A serious look at Mauricio Pochettino

Amadaeus said:
Yea the methods that got Spurs to the champions league finals for the first time in their history and consistently top four :lol:. If those players are tired of that method then, it is understandable where the problems lie in your team.
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Any team can go on a fantastic cup run. The team clearly got itself together for the biggest games and is still capable of pulling off great performances (we have some fantastic players that you massively underrate, for one) and that's what got us to the final. That and a lot of tight decisions and luck .. like any cup run.

Our league form has been shite for ages. Last season we scraped top 4 after a horrendous end to the season, and we've started in a similar vein. The atmosphere around the club hasn't been right for a while.

You love Pochettino, so are incapable of seeing when he might be a little to blame. He's a fantastic manager, but sometimes a relationship between the club/manager just comes to an end.
 
SquishyMcSquish said:
You love Pochettino, so are incapable of seeing when he might be a little to blame. He's a fantastic manager, but sometimes a relationship between the club/manager just comes to an end.
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exactly this, Sir Alex's genius was turning over the squad at the right time to keep things fresh and players engaged it could so easily have gotten stale in the mid 90s if he hadn't
 
FootyGirl88 said:
Quotes or it didn't happen :lol:
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I think a few have been deleted but these:

'feck off .... you come on hear and wank yourself off when we lose ... when we win you're nowhere ... you're a feckin' troll cnut just feck off and die ...'

'I don't give a feck ... I support Spurs not some internet wankers who can't wait to have a go ,... come in my local and see how long they last .. fecking cnuts'

One bloke isn't happy :lol:
 
SquishyMcSquish said:
I think a few have been deleted but these:

'feck off .... you come on hear and wank yourself off when we lose ... when we win you're nowhere ... you're a feckin' troll cnut just feck off and die ...'

'I don't give a feck ... I support Spurs not some internet wankers who can't wait to have a go ,... come in my local and see how long they last .. fecking cnuts'

One bloke isn't happy :lol:
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They sound like a nice bunch, you're safer here with us Squishy :lol:
 
GlastonSpur said:
Most if it is media hype and bullshit.

If you believed it all you'd think that Spurs have had a terrible start to the season, whereas in fact we sit in 3rd place in the league (after having already played two of the toughest away fixtures) and have started better in the CL than we did last season.
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:wenger:
 
Jimmy Skitz said:
exactly this, Sir Alex's genius was turning over the squad at the right time to keep things fresh and players engaged it could so easily have gotten stale in the mid 90s if he hadn't
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https://www.skysports.com/football/...this-tottenham-squad-not-the-best-i8217ve-had

I think this sums it up really. I don't see the point in a manager in coming out and saying stuff like that.

'Yeah this group is fine I guess .. had better'.

He says a lot of stuff you'd never have heard him say about past teams. He just appears negative and unhappy, and that can't be good for anybody.
 
always_hoping said:
When Jose was appointed his final season with Chelsea was ignored and was talked up on his past success. Likewise we are meant to ignore how Spurs have been doing in 2019 while talk up Poch for how he has done before 2019?

Poch is at a club that suits him. IMO he wouldn't last very long at a club whereby the pressure and expectation to succeed is far greater than Spurs.
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No, a suite would judge Poch on the whole. This year and the last years before that. Post Ole, whenever that might be, we wouldn't be hiring anyone short term, so only concentrating on what they did in that calendar year would be pointless.
 
SquishyMcSquish said:
Any team can go on a fantastic cup run. The team clearly got itself together for the biggest games and is still capable of pulling off great performances (we have some fantastic players that you massively underrate, for one) and that's what got us to the final. That and a lot of tight decisions and luck .. like any cup run.

Our league form has been shite for ages. Last season we scraped top 4 after a horrendous end to the season, and we've started in a similar vein. The atmosphere around the club hasn't been right for a while.

You love Pochettino, so are incapable of seeing when he might be a little to blame. He's a fantastic manager, but sometimes a relationship between the club/manager just comes to an end.
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The champions league is a bit different than any cup. When was the last time a team without any investment reached the finals of that competition? Or in fact a team that is not part of Europe’s elite? I believe Klopp Dortmund and we see how well he is doing now at a club with a proper backing. I agree that Poch has had his, “Klopp at Dortmund moment” at Spurs, so it is time for him to go on to a new project similar to Klopp. Staying at Spurs one more season might have been the wrong move, as it was obvious that the first chapter has ended and the second chapter will need a huge overhaul. I don’t believe Poch has the heart to conduct another one, especially with a club without huge ambitions.
 
SquishyMcSquish said:
https://www.skysports.com/football/...this-tottenham-squad-not-the-best-i8217ve-had

I think this sums it up really. I don't see the point in a manager in coming out and saying stuff like that.

'Yeah this group is fine I guess .. had better'.

He says a lot of stuff you'd never have heard him say about past teams. He just appears negative and unhappy, and that can't be good for anybody.
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alarm bells rang when he hinted he'd walk had you won the Cl Final, if I were Levy I would have replaced him in the summer as he simply cannot be as committed if the thought of leaving is in his mind
 
Jimmy Skitz said:
exactly this, Sir Alex's genius was turning over the squad at the right time to keep things fresh and players engaged it could so easily have gotten stale in the mid 90s if he hadn't
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Tbf to Poch I think he's wanted to turn over the squad entirely over the last 2 windows and Levy has held out for exorbitant fees nobody was going to play. Poch correctly identified the end of a cycle, but he's been let down in turning the squad over by Levy.
 
AR87 said:
Tbf to Poch I think he's wanted to turn over the squad entirely over the last 2 windows and Levy has held out for exorbitant fees nobody was going to play. Poch correctly identified the end of a cycle, but he's been let down in turning the squad over by Levy.
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then Levy should have replaced Poch, if you won't change the players then you have to change the coach
 
Amadaeus said:
The champions league is a bit different than any cup. When was the last time a team without any investment reached the finals of that competition? Or in fact a team that is not part of Europe’s elite? I believe Klopp Dortmund and we see how well he is doing now at a club with a proper backing. I agree that Poch has had his, “Klopp at Dortmund moment” at Spurs, so it is time for him to go on to a new project similar to Klopp. Staying at Spurs one more season might have been the wrong move, as it was obvious that the first chapter has ended and the second chapter will need a huge overhaul. I don’t believe Poch has the heart to conduct another one.
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I think we have a better team on paper than Chelsea did in 2010, although not the same experience as that team did, the likes of Cole, Terry, Drogba, Lampard basically managed one last hurrah despite being past their best. Ajax were so close to making it instead of us as well, and they had a team that has had very little investment.

Obviously the CL is different, and it was a remarkable achievement, something I'll always remember and thank Pochettino for. He's been a remarkable manager for us and anybody playing down his role at the club in recent years is being a fool. But the signs have been there for over a season now, we pulled it together for a fantastic cup run but in the league everything wasn't rosy and slowly but surely I think we're sadly coming to the end of the Pochettino era, which doesn't mean 'poch is overrated', it just means he needs a new project, we maybe need someone else to come in and start a new era as well.

Poch is a great manager - give him time and players who he can mould and he'll make a serious team out of you. He's not perfect, regularly makes poor/baffling substitutions and can sometimes show a bit too much favouritism to certain players, but he's definitely one of the most promising managers around and we're lucky to have had him. I think if he goes to a top club and gets the backing he needs he'll win trophies for sure.

One thing is for sure, we need to get the next manager absolutely right. Get it wrong and we could risk a period in the wilderness. We need somebody who is capable of conducting a restructure.
 
Jimmy Skitz said:
alarm bells rang when he hinted he'd walk had you won the Cl Final, if I were Levy I would have replaced him in the summer as he simply cannot be as committed if the thought of leaving is in his mind
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That's true, he doesn't sound very committed long term.
 
SquishyMcSquish said:
I think we have a better team on paper than Chelsea did in 2010, although not the same experience as that team did, the likes of Cole, Terry, Drogba, Lampard basically managed one last hurrah despite being past their best. Ajax were so close to making it instead of us as well, and they had a team that has had very little investment.

Obviously the CL is different, and it was a remarkable achievement, something I'll always remember and thank Pochettino for. He's been a remarkable manager for us and anybody playing down his role at the club in recent years is being a fool. But the signs have been there for over a season now, we pulled it together for a fantastic cup run but in the league everything wasn't rosy and slowly but surely I think we're sadly coming to the end of the Pochettino era, which doesn't mean 'poch is overrated', it just means he needs a new project, we maybe need someone else to come in and start a new era as well.

Poch is a great manager - give him time and players who he can mould and he'll make a serious team out of you. He's not perfect, regularly makes poor/baffling substitutions and can sometimes show a bit too much favouritism to certain players, but he's definitely one of the most promising managers around and we're lucky to have had him. I think if he goes to a top club and gets the backing he needs he'll win trophies for sure.

One thing is for sure, we need to get the next manager absolutely right. Get it wrong and we could risk a period in the wilderness. We need somebody who is capable of conducting a restructure.
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Yea, the next manager you choose is important. You keep mentioning Ten Haag and I am also a fan of his. However, if you ask Ajax fan on here, they don’t rate him that highly surprisingly. They believe the foundation they have at Ajax was the reason for their success moreso than their manager. Plus, Dutch managers tend to get overhyped and then underperform when they come to the premier league. I believe Howe or that Norwich manager seems more like a safer bet to not go completely into the wilderness.
 
Amadaeus said:
Yea, the next manager you choose is important. You keep mentioning Ten Haag and I am also a fan of his. However, if you ask Ajax fan on here, they don’t rate him that highly surprisingly. They believe the foundation they have at Ajax was the reason for their success moreso than their manager. Plus, Dutch managers tend to get overhyped and then underperform when they come to the premier league. I believe Howe or that Norwich manager seems more like a safer bet to not go completely into the wilderness.
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Maybe, surprised the Ajax fans don't rate him. Aside from the players they had they really did look like a fantastically coached team to me.

Howe/Farke would be a risk in their own way. Managers who know the league but don't have top level experience and may struggle to make that step up. Of course Pochettino was a similar risk, but it doesn't always work out.
 
SquishyMcSquish said:
https://www.skysports.com/football/...this-tottenham-squad-not-the-best-i8217ve-had

I think this sums it up really. I don't see the point in a manager in coming out and saying stuff like that.

'Yeah this group is fine I guess .. had better'.

He says a lot of stuff you'd never have heard him say about past teams. He just appears negative and unhappy, and that can't be good for anybody.
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Poch has been acting grumpy for a while now. I think he's just tired of dealing with your board and expects more investment in both wages paid to current players and transfers bought in.

Likes of Alderweireld and Eriksen running down their contract wasn't going to go down well in your dressing room and he knows it. The board should've ponied up a while ago for those two.
 
Kush said:
Poch has been acting grumpy for a while now. I think he's just tired of dealing with your board and expects more investment in both wages paid to current players and transfers bought in.

Likes of Alderweireld and Eriksen running down their contract wasn't going to go down well in your dressing room and he knows it. The board should've ponied up a while ago for those two.
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Far as I'm aware large contracts were on the table for them for a while .. they just knew what they were doing and ran it down anyway, and will benefit hugely financially from that.

We did spend this summer, but now looking back it potentially wasn't quite enough. I think our next summer is absolutely crucial and the one we need a serious rethink in.

Hopefully we can scrape top four which should make that easier.
 
SquishyMcSquish said:
Far as I'm aware large contracts were on the table for them for a while .. they just knew what they were doing and ran it down anyway, and will benefit hugely financially from that.

We did spend this summer, but now looking back it potentially wasn't quite enough. I think our next summer is absolutely crucial and the one we need a serious rethink in.

Hopefully we can scrape top four which should make that easier.
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I think there in lies the issue with Poch. He's feeling that he's reached ceiling at Spurs and the board aren't pumping in enough money to help him challenge for big prizes. After 5 years, it's still all about Top 4.
 
Kush said:
I think there in lies the issue with Poch. He's feeling that he's reached ceiling at Spurs and the board aren't pumping in enough money to help him challenge for big prizes. After 5 years, it's still all about Top 4.
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I think that's all we can realistically go for this season .. unless we have a domestic cup run in us.

The investment needs to increase going forward and the fans expect that.
 
AR87 said:
Tbf to Poch I think he's wanted to turn over the squad entirely over the last 2 windows and Levy has held out for exorbitant fees nobody was going to play. Poch correctly identified the end of a cycle, but he's been let down in turning the squad over by Levy.
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It is not just about the squad though, their squad is probably the best of the rest, behind Pool and City. The problem has been his whole demeanor, some of the comments he has made are not going to be good for morale, and that is a very important thing in football.

This season, he actually has got some very good players and kept some important players as well, as well as going to a new stadium. The fans love him, and won't turn on him even if he does not finish in top 4. At bigger clubs, he won't get that type of time and patience, and job security. The situation is not that bad, and if he does want to leave as he has problems with Levy or something, then just resign. Then again, if he was undecided on his future, then he should not have signed such a long contract in the first place.
 
I don't think he's going to last the season.

His relationship with Spurs is beyond repairing imo.
 
FootyGirl88 said:
All the Poch/spurs threads getting bumped now - it’s just a rough patch imo
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He’s already peaked with Spurs and should have left in the summer. Now he’s going to have the issue of looking like he’s regressed a team that we’re CL finalists. If he’s really lucky, Madrid sack Zidane and give him the job, although I don’t think he’ll last a full year.
 
Whether he's a good manager or not I think him and his players have reached full saturation after CL final and he doesn't seem to share same views with the board on how to build the team anymore. It's time for both of them to part company.
 
Reminds me of Klopp's last season for Dortmund. Just not the right fit anymore, should leave before it gets worse.
 
As I said in the other thread we should stay away. Good manager but we don't want to be hiring him off the back of a bad final season at Spurs
 
He's doing a Jose. With the Eriksen drama and not getting Dybala I think he's had enough. Would still give him a shot at United. Just to see. You know? To really see. What can he actually do at a big club with lots of money and pulling power. Every team he manages improves significantly and I would imagine some players wanna play under him. I'd actually go for it if he became available. Feck what the press think
 
FootyGirl88 said:
All the Poch/spurs threads getting bumped now - it’s just a rough patch imo
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It's been a bit more than a patch, league form has been abysmal for a long time,
The champions League run has saved him from too much criticism, that has been wiped off the slate now after this start.
 
FootyGirl88 said:
All the Poch/spurs threads getting bumped now - it’s just a rough patch imo
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Alas I think you're wrong. I did think this for a long while but the rough patch (league wise) has now extended for a large part of last season in to a good chunk of this one. In my opinion the team were able to motivate themselves for one big push in Europe, but simply are no longer motivated week in, week out in the way that a team who are desperate to impress their manager should be. Tonight was a good example of that, we're on a bad run and against lower league opposition, lots of players with points to prove but the performance was totally lacking in energy or purpose, a clear sign of a team who aside from a game like Arsenal away or a big European night, no longer have the fight in them.

Pochettino is a manager who demands a lot from his players. He gives them hell in pre-season and expects full throttle football all year round. I don't think this is a recipe for success with a squad which is ageing now and has many players who season after season go through the same rigorous pre-season yet have no trophies to show for it. I honestly believe a lot of players in this team are simply mentally exhausted and Pochettino's constant negativity in the press can hardly help in that respect.

Poch is at his best when he has fresh, young minds to mould to his style, players who will happily embrace his ideas and run through walls for him. The football we saw in the early years reflected that, but now we're seeing the pressing game slowly disintegrate and the creativity and dynamism in our football simply disappear and turn in to a slow, sideways approach which resembles the dark days of AVB. We perfectly resemble a team who still have talented individuals capable of moments like Kane conjured up last week, but one who has lost that 'spark'.

He will do well wherever he goes and if he gets more backing than he did here, will win trophies too. But with Pochettino long-term I think you'll need a decent amount of turnover to keep things fresh, whereas we're still running with basically the same squad we have since after his first season at the club.
 
slored1 said:
Reminds me of Klopp's last season for Dortmund. Just not the right fit anymore, should leave before it gets worse.
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The difference there is that Klopp had to sell his best players every year - Poch has held onto them and still won nothing.
 
el3mel said:
Whether he's a good manager or not I think him and his players have reached full saturation after CL final and he doesn't seem to share same views with the board on how to build the team anymore. It's time for both of them to part company.
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More likely that they fought for him, signed contracts for him, and then he started suggesting he'd leave if they won something etc.

Not the way to motivate your squad.

I'm surprised to see how much people ignore the strength of the squad he has, and the fact that 5 years of Harry Kane and some of the other talent he's had available, and he's still not actually won anything.

He struggled with the established players when he first joined, did well with relatively unknowns, and is now struggling to get the best out of established players again. Seems to me that he's not suited to managing higher-profile players, and if so, I can't see a 'bigger' team suiting him.
 
I wouldn't go over board about the result tonight. These results can always happen in the cup with weakened sides, just as i was saying last week when there was meltdown over the Astana game.
 
Leftback99 said:
I wouldn't go over board about the result tonight. These results can always happen in the cup with weakened sides, just as i was saying last week when there was meltdown over the Astana game.
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It isn't - it's just a league-two-shaped cherry on top of a cake iced with awful form, on a layer of not winning an away game for something like 9 months, with a bed of relegation form since the start of 2019.

The CL did well to gloss over that, but it is still what it is.
 
Stacks said:
He's doing a Jose. With the Eriksen drama and not getting Dybala I think he's had enough. Would still give him a shot at United. Just to see. You know? To really see. What can he actually do at a big club with lots of money and pulling power. Every team he manages improves significantly and I would imagine some players wanna play under him. I'd actually go for it if he became available. Feck what the press think
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Except it's quite a while since that's been true. The fluky UCL final papered over what had been two very meh back to back PL campaigns.
 
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