Tbf I would suspect that several totally unconnected women falsely accusing the same random guy is statistically even less likely. Especially given the sort of behaviour we're describing isn't something a guy is likely to do once and never again.
Celebrity Allegations, #MeToo etc
- Thread starter Buchan
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Tbf I would suspect that several totally unconnected women falsely accusing the same random guy is statistically even less likely. Especially given the sort of behaviour we're describing isn't something a guy is likely to do once and never again.
Unless he’s fecking innocent? Christ. If he did it he’s a grub and I’m so sorry for the women, but coming out with an official statement like that denying wrongdoing has to be at least acknowledged.
100% this.
What has gone on/is going in Hollywood is of course terrible, but you can’t just judge someone because they have been accused. I bet there are quite a few fake allegations that have latched on after the first wave.
It’s more than likely that there are cases of false accusations. Given the type of sociopaths in Hollywood, I’m sure there are a few actors who use this to get back into relevance. I wouldn’t be surprised if this happened a lot
http://ew.com/tv/2017/11/10/louis-c-k-fx/
Louis CK has been dumped from all FX shows, had his movie distribution deal cancelled and been fired from The Secret Life of Pets 2.
Louis CK has been dumped from all FX shows, had his movie distribution deal cancelled and been fired from The Secret Life of Pets 2.
http://www.indiewire.com/2017/11/ri...nt-exposing-himself-jessica-teich-1201896395/
Richard Dreyfuss accused of exposing himself.
Richard Dreyfuss accused of exposing himself.
I'm sorry to say but when it comes to victims, the truth is the last we want to sacrifice. I'm honestly a little baffled at the first sentence.
Women will never be 100% safe and neither will men ( for different reasons) - not your home, not at the airport, nowhere is fully secure. This being said, making women more comfortable and safe by trading in the right of people to be innocent until proven otherwise is just not the way. Blanket punishment based on someone's word will only lead to more sectarianism and further issues.
I suppose i didn't explore my thought fully. One thing is to tweet something or give interview and come out against someone. Another, i guess, is to press charges or something without proof. If you get an investigation going into someone and it turns out that someone is innocent, why wouldn't you bare the responsibility? Otherwise, everyone can do whatever they want.
In your first post you asked if people should be liable when their accusations aren't proven. In this post you're asking if they should liable if the accused is found to be innocent. Those are two massively different scenarios that warrant equally different responses.
Whilst i personally can believe pretty much all of these allegations that have come out and will continue to come out, as there has very clearly been massive issues routed in any industries like hollywood where men control the positions of power and the ease of abuse thereof, i feel very uneasy about how simple it is to accuse somebody on social media and they are judged instantly to be guilty.
People cant rush to judgement on issues like these until the facts come out as hard as that may seem, to remain emotionally unattached on a subject matter that is perhaps one of the most aweful things human beings can do to each other in the form of sexual assault and abuse. But the principle remains that you have to be presumed innocent until proven guilty.
People cant rush to judgement on issues like these until the facts come out as hard as that may seem, to remain emotionally unattached on a subject matter that is perhaps one of the most aweful things human beings can do to each other in the form of sexual assault and abuse. But the principle remains that you have to be presumed innocent until proven guilty.
Now George Tekai.
"Ohhhh myyyyy"
"Ohhhh myyyyy"
It's never ending
I have literally never heard of this CK guy.
Takei has been moralising online for the past God-knows-how-long about decent behaviour.
It's funny how pretty much all of the accused have been the same, isn't it?
It's funny how pretty much all of the accused have been the same, isn't it?
P.S. @Silva is correct - this thread needs threadmarks at this rate.
I agree with you. Someone comes forward and says "So-and-so groped me in 1985 at a opening-night party/so-and-so put his hand on my thigh in 1990". What should be the sensible reaction?
It seems that this sort of thing is getting mixed-up with the very serious allegations of rape and of repeat, significant offending. I could make similar "groping" allegations about one or two people over the years, but no-one would be interested because those men aren't celebrities. The one who really should have been investigated by the police is now long dead, and when he was grabbing and molesting young girls it was the 1970s and quite frankly, no-one really cared much, even though he was well-known in our town.
I did smile when I read in the local paper that someone had desecrated his grave, mind you.
How many accusations were/are there against Donald Trump? He seems bulletproof compared to these actors.
Prescient:
Tekai is a raging homosexual. He is a Howard Stern regular and often participates in their gay antics. I'm least surprised by this accusation than any other.
He only came out recently thought didnt he?
I agree. Media and on line activists are cobbling up different levels of abuse and harassment in the same basket. Louie CK is now listed alongside Weinstein and Spacey when his offences are far less serious than theirs. He is getting his just comeuppance now since he refused to publicly acknowledge these rumours when he had ample chance to do so. Also to make jokes, tv episodes and a whole movie surrounding similar subject points to an unbelievable hubris. But his actions are not comparable to that of Weinistein's.
Similarly I saw Matthew Weiner named mentioned alongside others when only allegation against him is that he remarked to a junior writer about his right to see her naked. That's gross misconduct and in a perfect world, he would have been reprimanded for it but it does not touch the level of heinous acts Spacy is alleged to have committed.
What's that got to do with anything?
That was the problem with the #MeToo movement a fortnight or so back, too.
Is there a link between homosexuals and committing sexual assault?
He always seems very calm in any interview I've ever seen of him.
Odd that Donald Trump is not on that list.
The list is about allegations that came after Weinstein, hence you don't see Woody Allen and Donald Trump there but you do see Roman Polanski who has had new allegations made about him.
Ah, makes sense (although everyone has known about Louis CK wanking at people for years and not given a shit).
It's utterly bananas to me that anyone, anywhere works with Polansk by the way.
The Piven thing concerns me in the way people are just taking it for granted that he's guilty.
I mean, if he is then he's a scumbag and deserves the full weight of justice, but it's wrong to just say that because he's been accused he's definitely done it. The idea that coming out to deny it is automatically a mistake is ridiculous, what if he actually is innocent?
There was a case in my local area where a scout leader (iirc) was accused by 3 women of having molested them way back in the day. Each of them giving detailed accounts of what had happened and where in this old building he'd taken them. It was only found to be bullshit because they screwed up and gave the same account of this room he'd taken them to that it turned out was part of an extension to the building that didn't exist until many years after they'd claimed the incidents had happened. He was obviously cleared but those accusations don't go away and people ignorantly still trot out stuff like "no smoke without fire".
Obviously I'm not saying for one minute that we should dismiss allegations out of hand but we should also be careful about assuming guilt and we need to be careful about tarring people with the Weinstein brush too easily.
@adexkola has made a lot of good posts this last few pages.
I mean, if he is then he's a scumbag and deserves the full weight of justice, but it's wrong to just say that because he's been accused he's definitely done it. The idea that coming out to deny it is automatically a mistake is ridiculous, what if he actually is innocent?
There was a case in my local area where a scout leader (iirc) was accused by 3 women of having molested them way back in the day. Each of them giving detailed accounts of what had happened and where in this old building he'd taken them. It was only found to be bullshit because they screwed up and gave the same account of this room he'd taken them to that it turned out was part of an extension to the building that didn't exist until many years after they'd claimed the incidents had happened. He was obviously cleared but those accusations don't go away and people ignorantly still trot out stuff like "no smoke without fire".
Obviously I'm not saying for one minute that we should dismiss allegations out of hand but we should also be careful about assuming guilt and we need to be careful about tarring people with the Weinstein brush too easily.
@adexkola has made a lot of good posts this last few pages.
That's only half of the truth imo, because these incidents aren't unrelated, they are different symptoms of the same culture. Abusive male power over women and children is a continuum with many different manifestations, it's not a collection of unconnected singular instances. The accusations have to be dealt with seperately by the law, but the public is right to notice that these individual deeds share a common basis.
So in this sense, "cobbling up different levels of abuse and harassment in the same basket" is not only justified, but necessary, which doesn't mean declaring all of these things equal.
That's the context for this.
Yeah, not to mention the letter of support to him that was signed by a long list of Hollywood giants a few years back.
That's the context for this.
Are those 1000 rapes confirmed or alleged?
Hopefully recent events mean more are able to come forward, but even by that logic it would only lead to 18 doing time instead of 6. It's such a hard crime to prove I guess.
That's the context for this.
Out of every 1000 alleged rapes? It’s the same thing some of the earlier posters are saying. It’s tragic that it’s difficult to prove, but one cannot simply assume guilt.
That's the context for this.
That’s the difficult part I always think. Because of where the crime happens it’s often between two people behind closed doors and can boil down to “he said she said” which makes it hard to build enough evidence to prove it beyond all reasonable doubt I suppose. But then you cant just lower the bar for the legal system to get more convictions. I don’t know what the answer is.
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More precautions, perhaps. But then people assume you’re victim blaming if you tell people to be extra careful/vigilant...