[gr3yham3]

I don't understand why people think Herrera is not good enough for a team like us - do we expect our midfield to have players like Keane and Scholes all the time? All teams need a player or two who does almost all the things at a high, though maybe not world-class standard. Look at the players like Fletcher for example. Even Cleverley managed to win EPL titles with us while being quite a regular in our midfield.

My positives about Herrera:
1. He does more than his share in terms of defensive duties with his pressing, tackles and interceptions.
2. He provides much needed energy and passion in the middle of the pitch. Sometimes he is almost doing the work of 2 people in midfield.
3. He can pull off an assist as well as anyone we have currently on the pitch, especially with those slide-rule passes to our forwards.
4. He clearly truly loves the club and understands what we fans want to see. Comes off very well in interviews too.
5. When given a specific role by the manager to follow, he does it well. Playing under people like Bielsa in the past surely has helped in this aspect.


I am sure there are more, but let us look at perhaps some things that I feel he can be better at

1. His finishing this season has been off
2. He runs out of energy at the end of games at times, though this can be attributed to his playing style this season and the sheer amount of games we have had
3. His clearances can be a little panicky at times.
4. He does playact, but heck, so long as it helps us towards a win. Will always remember how SlippyG stamped on him and said his farewells in such a memorable manner.

To summarise, which player would those who doubt Herrera replace him with? Yes, there are arguably midfielders who are better than Herrera at tackling, or passing, or controlling a game, but that is not what he is meant to do on the pitch. Just look at games this season when he is not in the team, or when he was sent off like against Chelsea. Please try to be realistic and name players that we can possibly attain and can match his positives mentioned above. In fact, he is one of the best candidates to be club captain after Rooney leaves - it does not always need to be the best player at the club who is the captain. The ability to be well-spoken, carrying out and relaying information to the rest of the team, passion are all as important to be a captain.

 

[Obiorahking_]

Yes its difficult, but if you have the quality you will get in. Thiago, who is almost 2yrs younger, has 20 caps already. Also, you cant blame LvG, cos Herrera is not some teenage talent that needs to be developed.

Dont get me wrong, I like the lad, but a lot of United fans overrate him, and for me that is simply cos most of the other players around him are much worse.

Like Pogba and Carrick, both of whom I would argue are still among the EPL's best for their respective positions?

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Like Pogba and Carrick, both of whom I would argue are still among the EPL's best for their respective positions?

People saying he isn't as good as Carrick, well he hasn't exactly been first choice for England where every man and his dog can get a cap.

 

[cheeky_backheel]

1)Maybe thats because Spain is home to the best crop of CMs on the planet? have Iniesta, Koke, Saul, Thiago.
2) He finally started performing consistently this year and even got called up for the qualifier


He would definitely get into Chelsea. I rate him far higher than Matic and has more all round game than Fabregas. You saw the game he had vs Chelsea right? He had the sole role of marking Hazard out of the game and still outperformed their midifield.
He would replace both Toure and Fernandinho.
He would replace Wanyama at Spurs.

Thiago got his first cap at 20 but Herrera started perfroming consistently at 27? That is further proof he is not as good as some view him. Mata has 110 caps and even sergio roberto has more caps than him.

Cesc does not start at Chelsea, it is Matic+Kante, and both are better than Herrera. Nobody is nominating Herrera for POTY anytime soon.

Wanyama is much better DM and Dembele is a better CM. Same applies to Fernandinho and Yaya.

Even when he was at Bilbao, he wasnt setting la liga on fire.

Yes he has his good side and is tactically disciplined (even when he was at Bilbao) but that does not make him a better player than he really is.

 

[cheeky_backheel]

Like Pogba and Carrick, both of whom I would argue are still among the EPL's best for their respective positions?

Herrera is clearly better than the current Carrick, and anybody that thinks Carrick is among the EPL's best (in any position) is either drunk from too much koolaid or gotten high on baking flour

 

[Obiorahking_]

Thiago got his first cap at 20 but Herrera started perfroming consistently at 27? That is further proof he is not as good as some view him. Mata has 110 caps and even sergio roberto has more caps than him

Thiago is one of the best cms in the world right now?
Van Gaal never knew how to use him and stifled his growth.
Mata is an attacking midfielder and Roberto is a defender. Unfair use of comparison and you know it.

Cesc does not start at Chelsea, it is Matic+Kante, and both are better than Herrera. Nobody is nominating Herrera for POTY anytime soon.

You think Matic is better than Herrera. Nemanja Matic is better than Ander Herrera? You better have some sort of explanation.

Nobody is nominating Herrera for POTY anytime soon.

Red Herring. How does this address whether or not he wouldn't get into the best teams in the EPL

Wanyama is much better DM and Dembele is a better CM.

Herrera has outperformed Dembele this year in every regard. In fact, he isn't even a consistent starter for them.

Same applies to Fernandinho and Yaya.

This is outright outrangeous. Neither players demonstrate any superior quality to Ander Herrera this year.

 

[Obiorahking_]

Herrera is clearly better than the current Carrick, and anybody that thinks Carrick is among the EPL's best (in any position) is either drunk from too much koolaid or gotten high on baking flour

The holding role position is one of the league's weakest points. There are very few players who can be rock in front of the midfield while also controlling the tempo of the game with his passing range. Give Carrick a new pair of legs and he'd be #1

 

[El Jefe]

Herrera is a very good player but is the most overrated player on the Caf imo. Many posters here get so defensive over any bit of criticism of him no matter how constructive it may be.

Herrera is a very good all round player but I don't think he particularly excels at either of the defensive or attacking game. To explain the defensive side more before I get bombarded with stats comparing him with Kante, he is good at winning the ball back and pressing high up the pitch absolutely but lacks the nous to hold a position in front of the back four and intelligently mop up the play. That is why at 35 Carrick is still so vital to our play and why we are heavily being linked with Fabinho and Dier.

In terms of his attacking game, he's skilled on the ball and has provided some very good assists but his building up of play is very average and in games without Pogba he's looked almost clueless when the onus is on him to be our link between midfield and attack. He has a limited passing range and also often passes back to often. In addition to this we can't rely on him to score goals as his shooting is poor.

This leaves him being suited to a 3 man midfield role which he is best at because he's good at most things but excels at nothing. He's a player for me who should face massive competition for his place next season.

 

[cheeky_backheel]

The holding role position is one of the league's weakest points. There are very few players who can be rock in front of the midfield while also controlling the tempo of the game with his passing range. Give Carrick a new pair of legs and he'd be #1

Yes and we can also give Fellaini a new brain while we are at it. I am not interested in dealing in hypotheticals

 

[Obiorahking_]

Herrera is a very good player but is the most overrated player on the Caf imo. Many posters here get so defensive over any bit of criticism of him no matter how constructive it may be.

Herrera is a very good all round player but I don't think he particularly excels at either of the defensive or attacking game. To explain the defensive side more before I get bombarded with stats comparing him with Kante, he is good at winning the ball back and pressing high up the pitch absolutely but lacks the nous to hold a position in front of the back four and intelligently mop up the play. That is why at 35 Carrick is still so vital to our play and why we are heavily being linked with Fabinho and Dier.

In terms of his attacking game, he's skilled on the ball and has provided some very good assists but his building up of play is very average and in games without Pogba he's looked almost clueless when the onus is on him to be our link between midfield and attack. He has a limited passing range and also often passes back to often. In addition to this we can't rely on him to score goals as his shooting is poor.

This leaves him being suited to a 3 man midfield role which he is best at because he's good at most things but excels at nothing. He's a player for me who should face massive competition for his place next season.

What position do you think Herrera plays? Superman? Because based on your description you seem to want Herrera perform the role of both a B2B midfielder and a deep lying holding CM at the same time.

 

[Obiorahking_]

He has a limited passing range and also often passes back to often.

60% of his passes are forward passes.
He is among the top cms in the league with regards to chances created
That pass for Rashford's goals says otherwise.

 

[Akshay]

Herrera is a very good all round player but I don't think he particularly excels at either of the defensive or attacking game. To explain the defensive side more before I get bombarded with stats comparing him with Kante, he is good at winning the ball back and pressing high up the pitch absolutely but lacks the nous to hold a position in front of the back four and intelligently mop up the play. That is why at 35 Carrick is still so vital to our play and why we are heavily being linked with Fabinho and Dier.

Kante is also good at pressing and winning the ball back, it's Matic who sits deeper and shields the back four. That's not a fault of players like Kante or Herrera, it's simply a different role.

 

[cheeky_backheel]

Thiago is one of the best cms in the world right now?
Van Gaal never knew how to use him and stifled his growth.
Mata is an attacking midfielder and Roberto is a defender. Unfair use of comparison and you know it.

Thiago is not the best CM in the world but that he can break into the Spain NT at an earlier date than Herrera supports the point that he is better than Herrera.
The comparison is not unfair when you argue that the failure of a player to make the cut for his NT at 27yrs is due to a 2yr managerial hiccup. Even before United, he wasnt some la liga midfield star at Bilbao. He did not make the NT back then and so you cannot blame his failure on van gaal (who has the same philosphy as Bielsa who coached Herrera at Bilbao). Other players have broken into the NT at a much younger age and his failure to do so shows his lack of needed quality.

You think Matic is better than Herrera. Nemanja Matic is better than Ander Herrera? You better have some sort of explanation.

I will do you one better - Matic is the best DM in the EPL

Red Herring. How does this address whether or not he wouldn't get into the best teams in the EPL

cos one of the players at a midfield you think he could get into is up for consideration.

Herrera has outperformed Dembele this year in every regard. In fact, he isn't even a consistent starter for them.
This is outright outrangeous. Neither players demonstrate any superior quality to Ander Herrera this year.

Both Fernadinho and Wanyama are better DMs than Herrera, but then Herrera is not a true DM. Even at Bilbao he wasnt the best DM (that honor went to Iturraspe)
As a CM, Dembele > Current Yaya> Herrera. They are better in almost every aspect of the game, except for Yaya lacking pace.
Dembele's influence on spurs midfield is similar to Pogba in ours - they are just totally different without him. He is essentially a poor mans Pogba. Herrera is not close.
Current Yaya is more debatable as he does show his age, but I will still take him over Herrera.

 

[anant]

Thiago is not the best CM in the world but that he can break into the Spain NT at an earlier date than Herrera supports the point that he is better than Herrera.

I'm sorry but going by this logic- Januzaj>Carrasco because he made his NT debut at a younger age

 

[Di Maria's angel]

He cant even get into the Spanish NT at 27 and has only 2 caps so far. Even in the EPL, he would not get into the midfield at Chelsea, City and Tottenham. Arsenal and Liverpool are debatable.

He would get into Citys midfield easily.

 

[El Jefe]

What position do you think Herrera plays? Superman? Because based on your description you seem to want Herrera perform the role of both a B2B midfielder and a deep lying holding CM at the same time.

I want to reply to your comments but I'm not sure its worth it as you've spouted some shite in this thread so far. Herrera is far away from being as good as you think he is.

Surely this is a joke?
Bar Madrid. Bayern, and Atletico, he'd get into any starting XI.

He would definitely get into Chelsea. I rate him far higher than Matic and has more all round game than Fabregas
He would replace Wanyama at Spurs.

Herrera has outperformed Dembele this year in every regard. In fact, he isn't even a consistent starter for them.

 

[Akshay]

Thiago is not the best CM in the world but that he can break into the Spain NT at an earlier date than Herrera supports the point that he is better than Herrera.
The comparison is not unfair when you argue that the failure of a player to make the cut for his NT at 27yrs is due to a 2yr managerial hiccup. Even before United, he wasnt some la liga midfield star at Bilbao. He did not make the NT back then and so you cannot blame his failure on van gaal (who has the same philosphy as Bielsa who coached Herrera at Bilbao). Other players have broken into the NT at a much younger age and his failure to do so shows his lack of needed quality.

I couldn't give a stuffing about who breaks into their NT when. It took David de Gea until last year to become the Spanish #1, it says absolutely nothing about his quality for several years before that.

 

[Lawman]

1) please tell me how the general opinion is that Rooney isn't a finished product? Have you not checked the performance thread in 2 years?
2) The general consensus that Blind was a great center back is a falsehood, hence the reason we bought Baily?
2) Lingard is great off the ball, he just can't make use of it when a ball is played in his direction, but that is another discussion.

Check the Rooney, Lingard and Blind thread last season and come back.

 

[gr3yham3]

How is Matic the best DM in the EPL? To me, he seems solid this season due to Kante's energy and tackling beside him. I didn't even notice him much on the pitch when Chelsea played us this season at Old Trafford. Anyway, the comparison does not really make sense as Herrera is not a DM.

The closest midfielder that I can think of who plays like Herrera is Thiago, but sure, compare Herrera to one of the best midfielders in this generation who plays for the top club in Germany. Bar Thiago, I cannot think of another midfielder who can replace Herrera in his current form. Speaking of the NT, which other Spanish midfielder in the EPL has made it as a regular in that midfield of theirs in recent years?

Is Herrera like, the best midfielder in the league? Of course not. Is there another replacement for what he currently brings to the team? None that are readily available. I think it is a syndrome that many United fans have - we tend to think there are better options out there when it really is not that simple. I have to admit that I am guilty at times when it comes to this too. People here were complaining about Pogba and how we should have got Kante or someone else for that money, and then realise how important he is to our game when he was out for a few matches. Will it take a prolonged absence from Herrera for people to realise that about him too?

 

[Lawman]

Based on what? Who do you think should replace him?

Keep in mind I'm not chief scout if you are going to question my choices. I think Herrera is our modern day Nicky Butt (not style wise) but ranking order. Kovacic I would like who wouldn't cost the earth. I think he's a better player. I do think Herrera is poor at 6 and would benifit from a good 6 behind him like Fabinho or even Romeluo (Southampton) could do a job at a cheaper price (not saying he's better but he'd compliment both Pogba and Herrera).

 

[Lawman]

Nope. His average pass length is almost 17m and more than 60% of his passes are forward. By the way he creates far more chances than most central midfielders in the league while having a comparable or better pass completion. So he doesn't play it safe, nor is he erratic. And you still haven't explained what qualifies as a good assist record for a central midfielder and who in the league has achieved that this season.

Not that I think it's a bad thing Herrera has a wicked cross on him and that's where he has a few assists. Midfielders are not all about the assists its more the pass before the assist. If you think Herrera is creative then we see football differently. He's a busy player who has a decent short game he struggles hitting passes and longer than 20 yards and hasn't got the football brain to play as a 6.

 

[Akshay]

Not that I think it's a bad thing Herrera has a wicked cross on him and that's where he has a few assists. Midfielders are not all about the assists its more the pass before the assist. If you think Herrera is creative then we see football differently. He's a busy player who has a decent short game he struggles hitting passes and longer than 20 yards and hasn't got the football brain to play as a 6.

Well sure, I don't think central midfielders should be judged mostly by their assists but you said he had a poor record when he hasn't. He's also very good at playing those forward balls into space along the ground for our attackers to run onto, and he's created quite a few chances that way. He's not one for the aerial long balls but we have Pogba who loves hitting those anyway.

Herrera isn't a creative player like Pogba or Fabregas but he offers more in that vein than most other ball winning midfielders. He's also not best employed as a holding midfielder who sits back, it's a complete waste of his energy to do that. That doesn't make him a bad player, unless you think Kante is poor too.

If you don't like box to box midfielders, or midfielders who defend by pressing that's fair enough, but I do think you're constantly changing the goalposts in order to justify your criticism of Herrera.

 

[cheeky_backheel]

I'm sorry but going by this logic- Januzaj>Carrasco because he made his NT debut at a younger age

Wrong logic!
Januzaj is 22 and has 6 caps while Carrasco is 23 and has 16
Herrera is 27 has 2 caps while Thiago is 26 and has 20 caps i.e Thiago is younger, debuted earlier and has more caps thus Herrera's failure cannot be blamed on Van Gaal

 

[Lawman]

Well sure, I don't think central midfielders should be judged mostly by their assists but you said he had a poor record when he hasn't. He's also very good at playing those forward balls into space along the ground for our attackers to run onto, and he's created quite a few chances that way. He's not one for the aerial long balls but we have Pogba who loves hitting those anyway.

Herrera isn't a creative player like Pogba or Fabregas but he offers more in that vein than most other ball winning midfielders. He's also not best employed as a holding midfielder who sits back, it's a complete waste of his energy to do that. That doesn't make him a bad player, unless you think Kante is poor too.

If you don't like box to box midfielders, or midfielders who defend by pressing that's fair enough, but I do think you're constantly changing the goalposts in order to justify your criticism of Herrera.

No you are putting stuff in that's nonsense like me not liking b2b players or Kante. Herrera is neither. He's rotten at attacking (offers no goal threat) and lacks quality on the ball and the ability to be a playmaker or as a 6. If you don't agree fine but it's getting boring now. Time will tell but this reeks of the Blind and Lingard thread. I do agree there are a right few who should be replaced before we get to Herrera.

 

[cheeky_backheel]

I couldn't give a stuffing about who breaks into their NT when. It took David de Gea until last year to become the Spanish #1, it says absolutely nothing about his quality for several years before that.

Why cant you follow basic logic?

De Gea had his debut at 24 and at 26 he already has about 20 caps. The fact that he is a GK (single position with less rotation) makes it clear he is the best they have.

 

[gr3yham3]

Wrong logic!
Januzaj is 22 and has 6 caps while Carrasco is 23 and has 16
Herrera is 27 has 2 caps while Thiago is 26 and has 20 caps i.e Thiago is younger, debuted earlier and has more caps thus Herrera's failure cannot be blamed on Van Gaal

You mentioned that we should not judge by stats yet you are using stats here to show that Herrera is inadequate for us. Sure, that will mean that Scholes' 66 caps for England means that he is a worse player than Lampard, who also made his NT debut at 21 compared to Scholes' age of 23 I think.

I think it is clear that Jose wants 'fighters' in the team who give their all - he is not going to allow people to faff around on the pitch and not put in a shift. Herrera puts in 100% all the time and is quite clearly one of the players Jose trusts with instructions, specific or not. Again, for those who think Herrera can be easily replaced - with whom then? Name me someone who offers the same as Herrera currently does.

 

[Akshay]

Why cant you follow basic logic?

De Gea had his debut at 24 and at 26 he already has about 20 caps. The fact that he is a GK (single position with less rotation) makes it clear he is the best they have.

Ok, Cleverley made his debut for England at 23. Is he a better midfielder than Herrera too?

 

[cheeky_backheel]

How is Matic the best DM in the EPL? To me, he seems solid this season due to Kante's energy and tackling beside him. I didn't even notice him much on the pitch when Chelsea played us this season at Old Trafford. Anyway, the comparison does not really make sense as Herrera is not a DM.

If Matic is not the best, then state who is. Since he cam back to Chelsea, he has been the best DM in the EPL imo

The closest midfielder that I can think of who plays like Herrera is Thiago, but sure, compare Herrera to one of the best midfielders in this generation who plays for the top club in Germany. Bar Thiago, I cannot think of another midfielder who can replace Herrera in his current form. Speaking of the NT, which other Spanish midfielder in the EPL has made it as a regular in that midfield of theirs in recent years?

The atletico trio of Gabi, Saul and Koke are all better than Herrera. Also Herrera was at Bilbao before joining United, and he still failed to break into the NT, so its not because he is playing abroad.

Is Herrera like, the best midfielder in the league? Of course not. Is there another replacement for what he currently brings to the team? None that are readily available. I think it is a syndrome that many United fans have - we tend to think there are better options out there when it really is not that simple. I have to admit that I am guilty at times when it comes to this too. People here were complaining about Pogba and how we should have got Kante or someone else for that money, and then realise how important he is to our game when he was out for a few matches. Will it take a prolonged absence from Herrera for people to realise that about him too?

Quality of a player is not the only determining factor in evaluating how well a player fits in a team but that a player fits does not mean his quality is higher than it truly is. For example, Benzema is a great fit to CR, but that doesnt make him a better striker than he is. Herrera is a good fit for the team but that is what it is.

As for the hype on Kante, I will reserve my judgement until he can perform at same level twice a week. It easy to run around like the energizer bunny when you can look forward to almost a week of rest before the next game.

 

[Akshay]

No you are putting stuff in that's nonsense like me not liking b2b players or Kante. Herrera is neither. He's rotten at attacking (offers no goal threat) and lacks quality on the ball and the ability to be a playmaker or as a 6. If you don't agree fine but it's getting boring now. Time will tell but this reeks of the Blind and Lingard thread. I do agree there are a right few who should be replaced before we get to Herrera.

By no. 6, I assume you mean a player like Matic who sits back and shields the defense right? Which neither Kante nor Herrera do. All the criticisms you've made of Herrera apply equally (or more) to Kante. You continue to say things like he's poor on the ball or can't be a playmaker despite the fact that he's created numerous chances for us and provided more assists than most central midfielders in the league.

 

[cheeky_backheel]

You mentioned that we should not judge by stats yet you are using stats here to show that Herrera is inadequate for us. Sure, that will mean that Scholes' 66 caps for England means that he is a worse player than Lampard, who also made his NT debut at 21 compared to Scholes' age of 23 I think.

I think it is clear that Jose wants 'fighters' in the team who give their all - he is not going to allow people to faff around on the pitch and not put in a shift. Herrera puts in 100% all the time and is quite clearly one of the players Jose trusts with instructions, specific or not. Again, for those who think Herrera can be easily replaced - with whom then? Name me someone who offers the same as Herrera currently does.

Seems you still cant get the logic <facepalm>

That Mourinho likes him or he suits the team does not make him a better player than he truly is.

 

[cheeky_backheel]

Ok, Cleverley made his debut for England at 23. Is he a better midfielder than Herrera too?

and cleverley is now spanish - WTF?

 

[Akshay]

and cleverley is now spanish - WTF?

No, the point you seem to be missing is that NT selection has little to do with a player's quality. You can't decide a player is poor simply because he didn't make his national team in a stacked position before the age of 27.

Not to mention it also has no bearing on how good he is at the age of 27 - which is what we're discussing.

 

[cheeky_backheel]

No, the point you seem to be missing is that NT selection has little to do with a player's quality. You can't decide a player is poor simply because he didn't make his national team in a stacked position before the age of 27.

Not to mention it also has no bearing on how good he is at the age of 27 - which is what we're discussing.

You can, when you consider the players that have been ahead of him and cant provide any other non-footballing reasons to justify his omission.

Still I have not said Herrera is poor, but simply that he is not as good as some fans seem to think.

 

[anant]

Wrong logic!
Januzaj is 22 and has 6 caps while Carrasco is 23 and has 16
Herrera is 27 has 2 caps while Thiago is 26 and has 20 caps i.e Thiago is younger, debuted earlier and has more caps thus Herrera's failure cannot be blamed on Van Gaal

But look at the age when they made their debuts!
Welbeck has double the caps of Harry Kane despite being just 1 year older. He also made his debut at a younger age. Baines and Rose made their NT debuts at the age of 26, Shaw at 19, Gibbs at 21. Van Nistelrooy has 70 caps while Huntelaar has 76.
People have already given examples of DDG and Scholes.
NT debut age and the number of caps hardly matters. It purely depends when a player peaks. Some are late bloomers, some are wonderkids

 

[Akshay]

You can, when you consider the players that have been ahead of him and cant provide any other non-footballing reasons to justify his omission.

Still I have not said Herrera is poor, but simply that he is not as good as some fans seem to think.

I didn't agree with whoever said he'd walk into Real, Barca, Bayern teams etc. I do think he has been one of our better players this season, and I think he's United caliber going forward.

 

[cheeky_backheel]

But look at the age when they made their debuts!
Welbeck has double the caps of Harry Kane despite being just 1 year older. He also made his debut at a younger age. Baines and Rose made their NT debuts at the age of 26, Shaw at 19, Gibbs at 21. Van Nistelrooy has 70 caps while Huntelaar has 76.
People have already given examples of DDG and Scholes.
NT debut age and the number of caps hardly matters. It purely depends when a player peaks. Some are late bloomers, some are wonderkids

Its not just about when you debut. That point was brought up to counter the notion that his failure to make it in the NT was related to Van Gaal, which is not true, cos if he was that good he would have broken in earlier.
Kane is 23 and already has 17 caps, Baines, Gibbs and Rose are not great players and Shaw we will see how is career pans out when he is older.
Ruud had less caps cos of injury, but at 27 he already had about 40 caps. At 27, scholes had almost 50 caps.
Herrera has only 2 caps at 27yrs while several players of same generation or younger have significantly more. He was at the U21 with Mata and Juan has 110 caps
So Herrera is going to bloom when he is 30+? He was not a wonderkid and doubt there will be any late blooming.

Again, it doesnt mean is a bad player, but that he is simply not as good as some would profess.

 

[cheeky_backheel]

I didn't agree with whoever said he'd walk into Real, Barca, Bayern teams etc. I do think he has been one of our better players this season, and I think he's United caliber going forward.

If he cannot get into the top teams, and United want to be one of the top teams, then you should not have a player of Herrera caliber in your team. If Herrera is in United starting XI, it simply cos we have not found the opportunity to sign a better player.

 

[anant]

Its not just about when you debut. That point was brought up to counter the notion that his failure to make it in the NT was related to Van Gaal, which is not true, cos if he was that good he would have broken in earlier.
Kane is 23 and already has 17 caps, Baines, Gibbs and Rose are not great players and Shaw we will see how is career pans out when he is older.
Ruud had less caps cos of injury, but at 27 he already had about 40 caps. At 27, scholes had almost 50 caps.
Herrera has only 2 caps at 27yrs while several players of same generation or younger have significantly more. He was at the U21 with Mata and Juan has 110 caps
So Herrera is going to bloom when he is 30+? He was not a wonderkid and doubt there will be any late blooming.

Again, it doesnt mean is a bad player, but that he is simply not as good as some would profess.

The world's 2nd best GK at the age of 26 has 20 caps! Most top GKs would be having more caps than that if they are supposedly the world's best. So let's sell Dave as well!
Also, Juan has 41 caps and not 110 caps that you are using to favour your argument

 

[Lawman]

By no. 6, I assume you mean a player like Matic who sits back and shields the defense right? Which neither Kante nor Herrera do. All the criticisms you've made of Herrera apply equally (or more) to Kante. You continue to say things like he's poor on the ball or can't be a playmaker despite the fact that he's created numerous chances for us and provided more assists than most central midfielders in the league.

What part of not a good passer do you not get? Plus why keep bringing Kante into it? I've never mentioned him once??

 

[K2K]

If he cannot get into the top teams, and United want to be one of the top teams, then you should not have a player of Herrera caliber in your team. If Herrera is in United starting XI, it simply cos we have not found the opportunity to sign a better player.

Is thos the same Barca team that gives games to Andre Gomes?

Yeah right.