Definitely. There is no way he should have played him midweek - given that that should have been their easiest group game.
But he didn't have the nerve to drop/rest him for their first Champions League game.
Brentan Rodgers
- Thread starter The Neviller
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Definitely. There is no way he should have played him midweek - given that that should have been their easiest group game.
But he didn't have the nerve to drop/rest him for their first Champions League game.
It's not only age though. Steven Gerrard has no idea how to play that holding role. None whatsoever. His defensive positioning is atrocious. He has no ability to read the game from a defensive standpoint. The fact they concede so many goals isn't just because their actual defenders are crap or they lack organisation, it's because Gerrard offers absolutely zilch protection. Even if you played Gerrard once a week, these faults would still mean he is utterly useless at that role.
It does seem that because his legs have gone and he can no longer contribute in an attacking sense like he used to, other than the 10 or 15 penalties a season Liverpool seem to get, Rodgers has used Gerrard in that deeper role just so he doesn't have to confront the problem of dropping him.
He doesn't seem at all suited to it , maybe because Scholes was able to change from a dynamic attacking midfielder to the playmaker role they just assumed Gerrard could do it as well. Playing him for the full 90 minutes 3 times in a week is just very poor management from Rodgers.
He looked absolutely knackered against West Ham.
He doesn't seem at all suited to it , maybe because Scholes was able to change from a dynamic attacking midfielder to the playmaker role they just assumed Gerrard could do it as well. Playing him for the full 90 minutes 3 times in a week is just very poor management from Rodgers.
He looked absolutely knackered against West Ham.
If anyone wants to defend Rodgers' transfer record now and debunk my post from last year that he's bobbins in the transfer market, I'm here all day...
Yes. This very often gets overlooked, I think Gerrard was at his best when he played behind Torres in 2009 and had a midfield behind himself.
I love that word! Thoroughly agree as well, obviously.
Quote / link the post then, we all want a good laugh.
I think people are missing the point with this playing Gerrard 3 times in 8 days criticism...he isn't good enough to be in the team at all. He was a weak link last season. They got around it by getting the ball to their forwards quickly, but in any game where Gerrard's role became important, they suddenly looked like a really poor side.
I would say they'll improve as soon as he drops Gerrard, but the problem is he hasn't brought in anyone who can replace him. He signed Can but can Can? No he can't (sorry).
Lucas, Allen and Henderson isn't going to compete with Chelsea or Man City's midfield. It would struggle against a lot of the midtable sides with the shakey defence it has behind it.
I don't think they're as bad as performances so far suggest, but Rodgers has left them with a squad that's fairly weak in a lot of areas. For all the players he signed in the summer, I can't think of a single one that I wouldn't have been severely disappointed/concerned with, if United had signed them.
I would say they'll improve as soon as he drops Gerrard, but the problem is he hasn't brought in anyone who can replace him. He signed Can but can Can? No he can't (sorry).
Lucas, Allen and Henderson isn't going to compete with Chelsea or Man City's midfield. It would struggle against a lot of the midtable sides with the shakey defence it has behind it.
I don't think they're as bad as performances so far suggest, but Rodgers has left them with a squad that's fairly weak in a lot of areas. For all the players he signed in the summer, I can't think of a single one that I wouldn't have been severely disappointed/concerned with, if United had signed them.
He definitely needs to sign a good DM who can protect that very vulnerable back four. Until that happens I don't see them winning anything.
He has spent a lot, hasn't he!
Not quite so sure on the SAF 1990 comparison now. Lolz
I actually think some of his signings are decent. Markovic, for one, looks very talented. Gerrard is the problem. He has to be phased out. I don't know what kind of player Can is, but if he can complement Henderson in midfield, it is a good team again.
Don't think Brendan has the balls to drop Slippy G.
If reports DS being forced upon him and trying to offload JH are true then..
What he should do is go back to Southampton and ask if he can exchange Lallana, Lambert and Lovren for the player he should of bought, Schneiderlin.
To be fair that is a huge decision to make. A lot of managers would struggle to make that decision.
I think Brendan needs to give him a rest. I agree it's a huge decision.
I really don't know why it should be. People said the same about Carragher. Once he was dropped for someone better, it was no issue at all.
It might be a problem if he gets dropped for someone who doesnt actually improve us.
Perhaps as more of the fans start to realise that it would be for the best it would be easier. I assume Gerrard has a big influence around the club though, if it isn't handled well then having a rift between your influential/adored captain and your manager isn't great.
Yeah posted that in the Liverpool thread last night. Very critical and I struggle to disagree, said last season that Rodgers' (mis)use of Agger was criminal.
Damn. I was hoping he left because of Mighty Red.
At this point would you take him over LvG?
feck no.
No. Would you?
No not really, but there seems little point in running him down as manager when the one we have is not doing any better.
No, I don't think we should but he's had one great season at Liverpool with them overachieving, and where he no doubt had influence on that. LvG has had a few months and we need a bit of patience. We've seen it before, he has the pedigree and I fully expect us to improve.
He's spent the best part of 40m on Sakho and Lovren. Are there any Liverpool fans who still rate Sakho?
I don't really like Rodgers but don't see why he's done wrong with Agger there. Like the article says it's a personality clash if nothing else. If the manager is sticking round, which Rodgers deserved to do, then the player is more than likely going to be the one who leaves if it isn't resolved. It's not like other managers aren't guilty of doing this. Fergie and Mourinho for example had a lot of fall outs with players.
What he's done wrong isn't falling out with Agger. It's dropping our best centre back because of a personal issue between the two, even at a time when we were defending terribly without him.
I don't know what happened between the two of them last season but falling out with a player weeks/months after giving him the vice captaincy is strange.
It's not a huge issue in itself, it's just yet another example of how Rodgers needs to improve defensively. Other than that he's doing a great job.
To be fair, prior to LVG's scouting by Tottenham, I don't think anyone on the Caf mentioned him as a probable candidate for the job, before, during or post Moyes. There has been a lot of whitewashing going on regarding LvG's background and record.
I agree it's not ideal but that's the problem with being a manager. Like you say no one knows what happens, if it's something Rodgers feels is disrespectful to him for example then it would be hard to let someone back in to the team. That's where it looks like part of the problem with Moyes was, judging by the Rio stuff it seems he was a bit of a pushover.
It's a difficult problem when it's a top player or one who does benefit your team because it's kind of a lose/lose situation to an extent.
I can't comment on how much he improved your team, you will definitely know more than me on that matter so I imagine it's hugely frustrating especially seeing as you're still pretty awful defensively.
He's saying the 'weight of the jersey' is the issue
Brendan Rodgers blames poor Liverpool form on ‘weight of the jersey’
• Liverpool manager: ‘People don’t understand the pressure’
• Jordan Rossiter and Sheyi Ojo could play in Capital One Cup
• Rodgers: Europe is disrupting Liverpool’s routine
• Daniel Agger: differences with Rodgers led to departure
Brendan Rodgers has identified formation changes and the “weight of the jersey” on Liverpool’s summer signings as the causes of the team’s early troubles, conceding he must find a settled system to rectify the problem. Liverpool host Middlesbrough in the Capital One Cup on Tuesday with the manager considering debuts for the 17-year-olds Jordan Rossiter and Sheyi Ojo while he rests Steven Gerrard from a midfield hit by injury. Jordan Henderson and Philippe Coutinho could join Joe Allen and Emre Can on the sidelines with respective hip and groin problems with the Merseyside derby against Everton awaiting on Saturday.
Rodgers is also prepared to give his preferred midfield diamond a rest against the Championship side having admitted his available players were unsuitable for the system that started at West Ham United on Saturday, when Liverpool suffered their third league defeat in five Premier League matches.
“Our passing disappointed me,” the Liverpool manager said. “We played more long passes than West Ham and that is something you have not seen from us in over the two years. We need to get back to doing what we do best. I look at the movement patterns in our team, our pressing in those patterns of pressure and, given the injuries, I need to retain a system for a longer period.
“The 4-4-2 diamond worked really well but it worked well with certain players and not at the weekend. Until I get all the players back that I know are multifunctional players, I’ll look at the strength of the players we do have fit. Hopefully that gives them confidence. Confidence has not been affected so far but if you don’t win games for too long it can be.”
Brendan Rodgers says playing for Liverpool brings unexpected pressure for players but expects his players to adapt. Photograph: Colorsport/Corbis
Liverpool signed nine players in the summer and Rodgers believes the eight involved in his first-team squad (Divock Origi was loaned back to Lille) need time to adapt: “We’ve conceded eight goals and the majority of those could have been avoided but what people probably don’t get is the pressure of playing for such a big club. The weight of the jersey here is heavy for most players. Once you adapt to playing for Liverpool you become clearer in your thinking.”
Gerrard is likely to be rested after playing three games past week and struggling in the third against West Ham, although the fitness doubt over Henderson has further stretched Rodgers’ midfield options. Rossiter and Ojo trained with the squad on Monday and Rodgers said: “A number of the young boys are training with us and working with us. These kids need a chance and if that comes tomorrow night we hope they can take it.”
• Liverpool manager: ‘People don’t understand the pressure’
• Jordan Rossiter and Sheyi Ojo could play in Capital One Cup
• Rodgers: Europe is disrupting Liverpool’s routine
• Daniel Agger: differences with Rodgers led to departure
- Andy Hunter
- The Guardian, Monday 22 September 2014 22.29 BST
Brendan Rodgers has identified formation changes and the “weight of the jersey” on Liverpool’s summer signings as the causes of the team’s early troubles, conceding he must find a settled system to rectify the problem. Liverpool host Middlesbrough in the Capital One Cup on Tuesday with the manager considering debuts for the 17-year-olds Jordan Rossiter and Sheyi Ojo while he rests Steven Gerrard from a midfield hit by injury. Jordan Henderson and Philippe Coutinho could join Joe Allen and Emre Can on the sidelines with respective hip and groin problems with the Merseyside derby against Everton awaiting on Saturday.
Rodgers is also prepared to give his preferred midfield diamond a rest against the Championship side having admitted his available players were unsuitable for the system that started at West Ham United on Saturday, when Liverpool suffered their third league defeat in five Premier League matches.
“Our passing disappointed me,” the Liverpool manager said. “We played more long passes than West Ham and that is something you have not seen from us in over the two years. We need to get back to doing what we do best. I look at the movement patterns in our team, our pressing in those patterns of pressure and, given the injuries, I need to retain a system for a longer period.
“The 4-4-2 diamond worked really well but it worked well with certain players and not at the weekend. Until I get all the players back that I know are multifunctional players, I’ll look at the strength of the players we do have fit. Hopefully that gives them confidence. Confidence has not been affected so far but if you don’t win games for too long it can be.”
Brendan Rodgers says playing for Liverpool brings unexpected pressure for players but expects his players to adapt. Photograph: Colorsport/Corbis
Liverpool signed nine players in the summer and Rodgers believes the eight involved in his first-team squad (Divock Origi was loaned back to Lille) need time to adapt: “We’ve conceded eight goals and the majority of those could have been avoided but what people probably don’t get is the pressure of playing for such a big club. The weight of the jersey here is heavy for most players. Once you adapt to playing for Liverpool you become clearer in your thinking.”
Gerrard is likely to be rested after playing three games past week and struggling in the third against West Ham, although the fitness doubt over Henderson has further stretched Rodgers’ midfield options. Rossiter and Ojo trained with the squad on Monday and Rodgers said: “A number of the young boys are training with us and working with us. These kids need a chance and if that comes tomorrow night we hope they can take it.”
Good one, Rodge.
But with Rodgers, you are still talking about potential rather than proven achievements over a period of time. There's no guarantee with LVG either (his CV has it's share of failures) but he has got it right on several occasions and, even where he didn't bring success, he often left a strong legacy for his successor. The worst of both worlds of course is to appoint someone who is already midway through their career and has not won anything nor demonstrated any real capacity for moving up to the elite level which, after last year's farce, is maybe why we are still relatively relaxed about LVG (if he had succeeded Fergie we would probably be more critical).
van Gaal has been in the job for a few months (coming in straight after the WC) with a bunch of new players seemingly meant for the starting XI and trying to get us to play a new system.Why are you so hellbent on all this doom and gloom? (re your thread earlier about players leaving since we'll most likely end outside the top 4.)
His big issue is Gerrard. He needed to demonstrate he was a big boy manager and drop him, he's made a rod for his own back here.
For me it will be very interesting to compare LVG's approach to big name flops v Brenton.
For me it will be very interesting to compare LVG's approach to big name flops v Brenton.
Tell you what, thank Christ they've been equally shite as us this season... Players like di Maria and Falcao should see us finish above them. I hope.
In Rodgers first 5 league games with Liverpool they had 2 points (even less than us this season). People thought he'd be out of a job in a couple of months. It takes time to get to grips with a new club, we need to have patience.
He's saying the 'weight of the jersey' is the issue
Brendan Rodgers blames poor Liverpool form on ‘weight of the jersey’
• Liverpool manager: ‘People don’t understand the pressure’
• Jordan Rossiter and Sheyi Ojo could play in Capital One Cup
• Rodgers: Europe is disrupting Liverpool’s routine
• Daniel Agger: differences with Rodgers led to departure
Liverpool can be much better, says Brendan Rodgers
- Andy Hunter
- The Guardian, Monday 22 September 2014 22.29 BST
Brendan Rodgers has identified formation changes and the “weight of the jersey” on Liverpool’s summer signings as the causes of the team’s early troubles, conceding he must find a settled system to rectify the problem. Liverpool host Middlesbrough in the Capital One Cup on Tuesday with the manager considering debuts for the 17-year-olds Jordan Rossiter and Sheyi Ojo while he rests Steven Gerrard from a midfield hit by injury. Jordan Henderson and Philippe Coutinho could join Joe Allen and Emre Can on the sidelines with respective hip and groin problems with the Merseyside derby against Everton awaiting on Saturday.
Rodgers is also prepared to give his preferred midfield diamond a rest against the Championship side having admitted his available players were unsuitable for the system that started at West Ham United on Saturday, when Liverpool suffered their third league defeat in five Premier League matches.
“Our passing disappointed me,” the Liverpool manager said. “We played more long passes than West Ham and that is something you have not seen from us in over the two years. We need to get back to doing what we do best. I look at the movement patterns in our team, our pressing in those patterns of pressure and, given the injuries, I need to retain a system for a longer period.
“The 4-4-2 diamond worked really well but it worked well with certain players and not at the weekend. Until I get all the players back that I know are multifunctional players, I’ll look at the strength of the players we do have fit. Hopefully that gives them confidence. Confidence has not been affected so far but if you don’t win games for too long it can be.”
Brendan Rodgers says playing for Liverpool brings unexpected pressure for players but expects his players to adapt. Photograph: Colorsport/Corbis
Liverpool signed nine players in the summer and Rodgers believes the eight involved in his first-team squad (Divock Origi was loaned back to Lille) need time to adapt: “We’ve conceded eight goals and the majority of those could have been avoided but what people probably don’t get is the pressure of playing for such a big club. The weight of the jersey here is heavy for most players. Once you adapt to playing for Liverpool you become clearer in your thinking.”
Gerrard is likely to be rested after playing three games past week and struggling in the third against West Ham, although the fitness doubt over Henderson has further stretched Rodgers’ midfield options. Rossiter and Ojo trained with the squad on Monday and Rodgers said: “A number of the young boys are training with us and working with us. These kids need a chance and if that comes tomorrow night we hope they can take it.”
They should get Warrior to work on that...
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