The handball at WBA was a poor shout from the ref. But the thing is, WBA would have had two penalties, and had a half against ten men if the ref had got it right. At the end of the day, it's difficult to say you'd have won if the ref had got the decision right in the first half, even if he had given your stonewall penalty in the second.
Cesc Fabregas
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The handball at WBA was a poor shout from the ref. But the thing is, WBA would have had two penalties, and had a half against ten men if the ref had got it right. At the end of the day, it's difficult to say you'd have won if the ref had got the decision right in the first half, even if he had given your stonewall penalty in the second.
14-5 is not understandable as a lot of those penalties are dives.
And you talk about the timing of the bad decisions. Well Dunne's rugby tackle on Nani vs Villa could have cost us points. Now just because we were too good not to let it affect us like Blackpool did does not mean it wasn't unfair.
B'ham should have had a penalty or two versus you'll and your crucial opener came after yet another dive from RvP for the free kick.B'ham also lost to you'll at the Emirates after a shocking Chamakh dive which won you'll the penalty. So when you say you've not had luck/ref decisions in your favor this season then your just joking.
The Arsenal fans I know have been blaming injuries and ref decisions for winning nothing for years. Those are two things that can't be blamed this year.
Any Arsenal fan who has blamed refs for us not winning the title recently is just wrong. Injuries is slightly fairer, but we're still at fault for not having enough depth.
You're just making stuff up now. Birmingham could possibly have had a penalty in a game we won 3-0. RVP was clipped for the free kick, blatantly.
Oh and Rafael v Blackpool was identical to Nani v Villa. I'd have given neither personally, but you can't claim one should have been given whilst one shouldn't have been.
Yeah Neville should have been sent off but it's not like it happens to us all the time. The decisions in our favor are more than balanced by the rubbish ones.
Incidents like the Rafael red card will be forgotten obviously. And once again the Neville "red" at Stoke is ridiculous because the first yellow he got was an unbelievably poor decision.
Seriously. I mean seriously just read what you wrote, and start again.
Why? Do we have to substantiate claims now, whilst every Arsenal fan on this board talks utter unsubstantiated garbage in nearly every post?
You can't help dragging United into any discussion about Arsenal.
The hypocracy is incredible. Unsubstantiated garbage? You genuinely claimed we'd scarcely be top 4 if it wasn't for referees. That is utter rubbish. If you can find one person even on this site who thinks that's true it'll be a miracle.
hypocrisy.
I have never claimed United get a helping hand from officials though. I'm just saying these things sort of balance out for most clubs. Whilst you were robbed against Birmingham, you got lucky at Blackpool/WBA/Stoke. To be fair though, none of the decisions that you got at those games were as bad as the goal v Brum, which was ludicrous.
We weren't discussing impact on games, we were discussing luck with refereeing decisions. In any case, they have had an impact in a lot of your games, you've had crucial and dubious penalties against Tottenham (x2), Leeds, Partizan, Birmingham and Huddersfield. I'd say 4 out of those 6 were definitely not penalties (Nasri v Spurs, Chamakh v Birmingham, van Persie v Partizan and Bendtner v Huddersfield). These on top of incorrect penalty awards for Djourou v Shaktar, Chamakh v Braga and Chamakh v Blackpool which had an impact on the scoreline if not the result.
I recognise that the better teams will generally get more penalties due to more time spent in the box, but not when you're comparing with us, who spend just as much time attacking as you do. If we're to add a sense of weighting, 11.5% of your goals this season have come from penalties, compared to just 4% of ours.
Gary Cahill's was a textbook yellow card, the other one I was referring to was Zabaleta, who didn't deserve even a booking.
You've had a run of dubious decisions in your favour, one offside call doesn't change that. Except I'm mature enough to put it down to a run of good luck with individual calls and not a referee having it in for us like you've suggested with Mason.
Cheers.
Er, that was kind of my point.
If Arsenal fans are going to talk unsubstantiated garbage, not sure why I should substantiate any outlandish claims I make.
Perhaps not out of the top four, but Arsenal's title challenge would be dead and buried without referee assistance.
The thing is - what you call dubious, I would call stonewall in a lot of cases. It would be wrong of me to claim that we should have had all of them, but the majority have been fine. Both Spurs ones were pens, as was the Bendtner one, as was the Leeds one. Chamakh v Birmingham was a dive. RVP v Partizan was a tad soft.
The Zabaleta red was in the 95th minute - it was a terrible decision(subsequently rescinded accordingly) but it made no impact on the game. It wasn't 'luck' in our favour, because we gained nothing from it.
With Mason, it was the first time I thought a ref had it in for us. I stand by that - his performance was bizarre. You probably haven't seen it in its entirety.
Would you say your FA. Cup challenge would be dead and buried without refereeing assistance?
I only brought up Nani vs Dunne for all those people who went crazy after the Blackpool game because the Rafael penalty was not give.
RvP clipped for the free kick? It was a definite dive.
Birmingham 0-1 Arsenal (Van Persie) - football video
"There was no real contact, van Persie went down very very easily"
Possibly but I don't give a feck about the FA Cup.
Van Persie should have been sent off in that game too, for diving and deliberate handball (which should have also given Brum a penalty).
Do you genuinely believe that? It wasn't deliberate handball - it might have been a penalty, but he'd never have been booked.
The free kick may or may not have been given - but it wasn't a dive, it's a question of whether there was enough contact to give the free kick. RVP rightly wondered off the pitch at the end with a goal and no booking.
What's the point.
Diving's fine, hand-balling in the box is fine, it's all good as long as RvP walks off the pitch with a goal and no card.
My bad.
Disagreed on nearly all of the penalty calls but whatevs. The Zabaleta red was in the 89th minute not the 95th (there you go again with your timing, in a game which went on for 95 minutes. Had he not been incorrectly sent off, city would have had 6 minutes of a man advantage. Not the the bitter blue catenaccio cnuts would have done anything with it but hey ho.The thing is - what you call dubious, I would call stonewall in a lot of cases. It would be wrong of me to claim that we should have had all of them, but the majority have been fine. Both Spurs ones were pens, as was the Bendtner one, as was the Leeds one. Chamakh v Birmingham was a dive. RVP v Partizan was a tad soft.
The Zabaleta red was in the 95th minute - it was a terrible decision(subsequently rescinded accordingly) but it made no impact on the game. It wasn't 'luck' in our favour, because we gained nothing from it.
With Mason, it was the first time I thought a ref had it in for us. I stand by that - his performance was bizarre. You probably haven't seen it in its entirety.
No. Again, I would say you didn't see that game in its entirety - we should have had two other penalties, and arguably a third.
Well atleast your not like pete then. I agree decisions get balanced out.
And what goal vs Brum was ludicrous?
And we might have gotten "lucky" at Blackpool but we also should have had a penalty there when Vidic was blatantly shoved at 2-1. Rafael was wrongly sent off as well vs Spurs. We din't get a penalty at Stoke and WBA so yeah it's balanced
10 mins back you were sure it's a penalty. It was a dive. Simple as that. Every bit as bad as Nasri (?) at WHL, Chamakh vs B'ham, Rafael vs someone, Bendtner vs Huddersfield etc etc.
The goal Brum scored against you lot was ridiculous - should never have stood.
The point is that the inordinate number of penalties we've had this year have, on the whole, been fair. Of the 14, only 2 of them you can say should not have been given. Which is about normal. It's definitely not a case of 'Arsenal would be out the top four if it weren't for refs'. That's just not true.
The Zabaleta red was neither here nor there - that game was destined for a 0-0 regardless - the point stands that it was not an example of Arsenal luck.
I watched the whole game - I don't think any of your penalty shouts were cast-iron at all. I would have given none, and the ref agreed on the most part.
Just so people aren't roped in by Comical Alistair's attempts to belittle any opinion he doesn't like.
Arsenalist - Arsenal Video Premier League Highlights
Not only is that a 100% nailed on penalty, but it's also a booking for deliberate handball as he takes the ball away from the Birmingham player who's about to volley it towards goal.
The score at this point should have been 0-0 because RvP had dived for Arsenal's free-kick - another bookable offence.
Arsenalist - Arsenal Video Premier League Highlights
Not only is that a 100% nailed on penalty, but it's also a booking for deliberate handball as he takes the ball away from the Birmingham player who's about to volley it towards goal.
The score at this point should have been 0-0 because RvP had dived for Arsenal's free-kick - another bookable offence.
Biased rubbish. I find it difficult to take you seriously when you suggest that we wouldn't be challenging without refs. You're just remarkably bitter, which is strange given United's success recently.
You say that only 2 out of your 14 penalties should not have been given and then claim that Skrtel's shirt-pulling, kneeing in the side and dragging to the ground of Evans wasn't a penalty. I find it hard to take what you have to say seriously.
et vice versa, ad infinitum
You're massively over-hyping the challenge. What's so ridiculous is that your bias clouds your judgement so heavily that you can't offer an even close to reasonable view point. You are trying to tell me you deserved three penalties in the Liverpool game. Get a grip, you were lucky to get one.
Of course it's biased rubbish to you. Even when clear video evidence is provided, you can't take it.
I'm not claiming any conspiracy, I just think Arsenal have had a nice rub of the green which has slipped under the radar because of how apoplectic everyone gets over the odd United incident. It's almost forgotten how much you've had go your way, so I'm redressing the balance (sort of).
You're right, I've nothing to be bitter about, and I'm not. Doesn't mean I can't highlight what's happened, whilst having a bit of fun with you at the same time. Let's be honest, you're pretty highly strung.
I'm like the least highly strung Gooner you'll meet.
Of course United's favourable decisions get highlighted the most - you're never the underdog who is supported - you're the big bad bully.
United have had an identical amount of fortune(or otherwise) as Arsenal this year, and whoever wins the league will win it on merit, not luck.
Actually, I think we should have had two. One where Giggs plays it off the inside of Jonjo Shelvey's leg and is upended, and one for the Evans challenge. I think on balance Berbatov's was probably not a penalty, but it was more of a penalty than a lot of the ones you've said were for Arsenal.
And I've just watched the Skrtel "challenge" on Evans again in the past minute. It's absolutely blatant, and a stonewall penalty. I really don't see how you could say it wasn't.
I don't think I've shown bias in anything I've said. I've qualified my opinions. The most biased things said on this thread (apart from Kraftwerker's mental claim that you'd be outside the top 4 without referee's calls) have all come from you - only 2 of the 14 were pens, the foul on Evans wasn't a penalty, Neville should have been sent off against Stoke, etc.
I reckon if you give all Arsenal's incidents this season to United, people would actually melt in rage.
Quite apart from the controversial nature of alot of the incidents, those penalty and red card statistics would be across every newspaper and held up against us at every juncture.
I don't think the press are biased or anything, but that United referee narrative sells copies.
Quite apart from the controversial nature of alot of the incidents, those penalty and red card statistics would be across every newspaper and held up against us at every juncture.
I don't think the press are biased or anything, but that United referee narrative sells copies.
If any of the GIF men about could get the Skrtel rape of Evans in the FA Cup game (it happened on exactly 68 minutes and there's a beaut of a replay on 77:50), that'd be great, we could see exactly what alastair defines as not a penalty, and then compare it to some of the Arsenal ones which apparently were, such as Nasri v Spurs or Bendtner v Huddersfield.
14 penalties.
Fabregas makes a comment in the tunnel to the 4th official and it's a major shitstorm with Talkshite spending an afternoon on it and the opposition manager claiming he should have been sent off. Rooney calls the ref a 'fecking wanker' on the pitch in widescreen 3D TV and there's not a peep from the opposition nor media. l
A slight difference between name-calling and an insinuation of corruption, no storey?
l
Personally I think the Fabregas thing is a load of nonsense but I'd be of the view that questioning a match official's integrity by saying he took a bribe is worse than a bit of vulgar abuse.
l
A comment?
He questioned Everton's and by association Moyes' integrity by suggesting they had possibly given money to the referee.
Big difference.
They are both showing contempt for officials - the big difference is that one was done in private and the other was done in public. But you wouldn't guess which was the public offence from the shitstorm/silence.
You're not getting it are you.
Yes - the same way pushing your wife at the beach and smashing her in the face with a brick at home are both showing her contempt, one done in public and the other in private, that still doesn't change the fact that one was much worse than the other.
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