problem was much more on Enzo not making himself available as much moreso than it was on Silva. Again, very understandable given the international fixtures and travel demands.
 
TheMagicFoolBus said:
Ya know, I don't really disagree with a lot of what you are saying - but I thought the problem was much more on Enzo not making himself available as much moreso than it was on Silva. Again, very understandable given the international fixtures and travel demands.
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Yea true, that is another issue Pochettino needs to fix. He needs to switch Gallagher role with enzo. Even though Gallagher has been one of chelsea better players in this heavy 8 light 10 role he is playing, I believe enzo is better being the heavy 8 light 10. Enzo has better vision, progressive passing ability and technical ability. I believe the reason why enzo is playing the light 8 heavy 10 role is because they don't have a reliable number 10 and Gallagher is perhaps not as good in that heavy 10 role. Once carni or nkunku is back, I could see enzo playing that heavy 8 light 10 role, which he will be better in and will be more available for the pass from the defenders.

injuries has really hampered the structure of their team. But with that said, even if chelsea play with three in midfield, enzo would have to learn how to play that heavy 10 light 8 role because I believe he is more attack oriented than his partner Caceido or lavia. I am not convinced with enzo in that heavy 10 role yet, but perhaps with the likes of nkunku, and better midfield partners in Caceido and lavia, enzo will be more efficient in that role. As good as Gallagher has been, I do not believe that he should be starting either ahead of lavia or Caceido. So, once chelsea has most of their fit players, I can see significant improvement in performance of individuals especially to the likes of Jackson and enzo. Maybe even sterling as well. Their defense has been good so far, but their attack is where the problem is.
 
Amadaeus said:
Yea true, that is another issue Pochettino needs to fix. He needs to switch Gallagher role with enzo. Even though Gallagher has been one of chelsea better players in this heavy 8 light 10 role he is playing, I believe enzo is better being the heavy 8 light 10. Enzo has better vision, progressive passing ability and technical ability. I believe the reason why enzo is playing the light 8 heavy 10 role is because they don't have a reliable number 10 and Gallagher is perhaps not as good in that heavy 10 role. Once carni or nkunku is back, I could see enzo playing that heavy 8 light 10 role, which he will be better in and will be more available for the pass from the defenders.

injuries has really hampered the structure of their team. But with that said, even if chelsea play with three in midfield, enzo would have to learn how to play that heavy 10 light 8 role because I believe he is more attack oriented than his partner Caceido or lavia. I am not convinced with enzo in that heavy 10 role yet, but perhaps with the likes of nkunku, and better midfield partners in Caceido and lavia, enzo will be more efficient in that role. As good as Gallagher has been, I do not believe that he should be starting either ahead of lavia or Caceido. So, once chelsea has most of their fit players, I can see significant improvement in performance of individuals especially to the likes of Jackson and enzo. Maybe even sterling as well. Their defense has been good so far, but their attack is where the problem is.
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I'd rather play someone like Maatsen in that more advanced role. Personally think we lose too much and it becomes easier for Enzo to be marked out of the game when he's further up the pitch
 
This is where I genuinely wonder if the Chelsea forums are as awful as the Caf currently. I mean they should be a whole lot worse given Chelsea look in dire trouble and have spent an astonishing amount over three different coaches since the takeover..

Any resident Chelsea fans care to give us an insight?
 
If their goal scoring problem is this bad, Boehly seems like the sort of thick skinned bloke that wouldn’t hesitate buying Greenwood.
 
TheReligion said:
This is where I genuinely wonder if the Chelsea forums are as awful as the Caf currently. I mean they should be a whole lot worse given Chelsea look in dire trouble and have spent an astonishing amount over three different coaches since the takeover..

Any resident Chelsea fans care to give us an insight?
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As shit as we've been too we have been losing to good teams. Spurs, Arsenal and Bayern all away plus Brighton who are especially good away.

Chelsea have picked up 1 point from Forest H , Bournemouth A, Villa H. With zero goals .
 
Djemba-Djemba said:
As shit as we've been too we have been losing to good teams. Spurs, Arsenal and Bayern all away plus Brighton who are especially good away.

Chelsea have picked up 1 point from Forest H , Bournemouth A, Villa H. With zero goals .
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interesting how they get a free pass in the media when you compare it to United who are without the majority of a first team to pick from.
 
Imagine if Chelsea get relegated. Probably won't, but it is legitimately within the realm of possibility if they don't turn things around. Just picture a club like that in the Championship. It would be the craziest thing that ever happened in the PL, with Leicester's title win a close second.
 
TheReligion said:
This is where I genuinely wonder if the Chelsea forums are as awful as the Caf currently. I mean they should be a whole lot worse given Chelsea look in dire trouble and have spent an astonishing amount over three different coaches since the takeover..

Any resident Chelsea fans care to give us an insight?
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Had a quick look last week after the Bournemouth game and someone was already calling him "Pottertino." :lol:

Didn't see the first half but second was Chelsea just getting into final third and then checking back constantly. If Sterling is the one crossing they also never ever have anyone arriving in the Lampard position e.g. running towards the penalty spot where so many crosses end up.

Sort of red where it wouldn't have been 10 years ago but now with the excessive force interpretation you see plenty sent off.

Gusto and Jackson suspended for Fulham away now.

Really surprised they took Fernandez off after 70 minutes as he's the only one in their midfield area who can get his head up quickly and see a pass to the forwards.
 
FootballHQ said:
Had a quick look last week after the Bournemouth game and someone was already calling him "Pottertino." :lol:

Didn't see the first half but second was Chelsea just getting into final third and then checking back constantly. If Sterling is the one crossing they also never ever have anyone arriving in the Lampard position e.g. running towards the penalty spot where so many crosses end up.

Sort of red where it wouldn't have been 10 years ago but now with the excessive force interpretation you see plenty sent off.

Gusto and Jackson suspended for Fulham away now.
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Congrats on the win. Watkins is an odd player. I notice he causes frustration and jubilation in equal measures. What’s your thoughts on him?
 
We need Nkunku back and to spend big on forwards in January few hundred million, 2 or 3 goal scorers. Then we can dream of 50 points this season.

If that doesn't happen relegation very possible.

We're dogshit upfront, couldn't finish our dinner. Even v the weaker teams we've played, outside of Luton game offered nothing up front.
 
TheReligion said:
interesting how they get a free pass in the media when you compare it to United who are without the majority of a first team to pick from.
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Just came to post this. Apparently ETH is under all sort of pressure and we are a club in crisis with no identity and no belief. Nothing about chelsea
 
Dansk said:
Imagine if Chelsea get relegated. Probably won't, but it is legitimately within the realm of possibility if they don't turn things around. Just picture a club like that in the Championship. It would be the craziest thing that ever happened in the PL, with Leicester's title win a close second.
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They'll be down there. Already there's a huge points gap to even 7th in the league. They've won I think 5 league games in the whole of 2023, we won that many just in April.

If you just ignore all the success in last 20 years there's little different in their approach in 12 months to what Everton have been doing from 2017 and they've fallen from top 8 regulars to now in the bottom 6 every season.
 
The only good thing for them is that they have invested in such young players. Another disaster start to the season and for now the big money signings dont look ready to deliver. Looks like it might be another season out of the champions league
 
Mb194dc said:
We need Nkunku back and to spend big on forwards in January few hundred million, 2 or 3 goal scorers. Then we can dream of 50 points this season.

If that doesn't happen relegation very possible.

We're dogshit upfront, couldn't finish our dinner. Even v the weaker teams we've played, outside of Luton game offered nothing up front.
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You got into the mess by spending big on countless players. Maybe stop digging your hole deeper, and sell some players, or sign a couple of really, really cheap ones?
 
Ekeke said:
The only good thing for them is that they have invested in such young players. Another disaster start to the season and for now the big money signings dont look ready to deliver. Looks like it might be another season out of the champions league
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That’s only good if the players are of a certain quality. Frankly other than Enzo, I’m not impressed by any of their purchases
 
Ekeke said:
The only good thing for them is that they have invested in such young players. Another disaster start to the season and for now the big money signings dont look ready to deliver. Looks like it might be another season out of the champions league
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How long do those on 7-8 year deals stay motivated though if they're not making europe season in season out? They're drawing Man. City again in the FA from season being over by early Jan again as Brighton could easily turn them over in league cup in midweek as they have way better squad depth and crucially players who can come in who know their system inside out.
 
Mb194dc said:
We need Nkunku back and to spend big on forwards in January few hundred million, 2 or 3 goal scorers. Then we can dream of 50 points this season.

If that doesn't happen relegation very possible.

We're dogshit upfront, couldn't finish our dinner. Even v the weaker teams we've played, outside of Luton game offered nothing up front.
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The 100m on Lukaku not enough?

Spent an obscene amount of money. There’s clearly zero strategy and planning.
 
TheReligion said:
The 100m on Lukaku not enough?

Spent an obscene amount of money. There’s clearly zero strategy and planning.
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Of course there's a strategy, it's private equity! It's just an utterly shite one for results now.

All the insane overpaying for midfielders but not buying attackers will go down as a historic mistake. More so if goals don't come from January.

I reckon we'll have about 15 points by 1st Jan looking at the fixtures.
 
Judas said:
All over the pitch they have players where I simply wonder where they came from and why they’ve been signed.
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I remember a tweet from Chelsea showing one of their players looking annoyed after the defeat and some comment like 'We go again next week'. All the replies were about how no-one knew who the player was. It's like they went out and got everyone who'd been named exactly twice by Frabrizio Romano.
 
Surely if Chelsea miss out on European football for a second season, with the money they’ve spent and their wage bill…they’ll be in pretty awful financial difficulty no?

I know they get by FFP by offering such long contracts but surely they need european football income to help support?
 
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