From what I've seen in our current system I'd prefer Icardi to Griezmann
Griezmann is a better player though. Strange isn't it?!
Griezmann is a better player though. Strange isn't it?!
Antoine Griezmann
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I think we will get him. But it smacks of opportunism. Logic is something like: Sign whatever top 10 attacker we can, who is buyable and would accept coming. And only Griezmann fits that spec. I can see some sense in the logic as such players are so hard to get that you don't get much choice but it looks like little consideration made as to how to get the most out of him.
Tbf with Pogba it was the same and it was clear that Mou had no real idea of how to utilise him either. Playing him with Fellaini in a double pivot seemed to be the initial plan which is shocking. Took a few months if experimentation (and lost points) to change formation and partners to the Carrick and Herrera alongside Pogba in a 4-3-3 to finally find something that works. Seems inevitable that we will need a similar process when Griezmann comes and another slow start to a season due to it, ending up with who knows what system. I can only guess that its seen as a price worth paying and risk worth taking if we can find something that works for all our key players in the end.
Tbf with Pogba it was the same and it was clear that Mou had no real idea of how to utilise him either. Playing him with Fellaini in a double pivot seemed to be the initial plan which is shocking. Took a few months if experimentation (and lost points) to change formation and partners to the Carrick and Herrera alongside Pogba in a 4-3-3 to finally find something that works. Seems inevitable that we will need a similar process when Griezmann comes and another slow start to a season due to it, ending up with who knows what system. I can only guess that its seen as a price worth paying and risk worth taking if we can find something that works for all our key players in the end.
And? So you got one example
How many were against signing Van Persie on here? Lots of people didn't want him because we had Rooney, Chicharito and Welbeck.
Also another thing, Veron played in a side that was full of world class players. How many have we got currently? More importantly the mentality of Griezmann seems much stronger than Veron. He'd handle the physical nature of the premier league and pace. Veron was scared of getting kicked and couldn't handle the pace.
A general assertion that world class players will fit in anywhere was made which I only needed one counter example to show its falsity. I could have picked Di Maria just as easily.
And my argument worked because what your argument is is that being world class is not enough. Being able to handle the physicality of the Prem, having pace, good mentality, and probably several other criteria, are necessary factors in a player being a success with us. And I don't disagree with that. In fact, that's precisely my point. Not just any world class player would be a good buy. Otherwise football managers wouldn't be needed.
No you need to be able to play to their strengths think Crespo Shevchenko or Kaka and how they suffered but in saying that I think we can easily accommodate Pogba and Griezman in the same team. So I would go all out for him. We also need another couple of midfielders so depends how much we have in the pot but I'd love Griezman at OT. His movement of the ball is fantastic.
People do keep saying they think we're just signing him for his name and reputation with little thought to where he will fit in, but we dont know that at all. In fact it is probably completely wrong. People only think this because they don't know where he will fit in. But we don't know the plans of the manager, so it's a bit unfair to say we're just trying to get him without any plan of how to use him.
Sometimes you want the player regardless of wether you have a ready made position for him. Jose had wanted Pogba from his Chelsea days not just at United.
I'd prefer Aubameyang. I don't believe we need a number 10 because it can impede Pogba and I believe Auba has more weapons in his Arsenal. That paceFrom what I've seen in our current system I'd prefer Icardi to Griezmann
Griezmann is a better player though. Strange isn't it?!
When we can get a player like this with the skill set we are missing it's a must in my opinion. His off the ball movement and pace running into the channels would improve our game no end plus his finishing and desire is immense. A lot is being made of him and Pogba not being able to play together but I think that was the personnel around them that contributed to that plus after all that is said they still reached the final. For me Pogba and Griezman occupy different areas with overlap so I would not be bothered by this at all. Sign him up Jose!
I'd prefer Aubameyang. I don't believe we need a number 10 because it can impede Pogba and I believe Auba has more weapons in his Arsenal. That pace
Griezmann isn't a number 10 like De Bruyne or Ozil.
The man is world class. Sign him up already Woody... get that pre-contract agreement on the go.
Vive la France!
Vive la France!
I think like Pogba (and Ibra) he is seen as being so good that you make the team fit him and.not vice versa. Mou is pragmatic about formation and style and I guess experiments to fit the best llayers he can.buy in. Hope he has better luck than Deschamps.
The idea that Jose will spend £90m on him, without a plan on how to use him is laughable.
Don't think this was posted yet?
To anyone who dared question Acquire Me who said we were already deep in negotiations
To anyone who dared question Acquire Me who said we were already deep in negotiations
Don't think this was posted yet?
To anyone who dared question Acquire Me who said we were already deep in negotiations
This is BBC gossip. They are provably quoting The Sun or something
From what I've seen in our current system I'd prefer Icardi to Griezmann
Griezmann is a better player though. Strange isn't it?!
I'd prefer Icardi too. Or any other centre forward who can lead the line and score 25+ goals a season.
Aubemeyang
Would be just one player I'd prefer to Griezmann. That said, his qualities are very Rashford like, and it may be preferred to see what he becomes first.
He has expressed his desire to play for Real Madrid, it's a dream of his. I'd love to have him here though.
Anyway, I don't understand the negativity towards getting Griezmann - if Mourinho sees him as a part of his system here then it's obvious we should try to get him?
Don't think this was posted yet?
To anyone who dared question Acquire Me who said we were already deep in negotiations
That's them quoting from the Sun. It even mentions Gossip in the tweet!
Yeah, it seems people are judging this from how they want to see us line up rather than using these rumours and judging how Jose wants his side to evolve into.
Don't forget Deschamps being the be all and end all. If he can't get them to work together at 100 percent then nobody can..
Griezmann seems to be a done deal according to a certain fanzine(no names as i get banned by puttinng name here) too for what its worth.
We have our own ideas of how the team should be playing, that's why. Mourinho will ultimately do what he wants, but we have our own views.
We are playing with 3 midfielders, and playing very well with 3 at that, and many fans, including myself, feel we should continue this way. Same fans probably want to see Martial and Mkhitaryan play.
Mourinho seems to think Fellaini is part of whatever plan he has, more so than Bastian. Why should we be compelled to think the same?
Griezmann would be a vanity purchase in my view. The same thing is happening with Rooney now. Yes, he's rubbish, which doesn't help, but he doesn't fit into any system here. He is not too dissimilar to Griezmann, and having Rooney in the team now would mean him out of position, which is pointless.
A fluid front 3 of Mkhitaryan, Griezmann and Rashford/Martial would be amazing after Zlatan leaves.
We need more goals from elsewhere on the pitch.
Griezmann has a great scoring record and would really add to our attack.
Could come down to Griezmann wanting to leave now, and buying him, accommodating the team with him as a second striker until Ibra is done (he is 35, despite playing like he is 29}, so that we have quality players to tinker with when he does hang up his boots.
Short-term tactical change for long-term squad quality gain. Cause God knows it may take time to find another top class striker if none of Rashford or Martial takes that mantle.
Short-term tactical change for long-term squad quality gain. Cause God knows it may take time to find another top class striker if none of Rashford or Martial takes that mantle.
We do, but that surely just means the likes of Mkhitaryan and Martial need to score more. It doesn't necessarily require a system change. We have enough goal scorers in the team already in Zlatan, Martial, Mkhitaryan and Pogba. Then Mata, Rashford and Rooney are all capable too. The defence should do more, but I think we are set up, and have the personnel already, to score goals.
I know Griezmann hasn't played as an inside forward for some time, but does he have to play centrally? He can be just as devastating from anywhere in the front 3 and might well enjoy his game all the same.
Pretty much this
I think so too. It's fine limiting Pogba in some games for a 4-2-3-1 where Ibra and Griezmann can probably do a lot of damage working together in a front two. We don't really need a controller in some games, IMO - one creative players and one energetic player in Pogba and Herrera should be okay in home games against the smaller teams where they go 4-5-1. And we can drop Martial, Mkhitaryan etc and play Griezmann in their position for a few games without restricting their playing time all that much.
Then the season after that we go fluid front 3.
Agreed.
I laughed.
I might agree with you about Griezmann, but can't help but get excited though, once a muppet always a muppet.
When the blend isn't right, this is proven, time and again, to not be true. One player (Pogba) or another (Griezmann) being 'world class' isn't really in question, them being world class simulataneously, hasn't happened once (to my knowledge) in all the games they've played together.
What has this got to do with Deschamps? In theory, he sets the formation and the tactics and then he lets them go out there and play. It's not him telling Griezmann to block Pogba's channels time and again, or Pogba to run into the spaces that make Griezmann's natural game go to pot.
These are two highly intelligent players who haven't worked things out between themselves; how is it that Mourinho will re-wire the thinking of one or the other. Even if he manages to do that, who's to say the final product won't be diminished and less than what it was?
Experiments are all fine and dandy, but this is an £80m+ player to go with a £89m player. Do you think it's prudent to gamble with £169m worth of talent. It would literally be the biggest/costliest failing of all-time if they don't mesh. Not only that, it could end up compromising both players over a period of years, not months, because if we dick about with Pogba and start shifting him all over the place to accommodate Griezmann, we're taking him off his natural developmental line, the one in which he has the potential to be an all-time great in.
All praise will go to Jose if he makes it work, but to dismiss the notion that it's fraught with potential mis-hap is asinine.
Also depends on how adaptable that big player is, Griezmann isn't a Di Maria he has proved to be one of the more adaptable players around, playing under Simeone teams where he has to press and work hard, if he was to come United i don't see him failing, because he has the temperament and workrate to go with his sublime finishing, a quality which makes you a star anywhere.
Saying that anything over 50m would be a bit too much imo, you could get a Julien Brandt, Felipe Anderson, Beradi for much less.
Because that's what people always point to. Their performances for France which is treated as gospel as to their ability to play together. He had Pogba as a DM and Matuidi was given the licence to go forward. Deschamps should be questioned over that rather than the iron clad prof it's made out to be.
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Quite a gap in proven class between Griezmann and the others listed. 50m clearly wouldn't do it, more likely double that.
The good thing about our squad now is that it does not need a big shake up. We have good young players in most positions. We could sell a few and go in for one big player reasonably sensibly.
That's not how they played for the entirety of the tournament. And what about before then? Heaping it all on Deschamps and not wondering why these two haven't shown the chemistry you would expect of such talent doesn't work, imo.
And even if it isn't categorical proof, it's something that can't just be glossed over, either.
At £80m+ messing with what you're buying is one hell of a risk.
I'm not sure how Griezmann would fit into the team. His best position is clearly as a second striker so where would Pogba play? We've tried Pogba in the deeper 2 man midfield position and it's just not worked at all and we've not had any balance. So does that mean Griezmann plays on the right? I'd be surprised if we paid massive money for someone and then didn't play them in their preferred position. Jose himself has stated that he likes specialists for most of the team.
For what it's worth I think he's a superb player but that is in his favoured position. He'd still no doubt do well in a wide area but just not to the extent that his fee would command if I'm being honest.
For what it's worth I think he's a superb player but that is in his favoured position. He'd still no doubt do well in a wide area but just not to the extent that his fee would command if I'm being honest.
for 99 percent of it, yes they did.
United have a different setup than France anyway, different characteristics. France are a lot slower up top for one thing with Giroud and Payet slowing everything the feck down.
All big signings are a risk. it's what the manager is paid to do.
Is Neymar at his best out on the left? Is Messi at his best dropping deep and picking up the ball after a season of 90 goals in a calendar year playing through the middle? Those two made sacrifices on the pitch to let Suarez come into the side and create the most fearsome front line of all time.
Who says Jose hasn't looked at Martial or Rashford and earmarked them as our number 9 next season? Play Griezmann on the left as an inside forward that allows us to keep our shape?
Or play him as a false 9 that allows Pogba to make the runs beyond him, that allows Pogba to provide the physical presence in the attacking third?
All I know is if we sign Griezmann then it's not due to the exact role as he's playing at the moment. The same way Herrera wasn't a deep laying midfielder, the same way Martial wasn't an inside forward. Players can adapt to their highest level.
This deal would be about as much as the commercial gain as his contribution on the pitch.
If Mourinho wants Griezmann, I imagine Woodward and co will stop at nothing to secure the deal - alongside Pogba, he is one of the most marketable players in world football. And no we're not talking about shirt sales, but rather about fan engagement, sponsorship tie-ups etc.
On the face of it, this deal is a no-brainer. And it wouldn't surprise me if the club begin laying the foundations of this deal in the spring - if not sooner.
If Mourinho wants Griezmann, I imagine Woodward and co will stop at nothing to secure the deal - alongside Pogba, he is one of the most marketable players in world football. And no we're not talking about shirt sales, but rather about fan engagement, sponsorship tie-ups etc.
On the face of it, this deal is a no-brainer. And it wouldn't surprise me if the club begin laying the foundations of this deal in the spring - if not sooner.
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