Ballon d'Or 2023 | Messi wins for 8th time

Gehrman said:
What i dont understand is that if Ronaldo is best and greatest ever. Ahead of Messi, Pelé and Maradona why was he never expected to pull off a Maradona at the wc? Platini had an infinitely better euros than Ronaldo ever had. Eusebio had a better wc. Heck so has Forlan, Modric and tons of players. He's never been the best performer at any international tournament despite playing so many. There was always absolutely massive pressure on Messi to do a Maradona. It never applied to Ronaldo despite some believing He's the greatest ever footballer.
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Maybe because deep down they know he is inferior to the big 3?
Maybe they think that Portugal is the eternal underdogs no matter how good their team. Then again that applies even more so to croatia/modric, uruguay/forlan, so at the end of the day, its just excuses. A certain eusebio played for their eternal underdogs Portugal too
 
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Haaland is not the best footballer in the world. He plays in a well oiled machine and scores the chances presented to him.

Messi led a nation to the World Cup and was the sole driving force of their attack. He produced moment of magic which Haaland will never be capable of. Very deserved winner for me.
 
Messi won the Golden Ball and the World Cup at 35. He was a massive favourite with the bookies. Everyone knew who deserved to, and who was going to win. It was a very obvious win. Those who disagree so vehemently, are consumed by bitterness and don’t live in reality, much like their idol.
 
Gehrman said:
I dunno tbf smashing all records in his first pl season. Won the treble. Ghosted the finals but its a team sport. I can see why some feel he deserved it.
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That’s exactly my point. It’s all about these kind of stats. Messi and many other players play a different sport compared to him. He’s great at goalscoring and there’s the golden shoe for that. He’s been important but never decisive in the clubs season. Without him they could’ve won it all anyways. That’s not what happens with Messi, Cristiano, Rodri or KDB.

So to say that he deserved it to me it’s hard to agree. I could argue that Julian Alvarez deserved it more.
 
We need an rvn said:
Because whilst it’s predominantly a United forum, it’s also here to discuss other football matters and other general topics.

Using your argument, we shouldn’t be discussing the Ukraine or Hamas either as it doesn’t affect United.
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Well yes, obviously. And I wasn’t saying anything about other topics or other football matters. I was also not referring to other fans discussing this.
I was referring to those Ronaldo fanboys who call themselves United fans and who seem to be disgusted that a non-City player won it.
 
Nicoteiro said:
That’s exactly my point. It’s all about these kind of stats. Messi and many other players play a different sport compared to him. He’s great at goalscoring and there’s the golden shoe for that. He’s been important but never decisive in the clubs season. Without him they could’ve won it all anyways. That’s not what happens with Messi, Cristiano, Rodri or KDB.

So to say that he deserved it to me it’s hard to agree. I could argue that Julian Alvarez deserved it more.
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Nobody would disagree that Messi isnt a different breed of footballer, but Haaland is a striker. Scoring goals is his job. Those records had stood for decades before Haaland. Anyway im not saying Haaland should have won it, but personally i think the top 3 were objectively very close in what their chances should have been.
 
Why on earth do we have so many United fans heavily invested in Haaland getting the Ballon d'Or?

What a bunch of weirdos.
 
antohan said:
Why on earth do we have so many United fans heavily invested in Haaland getting the Ballon d'Or?

What a bunch of weirdos.
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Its because they are Ronaldo fans and cant stand Messi being so far ahead now that their real careers are over.
 
He deserved it, and besides that do we really want city to get a Ballon d'or as well?
 
Jagga7 said:
Haaland is not the best footballer in the world. He plays in a well oiled machine and scores the chances presented to him.

Messi led a nation to the World Cup and was the sole driving force of their attack. He produced moment of magic which Haaland will never be capable of. Very deserved winner for me.
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Do you think Messi could ever lead Norway to a World Cup?
 
mu4c_20le said:
Do you think Messi could ever lead Norway to a World Cup?
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Do you think Haaland could ever lead this Argentina to a WC with his "non-existent" creativity, playmaking skills?

Do you think Kane, Mbappe, Messi, Benzema, Vinicius etc. etc. win PL, CL, FA Cup with that City?
 
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Rojow said:
Go and look what Messi did in the season 2018/2019 with a mediocre Barcelona Team. He can carry a whole Team for sure.
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Ya but Norway is not comparable to a mediocre Barcelona team. That said based on messi’s all round ability, he should at least get them qualified for the world cup
 
adexkola said:
He wouldn't have to. Modric got one for getting to the semifinals in 2018. If Haaland/Messi gets out the group stage with Norway he's a lock.
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Modric got to the final in 2018 and it looked close for a while. Anyway Modric didn't get to the final. Croatia did.
 
antohan said:
Why on earth do we have so many United fans heavily invested in Haaland getting the Ballon d'Or?

What a bunch of weirdos.
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Some United fans decided Ronaldo was better than Messi back in 2009 and nothing that has happened since has changed that, even if it means pushing for rival players to win awards over him.
 
KeanoMagicHat said:
Some United fans decided Ronaldo was better than Messi back in 2009 and nothing that has happened since has changed that, even if it means pushing for rival players to win awards over him.
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Its because he's the inspiration for their quest for a six pack and being a petulant narcissistic alpha dog with an inferiority complex towards a midget who's better at football.
 
Gehrman said:
I dont know much about the Norway squad but i doubt it.
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If the roles were reversed, and lets say Messi stayed at Barca and he has another insane treble season like in his prime, while Haaland led his nation to the WC, who do you think would have won it?
 
mu4c_20le said:
If the roles were reversed, and lets say Messi stayed at Barca and he has another insane treble season like in his prime, while Haaland led his nation to the WC, who do you think would have won it?
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If Messi played like Messi does which is scoring like pele, dribbling like Maradona and passing like Cryuff. It would be Messi 100%. If he was just a 1 dimensional goalscorer no chance. You said like in his prime so no gotcha.
 
Gehrman said:
If Messi played like Messi does which is scoring like pele, dribbling like Maradona and passing like Cryuff. It would be Messi 100%. If he was just a 1 dimensional goalscorer no chance. You said like in his prime so no gotcha.
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No gotcha, was genuinely curious. Actually the real question i had in the back of my mind was what more could haaland have done, but I think I have the answer, play more beautiful and less robotic.
 
mu4c_20le said:
No gotcha, was genuinely curious. Actually the real question i had in the back of my mind was what more could haaland have done, but I think I have the answer, play more beautiful and less robotic.
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"Ok Haaland, for this year, think less goals, and more dribbles. That will improve your chances at getting the Ballon D'Or"
 
mu4c_20le said:
No gotcha, was genuinely curious. Actually the real question i had in the back of my mind was what more could haaland have done, but I think I have the answer, play more beautiful and less robotic.
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No one was a better player since Maradona anyway than prime Messi. Neither Iniesta or Xavi won it despite being world cup heroes in a year where Barcelona didnt win the cl. Neither Snejder despite his heroics in the treble and being a key player to take the Netherlands to the final.
 
adexkola said:
"Ok Haaland, for this year, think less goals, and more dribbles. That will improve your chances at getting the Ballon D'Or"
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If Haaland had won the treble whilst playing like prime Messi he would have won it easily.
 
Gehrman said:
If Haaland had won the treble whilst playing like prime Messi he would have won it easily.
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This year?

While Messi finally won the World Cup, playing like Messi, for Argentina, capping an illustrious career with the biggest award in the sport?

No, Haaland would just have to repeat the feat next year with no WC to distract.

And if this year was a non-WC year, Haaland would win the Ballon D'Or. Tap ins or pirouettes.
 
adexkola said:
"Ok Haaland, for this year, think less goals, and more dribbles. That will improve your chances at getting the Ballon D'Or"
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Basically improve significantly as a footballer which he isn’t technically capable of anyway.

The difference between him and the two greats who won the honour despite others sometimes having won more trophies was the fact that they were absurd goalscorers and absurd / great footballers unlike Haaland who is poor outside of numbers.
 
adexkola said:
This year?

While Messi finally won the World Cup, playing like Messi, for Argentina, capping an illustrious career with the biggest award in the sport?

No, Haaland would just have to repeat the feat next year with no WC to distract.

And if this year was a non-WC year, Haaland would win the Ballon D'Or. Tap ins or pirouettes.
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Yes, its only hard to imagine because its impossible to imagine Haaland play like prime Messi.
 
Swoobs said:
My opinion is that your opinion is illogical (not the part where he is not the best on the world, but that he is not even in contention and any city player is better). Maybe you should accept that other have that opinion of your opinion today and move on
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:lol:
 
It's pretty normal for the World Cup to determine the Balon d'Or. It just feels a bit different this year because it was in the winter. There isn't much more to it.

Haaland needed more heroics in the semifinals and final to have a chance. He didn't have them so he didn't have one.
 
mu4c_20le said:
No gotcha, was genuinely curious. Actually the real question i had in the back of my mind was what more could haaland have done, but I think I have the answer, play more beautiful and less robotic.
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The answer really is "wait for the undisputed BPITW to retire". I'm not a Messi fan, it's just blindingly obvious.

Everyone will have a fairer crack at it in 2024 with him only having a Copa América to play in.

Oh, Euros... 2025 then Erling.
 
mu4c_20le said:
No gotcha, was genuinely curious. Actually the real question i had in the back of my mind was what more could haaland have done, but I think I have the answer, play more beautiful and less robotic.
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Or he could have turned up in the CL semi’s, in the showpiece final itself, and had a significant influence on the FA Cup final or the European super cup final or whatever. If he scores his goals in those games he’s got a much better chance. Although he probably still isn’t going to dethrone a 35 year old Messi producing an iconic WC display for the ages.

I suspect people know this anyway. As someone said above, the support for Haaland and the likes of VVD is all just rooted in the boring Messi/Ronaldo thing and people not wanting to see their man fall further behind. The tribalism on show with Ronaldo’s cult is unlike anything I’ve ever seen before really.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
Basically improve significantly as a footballer which he isn’t technically capable of anyway.

The difference between him and the two greats who won the honour despite others sometimes having won more trophies was the fact that they were absurd goalscorers and absurd / great footballers unlike Haaland who is poor outside of numbers.
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He's not capable of it, but he doesn't need to. If he continues like this and wins trophies, the only ones who will be quibbling about his "lack of all round game" will be the draft forum savants.

The vast majority of players don't come close to those 2, whether they are poachers or all round players.

I'm pushing back against this idea that a striker who scores a lot is unworthy of consideration for the award in general because "all he does is score", as if that's not the objective of the sport.
 
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