Anderson | 2013/14 Performances (on loan at Fiorentina)

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devilish said:
Zidane played at Juventus in CM behind Del Piero and Inzaghi. He may not be a goal machine like Scholes was but he could score a goal if he was given the occasion and his vision, intelligence and passing ability were simply top notch. He was also more then capable to start and end a game without running out of steam. Maybe the reason was that he never ate burgers at 1am.

Ando used to play behind the striker and under such circumstances you just have to be a decent finisher. Also his passing ability is average at best and so are his assists.
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Zidane was not a goal-scorer at all. He went a season in his peak scoring two goals in 40 games. He is very overrated as a goal-scorer because people remember his match-winning goals and apply that as his general performances.

He grew as a goal-scorer when he joined Real Madrid, but still just averaged 10 goals a season which is much less than Kagawa at Dortmund for example averaged.

He is good proofs that you can be one of the best AM's ever while averaging just a couple of goals a season. Of course Iniesta is another great example of it as well.
 
Annahnomoss said:
Zidane was not a goal-scorer at all. He went a season in his peak scoring two goals in 40 games. He is very overrated as a goal-scorer because people remember his match-winning goals and apply that as his general performances.

He grew as a goal-scorer when he joined Real Madrid, but still just averaged 10 goals a season which is much less than Kagawa at Dortmund for example averaged.

He is good proofs that you can be one of the best AM's ever while averaging just a couple of goals a season. Of course Iniesta is another great example of it as well.
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I haven't watch him alot at Madrid to be honest but as I said before, at Juventus he was a CM behind Del Piero (no 10) and Inzaghi. His assets were his vision, his intelligence and his passing abilities which were nothing short from WC.

Ando used to play just behind the striker at Porto. Under such circumstances he had to score goals. Also he lacked all the characteristics which made Zidane great and he couldn't last a game. He was a better eater though.
 
devilish said:
I haven't watch him alot at Madrid to be honest but as I said before, at Juventus he was a CM behind Del Piero (no 10) and Inzaghi. His assets were his vision, his intelligence and his passing abilities which were nothing short from WC.

Ando used to play just behind the striker at Porto. Under such circumstances he had to score goals. Also he lacked all the characteristics which made Zidane great and he couldn't last a game. He was a better eater though.
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He was a central attacking midfielder at Juventus and Real Madrid. There is no need to provide goals to be one of the best AM's in history. You can completely dominate games and be the match-winning player without scoring a goal or assist.

Iniesta is a great example of this.
 
Annahnomoss said:
He was a central attacking midfielder at Juventus and Real Madrid. There is no need to provide goals to be one of the best AM's in history. You can completely dominate games and be the match-winning player without scoring a goal or assist.

Iniesta is a great example of this.
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Zidane and Ando played in a different role though. If I remember well ando played just behind the striker at Porto (at Juve that role was covered by Del Piero). In fact Martin Ferguson compared him to Rooney. Zidane played as the most attacking player in central midfield behind del piero and inzaghi. In the latter case, ball possession, vision and ability to deliver the ball to the right channels is of paramount importance. In the latter case assists and goals are more important.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...ere-did-wrong-Anderson-Manchester-United.html

Also Zidane had various characteristics ando didn't had. Zidane was an intelligent player, with great vision and passing skills
 
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devilish said:
The role was different though. If I remember well ando played just behind the striker at Porto. Zidane played as the most attacking player in central midfield behind del piero and inzaghi. In andos case one simply has to score goals

Also had various characteristics ando didn't had. Zidane was an intelligent player, with great vision and passing skills
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I am not defending Anderson at all, just the statement that an attacking midfielder has to score goals. Usually the role you are describing is called a second striker though rather than an attacking midfielder.

That is when you suddenly are supposed to score goals and assist more frequently as part of your job. A second striker who doesn't score goals or assist and still isn't called an attacking midfielder would be really poor.
 
Annahnomoss said:
I am not defending Anderson at all, just the statement that an attacking midfielder has to score goals. Usually the role you are describing is called a second striker though rather than an attacking midfielder.

That is when you suddenly are supposed to score goals and assist more frequently as part of your job. A second striker who doesn't score goals or assist and still isn't called an attacking midfielder would be really poor.
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I am only saying why Ando couldn't retain his role at Porto with United (ie a mix of AM/Second striker) and the reason why SAF moved him in a deeper role. He simply didn't score enough goals and made enough assists.

One can't justify Ando (at Porto) with Zidane because they played in different roles. Zidane played in a much deeper position then the Brazilian and he had different priorities (ball retention, passing the ball to the right channels etc). If one had to compare him to a Juve player back to Zidane time then it would be Del Piero or as Martin Ferguson would say Wayne Rooney (although I believe they were both more attacking minded then Ando).
 
devilish said:
I am only saying why Ando couldn't retain his role at Porto with United (ie a mix of AM/Second striker) and the reason why SAF moved him in a deeper role. He simply didn't score enough goals and made enough assists.

One can't justify Ando (at Porto) with Zidane because they played in different roles. Zidane played in a much deeper position then the Brazilian and he had different priorities (ball retention, passing the ball to the right channels etc). If one had to compare him to a Juve player back to Zidane time then it would be Del Piero or as Martin Ferguson would say Wayne Rooney (although I believe they were both more attacking minded then Ando).
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Well one can argue that Anderson should have played as an attacking midfielder rather than as a central midfielder or at times even a defensive midfielder.
 
Annahnomoss said:
Well one can argue that Anderson should have played as an attacking midfielder rather than as a central midfielder or at times even a defensive midfielder.
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I think that the less effective Ando proved in more attacking roles, the more SAF moved him in a deeper role in a bid to save his career. SAF must have thought that the workhorse job would required less football intelligence then dictating United's tempo, created chances to score and passing the ball to the right channels.

However let us not blame SAF to Ando's demise. I doubt that it was SAF who told him not to remain fit or who gave the go ahead for Ando to eat crisps during pre season training or burgers at 1 am. If we need to blame something to the man it would be that he should have shipped this dead weight long ago.
 
People seem to forget he was a pretty decent player for us in his first couple of season. The slagging here does go a little overboard at times.
 
Annahnomoss said:
He was a central attacking midfielder at Juventus and Real Madrid. There is no need to provide goals to be one of the best AM's in history. You can completely dominate games and be the match-winning player without scoring a goal or assist.

Iniesta is a great example of this.
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Yeah and Anderson would be an absolutely terrible example of this.

Is the point you're making even clear in your own head?
 
ivaldo said:
People seem to forget he was a pretty decent player for us in his first couple of season. The slagging here does go a little overboard at times.
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More than decent, he was the best teenager in world football. It's a shame he never fulfilled his potential but suggesting he was never a good player is ridiculously wide of the mark.
 
mufcwarm92 said:
More than decent, he was the best teenager in world football. It's a shame he never fulfilled his potential but suggesting he was never a good player is ridiculously wide of the mark.
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He wasn't the best teenager in world football. For a start Fabregas was much better and has gone on to be miles ahead of him. He was good in his first season with us but to say he was the best teenager in the world is overrating him hugely, he's always had obvious deficiencies in passing and shooting and for an attacking midfielder that's fairly inexcusable
 
mufcwarm92 said:
More than decent, he was the best teenager in world football. It's a shame he never fulfilled his potential but suggesting he was never a good player is ridiculously wide of the mark.
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The best teenager in world football? Seriously?

I think one of the big problems with Ando was his hype. He was a good player with great potential and a terrible attitude nothing more and nothing less.
 
he's probably caalling him the best teenager in world football because of the golden boy thing he won. And anyway, he wasn't a patch on Messi or Fabregas at the time.
 
Anderson never really was an attacking midfielder. It's not the goals he scores (or doesn't), but his ability of decisive passing that makes him incapable. He can't the kick the ball very well, and doesn't have "the eye" either. No matter how much of a flair player Ronaldinho was, he also was also capable of some brilliant passing(not that him an Anderson are really comparable).

Anderson didn't really play in wrong position. He was quite brilliant in 2008, definitely a player like that would fit in our current squad too. He had huge energy, speed, strenght, dribbling ability and good enough passing to keep things moving. Having all those great players around didn't probably do any bad, but he certainly had great potential. We still saw some of it in the start of season 2011-12.
 
devilish said:
The best teenager in world football? Seriously?

I think one of the big problems with Ando was his hype. He was a good player with great potential and a terrible attitude nothing more and nothing less.
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Ibi Dreams said:
He wasn't the best teenager in world football. For a start Fabregas was much better and has gone on to be miles ahead of him. He was good in his first season with us but to say he was the best teenager in the world is overrating him hugely, he's always had obvious deficiencies in passing and shooting and for an attacking midfielder that's fairly inexcusable
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Fabregas wasn't a teenager at the time. Going on to be the better player isn't relevant to the debate here anyway - we are talking about how good he was as a teenager.

Anderson won the Golden Boy award without controversy as everyone seemed to agree. Messi broke through so early that he actually won it in 2005 - presumably it never gets given to the same player as Messi would have won several in a row. But best teenager in European football with the exception of Messi isn't a bad honour to have.

I really don't think he was overhyped at all on a purely talent basis. His stamina and injuries were a problem from an early stage, the attitude and diet issues surfaced a bit later, but he was impressing while playing regularly for the best team in Europe at the time. It's completely wrong to say he had 'obvious deficiencies' in his passing and he played such a deep role that he probably had no more than a handful of shots too. His energy, dribbling, speed and strength made him stand out as a serious player that seemed very much worth the fee in that first season.

I'm not denying his usefulness is all but gone and I'm not denying it's been a massive disappointment that he didn't hit the heights. I'm just defending his excellent debut season (and impressive form in between injuries for another couple of years), and it's pure fiction to say he was a poor player from the start.
 
ivaldo said:
People seem to forget he was a pretty decent player for us in his first couple of season. The slagging here does go a little overboard at times.
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You would expect with the fee that was paid for him to be at the very least 'pretty decent'.



mufcwarm92 said:
More than decent, he was the best teenager in world football. It's a shame he never fulfilled his potential but suggesting he was never a good player is ridiculously wide of the mark.
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No white text?
 
Rood said:
the list of winners of the Golden Boy award is actually very impressive - not all went on to be world class but Anderson sticks out a mile as the biggest failure:

Year Winner


2003 Rafael van der Vaart


2004 Wayne Rooney


2005 Lionel Messi


2006 Cesc Fàbregas


2007 Sergio Agüero


2008 Anderson


2009 Alexandre Pato


2010 Mario Balotelli


2011 Mario Götze


2012 Isco


2013 Paul Pogba
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I agree, though Pato also sticks out and Van der Vaart hardly set the world alight. Not sure anyone would have argued with them at the time though. Just the way of the world that some players kick on while others fall behind.
 
So.. any idea on what is the latest with this fellow. Is he back at United? Slimmer or fatter :lol: ?
 
mufcwarm92 said:
Fabregas wasn't a teenager at the time. Going on to be the better player isn't relevant to the debate here anyway - we are talking about how good he was as a teenager.

Anderson won the Golden Boy award without controversy as everyone seemed to agree. Messi broke through so early that he actually won it in 2005 - presumably it never gets given to the same player as Messi would have won several in a row. But best teenager in European football with the exception of Messi isn't a bad honour to have.

I really don't think he was overhyped at all on a purely talent basis. His stamina and injuries were a problem from an early stage, the attitude and diet issues surfaced a bit later, but he was impressing while playing regularly for the best team in Europe at the time. It's completely wrong to say he had 'obvious deficiencies' in his passing and he played such a deep role that he probably had no more than a handful of shots too. His energy, dribbling, speed and strength made him stand out as a serious player that seemed very much worth the fee in that first season.

I'm not denying his usefulness is all but gone and I'm not denying it's been a massive disappointment that he didn't hit the heights. I'm just defending his excellent debut season (and impressive form in between injuries for another couple of years), and it's pure fiction to say he was a poor player from the start.
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He wasn't overhyped? Seriously? Portuguese journalists compared him to Ronaldinho, SAF brother thought he is better then Rooney while united fans used to chant that he shits on Fabregas. What would you call that??
 
I know that I missed the initial posts that started it, but it is nevertheless amusing to wander into a thread in which the respective strengths/weaknesses of Anderson and Zinedine Zidane are being discussed.

What's the word on Anderson? Fiorentina sending him back our way?
 
devilish said:
Zidane played at Juventus in CM behind Del Piero and Inzaghi. He may not be a goal machine like Scholes was but he could score a goal if he was given the occasion and his vision, intelligence and passing ability were simply top notch.]
The point is goals were secondary to his role. Thus people trying to knock an Anderson for not being a goal getter is laughable. He was an attacking midfielder who's job was to create and who clearly did his best work ONLY in the final third. Fergia and his staff for some reason thought they could convert him to another Scholes. It failed (injuries, not quite making the transition) and he got stuck in limbo, not quite being a CM or an AM.

[Ando used to play behind the striker and under such circumstances you just have to be a decent finisher.] Not really. Finishing for an attacking midfielder is almost a luxury.

[ Also his passing ability is average at best and so are his assists.
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Now it most definitely is. When he first bought him it most certainly was not. People should stop mixing up what the see of Anderson now with what he was when we first bought him. For he is certainly not the same player in any shape or form. He is in fact much worse.
 
devilish said:
He wasn't overhyped? Seriously? Portuguese journalists compared him to Ronaldinho, SAF brother thought he is better then Rooney.....?
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All because that is what he was showing the potential of becoming. That is way different from people calling you what you are not. As youngster he was the real deal yet sadly he hasn't translated that into a steady career as a senior pro. It's not the first nor the last time that will happen.
 
jem said:
I know that I missed the initial posts that started it, but it is nevertheless amusing to wander into a thread in which the respective strengths/weaknesses of Anderson and Zinedine Zidane are being discussed.

What's the word on Anderson? Fiorentina sending him back our way?
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I think so. Apparently, he's said ta-ra to the Italian fans who supported him.
 
Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber said:
Now it most definitely is. When he first bought him it most certainly was not. People should stop mixing up what the see of Anderson now with what he was when we first bought him. For he is certainly not the same player in any shape or form. He is in fact much worse.
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I rated Ando as a kid but he certainly wasn't in Ronaldinho/Rooney level. He was very weak in scoring goals and he lacked the technique, intelligence and vision to reach that level. Honestly I saw him developing into a box to box player due to his strong frame, his ability to tackle (not great but not bad either) and his urge to be in the thick of the action. It wasn't meant tobe.

SAF himself said that he disagreed with his own brother about him rating him better then Rooney.
 
iBoss said:
When does his piece of paper saying he is apparently a Manchester United player expiring?
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Anderson's outstanding recent form and undoubted potential has been recognised with a new four-and-a-half-year contract extension, which will keep him at Old Trafford until at least June 2015.
 
His passing was inconsistent. Sometimes he would play some amazing passes, through the eye of the needle but he would attempt to try it again and it would fail. If he added consistency to his passing then he could of made it here.

The main issue was his stamina and injuries. He couldn't put a string of 7-8 games together without getting injured and most of the time he would only last 60-70 minutes in that game.

His ability to burst forward with the ball was exceptional though and would open up the game completely. Towards the end of his career here, that became less and less, he would be happy to sit back and just pass the ball side to side. It's a shame as the talent was definitely there but a number of factors led to his demise.

He will most likely be sold back to Brazil this summer.
 
mufcwarm92 said:
Well he was much more than pretty decent. If you can't see that and you've rewritten history the joke's on you.
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I cannot but blame Hargreaves' injury for Anderson's decline. He stopped functioning when Hargo's knees gave up completely. His own injuries & persistent lack of fitness worsened his case.

He featured alongside Hargreaves in the majority of our tough away games in 07/08 season & he gave a good account of himself especially at the Emirates and at Anfield.
 
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