Celebrity Allegations, #MeToo etc

walkinhop said:
As far as i'm concerned everyone in that freak show know plenty well what's going on, why it's going on, who likes what and how. They enter it knowingly with the hope they might get somewhere. Nobody cares as long as they get what they want. As soon as someone sees a benefit in outing someone, here's your newest outrage America.

Pathetic little shits, all of them. The poor "victims" too. As long as it's not some random kid who really was abused, all other career-for-sex rising stars can go Harvey Stein themselves.
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Look at the state of this.
 
Buchan said:
What on Earth is wrong with these scumbags that they feel the need to foist themselves upon victims with such regularity? Their transparent and thinly-veiled attempts at virtue-signalling and being 'good guys' is the most galling part about all this. These bastards lecture everyday people about what's morally acceptable and not, and here they are - being predators - in their own private lives.
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Trump must be laughing his ass off seeing all these Hollywood celebs go down.
 


I do wonder what practical structural changes Hollywood could make to address these issues.
 
VorZakone said:
Trump must be laughing his ass off seeing all these Hollywood celebs go down.
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It's been mentioned before but there's something strange about Trump not ripping into these Hollywood types since these details emerged. The only one he seemed to comment on was Weinstein and even that appeared to be a throwaway remark rather than a carefully-crafted tweetstorm.
 
Buchan said:
It's been mentioned before but there's something strange about Trump not ripping into these Hollywood types since these details emerged. The only one he seemed to comment on was Weinstein and even that appeared to be a throwaway remark rather than a carefully-crafted tweetstorm.
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A hollywood elite accused of sexual assault not talking about other hollywood figures mired in sexual assault allegations? Doesn't add up at all.
 
Rado_N said:
That's an awful statement, stop saying over and over how people admired you.
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Mmm I thought it was fine, he could have included an overt sorry statement but he mostly owned up to his actions and did not make any excuses. The admiration stuff was a pointer towards added responsibility he carries with his status.
 
crappycraperson said:
Mmm I thought it was fine, he could have included an overt sorry statement but he mostly owned up to his actions and did not make any excuses. The admiration stuff was a pointer towards added responsibility he carries with his status.
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It just felt really awkwardly squeezed in there several times. The acknowledgement of the actions etc was fine but as a whole it just felt, I dunno, wrong. An apology should surely also have featured.
 
Mockney said:
There’s at least one person in this thread
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Oh, get off your high horse! And try reading with a little more care and attention.

On the day after the incident in the Aspen hotel room, it seems the two girls told the story to everybody they met. Kickback from Louis CK's people was to be expected since their job was to protect their client.

In the article the girls talk vaguely about possible repercussions on their careers - they were reluctant to try for gigs in which Louis's agent was involved...

That is not to say they should have kept quiet - since the incident was forced upon them they had no obligation to protect CK's privacy. But traducing the guy's reputation all over the resort was clearly an impolitic thing to do.
 
“wielded power irresponsibly”

From what I read it wasn’t the only thing he wielded irresponsibly.
 
SalfordRed18 said:
Not disregarding those who have been harassed/abused, but this seems a witch hunt.
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Nothing witch-hunty about it, as far as I can tell. Has there yet been a case of someone getting in trouble for something completely innocent and innocuous.
Buchan said:
My word. It's on par with Spacey's for total lack of self-awareness.
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Not at all. Spacey basically went "I was drunk and don't remember this, but I'm sorry if it made you uncomfortable. Also, I've decided to come out as gay." He failed to acknowledge the problem (he did in a later statement, sort of) and then tried to score sympathy points.

Louis admits to everything and makes no excuses. A little heavy on how much he's admired, but I think his reason for doing so is to highlight how much worse that makes his actions. It's not a perfect statement, but it's not a bad one. Should probably have included an apology, though.
 
https://www.facebook.com/EllenPage/posts/10155212835577449

“You should feck her to make her realize she’s gay.” He said this about me during a cast and crew “meet and greet” before we began filming, X Men: The Last Stand. I was eighteen years old. He looked at a woman standing next to me, ten years my senior, pointed to me and said: “You should feck her to make her realize she’s gay.” He was the film’s director, Brett Ratner.

I was a young adult who had not yet come out to myself. I knew I was gay, but did not know, so to speak. I felt violated when this happened. I looked down at my feet, didn’t say a word and watched as no one else did either. This man, who had cast me in the film, started our months of filming at a work event with this horrific, unchallenged plea. He “outed” me with no regard for my well-being, an act we all recognize as homophobic. I proceeded to watch him on set say degrading things to women. I remember a woman walking by the monitor as he made a comment about her “flappy pussy”.

We are all entitled to come into an awareness of our sexual orientation privately and on our own terms. I was young and although already a working actor for so long I had in many ways been insulated, growing up on film sets instead of surrounded by my peers. This public, aggressive outing left me with long standing feelings of shame, one of the most destructive results of homophobia. Making someone feel ashamed of who they are is a cruel manipulation, designed to oppress and repress. I was robbed of more than autonomy over my ability to define myself. Ratner’s comment replayed in my mind many times over the years as I encountered homophobia and coped with feelings of reluctance and uncertainty about the industry and my future in it. The difference is that I can now assert myself and use my voice to to fight back against the insidious queer and transphobic attitude in Hollywood and beyond. Hopefully having the position I have, I can help people who may be struggling to be accepted and allowed to be who they are –to thrive. Vulnerable young people without my advantages are so often diminished and made to feel they have no options for living the life they were meant to joyously lead.

I got into an altercation with Brett at a certain point. He was pressuring me, in front of many people, to don a t-shirt with “Team Ratner” on it. I said no and he insisted. I responded, “I am not on your team.” Later in the day, producers of the film came to my trailer to say that I “couldn’t talk like that to him.” I was being reprimanded, yet he was not being punished nor fired for the blatantly homophobic and abusive behavior we all witnessed. I was an actor that no one knew. I was eighteen and had no tools to know how to handle the situation.

I have been a professional actor since the age of ten. I’ve had the good fortune to work with many honorable and respectful collaborators both behind and in front of the camera. But the behavior I’m describing is ubiquitous. They (abusers), want you to feel small, to make you insecure, to make you feel like you are indebted to them, or that your actions are to blame for their unwelcome advances.

When I was sixteen a director took me to dinner (a professional obligation and a very common one). He fondled my leg under the table and said, “You have to make the move, I can’t.” I did not make the move and I was fortunate to get away from that situation. It was a painful realization: my safety was not guaranteed at work. An adult authority figure for whom I worked intended to exploit me, physically. I was sexually assaulted by a grip months later. I was asked by a director to sleep with a man in his late twenties and to tell them about it. I did not. This is just what happened during my sixteenth year, a teenager in the entertainment industry.

Look at the history of what’s happened to minors who’ve described sexual abuse in Hollywood. Some of them are no longer with us, lost to substance abuse and suicide. Their victimizers? Still working. Protected even as I write this. You know who they are; they’ve been discussed behind closed doors as often as Weinstein was. If I, a person with significant privilege, remain reluctant and at such risk simply by saying a person’s name, what are the options for those who do not have what I have?

Let’s remember the epidemic of violence against women in our society disproportionately affects low income women, particularly women of color, trans and queer women and indigenous women, who are silenced by their economic circumstances and profound mistrust of a justice system that acquits the guilty in the face of overwhelming evidence and continues to oppress people of color. I have the means to hire security if I feel threatened. I have the wealth and insurance to receive mental health care. I have the privilege of having a platform that enables me to write this and have it published, while the most marginalized do not have access to such resources. The reality is, women of color, trans and queer and indigenous women have been leading this fight for decades (forever actually). Marsha P. Johnson, Sylvia Rivera, Winona LaDuke, Miss Major, Audre Lorde, bell hooks, to name a few. Misty Upham fought tirelessly to end violence against indigenous women, domestic workers and undocumented women. Misty was found dead at the bottom of a cliff three years ago. Her father, Charles Upham, just made a Facebook post saying she was raped at a party by a Miramax executive. The most marginalized have been left behind. As a cis, white lesbian, I have benefited and have the privileges I have, because of these extraordinary and courageous individuals who have led the way and risked their lives while doing so. White supremacy continues to silence people of color, while I have the rights I have because of these leaders. They are who we should be listening to and learning from.

These abusers make us feel powerless and overwhelmed by their empire. Let’s not forget the sitting Supreme Court justice and President of the United States. One accused of sexual harassment by Anita Hill, whose testimony was discredited. The other proudly describing his own pattern of assault to an entertainment reporter. How many men in the media – titans of industry - need to be exposed for us to understand the gravity of the situation and to demand the fundamental safety and respect that is our right?

Bill Cosby was known to be predatory. The crimes were his, but many were complicit. Many more chose to look the other way. Harvey was known to be predatory. The crimes were his, but many were complicit. Many more chose to look the other way. We continue to celebrate filmmaker Roman Polanski, who was convicted of drugging and anally raping a young girl and who fled sentencing. A fugitive from justice. I’ve heard the industry decry Weinstein’s behavior and vow to affect meaningful change. But let’s be truthful: the list is long and still protected by the status quo. We have work to do. We cannot look the other way.

I did a Woody Allen movie and it is the biggest regret of my career. I am ashamed I did this. I had yet to find my voice and was not who I am now and felt pressured, because “of course you have to say yes to this Woody Allen film.” Ultimately, however, it is my choice what films I decide to do and I made the wrong choice. I made an awful mistake.

I want to see these men have to face what they have done. I want them to not have power anymore. I want them to sit and think about who they are without their lawyers, their millions, their fancy cars, houses upon houses, their “playboy” status and swagger.

What I want the most, is for this to result in healing for the victims. For Hollywood to wake up and start taking some responsibility for how we all have played a role in this. I want us to reflect on this endemic issue and how this power dynamic of abuse leads to an enormous amount of suffering. Violence against women is an epidemic in this country and around the world. How is this cascade of immorality and injustice shaping our society? One of the greatest risks to a pregnant woman’s health in the United States is murder. Trans women of color in this country have a life expectancy of thirty-five. Why are we not addressing this as a society? We must remember the consequences of such actions. Mental health issues, suicide, eating disorders, substance abuse, to name a few.

What are we afraid to say and why can’t we say it? Women, particularly the most marginalized, are silenced, while powerful abusers can scream as loudly as they want, lie as much as they want and continue to profit through it all.

This is a long awaited reckoning. It must be. It’s sad that“codes of conduct” have to be enforced to ensure we experience fundamental human decency and respect. Inclusion and representation are the answer. We’ve learned that the status quo perpetuates unfair, victimizing behavior to protect and perpetuate itself. Don’t allow this behavior to be normalized. Don’t compare wrongs or criminal acts by their degrees of severity. Don’t allow yourselves to be numb to the voices of victims coming forward. Don’t stop demanding our civil rights. I am grateful to anyone and everyone who speaks out against abuse and trauma they have suffered. You are breaking the silence. You are revolution.
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Ellen Page made a statement claiming the director of the X-Men movies Brett Ratner made sexist/homephobic remarks to her while filming the movie. I’m struggling to link from my phone sorry.
 
Silva said:
Unless that self defence training is carrying a gun everywhere, I think it's fair to assume the overwhelming majority of women will say it's too creepy and they don't want to physically engage these guys.
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Thanks for that view. I'm just thinking how best to prepare my daughter as it seems this stuff is just inevitable....how sad.
 
buchansleftleg said:
That's awful. Do you think self defence training would have helped you in that situation or was it just too weird.?
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Yes and no.
I think everybody thinks they know what they'll do or how they'll react when faced with a situation like that - but when it happens to you in reality, your reactions are likely to be far different.
One thing which i've learned is that every situation involving sexual harassment that i've been in, I immediately freeze and don't react like I do in *normal* situations, I guess out of shock, but there's no rational way to know how to respond to an irrational situation.

However if I knew I had the ability to beat up that guy, then it would have at least removed the fear of not knowing what he was going to do next or if he could have harmed me or my friends.
It's a tough one, I can't say it would have helped for sure because it was so surreal - but I have been taking beginner muay thai lessons every other week, hopefully I won't have to put them into practice.
 
I thought C.K's statement was fine, apart from the obvious lack of apology to the victims at the end. He clearly feels remorse.
 
2 Man Midfield said:
I thought C.K's statement was fine, apart from the obvious lack of apology to the victims at the end. He clearly feels remorse.
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So far he seems to be one of the few (the only one?) to own up to what he did and make no attempt at excusing his behavior. That doesn't mean that I think he deserves plaudits, he's only done what any decent human being should do (assuming he has at least reached out to his victims and apologized to them directly). But in the light of Weinstein's attempt at downplaying the severity, followed by just trying to deny everything, and Spacey's "I don't remember, but I'm sorry if it made you feel bad" and attempt at scoring sympathy points, it's refreshingly honest, if nothing else.
 
Bit OTT that Brett Ratner get hung out for making a sexist\homophobic remark, most people have done that.

If he constantly goes around making them, then fair does, but if it was just one incident then who the feck cares.
 
SwansonsTache said:
Bit OTT that Brett Ratner get hung out for making a sexist\homophobic remark, most people have done that.

If he constantly goes around making them, then fair does, but if it was just one incident then who the feck cares.
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He's already been accused of rape, with several other actresses having also accused him of sexual harassment.
 
SwansonsTache said:
Bit OTT that Brett Ratner get hung out for making a sexist\homophobic remark, most people have done that.
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I’ve never said anything like that to hurt somebody before, and certainly not to somebody I work with or who’s just turned 18. That’s deplorable behavior and not acceptable in any civilized society.
 
Rams said:
I’ve never said anything like to hurt somebody before, and certainly not to somebody I work or who’s just turned 18. That’s deplorable behavior and not acceptable in any civilized society.
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I will correct my behaviour from now on.
 
Will taking on Mockney, this could be fun.
 
SwansonsTache said:
Bit OTT that Brett Ratner get hung out for making a sexist\homophobic remark, most people have done that.

If he constantly goes around making them, then fair does, but if it was just one incident then who the feck cares.
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Homophobia and sexism is still abhorrent, especially when leveled directly at another person.

Mind, non-targeted homophobia and sexism isn't really much better, but I accept the fact that a lot of people use words like "fag" and "gay" and joke about women drivers or whatever without necessarily being homophobes or sexist. I do, however, expect any decent person to make a conscious effort to purge that shit from their vocabulary, and apologize when called out for it (using the words, obviously, not purging them).
 
vi1lain said:
It’s weird.
First time I went to New York, a homeless guy followed me and my group of friends on to the subway (it was about 1am) had his hand in his trousers the entire time, then sat across us and started masturbating in front of us.
When we tried to leave he got up and stood in front of us, and we were all just shocked and frozen scared he was going to touch one of us.

It wasn’t until the train pulled up to the next station that he backed down and moved further into the carriage away from us.
When we reached our stop he was still following us as we were walking back to our airb&b, at that point he grabbed my hand and tried to get it to touch his penis - we all screamed and ran away. We were all shaken up and didn’t sleep well that night, and also stopped taking the subway past midnight too unless we had a male companion with us.
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Post wasn't making any sense till I realised you were female
 
SwansonsTache said:
Bit OTT that Brett Ratner get hung out for making a sexist\homophobic remark, most people have done that.

If he constantly goes around making them, then fair does, but if it was just one incident then who the feck cares.
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Outing a LGBTQ person is a horrific thing to do
 
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