My last post on this matter but this sums it up for me. I've no doubt that Smith is a very decent bloke, it's sad to see him given an excessive ban.
Australia Tour of South Africa 2018/Ball tampering
- Thread starter freeurmind
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My last post on this matter but this sums it up for me. I've no doubt that Smith is a very decent bloke, it's sad to see him given an excessive ban.
Yeah pressure will be there on other boards for similar incident no doubt, will remain to be seen if they take similar action. Players will be more careful now as well.
Well, no. To be fair to them, they stated that Smith and Warner would have played had CA not banned them.
@KM good read about Lehmann etc.
https://www.cricket.com.au/news/pla...r-australia-cricket-ball-tampering/2018-03-28
As many have suspected, seems Warner is the true villain in all this and Smith is taking a lot of the heat. Warner has priors, how the feck can him and Smith cop the same ban?
As many have suspected, seems Warner is the true villain in all this and Smith is taking a lot of the heat. Warner has priors, how the feck can him and Smith cop the same ban?
Year long bans may seem excessive but i don't have sympathy for those involved. Cheat, and you pay a huge price. Be part of a leadership group found to have cheated, you pay and pay big. We hear hard but fair is the Australian mantra. Well, they've played in an unfair manner bringing shame to Australian sport, Australian cricket and Australia in general. If a harsh sanction is required to make sure an Australian cricket never tea cheats, never cheats in a premeditated manner, then that's what must come.
Darren Lehmann needed to go and hopefully will go after this series. Australia's behavioural standards have slipped terribly on his watch. I don't want Australia to turn into New Zealand. I don't want a bunch of nice guys on the cricket field. I want a team that plays to win first and foremost. This lot though do it a manner that has left them disliked even by people in their own country. ''Boof'' as he's known by many has done nothing about it. Dave Warner's behaviour is encouraged by Lehmann. That alone means he should lose his job. The cultural (behavioural) changes needed will not come while Darren Lehmann and Brad Haddin are involved in Australia's coaching set up.
It won't happen, but in an ideal world, Jason Gillespie, Simon Katich and maybe George Bailey would be part of Australia's set up. With those three at the helm, Australia will hopefully win and do so with humility and dignity. Those three are fine individuals who will ensure the reputation of Australian sport, Australian cricket and Australia in general will not be tarnished the way it has been over last week.
Darren Lehmann needed to go and hopefully will go after this series. Australia's behavioural standards have slipped terribly on his watch. I don't want Australia to turn into New Zealand. I don't want a bunch of nice guys on the cricket field. I want a team that plays to win first and foremost. This lot though do it a manner that has left them disliked even by people in their own country. ''Boof'' as he's known by many has done nothing about it. Dave Warner's behaviour is encouraged by Lehmann. That alone means he should lose his job. The cultural (behavioural) changes needed will not come while Darren Lehmann and Brad Haddin are involved in Australia's coaching set up.
It won't happen, but in an ideal world, Jason Gillespie, Simon Katich and maybe George Bailey would be part of Australia's set up. With those three at the helm, Australia will hopefully win and do so with humility and dignity. Those three are fine individuals who will ensure the reputation of Australian sport, Australian cricket and Australia in general will not be tarnished the way it has been over last week.
Given how Smith responded to the recent Rabada case, I'm not convinced he is that of a decent bloke. Just seemingly has better PR than Warner. Think he was more than happy to go along with Warner's plan and as captain should have put his foot down but either he lacked guts or was just as big of a cnut. Still a year long ban is excessive, stripping the captaincy (and vice) and a dock in pay should have been enough for me.
He is a great batsman though, 2nd best behind Kohli for me so it's a massive shame that he will be missed there. While I disagree with @zing that Aus v India will now not be competitive (i'd still back Australia to win at home with their attack), it's still a big loss.
He is a great batsman though, 2nd best behind Kohli for me so it's a massive shame that he will be missed there. While I disagree with @zing that Aus v India will now not be competitive (i'd still back Australia to win at home with their attack), it's still a big loss.
I have no complaints and no sympathy about this being a year long ban. Their employer (CA) can do whatever they want.
It's very concerning however, that ICC have done sweet feck all. Makes me question their seriousness and intent to curb future incidents of the same kind.
It's very concerning however, that ICC have done sweet feck all. Makes me question their seriousness and intent to curb future incidents of the same kind.
Exactly this! Don't understand the sympathy for Smith, who doesn't strike me as being a decent, honest person.
Per Peter Lalor regarding the bans for Warner, Smith and Bancroft.
Seeking to mislead match officials is not acceptable either to be honest.
Seeking to mislead match officials is not acceptable either to be honest.
Why?
This is hardly an isolated incident, even if you take the Aussie line that this happened to be the only time they did it on face value (and I think you would be naïve to) this is the second time he has been accused of cheating within the past year. If you add to the fact that the Aussies were caught because of suspicions raised by their ability to generate reverse swing so early in the last tests, and video evidence of Bancroft bringing outside agents (sugar in that case) onto the field in the past then it's not unreasonable to speculate that they may have systematically cheated over the past few months.
How highly you rate cheating on the 'shit bloke' scale is your own personal call, but it's far from proof of Smith being a decent bloke, and personally I'm struggling to think of examples of Smith doing anything to suggest we shouldn't treat those examples as proof of his character rather than aberrations.
Either way I think the argument that we should feel sorry for Smith is a bit rich. I don't have a shred of sympathy for him; he's not a victim of circumstances or a baby, he was captain of the team and the buck stops with him. He made his bed and has to lie in it. I'm a bit sad about Smith, in the sense that it's cricket's loss to have such a talented player missing from the game for a year, but his talent should strengthen the irritation we feel towards him for chucking it away not absolve him of criticism.
If we're discussing what I'm sorry about with this case then. I'm sorry Lehmann's got away with it again, I'm sorry the bowlers have somehow managed to convince people they had no knowledge the ball was being tampered with, I'm sorry that Warner appears to be being made a scapegoat of so Australia can avoid making changes to the culture that led to what happened (although not that sorry because he is a cnut), I'm sorry that they tasked the most junior member of the squad with carrying out the task rather than having the balls to do it themselves (although again feel that Bancroft is responsible for his own actions), and I'd be very sorry if some of Australia's inexplicable selection decisions have occurred because players have refused to engage with the plans to cheat.
But it's only the last group I would have any actual sympathy for.
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Yeah it seems I was a bit naive to feel sad for Smith now that CA has confirmed that it was sandpaper.
Him and Bancroft were still insisting in their press conference that it was tape and not sandpaper.
Him and Bancroft were still insisting in their press conference that it was tape and not sandpaper.
I do desperately hope that vitriolic comments via social media directed to partners and wives of Australia's players would stop too.
1 year ban looks just. Cricket Australia or any board needs to come hard on blatant cheating like this.
Lehman should obviously have lost his job. It is a disgrace he is still on.
And BCCI did the right thing by banning them from this IPL.
Completely disgraceful from ICC not to give them bans of their own. 1 match ban.. Boo!!
Lehman should obviously have lost his job. It is a disgrace he is still on.
And BCCI did the right thing by banning them from this IPL.
Completely disgraceful from ICC not to give them bans of their own. 1 match ban.. Boo!!
This could get ugly. https://www.foxsports.com.au/cricke...r/news-story/ec226a44c46b131d33cbbfd10536a495
1 year ban seems about right in this case. They've done something wrong and the CA has to send out a strong message and make an example out of this.
Over the past couple of days, it appears that Smith's PR team have been on overdrive with a lot of media reports trying to make Warner look like the bad guy (reports of him getting himself out of the WhatsApp group and stuff).
I would be very surprised if Lehman stays on after this series.
Edit: I agree with the BCCI's decision too.
Over the past couple of days, it appears that Smith's PR team have been on overdrive with a lot of media reports trying to make Warner look like the bad guy (reports of him getting himself out of the WhatsApp group and stuff).
I would be very surprised if Lehman stays on after this series.
Edit: I agree with the BCCI's decision too.
At the very least it sends a message to ICC and other boards that if CA went hard in on their best player and arguably the best batsman in recent years then cheating across the board should be treated accordingly. If the Atherton/Tendulkar incident occurred in modern day with cameras everywhere and social media inquests they'd have been treated harsher. Mind you I don't think those two are dumb enough to have done it in that case. Just using them as examples of big players who were supported by their respective countries.
It's disappointing that what was supposed to be the one redeeming aspect of their behaviour (owning up after getting caught) has turned out to be just another attempt to mislead people. It's clear they feel no guilt and Smith's remarks about brain fades in the past become even more suspicious. I've no doubt there is a culture of serial cheating amongst some of these guys. Also, what the hell was Smith doing talking about a leadership group if none other than him and Warner were involved? It doesn't make sense.
Yes. Domestic and Abroad and being encouraged to do so. Surrey will definitely sign one of then
Smith should join Kohli at Surrey!
Aren't Surrey getting Kohli for a few games? Would make more sense to skip him and get Smith instead.
They can only play one overseas player in the County Championship and one day cup. They're allowed to play two in the T20 but I think Surrey already have Finch for that competition. So wouldn't make sense to get both Smith and Kohli unless Smith is willing to be a reserve in the period Kohli is there.
So is Bancroft available again after this tour?
Was a joke because of how well they get along. Kohli is there just for a month anyways
Can never be sure these days. Seeing people on twitter suggesting Surrey's XI and it consists of Warner, Roy, Finch, Kohli and Smith.
He's been banned for 9 months.
That strikes me as harsh. I don't think a bloke playing his eighth match and not yet established in the team is anywhere near as culpable as the bloke who's played a lot and came up with the idea and the one who happens to be his captain, who together told him to do the wrong thing he did.
He didn't have to do it - and for all I know he was actually well up for it - but to say no he would be defying vastly senior members of the team and in the process accusing them of unacceptable practice.
I guess it makes no difference, at this stage, mind. The guy is not a particularly special talent and now he's tainted by this it's always likely to be preferable to the selectors just to pick someone else, so it's probably his international career over regardless of length.
Not really. In most jobs, if you do something illegal, you can't escape by saying my manager asked me to do it.
You can't and I'm not arguing he should escape. I'm arguing 3/4 of their sentence isn't what I'd feel was warranted.
Well. He tampered the ball and tried to hide it when caught. So 9 months look just about right. It is not like he claimed a grounded catch. This is serious breach of rules.
It is but if nine months is what he deserves then I think Smith and Warner should have more.
Why are people grouping Smith with Warner? If warner deserves a year and Bancroft deserves 9 months, Smith should get no more than 3 months. He’s only guilty of wilfully turning a blind eye to the hatching of a plan between players that he was not fully aware of until after the fact. As the article stated, he basically said “what are you blokes up to? I don’t want to know”. Bad captaincy, he should’ve taken control, but one year? He’s the most innocent of all of them, unquestionably. All the hilarious sympathy for Bancroft, a fully grown adult who willingly went along with Warner’s moronic ploy, yet some sort of distorted hatred towards Smith. I don’t get it.
Captain. Literally his job.
He came out and said the Leadership Group or whatever group he created knew everything about it. When he could have just said, I was not exactly aware of that happening right under my nose and I am sorry for being a lousy captain. The former makes him equally culpable. The latter makes him a lousy captain and would have resulted in a small ban and loss of captaincy.
There has been speculation he did this to take some of the heat off the other blokes. Not sure of the veracity of that but if true, surely one must sympathise with him?
He’s not a high school teacher. The conduct of the team vice captain is not the captains responsibility to the extent you are implying.
I don't care if he just nodded or said 'I dunno, maybe, okay'... or he said 'Yes! Best idea I've ever heard' - there is no doubt here that the captain of the team condoned it.
What if he wasn’t fully aware of the intention to tamper with the ball until afterwards? If so, can’t you sympathise?
CA isnt going to take twitter speculation and hypotheticals to decide the severity of punishment. Nor does he deserve any sympathy for it.