I think you're being presumptuous there. And without debating the relative merits of Taylor and Ducker I was simply pointing out that , contrary to your statement, there have been journos with good ins at United (and elsewhere) running Mourinho to United for some time.
BBC: United hold talks with Mourinho
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I think you're being presumptuous there. And without debating the relative merits of Taylor and Ducker I was simply pointing out that , contrary to your statement, there have been journos with good ins at United (and elsewhere) running Mourinho to United for some time.
If it happens on Saturday or Sunday, LvG will proudly announce that he has won a title in England and now will hand over the reins to his good friend Jose while he enjoys a happy retirement in Portugal
If Mourinho comes in, then surely we play 4231 for a start?
Giroud starts at Arsenal
Benzema starts at Real
Costa starts at Chelsea
Ibra starts at PSG
Lewandowksi starts at Bayern
Aguero starts at City
Even Suarez to an extent when plays, is a striker, moving Messi out wide
All them primarily play down the middle, with pace around them
I think there could be a chance as Madrid usually like to overpay for an attacker every summer. With both Ronaldo and Bale untouchable, there is a chance they can try for either Lewandoski or Aubameyang; which could give us a shot at Benzema.
Reus, could be tough if they are already losing Hummels, Gundogan and Mikhitariyan this summer. Would like us to try by offering them 60m pounds.
I didn't know Dybala is hell bent on staying in Italy.
Basically, I would like us to try other younger and better options before we commit to Zlatan. Because we already have Martial, either a top left winger or striker would work.
Mourinho will not play a 4-3-3 going by his previous stint
I don't think it will make much difference whether we win or lose but LVG might get a couple more days grace if we win. Just a relatively respectful gesture and he can leave on a high. Lose and they might as well announce it the following day. Whatever happens he's going.
"Jose says he'd rather kill a Sky reporter than go to United. "
Giroud is a donkey. Benzema, Lewandowski, Aguero and Suarez offer plenty of pace & movement, and are not necessarily target men.
I actually am unsure which formation will Jose adopt. His first Chelsea team played 433 and this one plays 4231. I believe our current squad is more suited to play 433.
I think re benzema teams will stay clear of him now that he may get punished for that valbuena case. We don't want to spend £40m on him before he gets convicted.
Yeah.
I think if we win the Cup he might get a week say to enjoy the success and then we'll get rid.
If we lose it he'll be gone in 48 hours. Avram Grant after Moscow style.
I'd like that too but I can't see us signing someone of the required quality.
I think my first reply to you i said the story has been as is since Jan-Feb - not doubting its been around.
I'm not a fan of Giroud either, but I was more saying that a lot of clubs still play with a central striker. Being central doesn't mean you are a target man.
I was more saying, put Aguero, Lewandowski, Suarez etc out wider in a front 3 and you'd get half the player. Players like Griezmann and Martial etc are different.
You can also play 4231 but have wingers that like to cut inside, it just requires your 2 CMs to be a lot more aware and ready to protect
That's going to be a horrendous week on here.
That's going to be a horrendous week on here.
Oh definitely.
I'd sack him the day after the Cup final whatever the result, but I don't think that'll happen.
My take for what it's worth:
The board spoke to Mourinho months ago when our results suggested that we would not qualify for the CL.
There was some arrangement made in principle or even a pre-contractual agreement signed with caveats for 'other eventualities'.
Both the board and Mourinho could have killed the rumours off with a solitary statement to the press at any time since. They haven't.
As with Moyes, and for financial reasons regarding LVG's contract, the board were bound to wait for the mathematical impossibility of CL qualification before they could even contemplate letting him go.
This went to the last Sunday of the season.
We have not qualified for the CL and so LVG has not fulfilled the minimum requirement of his contract and so his contract can therefore be terminated.
Woodward may have some loyalty to LVG but his prime concern is the financial health of the club and 'no CL' is too big a hit.
Also 46 goals scored will be deemed unacceptable in terms of value for money to paying customers. Even relegated Sunderland scored more.
There will be a stay of execution out of good-will because the thinking will be that the guy got us to the FA Cup final and it would be cnutish to sack him before.
After Saturday LVG will be allowed to bow out by his own volition to save face. Whether there's a DOF position for him remains to be seen.
The clinchers for me:
Nobody has categorically denied it.
Mourinho has said he wants a new club in July
Practically all other European league seasons are at an end.
If Mourinho was going elsewhere this would have been either announced or it would be all over the press.
Prediction: Jose Mourinho will be announced as manager of Manchester United next week regardless of the FA Cup outcome.
The board spoke to Mourinho months ago when our results suggested that we would not qualify for the CL.
There was some arrangement made in principle or even a pre-contractual agreement signed with caveats for 'other eventualities'.
Both the board and Mourinho could have killed the rumours off with a solitary statement to the press at any time since. They haven't.
As with Moyes, and for financial reasons regarding LVG's contract, the board were bound to wait for the mathematical impossibility of CL qualification before they could even contemplate letting him go.
This went to the last Sunday of the season.
We have not qualified for the CL and so LVG has not fulfilled the minimum requirement of his contract and so his contract can therefore be terminated.
Woodward may have some loyalty to LVG but his prime concern is the financial health of the club and 'no CL' is too big a hit.
Also 46 goals scored will be deemed unacceptable in terms of value for money to paying customers. Even relegated Sunderland scored more.
There will be a stay of execution out of good-will because the thinking will be that the guy got us to the FA Cup final and it would be cnutish to sack him before.
After Saturday LVG will be allowed to bow out by his own volition to save face. Whether there's a DOF position for him remains to be seen.
The clinchers for me:
Nobody has categorically denied it.
Mourinho has said he wants a new club in July
Practically all other European league seasons are at an end.
If Mourinho was going elsewhere this would have been either announced or it would be all over the press.
Prediction: Jose Mourinho will be announced as manager of Manchester United next week regardless of the FA Cup outcome.
The problem with modern football is that loads of pseudo-tacticians talk of meta-shifts in terms of how a striker is supposed to play, and use buzzwords like playing across the front three and whatnot, even though the basic plan hasn't seen a transitional shift (unless one is talking about pure target strikers). There is no expectation to play across the front three. Most top teams still have strikers who engage the central defenders, and the positional interchange isn't as everpresent as it's portrayed to be.
This is a standard Lewandowski heat-map at Bayern, and he plays essentially the typical #9 role. He drifts at times, and comes deeper - centrally; but doesn't have positional interchanges with Costa or Coman or Robben:
This is Agüero's heat map at City. Again, drifts a bit, but his standard action zone is in central forward areas:
This is a typical Suárez heat map. Again, central action, leading the lines, extending the defense, and creating pockets for Messi and Neymar.
Karim Benzema at Madrid - acting the foil to Ronaldo:
Van Persie at United:
All of them are predominantly active in central and deeper central zones, as has been the case for strikers and forwards for donkey years. There's no monumental shift in the way they play. Or Diego Costa at Chelsea, Mandžukić/ Morata at Juventus, etc.
And this is a sample Zlatan heat map:
Reading your over-emphasis on fluid front threes, one would imagine Ibrahimović's heat map to resemble Duncan Ferguson's - but he is much more than a striker. He recedes into deeper areas to link the play like a false 9, creates room for Cavani, leads the line, and much more. You'd have little to no trouble building a smooth attack with Ibrahimović.
And just to sample how he plays these days, here are bits of his match vs Real Madrid to highlight his movement:
And this is how he operated over the month of March last season:
Notice the deeper patterns where he links up with the midfielders, and creates room for Cavani.
I honestly don't understand what you mean by traditional strikers. If by traditional you mean strict targets, then the good news is Zlatan is not a target type.
Now we've sidetracked from semi-objective to subjective debate, and I honestly have no appetite for it in FF. You don't know Zlatan on a personal level, and how he acts with his team-mates, and neither do I. So these are uncertain terms.
Luckily United have money to spend? Rather 300k on a worthy risk, than that money in the bank - and no solution to our striker conundrum in sight.
The key thing is - Zlatan's reputation is current. And he's scored close to 50 goals this season at club level, and almost 1 per game for Sweden. No matter what way you spin in, the tag of him being a pure reputation based player can't be justified. Say what you will about Ligue 1, but a handful of the best player in the Premier League were plying their trade there just last season. And Zlatan's better than them, a physical beast (would dwarf a good deal of Premier League defenders), productive, immensely proud - which could rub off on our oft-shellshocked players, and experienced.
Zlatan's heat map is insane.
He'll be Cantona mkII
Box office on and off the field.
Box office on and off the field.
Yeah looks like Ebola cultivations
Good post @Invictus
The rules haven't actually changed that much. Lewandowski, Costa, Giroud, Aguero and Benzema largely occupy central areas with a bit of drifting, off-base, either down the channels or into pockets in between midfield and defence. Were Henry, Drogba and Et'o really any different to the names mentioned above? I don't see any sea of change. Messi as a false 9 was slightly unique in that he wasn't actually a centre forward but rather a mix between a 9 and a 10, and took plenty of touches in all attacking areas. Otherwise the role of the striker is largely the same.
So, really, I think you're mistaking "role" for "pace". You've sort of assumed that someone with a lot of running power is going to be constantly working the channels and pulling defences apart, while those with slightly less pace are just sat in a fixed position, with little movement. Which is simply wrong.
And in addition, you've wrongly assumed the role Zlatan actually plays. He's much more of a playmaker than your usual striker. He's more Henry than Giroud in that sense, and is a great example that disproves the theory of "quick means non-static/not so quick means static". He's far more likely to drop deep, be involved in the buildup, and create than Aguero, for example.
The rules haven't actually changed that much. Lewandowski, Costa, Giroud, Aguero and Benzema largely occupy central areas with a bit of drifting, off-base, either down the channels or into pockets in between midfield and defence. Were Henry, Drogba and Et'o really any different to the names mentioned above? I don't see any sea of change. Messi as a false 9 was slightly unique in that he wasn't actually a centre forward but rather a mix between a 9 and a 10, and took plenty of touches in all attacking areas. Otherwise the role of the striker is largely the same.
So, really, I think you're mistaking "role" for "pace". You've sort of assumed that someone with a lot of running power is going to be constantly working the channels and pulling defences apart, while those with slightly less pace are just sat in a fixed position, with little movement. Which is simply wrong.
And in addition, you've wrongly assumed the role Zlatan actually plays. He's much more of a playmaker than your usual striker. He's more Henry than Giroud in that sense, and is a great example that disproves the theory of "quick means non-static/not so quick means static". He's far more likely to drop deep, be involved in the buildup, and create than Aguero, for example.
And what are the chances of that when his players play a handful of competitive games a year?
His "Legacy" would be better served coming back to a massively competitive league and taking on Pep Guardiola and other other top managers in it and taking a big club back to the top - being the first man since Fergiue to have any success.
I suspect if he wanted the PSG job he'd already have it.
Mendes brigade is out in full force today-
- Zlatan will only come for mourinho
- David de gea will leave if LVG stays
- PSG make contact with mourinho
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I'd give it 1 month before OT goes nuts at him. Banners, Green and Gold scarves, the lot.
I honest to God wish that we didn't have the cup final.. so we could just get this over with already. The waiting is a killer.
Surely these last few posts need to be in the Zlatan thread?
Anyway, I think we will at least let Van Gaal enjoy the open-top bus through Manchester with the FA Cup before letting him go and announcing Mourinho.
Anyway, I think we will at least let Van Gaal enjoy the open-top bus through Manchester with the FA Cup before letting him go and announcing Mourinho.
I think we will win the F.A Cup and LVg will leave on a high. There is absolutly no reason to keep him right now.
Mourinho is also the only reasonable alternative out there, so i guess he will replace LVG.
If its also true that Ibra only comes, and DDG only stays, if Mourinho comes then its done for me.
Mourinho is also the only reasonable alternative out there, so i guess he will replace LVG.
If its also true that Ibra only comes, and DDG only stays, if Mourinho comes then its done for me.
We shouldn't even have a parade for the FA Cup, can't exactly see the streets being full of people to watch Van Gaal wobbling about on the top of a bus.
Why are people stuck in the notion that a 'slow' attack is all to do with how quick people run!?! Yeah, you need quick attackers in your team to stretch defences but much more relevant to the speed of a team's attack is how quickly they move the ball around.
Ibra playing alongside the likes of Martial, Rashford and even Lingard, Mata, Herrera, Shaw, CBJ, Valencia, etc (if no other players come in) will only be as slow or fast as the way they are set up and coached to play.
Surely this season is testament to the fact that having quick young players doesn't necessarily mean expansive, free-flowing football?
Ibra playing alongside the likes of Martial, Rashford and even Lingard, Mata, Herrera, Shaw, CBJ, Valencia, etc (if no other players come in) will only be as slow or fast as the way they are set up and coached to play.
Surely this season is testament to the fact that having quick young players doesn't necessarily mean expansive, free-flowing football?
I actually think that to not have a full scale parade after winning the cup would be a brilliant statement of intent from us ie the message being that our season was not good enough and that we're saving any parades for winning the EPL or the CL.
We won't have a bus parade for the FA Cup. Win or lose that final I expect Van Gaal out this time next week.
I bet you he won't be out in a weeks time.
I agree to an extent but I'd argue that PSG didn't do too badly in Europe with him up front. Problem is, we're nowhere near one of the best teams in the World, so we're into territory of sticking bandages on areas that need attention whilst we gradually turn things around.
Whichever way you cut it, Ibra would be a serious improvement to our attack. He'd also allow the young players to continue to develop alongside him as he won't be playing 50 games a season.
Mendes has nothing to do with Zlatan.
Mega analysis of Zlatan in a Mourinho thread. Well played guys.
Absolutely. But zlatan hates LVG, zlatan would go to war with mou on his side. Simple report in a newspaper to put pressure on ed. Zlatan will ask who is the next coach? Do you think he will come if united keep LVG? Simple tactics to negotiate/initiate talks.
Come on man. It's clear as day that it is happening. Stop whining like Aaron Paul from breaking bad.
Just like it was suppose to happen with Toni kroos, Thiago, Wesley sniejder, karim benzema,bale, Vidal?
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