There is no point in doing so, unless you avoid the internet too. Facebook, twitter, Caf, 9gag, reddit etc, all will spoil it for you anyway.
Books A Song of Ice and Fire (Books) | TV show? What TV show?
- Thread starter Massive Spanner
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I think I'm more excited about it now. There's something new and unknown to look forward to. It had almost become a choir to watch it, during the last two seasons. I was regularly expecting to be disappointed by the portrayal of this or that. I think I'll enjoy the show more now, for what it is, and not be angry that it's not what it's supposed to be.
Aye I agree, but a friend of mine was considering it and what you've said is my response.
This is true, but just from a sheer cinematic/television point of view, the show has clearly disintegrated. Shots/cinematography is less calculated, contrivances are rife, and worst of all the writing has been atrocious at times. It's still decent as far as good television goes, but it's pretty much all we'll have to go on next year and I think it'll make everyone pick scabs at it even more.
Finished all the books. Probably been talked about loads in here already but I can't believe how much they fecked over Stannis in the show.
In the show, he burns his daughter alive. In the books, he sends Justin Massey to Braavos to get 20,000 sellswords and commands him to put his daughter on the throne if he dies.
Glad the show didn't go with the Quentyn Martell storyline though. Too many chapters wasted on that idiot.
In the show, he burns his daughter alive. In the books, he sends Justin Massey to Braavos to get 20,000 sellswords and commands him to put his daughter on the throne if he dies.
Glad the show didn't go with the Quentyn Martell storyline though. Too many chapters wasted on that idiot.
Some of the best cinematography has being from season four & five, if anything, it's getting better. The whole Battle of The Wall has yet to be surpassed when it comes to cinematography, the Blackwater Battle is a close second followed by Hardhome.
Battle of the Wall was shit.
THe Blackwater Battle was far superior, while Hardhome was great, especially considering that it was a for show invention.
But really, the last season was from crap to awful. Cinematography was okay, but the writting was almost Dexter-bad at time. On the other side, I think that season 4 was second only to the first season.
Strongly disagree. The cinematography was much better at the battle of the wall. And it was far from shit. To say it was shit it absolute bonkers.
Nothing as come close to that particular shot as of yet.
I agree that show Stannis was ruined. They made him more endearing to then make him more hated. Completely ruined the essence of the character. Also, certain characters like Ramsey and Brienne having zero consequences fir their actions goes against the whole shows/books mantra.
Is there a release date for the Book 6?
It's George, the book could be finished anytime... this century. If we're lucky.
Yep. 12 March, 2079. It is still a tentatively date though.
Call me optimistic but I think book 7 can be written relatively quickly, say 2-3 years after 6 is out, which will be sometimes next year or at the latest 2017. He knows how the story is going to end, he has the ideas for the fate of major characters, it's just hashing out the details and tying up loose ends, many of which can be done in book 6 already.
Let's hope the old bastard stays healthy.
Let's hope the old bastard stays healthy.
He had to split books and publish because he couldn't put all the stuff in his mind into a single book. Happened twice.
I wonder if he could just write anything in 2-3 years.
First 3 books came within 2 years of each other. It's not unfeasible.
It's a question of how much public events he will attend that eats up his time. He's been living it large on the show's success last few years, basically. Follow his blog and it's pretty much non stop travel, plus the WOIAF wiki and Dunk&Eggs Novella.
Theres been rumours circulating for a while that GRRM has submitted a completed manuscript and it is currently being translated for Polish and Spanish publishers.
The optimist in me thinks it'll be released in line with the new season.
The optimist in me thinks it'll be released in line with the new season.
Good news guys:
Not really good. But it looks likely that it will be published this year.
The last post from the Lost Post, and the one you've all been waiting for.
Back when this was one long long long post, before Live Journal sent it to the cornfield, I mentioned opening with Dickens' line, "It was the best of times, it was the worst of times." So it was for me in 2015. I've spent much of the day recreating (in Cliff's Note summaries) my own personal "best of times" from the previous year, all the wonderful things that went down for me in 2015, the awards and the publications and the bestseller lists, the cons and the parties, the travel, all the exciting new projects underway at HBO and right here down the street in Santa Fe. But inevitably that brings me to my own personal "worst of times," and that is considerably less fun to blog about, so do forgive my reluctance to do so.
You wanted an update. Here's the update. You won't like it.
THE WINDS OF WINTER is not finished.
Believe me, it gave me no pleasure to type those words. You're disappointed, and you're not alone. My editors and publishers are disappointed, HBO is disappointed, my agents and foreign publishers and translators are disappointed... but no one could possibly be more disappointed than me. For months now I have wanted nothing so much as to be able to say, "I have completed and delivered THE WINDS OF WINTER" on or before the last day of 2015.
But the book's not done.
Nor is it likely to be finished tomorrow, or next week. Yes, there's a lot written. Hundreds of pages. Dozens of chapters. (Those 'no pages done' reports were insane, the usual garbage internet journalism that I have learned to despise). But there's also a lot still left to write. I am months away still... and that's if the writing goes well. (Sometimes it does. Sometimes it doesn't.) Chapters still to write, of course... but also rewriting. I always do a lot of rewriting, sometimes just polishing, sometimes pretty major restructures.
I suppose I could just say, "Sorry, boys and girls, still writing," and leave it at that. "It will be done when it's done." Which is what I have been doing, more or less, since... well, forever. But with season 6 of GAME OF THRONES approaching, and so many requests for information boiling up, I am going to break my own rules and say a little more, since it would appear that hundreds of my readers, maybe thousands or tens of thousands, are very concerned about this question of 'spoilers" and the show catching up, revealing things not yet revealed in the books, etc.
My publishers and I have been cognizant of these concerns, of course. We discussed some of them last spring, as the fifth season of the HBO series was winding down, and came up with a plan. We all wanted book six of A SONG OF ICE AND FIRE to come out before season six of the HBO show aired. Assuming the show would return in early April, that meant THE WINDS OF WINTER had to be published before the end of March, at the latest. For that to happen, my publishers told me, they would need the completed manuscript before the end of October. That seemed very do-able to me... in May. So there was the first deadline: Halloween.
Unfortunately, the writing did not go as fast or as well as I would have liked. You can blame my travels or my blog posts or the distractions of other projects and the Cocteau and whatever, but maybe all that had an impact... you can blame my age, and maybe that had an impact too...but if truth be told, sometimes the writing goes well and sometimes it doesn't, and that was true for me even when I was in my 20s. And as spring turned to summer, I was having more bad days than good ones. Around about August, I had to face facts: I was not going to be done by Halloween. I cannot tell you how deeply that realization depressed me.
Early August saw me back east for my nephew's wedding and an appearance with the Staten Island Direwolves. I took advantage of the visit to have another sit down with my editors and publishers and told them that I didn't think I could deliver by Halloween. I thought they'd be sick about it... but I have to say, my editors and publishers are great, and they took it with surprising equanimity. (Maybe they knew it before I did). They already had contigencies in place. They had made plans to speed up production. If I could deliver WINDS OF WINTER by the end of the year, they told me, they could still get it our before the end of March.
I was immensely relieved. I had two whole extra months! I could make that, certainly. August was an insane month, too much travel, too many other obligations... but I'd have September, October, and now November and December as well. Once again I was confident I could do it.
Here it is, the first of January. The book is not done, not delivered. No words can change that. I tried, I promise you. I failed. I blew the Halloween deadline, and I've now blown the end of the year deadline. And that almost certainly means that no, THE WINDS OF WINTER will not be published before the sixth season of GAME OF THRONES premieres in April (mid April, we are now told, not early April, but those two weeks will not save me). Even as late as my birthday and our big Emmy win, I still thought I could do it... but the days and weeks flew by faster than the pile of pages grew, and (as I often do) I grew unhappy with some of the choices I'd made and began to revise... and suddenly it was October, and then November... and as the suspicion grew that I would not make it after all, a gloom set in, and I found myself struggling even more. The fewer the days, the greater the stress, and the slower the pace of my writing became.
Look, I have always had problems with deadlines. For whatever reason, I don't respond well to them. Back in November, when I returned to Northwestern to accept my Alumni Award, I told the Medill students that was why I started writing fiction instead of getting a job on a newspaper. I knew even then that daily deadlines would kill me. That was a joke, of course... but there was truth in it too. I wrote my first novel, DYING OF THE LIGHT, without a contract and without a deadline. No one even knew I was writing a novel until I sent the completed book to Kirby to sell. I wrote FEVRE DREAM the same way. I wrote THE ARMAGEDDON RAG the same way. No contracts, no deadlines, no one waiting. Write at my own pace and deliver when I'm done. That's really how I am most comfortable, even now.
But I won't make excuses. There are no excuses. No one else is to blame. Not my editors and publishers, not HBO, not David & Dan. It's on me. I tried, and I am still trying. I worked on the book a couple of days ago, revising a Theon chapter and adding some new material, and I will writing on it again tomorrow. But no, I can't tell you when it will be done, or when it will be published. Best guess, based on our previous conversations, is that Bantam (and presumably my British publisher as well) can have the hardcover out within three months of delivery, if their schedules permit. But when delivery will be, I can't say. I am not going to set another deadline for myself to trip over. The deadlines just stress me out.
I am going back to my stance from last March, before all this. It will be done when it's done. And it will be as good as I can possibly make it.
Having said all that, I know what the next question will be, because hundreds of you have already asked it of me. Will the show 'spoil' the novels?
IF YOU HAVE NOT SEEN ALL FIVE SEASONS AND READ ALL FIVE BOOKS, STOP HERE!
Just consider. Mago, Irri, Rakharo, Xaro Xhoan Daxos, Pyat Pree, Pyp, Grenn, Ser Barristan Selmy, Queen Selyse, Princess Shireen, Princess Myrcella, Mance Rayder, and King Stannis are all dead in the show, alive in the books. Some of them will die in the books as well, yes... but not all of them, and some may die at different times in different ways. Balon Greyjoy, on the flip side, is dead in the books, alive on the show. His brothers Euron Crow's Eye and Victarion have not yet been introduced (will they appear? I ain't saying). Meanwhile Jhiqui, Aggo, Jhogo, Jeyne Poole, Dalla (and her child) and her sister Val, Princess Arianne Martell, Prince Quentyn Martell, Willas Tyrell, Ser Garlan the Gallant, Lord Wyman Manderly, the Shavepate, the Green Grace, Brown Ben Plumm, the Tattered Prince, Pretty Meris, Bloodbeard, Griff and Young Griff, and many more have never been part of the show, yet remain characters in the books. Several are viewpoint characters, and even those who are not may have significant roles in the story to come in THE WINDS OF WINTER and A DREAM OF SPRING.
GAME OF THRONES is the most popular television series in the world right now. The most pirated as well. It just won a record number of Emmy Awards, including the ultimate prize, for the best drama on television. It's an incredible production with an incredible cast and crew.
WINDS OF WINTER should be pretty good too, when it comes out. As good as I can make it, anyway.
Which is a long way of saying, "How may children did Scarlett O'Hara have?"
Enjoy the show. Enjoy the books.
Meanwhile, I'll keep writing. Chapter at a time. Page at a time. Word at a time. That's all I know how to do.
((And yes, this is my final Cliff's Note for the day. You can all go to bed now)).
Not really good. But it looks likely that it will be published this year.
I feel sorry for him. Having his life's work spoiled by a fecking TV show. Doesn't have anyone else to blame though as sad as it is.
Don't care anymore though. The show will forge ahead so that deadline will no longer hang over him. Just hope he finishes the 2 (or 3) books in the way he wants them to and ends a great series.
Don't care anymore though. The show will forge ahead so that deadline will no longer hang over him. Just hope he finishes the 2 (or 3) books in the way he wants them to and ends a great series.
Meh. He has got a shitload of money because of the TV show. He had around 5m-10m books sold when the show started, but now has sold over 60m.
And well, he really could have done it faster if he had really tried. The last book has been published near 5 years ago and apparently he had 200 pages or so of this book when he published the last one.
I doubt it. Writing is not a linear process as pretty much all authors will tell you. You can't just sit in front of a computer and force yourself to write. The stress of writing and re-writing parts of DwD has caught up to him with this book as well.
Anyway, like I said I don't care anymore as long as he completes it. I'm probably alone in not caring for the show.
Sounds like a classic case of an artist struggling with creativity and inspiration as they get older.
I don't care how long it takes, my bigger concern is the remaining books won't be as good as they seem to be getting harder to write for him.
I don't care how long it takes, my bigger concern is the remaining books won't be as good as they seem to be getting harder to write for him.
The last two books weren't near as good as the first three, anyway. I would take the remaining books to be just as good as A Dance with Dragons.
So basically all the reports coming out were good old George leading the poor bastards on?
I don't blame him for the slow pace. He's done a lot of press promoting the show in the 2 years after the release of ADwD, and he should get to enjoy his moment in the sun, enough great writers never had that opportunity.
Still, it's frustrating. I guess it'll be at least a good six months before he finish writing and if we are lucky the publisher will accelerate the editing process to get it out by mid-late Sept.
I don't blame him for the slow pace. He's done a lot of press promoting the show in the 2 years after the release of ADwD, and he should get to enjoy his moment in the sun, enough great writers never had that opportunity.
Still, it's frustrating. I guess it'll be at least a good six months before he finish writing and if we are lucky the publisher will accelerate the editing process to get it out by mid-late Sept.
I don't care that much either, the first couple of seasons were fantastic but I feel like it's going downhill since somewhere around the start of season 4. The books are far superior to the show imo, at first I vowed I wouldn't watch season 6 until Winds of Winter is released but I think it'll be near impossible to avoid any spoilers on the internet so I might as well watch it. In the beginning, I was annoyed when they didn't follow the books but right now I'm hoping they create their own storyline (which they've already done by killing off several characters who're still alive in the books) so that there are still many suprises when the book comes out.
He just confirmed Stannis is dead it seems. Lol.
The problem with his points are, we don't really care about those mysteries being spoiled. Its the Jon Snow mysteries and the Others that we care about. All things the show will likely reveal in the next season.
The problem with his points are, we don't really care about those mysteries being spoiled. Its the Jon Snow mysteries and the Others that we care about. All things the show will likely reveal in the next season.
I stopped watching the show before the end of the last series that aired, it had taken a nosedive in quality when they ran out of book stuff and started going their own way. It's just not a good enough show to justify watching it and it spoiling one of my favourite book series. It's really annoying knowing that it's going to be impossible to avoid spoilers anyway.
He seems genuinely kinda stressed.
He seems genuinely kinda stressed.
He should be. Tue guy fecked up and let the show catch up. He shouldn't be pushing for deadlines like this considering he had 5 years to write the book. Never should have let the show catch up like this considering where he was 5 years ago.
I'm surprised people are surprised. From the updates we've been getting and how much time GRRM spent faffing about at conventions, it's been clear he wasn't close to completion. Reading the ASOIAF sub, some people really seem to believe he had everything almost completed, just waiting to be sent to the publishers 
I guess at this rate, end of 2016 or early 2017 should be the soonest.
I guess at this rate, end of 2016 or early 2017 should be the soonest.
Yep, I said so myself in response to @ThierryHenry who was expecting it to be published before the new season. It really was never in the cards.I'm surprised people are surprised. From the updates we've been getting and how much time GRRM spent faffing about at conventions, it's been clear he wasn't close to completion. Reading the ASOIAF sub, some people really seem to believe he had everything almost completed, just waiting to be sent to the publishers
I guess at this rate, end of 2016 or early 2017 should be the soonest.
Would definitely be happy if it will get released this year, but it will likely be next year. And then who knows when it will be published the final book (if he doesn't extend the story).
I've kind of just given up on it. Even if it comes out this year or next I don't think I could be arsed waiting another 5-7 years for the next one after it's been spoiled by a sub standard TV show.
Probably agonizing over which foods to leave out in his feast descriptions.
Do fans of the books wish the TV show never existed? I do.
Yep, that's my main concern too. I'd made peace with the fact that TWOW wasn't coming any time soon, so I'm not bothered. I shudder to think when ADOS will be released though(2021 seems to be a good estimate calculating his pace), and if he does add an 8th book with all the loose ends to be tied up, then I'm done, not sure I can put myself through that
Again, your books are still there, the TV show changes nothing, Stannis isn't "ruined". Dorne isn't as shit, all the missing side stories are still there and will still be there. The TV show being a thing has got nothing to do with GRRM's turtle paced writing.
You seem very upset when people criticise the show.
I know they are still there but I don't like it
. Sorry. The Slutty snakes are crap, 'Stannis' is crap, Jaime is crap, the North is terrible...It's a crap adaption.Kinda. The first couple of seasons were quite good, but it's gone tits up. I'm still haunted by the whole Bronn/Sand Snake exchange.
"Oi, guy I just met."
"Yeah?"
"Remember earlier when we were like fighting and stuff?"
"Yeah."
"I like totally poisoned you."
"Oh?"
"Yeah. Wanna see my tits? Ignore my sisters here."
"Poisoned me?"
"Tits?"
"Um...ok...? What's this about poison?"
"Do you like my titties?"
"Seriously, the poison. What gives?"
"Tell me you like them!!"
"Fine. Your baps are grand!"
"Aaaww that's sweet. Here's the antidote."
"Cheers, love."
"Wanna bang?"
"Ok"
Paraphrasing, but fecking hell it was bad. I'd stopped enjoying it long before that, but it was at that point I questioned the use of my time spent watching it.
I thought that was a relatively level headed response if I do say so myself. And without the show I'd have never being introduced to this amazing world and its characters. And yeah, I find peoples (primarily book readers) distaste for season five equates to "what a shit show this is" to be baffling. Besides Dorne, it's being, for me, nothing but stellar. Changes to the show won't effect the books.
The most recent season had some great stuff. People just love to moan about everything (yet still watch).