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2018-19 Performances


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5.5 Season Average Rating
Appearances
38
Goals
12
Assists
3
Yellow cards
2
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No, I don't know (as yet) how Ole wants him to play. Has that been decided yet? I get the impression Ole / Phelan are still working things out across much of the squad, nowt wrong with that.

I still feel if Sanchez finds and sustains form, he will start... and I cannot see him starting/playing from the right.

It's a good problem to have.
 
Martial isn't a LW.

He is only playing there because he is better than Rashford, Lingard & even Sanchez as a winger. Hell, I think his debut goal against Liverpool where he took on 3 defenders on the left channel has made people assume that playing him at LW is the best to way to make him progress here.

His dribbling ability is overrated by many fans here - whilst his ability to drop deep, initiate play, make short passes & his finishing is underrated by a lot of fans. He isn't a great crosser either - so what exactly makes people think that LW is going to get the best out of him?

Yesterday he came on & made some few errors by losing the ball - that was not his fault; that was him trying to take on his man & dribble past the defenders as a makeshift LW would. He isn't going to get any better at that. How were his crosses? Not that great either.

When people complain about Martial's performances - it's irritating that they refuse to see that martial is not a proper LW & that he is playing in a position that shows off his weaknesses more often than his strengths.

The same thing happened with Rashford last year. He got played as a winger - all the fans complained about his performances & how he is not good enough for united - giving up because as a winger Rashford only played to 60-75% of his ability as any player in their wrong positions would.

Martial needs to play as a LF, a SS or a False nine. Playing him out wide & making him take on the RB & the RCB is only going to lead to his game being inconsistent.

Funny thing is - Martial was likened to Thierry Henry in the way he plays - who was inconsistent as a LW trying to take on the fullbacks & crossing all failing; but he got turned to a ST that would use the left channel especially on the counter at Arsenal & became deadly as hell. Martial has gone the other way - turning from a striker to a LW instead.

Ole knows what he is doing anyway- using the false nine of Lingard with Martial & Rashford on sides is just the start. Martial will take Lingards spot as the false nine, Rashford will take Martial's spot as the LF (not LW) whilst someone like Greenwood can play as the RF next year.
Absolutely agreed. You make the best posts regarding Martial and his positioning. Even that goal agaijst Liverpool he wasnt coming off the touchline. He was the furthest forward as striker but drifting out the left. I also read this when we signined him from Monaco hes forward that likes to drift to the left and attack space between the fullback and centre back from an angle - not from standing start on the touchline. Yet despite not playing in his preffered positon hes still showed enough to keep the spot that it can only bode well for the future.
 
And what part of my post says that people aren't entitled to their opinions.

Did you just read my post and what you got from that was me restricting people's opinions.

If I must repeat myself, I'm clearly talking about agenda posters who happen to be very obvious, and such posters need to be kept away from threads they clearly aren't contributing anything constructive but instead needless pettiness because they happen to have an agenda. It's something made very clear in the earlier post you quoted.
I got it from the bit where you appealed for banning people from the thread

Are you calling them out directly or just complaining to everyone?
 
No, I don't know (as yet) how Ole wants him to play. Has that been decided yet? I get the impression Ole / Phelan are still working things out across much of the squad, nowt wrong with that.

I still feel if Sanchez finds and sustains form, he will start... and I cannot see him starting/playing from the right.

It's a good problem to have.

Interesting perspective, imo. We have a front trio that works surprisingly well together, with three young players that can interchange position and are building an understanding between them, we're creating chances, scoring goals and winning matches, yet it's very easy to get the feeling that some are just itching for players to be replaced. Look at the goal Rashford scored against Brighton and what happens before he puts the ball in the top corner, he drifts out of position and plays the ball wide to Dalot, Martial runs into the space left by Rashford to:

- get into dangerous space

- free up space behind him

Dalot and Rashford takes advantage and we score.

Up until we reach a point where one of our 3 forward players aren't performing good enough while the forward that comes on delivers, I see absolutely feck all reason to feck about with the attacking lineup. Yet here we are, Sanchez has barely performed decently for the past 12 months and the feeling is that he'll walk into the side and displace players actually performing as soon as he finds and sustains form.

Weird.
 
Tony only had one assist? That just league stats?
2 in the league I think. He's a been a bit unlucky with regards to the assists stat this season IMO. A few of the chances he's created should have been finished off.

Upto 10 in the league now despite not starting early on if I'm not mistaken.
 
Martial isn't a LW.

He is only playing there because he is better than Rashford, Lingard & even Sanchez as a winger. Hell, I think his debut goal against Liverpool where he took on 3 defenders on the left channel has made people assume that playing him at LW is the best to way to make him progress here.

His dribbling ability is overrated by many fans here - whilst his ability to drop deep, initiate play, make short passes & his finishing is underrated by a lot of fans. He isn't a great crosser either - so what exactly makes people think that LW is going to get the best out of him?

Yesterday he came on & made some few errors by losing the ball - that was not his fault; that was him trying to take on his man & dribble past the defenders as a makeshift LW would. He isn't going to get any better at that. How were his crosses? Not that great either.

When people complain about Martial's performances - it's irritating that they refuse to see that martial is not a proper LW & that he is playing in a position that shows off his weaknesses more often than his strengths.

The same thing happened with Rashford last year. He got played as a winger - all the fans complained about his performances & how he is not good enough for united - giving up because as a winger Rashford only played to 60-75% of his ability as any player in their wrong positions would.

Martial needs to play as a LF, a SS or a False nine. Playing him out wide & making him take on the RB & the RCB is only going to lead to his game being inconsistent.

Funny thing is - Martial was likened to Thierry Henry in the way he plays - who was inconsistent as a LW trying to take on the fullbacks & crossing all failing; but he got turned to a ST that would use the left channel especially on the counter at Arsenal & became deadly as hell. Martial has gone the other way - turning from a striker to a LW instead.

Ole knows what he is doing anyway- using the false nine of Lingard with Martial & Rashford on sides is just the start. Martial will take Lingards spot as the false nine, Rashford will take Martial's spot as the LF (not LW) whilst someone like Greenwood can play as the RF next year.
Great post.

I hope you're right, that front 3 would be a delight to watch. :drool:
 
The issue with Tony is inconsistency. One minute he's brilliant, the other he's infuriatingly sloppy and yesterday was the perfect example of this. To be expected with a young player though, glad Ole is persisting with him and we are reaping the rewards. If Jose was in charge, Martial would find himself on the bench for the next 5-6 games and frozen out for someone like Fellaini or McTominay.
 
Absolutely agreed. You make the best posts regarding Martial and his positioning. Even that goal agaijst Liverpool he wasnt coming off the touchline. He was the furthest forward as striker but drifting out the left. I also read this when we signined him from Monaco hes forward that likes to drift to the left and attack space between the fullback and centre back from an angle - not from standing start on the touchline. Yet despite not playing in his preffered positon hes still showed enough to keep the spot that it can only bode well for the future.

It's just very irritating to speak out something so obvious consistently.

As I say - Rashford last year was good as gone because he failed as a winger under peoples eyes - couldnt take on his man properly, wasnt crossing well, wasnt scoring - the only thing he had last year was a top work rate.

The thing is Martial is not just random anomaly who plays as a LF that drifts out on the counter & wants to take on the space between the RB and RCB.

Would Thierry Henry work as our LW? would Saido Mane work as our LW trying to beat the RB with the ball at his feet as the attacking move he has to repeat with every attack?

They wouldn't because even though they can dribble; their ability to beat a man on the outside channel of the marking RB is not as good as their ability to play inbetween the RB and RCB.


I also think - ever since C Ronaldo left us - the fans are desperate for a winger who plays like him - this magical winger who with us could in a skillfull manner take the fullback on from the inside or outside - taking a shot or whipping a cross in for the striker. like RVN, Rooney or Tevez. That isnt going to happen with Martial & even if he could - players like Rashford & lingard are not going to benefit from that type of play.

Rashford, Lingard, Martial & even Greenwood are players that are going to benefit from interchanging positions, making short passes & spaces for each other before one of them becomes free to take on a defender or take a shot at goal. Look at the goal vs cardiff.



Look at how close Rashford, Lingard & Martial are - their fullbacks are irrelevant; and the centre of defence has to deal with three attackers than can interchange positions - usually a skillfull dribble away from being one on one with the goalkeeper.

They need to be close together so that the defence are overloaded and get stretched when the ball is at their feet. When Martial starts as a LW - he starts off too wide, the defence have marked him out as wide as possible with their fullback even before he has recieved the ball. The defence is in the ideal positions to not only mark martial out the game but are lined up with 2 defenders focusing purely on Rashford whilst Lingard plays as RW who again does a minimal job against their LB.

Rashford is rubbish at RW, LW because he struggles to take on the fullbacks and even if he does beat him - is covered by their CB who has marked the fullbacks weakspots leading to Rashford being pushed out wide than being in a position where he can score a goal. In my opinion martial plays almost the same way as Rashford does but just happens to be marginally more skillful; he gets marked out by a fullback; even if he beets them gets covered by a CB.



Look at Rashford position here - is in between the widest fullback and the RCB; one of their defenders are completely out of marking Rashford meaning that their RCB is directly the first opposition Rashford faces. He takes him on, beats him and finds himself right in front of goal to take a shot and score.

Martial is no different.
 
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Anthony is on fire in the last month. It was more than obvious that Mourinho's style didn't suit him, and he showed once again that has a pure football talent. But in my opinion he needs to work even more. He needs to be braver sometimes, and to improve his runs. Sometimes he is late, with a run, or with a pass and doesn't read the game really well. I hope Ole can help him with that and develop him in a world class player, as he should be.
 
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Why aren't thread ban implemented on these boards. I mean when it cones to obvious agenda poster, it would help curtail derailment of threads and keep threads clean.

Some posts are just either obvious wum or filled with agendas that I can't help but think that certain posters need to be kept away from certain threads.

Yeah you'd be the first one kicked out of this thread so you better hold your horses a bit.

People are entitled to think that he is; world class, not so good or somewhere in between. I don't see what your problem is?

And what part of my post says that people aren't entitled to their opinions.

Did you just read my post and what you got from that was me restricting people's opinions.

If I must repeat myself, I'm clearly talking about agenda posters who happen to be very obvious, and such posters need to be kept away from threads they clearly aren't contributing anything constructive but instead needless pettiness because they happen to have an agenda. It's something made very clear in the earlier post you quoted.

And that's the perfect description of yourself.

This.
 
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We missed him badly tonight. His dribbling and treat from wide was lacking and it hurt us. Let's hope he is back soon enough.
 
Supposed to be back for next weekend, so doesn't look very serious.
 
He's our only decent wide player, missed him most today imo
 
We are clueless in breaking low block sides when he doesn't play. He constantly takes two defenders out of play.
 
Yeah I would say he was missed yesterday, we missed someone with a bit of guile and able to make something happen. Draws defenders to himself, we just needed that bit of coolness in the final 3rd he provides.
 
Why does he look like a fifa player when he’s celebrating goals?
 
Martial isn't a LW.

He is only playing there because he is better than Rashford, Lingard & even Sanchez as a winger. Hell, I think his debut goal against Liverpool where he took on 3 defenders on the left channel has made people assume that playing him at LW is the best to way to make him progress here.

His dribbling ability is overrated by many fans here - whilst his ability to drop deep, initiate play, make short passes & his finishing is underrated by a lot of fans. He isn't a great crosser either - so what exactly makes people think that LW is going to get the best out of him?

Yesterday he came on & made some few errors by losing the ball - that was not his fault; that was him trying to take on his man & dribble past the defenders as a makeshift LW would. He isn't going to get any better at that. How were his crosses? Not that great either.

When people complain about Martial's performances - it's irritating that they refuse to see that martial is not a proper LW & that he is playing in a position that shows off his weaknesses more often than his strengths.

The same thing happened with Rashford last year. He got played as a winger - all the fans complained about his performances & how he is not good enough for united - giving up because as a winger Rashford only played to 60-75% of his ability as any player in their wrong positions would.

Martial needs to play as a LF, a SS or a False nine. Playing him out wide & making him take on the RB & the RCB is only going to lead to his game being inconsistent.

Funny thing is - Martial was likened to Thierry Henry in the way he plays - who was inconsistent as a LW trying to take on the fullbacks & crossing all failing; but he got turned to a ST that would use the left channel especially on the counter at Arsenal & became deadly as hell. Martial has gone the other way - turning from a striker to a LW instead.

Ole knows what he is doing anyway- using the false nine of Lingard with Martial & Rashford on sides is just the start. Martial will take Lingards spot as the false nine, Rashford will take Martial's spot as the LF (not LW) whilst someone like Greenwood can play as the RF next year.
Very good post.
 
I really don't know where I stand with Martial. He has some quality that's for sure, but has he improved since he came here? I'm not actually sure he has. He may be our best actual finisher; if we're in a one on one situation it's probably him I'd want on the ball, but I also don't see him actually getting a chance to play up front much. Lukaku was obviously number one and now MAYBE Rashford is squeezing him for that position, which leaves Martial stuck out on the left. For me, he's far too reluctant to take players on. Maybe that's what has been drummed into him over the years by Managers we've had here because of their style of play, but far too often he simply turns back and passes backwards. Under the new management, that seems to be encouraging our players to attack and take on players, I don't feel like he has changed his own game too much. How many times does he go down the outside of player? Hardly ever, and with today's analysis that goes on, I honestly think he's quite easy to mark. He needs more variety in his game, which leads me back to one of my first points; has he actually improved since he came here?
 
Martial isn't a LW.

He is only playing there because he is better than Rashford, Lingard & even Sanchez as a winger. Hell, I think his debut goal against Liverpool where he took on 3 defenders on the left channel has made people assume that playing him at LW is the best to way to make him progress here.

His dribbling ability is overrated by many fans here - whilst his ability to drop deep, initiate play, make short passes & his finishing is underrated by a lot of fans. He isn't a great crosser either - so what exactly makes people think that LW is going to get the best out of him?

Yesterday he came on & made some few errors by losing the ball - that was not his fault; that was him trying to take on his man & dribble past the defenders as a makeshift LW would. He isn't going to get any better at that. How were his crosses? Not that great either.

When people complain about Martial's performances - it's irritating that they refuse to see that martial is not a proper LW & that he is playing in a position that shows off his weaknesses more often than his strengths.

The same thing happened with Rashford last year. He got played as a winger - all the fans complained about his performances & how he is not good enough for united - giving up because as a winger Rashford only played to 60-75% of his ability as any player in their wrong positions would.

Martial needs to play as a LF, a SS or a False nine. Playing him out wide & making him take on the RB & the RCB is only going to lead to his game being inconsistent.

Funny thing is - Martial was likened to Thierry Henry in the way he plays - who was inconsistent as a LW trying to take on the fullbacks & crossing all failing; but he got turned to a ST that would use the left channel especially on the counter at Arsenal & became deadly as hell. Martial has gone the other way - turning from a striker to a LW instead.

Ole knows what he is doing anyway- using the false nine of Lingard with Martial & Rashford on sides is just the start. Martial will take Lingards spot as the false nine, Rashford will take Martial's spot as the LF (not LW) whilst someone like Greenwood can play as the RF next year.
Good post mate. Agree with your opinion. This leaves us in a tricky position though. We have 4 players who's best position is as a forward. Rashford, Martial, Sanchez and Lukaku.
 
I really don't know where I stand with Martial. He has some quality that's for sure, but has he improved since he came here? I'm not actually sure he has. He may be our best actual finisher; if we're in a one on one situation it's probably him I'd want on the ball, but I also don't see him actually getting a chance to play up front much. Lukaku was obviously number one and now MAYBE Rashford is squeezing him for that position, which leaves Martial stuck out on the left. For me, he's far too reluctant to take players on. Maybe that's what has been drummed into him over the years by Managers we've had here because of their style of play, but far too often he simply turns back and passes backwards. Under the new management, that seems to be encouraging our players to attack and take on players, I don't feel like he has changed his own game too much. How many times does he go down the outside of player? Hardly ever, and with today's analysis that goes on, I honestly think he's quite easy to mark. He needs more variety in his game, which leads me back to one of my first points; has he actually improved since he came here?
You should read @Aloysius's Back 3 comments above. Martial isn't a winger, nor is he particularly exceptional dribbler/crosser. Fans have overrated these elements of his game and expect him to be player he never was.
He's wide forward with very good close control that likes to recireve ball in between lines and start attacking moves or peels off into chanells taking on centre backs instead of fullbacks. See his two assits against Cardiff and Bournemouth.
the arrivals of Ibrahimovic plus subsequent number change from 9 to 11 indicated we saw him as winger expected to be involved in all facets of play and thus his development stagnated for a few years. He didn't play in position which allowed him to demonstrate his strengths. Now with Ole arriving steps are being made to rectify this . First the removal of target man/focal point ie Ibrahimovic/Lukaku and deploying interchanging front three with false 9 in the middle , the next step will be finding ourselves a right sided forward to give us another rotation option whilst offloading Mata .
 
You should read @Aloysius's Back 3 comments above. Martial isn't a winger, nor is he particularly exceptional dribbler/crosser. Fans have overrated these elements of his game and expect him to be player he never was.
He's wide forward with very good close control that likes to recireve ball in between lines and start attacking moves or peels off into chanells taking on centre backs instead of fullbacks. See his two assits against Cardiff and Bournemouth.
the arrival of Ibrahimovic plus subsequent number change from 9 to 11 indicated we saw him as winger expected to be involved in all facets of play and thus his development stagnated for a few years. He didn't play in position which allowed him to demonstrate his strengths. Now with Ole arriving steps are being made to rectify this . First the removal of target man/focal point ie Ibrahimovic/Lukaku and deploying interchanging front three with false 9 in the middle , the next step will be finding ourselves a right sided forward to give us another rotation option whilst offloading Mata .

Fair comments and I did catch the the post you mentioned. Maybe more time is needed but I still don't see anything different in his game since Ole's arrival. I still think he's easy to mark out of a game due to a lack of variety. Ole is not certain to be here next year and neither is any of the management team that is currently working with the players (I'd be more than happy to continue with the current management but I'll save that for another thread). Which means a new Manager could come in and we COULD be back to square one with him. I'd be interested to know (not that we will ever find out) what assurances he's been made with regards to playing time/position. I can only assume that the powers that be within the club have in fact made a decision on a DOF or new Manager otherwise we're simply getting these guys to sign a new contacts so we don't lose them for less than they are worth.
 
His dribbling ability is overrated by many fans here - whilst his ability to drop deep, initiate play, make short passes & his finishing is underrated by a lot of fans. He isn't a great crosser either - so what exactly makes people think that LW is going to get the best out of him?
Although I agree with the rest of your post I find the highlighted part quite intresting. Who are you comparing his standard of dribbling to? Neymar? Messi? Dembele? And are you one of these people that class dribbiling just as his ability to cover a certain distance. It’s just his control and ability of the ball for me whilst dribbiling is a major part of his game and strength. We’ve seen him create many oppertunites due to his ability and control at speed with the ball. Personally I think you’re vastly underrating his dribbiling.

I don’t necessarily disagree with the winger thing but again what type of winger are you imagining when you say that as I would say he has the skill set for the modern winger but he isn’t going to be someone who goes down the line and whips in a ball but as say operating as a wide forward to me is where he’d do his most damage.
 
He might not be a LW but he's also not a CF.
I disagree in a sense that he's more a CF than a LW. He's a CF with far more to his locker than scoring goals. His playmaking ability, particularly, is criminally underrated. This is why he's more effective as part of a fluid front three where he gets ample time to go in the middle and either play CF or drop a bit deep to join the midfielders in creating. I believe he would be the most dangerous as a false nine, it's the one position tailor-made to his biggest strengths, playmaking and finishing.
 
I disagree in a sense that he's more a CF than a LW. He's a CF with far more to his locker than scoring goals. His playmaking ability, particularly, is criminally underrated. This is why he's more effective as part of a fluid front three where he gets ample time to go in the middle and either play CF or drop a bit deep to join the midfielders in creating. I believe he would be the most dangerous as a false nine, it's the one position tailor-made to his biggest strengths, playmaking and finishing.
He's at his best in the space between the LB and LCB. The more he touches the ball the better he is. First of all, I don't think he is good enough at pressing from the front, harassing CBs to play CF for most managers in a team that looks to press from the front. Admittedly, we don't have a sample to choose from.
However, I think he's an inside forward. A kind of mixture between Neymar and Dybala. Neither are CF, play on the inside and play it differently.
I don't see any problems playing him as part of a roaming front three as long as that front three are allowed to stay up the pitch.
I've said it many times, Martial is being hampered because of the lack of a RW. The reason Mourinho and Ole have told him to stay wide is beacue he's the best player at the club at doing it even though it's not his natural game. He still does it reasonably well. Martial is by far the best player at the club at beating players from a standing position. The managers tell him to stay wide most of the time because that quality means up to two players are taken out of the game at any time, leaving space for others. It's been better under Ole because he's allowed Pogba to drift to those areas and Shaw has been pushed higher up, which has freed Tony at various times in games.
A proper RW does the job Tony is being asked to do allowing him more time to drift into the space where he's at his best.
Furthermore, Martial can improve in his own side of things.
Another thing is I don't really think he's done much wrong since Ole has come. With a bit more luck he has at least three more goals, three more assists and the conversation is very different.
 
Happy with his renewal. Not thrilled because he still has to gain consistency, which hopefully will happen from now on.
 
He’s an important piece of a very potent attack at the moment. Him and Rashford looks to be our go to guys now, with Pogba pulling the strings. Long may it continue.
 
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