Antonio Valencia... | Will wear #25 shirt from this point onwards by request

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Randall Flagg said:
He has been brilliant for us since he arrived FFS.

You hate because he has nicked your butt buddies place.
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Randall, look back on the majority of my posts about Valencia and then say that again.

He has been poor this season and was poor today, simpler as that.

FWIW, I don't think any of our wingers should be starting games, I'm the one who made that thread after all
 
paceme said:
No idea why people think Nani should get a nod ahead of him in the next game, he hasn't been any better
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He hasn't been any worse either, and has contributed more in goals/assists/chances created.

Still doesn't mean he should start over Valencia though, infact none of them should start.
 
paceme said:
No idea why people think Nani should get a nod ahead of him in the next game, he hasn't been any better
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Like he showed against Spurs and Chelsea and many times in his time at United, he can come up with a crucial goal or assist or moment of magic even when he's nowhere close to his best. It's something Valencia just doesn't do.
 
paceme said:
No idea why people think Nani should get a nod ahead of him in the next game, he hasn't been any better
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Who thinks that? Am in favor of benching all 3 and starting all our strikers ahead of a midfield 3.
 
wr8_utd said:
Like he showed against Spurs and Chelsea and many times in his time at United, he can come up with a crucial goal or assist or moment of magic even when he's nowhere close to his best. It's something Valencia just doesn't do.
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Bollocks. Valencia also assisted against Chelsea and he was brilliant against Braga. Valencia has been awful/average whatever this season but Nani hasn't been any better than him.
 
Varun_Utd said:
Yep, far too good a player to continue playing the way he's started this season.
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Our wingers periodically go out of form but before it occurred in such a way that when one went out of form the other would produce and no one would care, now Nani has his contract issues and all of them are out of form.
 
Stack said:
Dumb idea
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Care to elaborate whats so dumb about it? All 3 of our wingers are in poor form and we've 3 striker in great nick. Add to that the fact that both clev and ando have looked good when they'e played and its far far from a dumb idea.
 
In defense of Valencia, Ferguson clearly recognized the problem was not him, rather on the left and in the middle, made the changes and we got three goals and two off the woodwork. In the first half, Valencia was our only attacking option, and he really didn't have anyone to play with. Everyone around his was pretty much shite or non existant.
 
4-3-3 is essentially playing with one proper striker and two wingers. It would mean shunting Rooney and Van Persie/Hernandez out wide.
 
I just wonder if teams have actually understood/realised that he's more one footed than they once thought. It is quite hilarious how he prefers to hit it outside the foot to make a short pass, when it's 100 times easier to just tap it with the left :lol:

As some have said - he's just slightly off the boil at the moment. Nevertheless, it's pretty good having a winger that's off-form but still supplies assists like he does. Only 7 have assisted more than him so far - and two of them are Rooney and RVP (Hazard is topping the charts with an incredible 9 to be fair to the guy); he has 4 assists, only one behind Mata who's been a fantastic playmaker this season.

In my opinion, he gets better as the season goes on. Valencia will be on top form in the business part of the season.
 
ArmchairCritic said:
Our wingers periodically go out of form but before it occurred in such a way that when one went out of form the other would produce and no one would care, now Nani has his contract issues and all of them are out of form.
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Yeah, its strange to see all 3 totally out of form at the same time. We've come to a situation where a change in the system for a few games looks inevitable. 3 strikers looking very good, none of the wingers looking in touch and both clev and ando being good makes it seem worthwhile really. We'l need to buy a winger in Jan if Nani doesnt sign a contract by then even if he's still at the club. If we're not playing him, we need a 3rd alternative. Am confident about valencia coming good, Young just doesnt fill me with much confidence,. good squad player, not good enough a winger to start for Man Utd imo.
 
kps88 said:
4-3-3 is essentially playing with one proper striker and two wingers. It would mean shunting Rooney and Van Persie/Hernandez out wide.
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Not at all. Both Rooney and Rvp can play in a narrow system behind Hernandez. Width doesnt have to come from wingers, we have 2 quality attacking FBs who'l provide the width.
 
KM said:
Bollocks. Valencia also assisted against Chelsea and he was brilliant against Braga. Valencia has been awful/average whatever this season but Nani hasn't been any better than him.
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Nani was our best player vs Gala and has played lesser games than Valencia and also been in and out of the team due to his various transfer/contract related issues. He's never really had the run of games that Valencia's been given. He's just started 4 PL games so far.
 
kouroux said:
He made one pass with the left foot tonight.It must have been a real torture for him to do so
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That 30 yard run when he ran back away from the LB, did not play a simple left footed pass and then finally passed it with the outside of his right foot :lol:
 
Varun_Utd said:
That 30 yard run when he ran back away from the LB, did not play a simple left footed pass and then finally passed it with the outside of his right foot :lol:
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It's a like mental block.You see him shape his body to pass with the left but something prevents him, it can force him on these ridiculous runs backwards.He must have been taught that using your weaker makes you "weaker"
 
Varun_Utd said:
Care to elaborate whats so dumb about it? All 3 of our wingers are in poor form and we've 3 striker in great nick. Add to that the fact that both clev and ando have looked good when they'e played and its far far from a dumb idea.
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Different opposition require different tactical approaches. No longer can managers have one playing system and just stick to that. Fergie has alluded to such recently.
Big squads have come about because the need for player depth and players to fill different roles. The big teams can afford the big squads which in turn give the options to play different systems, its one of the many reasons its the same elite group of clubs that win everything year in year out.

Funny, in recent match day threads i have seen Ando and Clev slaughtered for how they have been playing, last weeks game Ando got hammered for most of the thread.

With respect to form well you have players who at a given time in the season might be training well but playing badly, playing well but training badly or playing and training well. You have players coming back from injury or a rest trying to play their way in to form, you have players having to come back earlier than preferred (smalling, Fergie mentioned it today) and you have players needing a rest.

So take in to account all the variables, player form and reasons for that form, opposition tactics and the availability of players to fit required tactics and any thoughts of simply dumping wingers and going only 4-3-3 is a dumb idea.
 
kps88 said:
4-3-3 is essentially playing with one proper striker and two wingers. It would mean shunting Rooney and Van Persie/Hernandez out wide.
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There are half a dozen different ways to play with a setup of 4-3-3. what you are saying simply isnt true.
 
Stack said:
Different opposition require different tactical approaches. No longer can managers have one playing system and just stick to that. Fergie has alluded to such recently.
Big squads have come about because the need for player depth and players to fill different roles. The big teams can afford the big squads which in turn give the options to play different systems, its one of the many reasons its the same elite group of clubs that win everything year in year out.
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Exactly, which is where a narrow system comes in. Flexibility as you said is required.

Funny, in recent match day threads i have seen Ando and Clev slaughtered for how they have been playing, last weeks game Ando got hammered for most of the thread.
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I rarely read match day threads but i'd be surprised if thats true. Both have been very good of late.

With respect to form well you have players who at a given time in the season might be training well but playing badly, playing well but training badly or playing and training well. You have players coming back from injury or a rest trying to play their way in to form, you have players having to come back earlier than preferred (smalling, Fergie mentioned it today) and you have players needing a rest.

So take in to account all the variables, player form and reasons for that form, opposition tactics and the availability of players to fit required tactics and any thoughts of simply dumping wingers and going only 4-3-3 is a dumb idea.
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Our next opposition are Norwich. Nothing in them to force us to play a specific way to counter threats. Play your best 11, play to our game and we'd beat them. That 11 for me atm doesnt include wingers.
 
Not in good form right now and seems reluctant to take his man on, but the oddest thing today was he didn't cover Rafael as well as he usually does even when the other half of his game is off the boil.
 
Stack said:
Are our best players available and in form?
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---Hernandez---

Rooney---RVP

Ando-----Clev

----Carrick--

Narrow system with the width provided by Rafael and Evra.

Available. Tick

In form. Tick.
 
I'd bench both him and Young for that performance. He were 1 v 1 for most of the match vs Enda fecking Stevens, and he did feck all. Then, one minute before the final whistle, he just randomly decided to dribble the whole Villa-team, without much trouble at all.

Looked bereft of confidence, which is strange.
 
Nobby style said:
In defense of Valencia, Ferguson clearly recognized the problem was not him, rather on the left and in the middle, made the changes and we got three goals and two off the woodwork. In the first half, Valencia was our only attacking option, and he really didn't have anyone to play with. Everyone around his was pretty much shite or non existant.
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We didnt have a choice did we? Nani not on the bench meant we dont have anyone who gets games on the right to choose from... Not unless we went to a diamond and used Cleverley on the right. Rooney has played plenty on the left so it was a no brainer. At the same time its hard to argue that Young should stay on and Valencia off
 
Varun_Utd said:
---Hernandez---

Rooney---RVP

Ando-----Clev

----Carrick--

Narrow system with the width provided by Rafael and Evra.

Available. Tick

In form. Tick.
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To be honest, those are the same players who i think make up our best players in the front half of the pitch but I hate not having width in the middle third.
 
Stack said:
To be honest, those are the same players who i think make up our best players in the front half of the pitch but I hate not having width in the middle third.
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Width can come from the full backs, wingers arent the only ones that provide width mate.
 
Hernandez - BFA said:
I just wonder if teams have actually understood/realised that he's more one footed than they once thought. It is quite hilarious how he prefers to hit it outside the foot to make a short pass, when it's 100 times easier to just tap it with the left :lol:
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The part I dont get is why its only Valencia who has this said about him. There are loads of players out there who use the outside of their foot instead of their left a huge majority of the time. We had another one ourselves recently in Berbatov. But its only with Valencia that people notice it?
 
Varun_Utd said:
Width can come from the full backs, wingers arent the only ones that provide width mate.
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Very true but I like width in the middle third when countering. If we have been defending and break out the width in the middle third helps open up and opposition central midfield.
 
Ekeke said:
The part I dont get is why its only Valencia who has this said about him. There are loads of players out there who use the outside of their foot instead of their left a huge majority of the time. We had another one ourselves recently in Berbatov. But its only with Valencia that people notice it?
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I guess its more of a problem when its a player out wide that does it, specially when its to the extent valencia does it.

Stack said:
Very true but I like width in the middle third when countering. If we have been defending and break out the width in the middle third helps open up and opposition central midfield.
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True to an extent but i feel counters can be effective regardless. Players can peel off whichever part then want to when countering.
 
hard to admit but the quality wasn't there at all. I liked the resilience to try over and over again. Made a fantastic run in the second half as well.

He'll turn much better before long.
 
Hernandez - BFA said:
I just wonder if teams have actually understood/realised that he's more one footed than they once thought. It is quite hilarious how he prefers to hit it outside the foot to make a short pass, when it's 100 times easier to just tap it with the left :lol:
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That first bit
 
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