A. Young | Guardian: Medical today

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Freak said:
Because that would mean we would have lesser to spend on a CM, a position that needs more attention. Especially if you look our (supposed) targets - Modric, Sneijder - players that would cost more than around 30 million themselves. Also considering De Gea would (most probably) sign for around 18million, that's a lot of money spent on just 3 players, one of whom would only act as cover to Nani/Valencia.
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You don't know what our summer transfer budget is.
 
Freak said:
Because that would mean we would have lesser to spend on a CM, a position that needs more attention. Especially if you look our (supposed) targets - Modric, Sneijder - players that would cost more than around 30 million themselves. Also considering De Gea would (most probably) sign for around 18million, that's a lot of money spent on just 3 players, one of whom would only act as cover to Nani/Valencia.
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How do you know it means we'd have less to spend on a CM? Have you got some kind of insight into how much money SAF is allowed to spend that the rest of us haven't seen? Do you think you are better placed to make decisions on transfers than him?

Here's a thought, why not wait and see how the summer pans out, and put a little faith in a man who has shown us time after time that he kinda knows what he's doing?
 
towcester_red said:
because £20m is mental for a player with 1 year remaining on his contract, we would have been royally taken to the cleaners.

Ozil went for 12m with 1 year remaining.
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And all signings of players with 12 months remaining on there deals are directly comparable? There's no other variable factors in transfer fees?
 
How often has SAF spent that sort of money each on 3 players in the same transfer season? I don't know what our budget is, but you only need to look at the patterns of how we have spent in the past.
 
MacMUFC said:
Go to the update thread. Plenty of the papers are in agreement of the price.
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Yes.

Daily Mail claimed yesterday that we were signing for 15Mil, now that price has been increased to 20Mil.

Express is Claiming that we'll sign for 20Mil.

Mirror claims that we are signing for 16Mil.

Indeed Plenty of papers are in agreement of the price.
 
Freak said:
How often has SAF spent that sort of money each on 3 players in the same transfer season? I don't know what our budget is, but you only need to look at the patterns of how we have spent in the past.
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In the 2007 transfer window. When we signed Anderson, Nani, Hargreaves and Tevez(two year on loan with 5m paid for every loan every year).

Just four years ago.
 
R_Nick said:
If SAF decides that Young is a player he wants in his squad and that he's willing to pay £20m to bring him in, why do you any of you guys give a stuff how much he is signed for?

If we sign him for £20m or £12m, what difference will that make to you?
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It contradicts his notion of value for one. Something I dont get is why people dont care how much their club spend, because its not coming out of their pocket (thats effectively what you're saying, or have I misinterpreted?). If thats the case, would it not bother you if we spent £30m,40m,50m on Young? Of course it would, and it bothers me that - in my eyes - we're overpaying for a player.

Clearly, there is no direct effect on me. I will get on with my life, but at the end of the day, i'm a supporter and like any other supporter I want to see my team do well. If I think we're signing a player who is not essential for the club, then yes, I will 'give a stuff'.
 
R_Nick said:
And all signings of players with 12 months remaining on there deals are directly comparable? There's no other variable factors in transfer fees?
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Young isn't worth 20m pounds, let alone worth 20m pounds with 12 months left on his contract.
 
Freak said:
How often has SAF spent that sort of money each on 3 players in the same transfer season? I don't know what our budget is, but you only need to look at the patterns of how we have spent in the past.
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How often do 2 of the biggest names on our team sheet retire in the same year(Scholes,VDS), Neville retired this year as well. Those are 3 players. Add to that we're not offering Hargo new contract - our squad is decimated by 4. With so many goers I can't see why not go for a little spending spree, having in mind we haven't really in some years.
 
Freak said:
None of them cost above 20 million.
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Nani cost 17 Million, Hargreaves costed 17 Mil and when Ando was signed the Porto board announced that they have received 30Mil Euros from us.

Young when he signs will be around this figure also.
 
towcester_red said:
If you cant see thats ridiculous then il just leave it there.

If we sign him we wont pay anywhere near that crazy figure.
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What's ridiculous? Do you accept that there are other variables than the length of time remaining on a contract or not?

Enigma_87 said:
Young isn't worth 20m pounds, let alone worth 20m pounds with 12 months left on his contract.
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If Manchester United sign Ashley Young for £20m then that's exactly what he's worth according to the market. You or I don't need to agree with it, it is what it is, and if SAF thinks it's worth it then that's good enough for me.
 
I'm still hoping that this is all a load of nonsense and wont actually happen.

I'd actually rather we signed no one than signed Ashley Young.
 
Freak said:
Because that would mean we would have lesser to spend on a CM, a position that needs more attention. Especially if you look our (supposed) targets - Modric, Sneijder - players that would cost more than around 30 million themselves. Also considering De Gea would (most probably) sign for around 18million, that's a lot of money spent on just 3 players, one of whom would only act as cover to Nani/Valencia.
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You really think SAF would spend this money if he thought it would leave him without enough for other players he wants to get?
 
KM said:
Nani cost 17 Million, Hargreaves costed 17 Mil and when Ando was signed the Porto board announced that they have received 30Mil Euros from us.

Young when he signs will be around this figure also.
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We spent a reported 50 million total on those players. So if we're using that as a comparison, signing young (20 million) and de gea(18 million) would put leave us with 12 million for a midfielder. Looking at who we have been linked with (Modric, Sneijder), we won't be able to sign our supposed targets with that 12 million.

My point about having lesser to spend on a centre mid, where re-inforcements are desperately need, by signing young for 20 million still stands.
 
R_Nick said:
What's ridiculous? Do you accept that there are other variables than the length of time remaining on a contract or not?
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Yeh there are other variables, Young wants to leave and Villa wont want to lose him for anything. By all accounts Young wants to come to Old Trafford, so to come in with an offer of anything more than £12-14m would be crazy and il be amazed if im wrong.

Especially after all Fergie says about value aswell.
 
R_Nick said:
If Manchester United sign Ashley Young for £20m then that's exactly what he's worth according to the market. You or I don't need to agree with it, it is what it is, and if SAF thinks it's worth it then that's good enough for me.
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I don't agree. If this was the case Bebe is worth as much as VDV according to the market.

We tend to overpay for players.

If Fergie keeps saying there's no value on the market, can't see what value is there in 20m Young. He's a good player but that's that. Can't see being an improvement on what we've got, and paying 20m for a squad player is a bit too much I reckon.

Young isn't worth 20m, neither is Carroll at 35m. If someone is that stupid to pay it doesn't mean that's the price.
 
Freak said:
We spent a reported 50 million total on those players. So if we're using that as a comparison, signing young (20 million) and de gea(18 million) would put leave us with 12 million for a midfielder. Looking at who we have been linked with (Modric, Sneijder), we won't be able to sign our supposed targets with that 12 million.

My point about having lesser to spend on a centre mid, where re-inforcements are desperately need, by signing young for 20 million still stands.
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17+17+25.5=59.5 i.e the amount we spent that summer plus the amount we spent on securing Tevez's loan(5m for one year, 10m in total) makes that figure near 70Mil.

Which makes it 32Mil for us to spend on Sneijder/Modric which are more than enough to sign him.
 
Freak said:
We spent a reported 50 million total on those players. So if we're using that as a comparison, signing young (20 million) and de gea(18 million) would put leave us with 12 million for a midfielder. Looking at who we have been linked with (Modric, Sneijder), we won't be able to sign our supposed targets with that 12 million.

My point about having lesser to spend on a centre mid, where re-inforcements are desperately need, by signing young for 20 million still stands.
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It really doesn't.

You're speculating about a potential spending spree of 50 million quid in one summer (because you've decided that there's absolutely no chance we'll spend more than we did in the summer when we signed Anderson et al) and you've decided that there's absolutely no chance Fergie will go above that hypothetical limit of 50 million limit, by a few million quid, in order to sign the players he wants.

It's assumption, on assumption on assumption. Ridiculous.
 
KM said:
17+17+25.5=59.5 i.e the amount we spent that summer plus the amount we spent on securing Tevez's loan(5m for one year, 10m in total) makes that figure near 70Mil.

Which makes it 32Mil for us to spend on Sneijder/Modric which are more than enough to sign him.
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Hargreaves signed for around 17m (wikipedia). BBC lists Anderson and Nani for a combined transfer fee of 30 million (other websites lists it as 35 mil). I'm not sure how you got 59.5
 
Pogue Mahone said:
It really doesn't.

You're speculating about a potential spending spree of 50 million quid in one summer (because you've decided that there's absolutely no chance we'll spend more than we did in the summer when we signed Anderson et al) and you've decided that there's absolutely no chance Fergie will go above that hypothetical limit of 50 million limit, by a few million quid, in order to sign the players he wants.

It's assumption, on assumption on assumption. Ridiculous.
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The whole transfer forum is based on assumptions and rumours though. Ridiculous eh?

And where did I say there's absolutely no chance fergie will go over that limit? Please point that out to me. I just took a comparison from our biggest spending seasons from our recent past.
 
It seems perfectly reasonable to me that the reason Fergie hasn't spent 'big' in recent transfer windows is the exact situation we find ourselves in this summer.
 
Freak said:
The whole transfer forum is based on assumptions and rumours though. Ridiculous eh?

And where did I say there's absolutely no chance fergie will go over that limit? Please point that out to me. I just took a comparison from our biggest spending seasons from our recent past.
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You're arguing the toss about exactly how much we spent in that summer. If you accept that it's, at best, a very rough guide for the type of money we could spend this summer then why on earth are you quibbling about exactly how much Hargreaves and Anderson cost?

The simple fact remains, as KM has already pointed out to you, SAF has proven willing to spend a lot of money on transfers when he thinks it necessary. This means, he's not going to pull the plug on whoever he has his eye on for central midfield, just because the cost of signing Young ends up being closer to 20m than the 13m valuation you slapped on him.
 
Freak said:
The whole transfer forum is based on assumptions and rumours though. Ridiculous eh?

And where did I say there's absolutely no chance fergie will go over that limit? Please point that out to me. I just took a comparison from our biggest spending seasons from our recent past.
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You forget one thing tho - inflation of the market.
 
towcester_red said:
Yeh there are other variables, Young wants to leave and Villa wont want to lose him for anything. By all accounts Young wants to come to Old Trafford, so to come in with an offer of anything more than £12-14m would be crazy and il be amazed if im wrong.

Especially after all Fergie says about value aswell.
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We paid £7m for a player who Fergie admitted he'd never even seen play last year.

I wouldn't care if we signed Young for £2m to be honest. Why pay money for a player who is in his midtwenties and would make your first team worse than it is currently?
 
Freak said:
Hargreaves signed for around 17m (wikipedia). BBC lists Anderson and Nani for a combined transfer fee of 30 million (other websites lists it as 35 mil). I'm not sure how you got 59.5
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Ok I'm going out of this thread as it seems that you can't be able to grasp this concept.

Hargreaves was signed for 17M

Nani was signed for 17M or 25.5Mil Euros as said by this document released by Sporting:
http://web3.cmvm.pt/english/sdi2004/emitentes/docs/FR13708.pdf

Anderson was signed for 30Mil Euros as said by this document released by Porto:
http://www.fcporto.pt/IncFCP/pdf/Investor_Relations/FactosRelevantes/VendaAnderson2junho07.pdf

Not sure why I'm going into this argument with you, as it's a thread about Young, but there you go.
 
noodlehair said:
We paid £7m for a player who Fergie admitted he'd never even seen play last year.

I wouldn't care if we signed Young for £2m to be honest. Why pay money for a player who is in his midtwenties and would make your first team worse than it is currently?
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Presumably because - as is often the case - Fergie sees things slightly differently to you.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
You're arguing the toss about exactly how much we spent in that summer. If you accept that it's, at best, a very rough guide for the type of money we could spend this summer then why on earth are you quibbling about exactly how much Hargreaves and Anderson cost?

The simple fact remains, as KM has already pointed out to you, SAF has proven willing to spend a lot of money on transfers when he thinks it necessary. This means, he's not going to pull the plug on whoever he has his eye on for central midfield, just because the cost of signing Young ends up being closer to 20m than the 13m valuation you slapped on him.
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I was arguing about how spending on young will equate to lesser funds for a central midfielder. Do you even read or do you simply choose to ignore the points and bring in your pointless crap?

He might not pull the plug, but what happened in the cases of robben and even ronaldinho? We tried to bargain and lost out. What makes you think that by spending big on young (and thus having lesser for centre midfield as is my point in the first place) that we won't attempt to bargain again and lose out on our targeted central midfielder.
 
we put a lot of money into anderson.

this really is a crucial year for him.

between him and hargreaves, we did spend close to 40 million in 2007 to bolster our midfield ranks for the next 5-7 years.

Looks like that has fallen flat on its face and is forcing fergie to go back in the market.
 
I'm really not sure he's worth 20 million pounds though; I hope this isn't true, I'd rather we cement the central midfield and GK first off.
 
30m euros = a bit over 20m pounds at that times exchange rate iirc
so its around 54m
we did spend quite a bit that summer

I dont think it matters. We are freeing up around 400k a week in wages (20m a year) after the retirement of Scholes,nev,vds and hargo leaving

Looks like wes, gibson, diouf, de laet, koosh might be off too
we'll spend what is needed
 
Bryan_Munich said:
He's not going to play 'instead of' anyone, he's going to strengthen our squad and provide competition for places.
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We don't need anyone to strengthen our squad. Especially in wide positions.

We have Nani and Valencia, Park plays from out wide, Giggs can play from out wide, Rooney can play from out wide, Fletcher can play wide, both of the twins can play wide, Obertan can play out wide, Welbeck will probably be used there if he's not loaned out, Cleverley the same, Bebe keeps being played there.

We don't need anymore fecking wide players. I want to shout this into Fergie and Gill's ears. The only possible reason to sign one is if they're significantly better than what we already have, and even then we don't them enough for them to be any kind of priority.
 
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