[El Jefe]

Appoint Fergie, sign Giggs

Announce Darren and Rhodri.

 

[Tony247]

There is nothing wrong with the roles of Rashford or Greenwood as wide forwards. For example, Rashford was among top 10 or top 15 when it comes to goal contributions and he was better than Bruno in goal contributions from open play, so it's not Bruno that's holding them back, it's Rashford's overall play which was poor for lot of various reasons (injury being the most reported).

Only player whose position or role that was impacted was Pogba's. McT, Fred, Rashford, Cavani/Martial, Greenwood all play the exact same role with or without Bruno.

Hang on. When Pogba played no 10 role for united? All the time he was 6, every since he joined. It is not that he was 10, then Bruno came and he pushed Pogba to 6. 6 is the position Pogba always wanted to play, his agent wanted him to play, Jose confirmed in the press that he is playing him 6 as per his desire.

Bruno, replaced lingard/perriera/mata. All others are where they were.

Edit: Jose said Pogba's favourite position is 8 on the left.

 

[roonster09]

Hang on. When Pogba played no 10 role for united? All the time he was 6, every since he joined. It is not that he was 10, then Bruno came and he pushed Pogba to 6. 6 is the position Pogba always wanted to play, his agent wanted him to play, Jose confirmed in the press that he is playing him 6 as per his desire.

Bruno, replaced lingard/perriera/mata. All others are where they were.

Edit: Jose said Pogba's favourite position is 8 on the left.

Without Bruno, Pogba would have played attacking role in 4-3-3, with Bruno it's not possible.

 

[He'sRaldo]

There is nothing wrong with the roles of Rashford or Greenwood as wide forwards. For example, Rashford was among top 10 or top 15 when it comes to goal contributions and he was better than Bruno in goal contributions from open play, so it's not Bruno that's holding them back, it's Rashford's overall play which was poor for lot of various reasons (injury being the most reported).

Only player whose position or role that was impacted was Pogba's. McT, Fred, Rashford, Cavani/Martial, Greenwood all play the exact same role with or without Bruno.

Rashford is a dangerous, often decisive player so he will always have good goal involvements. The drop in performance I was talking about has more to do with his actual performance levels than his goal/assist tallies.

Ole has always favoured the 4-2-3-1, but there has definitely been a distinct change of shape since 19/20. The forwards are much wider, often near the touchline playing as wingers, and the attacking midfielder plays more as a shadow striker. The shape becomes closer to a 4-4-2, which is why Sancho is now basically a necessity to get some creativity on the wing to balance out the more attacking role of the AM.

A good example is this game vs Newcastle, IMO the ideal way we should have set up and built towards. The forwards are very narrow here and in much more dangerous areas, while the AM is looking mainly to link play and create space as opposed, to taking advantage of it.

The shoehorning of box-to-box players as holders I blame more on Ole. However the role changes of the forwards, which now means we require a creative winger, has more to do with how Bruno plays.

 

[bsCallout]

Rashford is a dangerous, often decisive player so he will always have good goal involvements. The drop in performance I was talking about has more to do with his actual performance levels than his goal/assist tallies.

Ole has always favoured the 4-2-3-1, but there has definitely been a disticnt change of shape since 19/20. The forwards are much wider, often near the touchline playing as wingers, and the attacking midfielder plays more as a shadow striker. The shape becomes closer to a 4-4-2, which is why Sancho would be so useful to get some creativity on the wing to balance out the more attacking role of the AM.

A good example is this game vs Newcastle, IMO the ideal way we should have set up and built towards. The forwards are very narrow here and in much more dangerous areas, while the AM is looking mainly to link play and create space as opposed, to taking advantage of it.

The shoehorning of box-to-box players as holders I blame more on Ole. However the role changes of the forwards, which now means we require a creative winger, has more to do with how Bruno plays.

Bruno has been utilised in a midfield 3 for club and country. He could have played that role for us. The problem is we don't have the other midfielders to make it possible. We could have just as well played Bruno as the false 9 with the wingers more narrow but again we don't have the midfield 3 to make it work.

 

[LawCharltonBest]

Some of the posts on here are shocking.

Go on literally any thread about any player and read any 2 random pages. Pogba is shit, Bruno is shit, Rashford is shit, Solskjaer is shit, Maguire is shit, Phelan's shorts are shit..

Not sure how so many idiots got through the newbie system, but I'm laying a lot of the blame with @Offside

 

[roonster09]

Rashford is a dangerous, often decisive player so he will always have good goal involvements. The drop in performance I was talking about has more to do with his actual performance levels than his goal/assist tallies.

Ole has always favoured the 4-2-3-1, but there has definitely been a disticnt change of shape since 19/20. The forwards are much wider, often near the touchline playing as wingers, and the attacking midfielder plays more as a shadow striker. The shape becomes closer to a 4-4-2, which is why Sancho is now basically a necessity to get some creativity on the wing to balance out the more attacking role of the AM.

A good example is this game vs Newcastle, IMO the ideal way we should have set up and built towards. The forwards are very narrow here and in much more dangerous areas, while the AM is looking mainly to link play and create space as opposed, to taking advantage of it.

The shoehorning of box-to-box players as holders I blame more on Ole. However the role changes of the forwards, which now means we require a creative winger, has more to do with how Bruno plays.

Imo the only distinct change is, we had poor player playing in attacking mid position stinking up the pitch week in week out, with Bruno we had great attacking mid.

 

[He'sRaldo]

Imo the only distinct change is, we had poor player playing in attacking mid position stinking up the pitch week in week out, with Bruno we had great attacking mid.

That is one change for sure, but another one is us moving more towards a 4-4-2 shape with the introduction of Bruno.

 

[He'sRaldo]

Bruno has been utilised in a midfield 3 for club and country. He could have played that role for us. The problem is we don't have the other midfielders to make it possible. We could have just as well played Bruno as the false 9 with the wingers more narrow but again we don't have the midfield 3 to make it work.

Who knows, we haven't tried it yet so we can't say for certain. Looking at our midfielders' attributes, I see no reason why it can't work.

 

[roonster09]

That is one change for sure, but another one is us moving more towards a 4-4-2 shape with the introduction of Bruno.

I dont agree with that, there are few who keeps saying how Bruno isn't involved much or how he isn't available for passes. He is available for passes, plays plenty of passes, almost as much as our CMs which isn't possible at all with anyone playing as second striker.

Bruno doesn't play as second striker, he plays free role and moves all over the place including on wings and also as deeper midfielder when needed.

 

[bsCallout]

Who knows, we haven't tried it yet so we can't say for certain. Looking at our midfielders' attributes, I see no reason why it can't work.

We've tried a midfield three. Neither Fred or McT are good enough for the holding role. They are both no.8s in that formation.

 

[Tony247]

Without Bruno, Pogba would have played attacking role in 4-3-3, with Bruno it's not possible.

Well, you can actualy play two CM side by side in free swap role in 4-3-3. But not having a specialized CDM is stopping us to plant 4-3-3. You bring Locatelli, set him up slightly behind Pogba and Bruno, then play Sancho on right wing, Rashford on Left and Cavani center. And there you go. But if you don't have CDM and you try 4-3-3 solely relying on McT or Fred then we are screwed.

 

[bsCallout]

Well, you can actualy play two CM side by side in free swap role in 4-3-3. But not having a specialized CDM is stopping us to plant 4-3-3. You bring Locatelli, set him up slightly behind Pogba and Bruno, then play Sancho on right wing, Rashford on Left and Cavani center. And there you go. But if you don't have CDM and you try 4-3-3 solely relying on McT or Fred then we are screwed.

We desperately need that player that can sit infront of the defence on his own.

 

[He'sRaldo]

I dont agree with that, there are few who keeps saying how Bruno isn't involved much or how he isn't available for passes. He is available for passes, plays plenty of passes, almost as much as our CMs which isn't possible at all with anyone playing as second striker.

Bruno doesn't play as second striker, he plays free role and moves all over the place including on wings and also as deeper midfielder when needed.

He is definitely very involved (maybe a bit too involved as he seems to be getting tired), and he has a free role.

But like I said his tendency is to play like a striker, an attacker. You can see it in his movements, he takes up positions to score vs someone like VDB, who loves to make overlapping runs and create space to play the final ball or the ball before that.

And since he has a free role, that's what he does most of the time. Hence we end up playing in a 4-4-2 shape. The same thing has happened in Portugal's past few matches, where the combination of 2 DM's and Bruno's positioning meant there was a gap in the midfield where the link player should be.

 

[He'sRaldo]

We've tried a midfield three. Neither Fred or McT are good enough for the holding role. They are both no.8s in that formation.

I don't remember us trying it besides Ole's interim period, though we have tried a midfield diamond at times to good effect.

I agree though that we don't have a natural holder for the midfield. Which is why I've been surprised with the direction we've been taking our squad building, buying players like Bruno (good as he's been) and Donny, instead of a holding mid.

 

[roonster09]

He is definitely very involved (maybe a bit too involved as he seems to be getting tired), and he has a free role.

But like I said his tendency is to play like a striker, an attacker. You can see it in his movements, he takes up positions to score vs someone like VDB, who loves to make overlapping runs and create space to play the final ball or the ball before that.

And since he has a free role, that's what he does most of the time. Hence we end up playing in a 4-4-2 shape. The sam thing happened in Portugal's past few matches, where Bruno's positions meant there was a gap in the midfield where the link player should be.

He plays like proper attacking mid, he drops deep to build the play, when he has a chance he attacks the box to find space and scoring chance. That's how attacking mids should play.

When the move starts, check his starting position. More often than not, he finds in goal scoring position by making runs from deep.

 

[He'sRaldo]

He plays like proper attacking mid, he drops deep to build the play, when he has a chance he attacks the box to find space and scoring chance. That's how attacking mids should play.

When the move starts, check his starting position. More often than not, he finds in goal scoring position by making runs from deep.

A shadow striker is a type of attacking mid so it's not like he isn't playing his position. We're talking about how his playing style affects/synergizes with his teammates'.

It's hard for such a vertical, direct player like Fernandes to play alongside similarly vertical players like Rashford and Greenwood without someone compromising their natural game. They're all such good players that they make it work, but without better balance I think we'll flatter to deceive too often.

IMO Bruno's vertical movements are perfect for the role of most attacking of 3 CM's, starting from deep and then ending up in dangerous areas outside the box. Right now his movements are such that he already starts high up and then makes runs in behind, which while still dangerous tend to leave the midfield vacated thus needing either (i) another player to fill in as the link player, or (ii) a very direct gameplay.

 

[Tony247]

We desperately need that player that can sit infront of the defence on his own.

We also need a specialized CF to play 4-3-3. Because other than Cavani there is no one who can have that presence in the box. Rest all strikers are wide forwards. Get CF, CDM, RW and an experienced CB, we are then dandy. I know easier said than done. But the club needs to fill these gaps asap.

Imagine if we have those sorted out, and then unleashing Pogba and Bruno in the midfield, Rashford and Sancho cutting in from wide. We will have the most lethal attack in the world.

 

[roonster09]

A shadow striker is a type of attacking mid so it's not like he isn't playing his position. We're talking about how his playing style affects/synergizes with his teammates'.

It's hard for such a vertical, direct player like Fernandes to play alongside similarly vertical players like Rashford and Greenwood without someone compromising their natural game. They're all such good players that they make it work, but without better balance I think we'll flatter to deceive too often.

IMO Bruno's vertical movements are perfect for the role of most attacking of 3 CM's, starting from deep and then ending up in dangerous areas outside the box. Right now his movements are such that he already starts high up and then makes runs in behind, which while still dangerous tend to leave the midfield vacated thus needing either (i) another player to fill in as the link player, or (ii) a very direct gameplay.

Imo there is 0 negative impact. He plays the way Ole wants, just like other players who wants to play quick forward passes.

 

[bsCallout]

We also need a specialized CF to play 4-3-3. Because other than Cavani there is no one who can have that presence in the box. Rest all strikers are wide forwards. Get CF, CDM, RW and an experienced CB, we are then dandy. I know easier said than done. But the club needs to fill these gaps asap.

Imagine if we have those sorted out, and then unleashing Pogba and Bruno in the midfield, Rashford and Sancho cutting in from wide. We will have the most lethal attack in the world.

I don't think you do need a specialised CF personally. You can play the false 9 like Liverpool and City both have shown. Bruno could easily play that role. Both our wingers would be strikers in a partnership in a previous era so I think it would kind of suit them.

I think having that option of Bruno as a false 9 or Cavani or Greenwood as CF is fantastic. But we obviously need that CDM to offer that flexibility. We might then have a role for VdB too.

 

[He'sRaldo]

Imo there is 0 negative impact. He plays the way Ole wants, just like other players who wants to play quick forward passes.

That's the highlights of the 20/21 Newcastle match with Bruno. Look at the overall shape, the positions Bruno takes up, as well as the wingers. A clear difference to the other video.

Whether or not there's a negative impact depends on the viewer I suppose. IMO Bruno vacating the midfield and playing up front and on the wings so often clearly affects the roles of many other players. Fair enough if you disagree.

 

[He'sRaldo]

Imo there is 0 negative impact. He plays the way Ole wants, just like other players who wants to play quick forward passes.

And by the way, this is Bruno's first match for Utd. He's playing a lot different here; more controlled, less vertical.



It's his initial showings like this one that leads me to believe Bruno in a more restricted, controlled role would be better for overall team balance.

 

[RooneyLegend]

Creatively speaking, his passing stats are pretty much right there with De Bruyne as being the best creators in the world. Very similar shooting stats as well, I agree he's not necessarily a world class goalscorer without the penalties but being the best penalty taker in the world is a nice bonus.
But all of these stats:

• Shot creating actions
• xA
• key passes
• passes into penalty area
• passes into final third
• progressive passes
• even pass completion %
• progressive passes Received
• touches in the attacking 3rd
• touches in the midfield 3rd

They are pretty much right up there alongside each other with those stats per 90 minutes. He is an elite creator with his passing (and both are ahead of Grealish for example). De Bruyne offers more with his dribbling, and Grealish offers more than both with his dribbling, but both offer far more in the way of shooting and goalscoring than Grealish does. And then Bruno offers more with his general work rate/pressing etc.

Take out penalties, Bruno is still a world class #10 (though depending on definition I understand wanting to wait for him to step up in the biggest games for that label). The penalties are nice for the stat padding of course, and there's no doubting that he occasionally loses form and gets annoying, but so does everyone. I'd say he's far more harmed with the systems he is in then somebody like De Bruyne though, and he's in the situation where for both club and country they use a very limited midfield 2 behind him.

We don't play the same system as City and they don't play the same roles. Not sure what's the relevance of all this.

 

[krentz]

He's having poor tournament so far. Also not sure why'd he keep playing too high though? almost like he's playing as second striker. Look at KDB, he often dropped deep adding bodies and options in the midfield, why cant Bruno do that? Bruno playing upfront could only work if Fernando santos play creative central midfielders like Moutinho or Neves, instead of 2 DMs like Danilo or Carvalho, I'm genuinely confused on how do santos expect these 2 to distribute the ball to the final third by themselves? This is also the reason why Bruno cant link up really well with Bernardo silva, because both occupying the same position.

 

[bosnian_red]

We don't play the same system as City and they don't play the same roles. Not sure what's the relevance of all this.

The relevance is it still shows he matches up with De Bruyne with all passing stats - even ignoring actual goals and assists since people love to knock his down as flukey for whatever reason, thinking it'll lessen how good his underlying stats still are. He's a brilliant player, and has shown that. That's all there is. Saying "ignore the pens and he's average" is the biggest load of bullshit spouted on here by some people, and it's very easy to disprove. So yeah. When I see people saying some bullshit about Bruno, I'll disagree.

Also, they play pretty much the same role despite different systems. We play different systems but they are the key players, the go to guys who everything goes through creatively speaking. In practice on the pitch, they are effectively the same role and if you can't compare them, there is literally nobody who you can compare.

 

[A-man]

And it mostly happens with United fans. I rarely see chelsea fan or arsenal fan or Liverpool fan mocking or trolling their players. Chelsea fans go to the limit to defend werner, heck they even defended Lampard. Liverpool fans still promote Thiago as a pirlo type for them. Meanwhile our fans will call Maguire a fridge and giggle with other club's fans. It is truly pathetic.

It’s tragic to see. I don’t see it at other clubs either. I just had a look at McGoldbridges tweets during Sweden’s game and it was so pathetic and embarrassing I had to stop reading.

 

[roonster09]

That's the highlights of the 20/21 Newcastle match with Bruno. Look at the overall shape, the positions Bruno takes up, as well as the wingers. A clear difference to the other video.

Whether or not there's a negative impact depends on the viewer I suppose. IMO Bruno vacating the midfield and playing up front and on the wings so often clearly affects the roles of many other players. Fair enough if you disagree.

And by the way, this is Bruno's first match for Utd. He's playing a lot different here; more controlled, less vertical.



It's his initial showings like this one that leads me to believe Bruno in a more restricted, controlled role would be better for overall team balance.

I think both the videos are geo-blocked.

 

[He'sRaldo]

I think both the videos are geo-blocked.

Damn sorry about that.

The first video is the 3-1 win vs Newcastle this season.

The 2nd is the 0-0 draw vs Wolves. Bruno's debut.

 

[OrcaFat]

I don't get this arguement, why does he need to be the key player? If the team gets better and those around him get better and we play better without him then he will be on the bench.

On the other hand we might see the best of Bruno in a better team. Hes certainly the type to do whatever it takes to improve so that can be part of the team. Seems like no one is harder on him than himself.

It's not like he's on stupid wages or even cost a stupid amount, at the same time I don't think we'd easily recoup that money. That is the sort of player we should have in our squad, whether they start or not.

I think he will play better when he doesn’t feel like the team relies on him so much.

By that I don’t mean the pressure is a problem for him, more that it will be good for his mental state to be part of a better quality team, to have more reason for optimism and see the club building. If I was him I’d be thinking: “do I have to do it all myself, ffs.”

If it’s true that Sancho can play left, right or no.10 then he will make a huge difference to us and to Bruno because of the much improved rotation options we’d have.

 

[charlenefan]

It’s tragic to see. I don’t see it at other clubs either. I just had a look at McGoldbridges tweets during Sweden’s game and it was so pathetic and embarrassing I had to stop reading.

Yep our fans are the absolute worst, at least the old newbie system filtered them out before now we all have to read their garbage

I'm gonna get a 'can't take the strain' error if I add anyone else to my ignore list

 

[Sandikan]

Please send me a private message, I just want us to be pals, pal. Despite him swearing.

Some people really get their knickers uptight when called pal.

It's weird, as pal up north is a really friendly term.

 

[lex talionis]

Bruno, even more than Rashford, needs a proper rest. Let's get this over with and see Portugal crash out of the Euros ASAP.

 

[the_answer]

I think he will play better when he doesn’t feel like the team relies on him so much.

By that I don’t mean the pressure is a problem for him, more that it will be good for his mental state to be part of a better quality team, to have more reason for optimism and see the club building. If I was him I’d be thinking: “do I have to do it all myself, ffs.”

This.

Its also tactical.
Currently its enough manmark Bruno, deny Rashford the space he needs.... and United is toothless.
Also, with whom is Bruno supposed to play nifty passes? McFred?

 

[SAFMUTD]

Amazing how people here can turn on on Bruno, our best player since he joined us. He's not been at his best for a while now but you only need to see how do we perform without him to know how important he is for us.

 

[Roane]

I think he will play better when he doesn’t feel like the team relies on him so much.

By that I don’t mean the pressure is a problem for him, more that it will be good for his mental state to be part of a better quality team, to have more reason for optimism and see the club building. If I was him I’d be thinking: “do I have to do it all myself, ffs.”

If it’s true that Sancho can play left, right or no.10 then he will make a huge difference to us and to Bruno because of the much improved rotation options we’d have.

I think Bruno is excelling because the team relies on him. The free role also helps him.

Portugal give him a more disciplined role and his role at UTD is more what Ronaldo is given for Portugal. I think this hinders him a little and is reflected in his performances. And I take on board it maybe tiredness too.

How would people compare his Portugal v utd performances prior to these championships?

 

[Mainoldo]

I think Bruno is excelling because the team relies on him. The free role also helps him.

Portugal give him a more disciplined role and his role at UTD is more what Ronaldo is given for Portugal. I think this hinders him a little and is reflected in his performances. And I take on board it maybe tiredness too.

How would people compare his Portugal v utd performances prior to these championships?

That works when they play 4-3-3. I don’t think that argument works at all in the 4-2-3-1formation an how they have played in this tournament. He just hasn’t turned up.

 

[#07]

Amazing how people here can turn on on Bruno, our best player since he joined us. He's not been at his best for a while now but you only need to see how do we perform without him to know how important he is for us.

Its the internet. Its so easy to go along with what's trending and be reductivist about everything.

Bruno has been a godsend to Man Utd. Without Bruno we would have struggled for any kind of European football over the past couple of seasons.

 

[Vidyoyo]

Granted he's good but is he actually good?

 

[JJ12]

Amazing how people here can turn on on Bruno, our best player since he joined us. He's not been at his best for a while now but you only need to see how do we perform without him to know how important he is for us.

These united fans call us a ‘parody club’. Ironically they are the people that make us a parody.

 

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

Amazing how people here can turn on on Bruno, our best player since he joined us. He's not been at his best for a while now but you only need to see how do we perform without him to know how important he is for us.

so many jokers on this forum. Some will be WUM for sure, but some take pleasure from slagging off anything and everything.

you know for sure, that’s the way they live their lives. What a pathetic existence they have.