A discussion about Paul Ince

He was a great player for us but also it showed Fergie's knack for identifying when it was time to rebuild, just before players began to massively decline, so the team could be refreshed every so often and stay competitive.

Despite the cringe Liverpool celebration, Ince did an awful lot more for United than many players who remain lauded by our fans.
 
Just listened to Ince post match and he answered lots of questions on United.

Spoke glowingly about Ten Hag and said as a former United player he wants the club to do well and it’s nice to see the improvements even if it will take a bit of time.
 
As a midfielder he really did have it all. Think he's underrated in the English game, personally.
 
Ince was my favourite United player before he left,loved his energy and arrogance,What a player
I was sad when he was sold but SAF knows best
 
Glad things are moving on 20 years on. Was really good in those initial years of the premiership.

I didn't begrudge him joining Liverpool. Not even too fussed about the celebrations though it sucked to watch as it was a late equaliser (still baffled Irwin got booked again for passing the ball and it was seen as kicking it away ...)
I kinda however remember him saying he hopes that goal stops us which sucked
 
Paul Ince was the best dedicated DM we had during SAF's era. Keane was a better overall player but defensively Ince was a beast. He was stronger, he was faster, he was meaner and he had better positioning. That might sound trivial in today's football were ball retention is key but not at the time. Ince was one of the best DMs at the time as shown with United and Inter. And yet SAF did well in getting rid of him and ironically I reached that conclusion through a Liverpool fan who was mate of mine.

The guy was quite involved with Liverpool at the time and it was common to have Liverpool players and the manager calling him. Anyway I've asked the guy why Liverpool had allowed Ince to leave for 1m. The answer to that was shocking.

During Evans time, the manager would set up the line up only for Ince to clear it up and write his favourites himself. When Liverpool tried to sign Foe, Ince went ballistic as he expected to be consulted first. The Guvnor's nickname wasn't there out of Lulz. Which is why the first thing Houllier did was to get rid of him.

SAF could take alot of shit especially towards the end of his career. However there was one thing that he would never compromise upon and that was his authority. Which is why Ince had to go.
 
Adisa said:
Must have been though to deal with. Most people would feel some sort of animosity towards the club.
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I don't get that impression personally. Paul Ince even says himself he respected the decision - it happens in football. It's clear he begrudged it but he literally says it was the best thing that happened to him, going to Serie A at that time.
 
Sylar said:
Glad things are moving on 20 years on. Was really good in those initial years of the premiership.

I didn't begrudge him joining Liverpool. Not even too fussed about the celebrations though it sucked to watch as it was a late equaliser (still baffled Irwin got booked again for passing the ball and it was seen as kicking it away ...)
I kinda however remember him saying he hopes that goal stops us which sucked
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Totally human reaction.
I am very happy with my current job, I think everything is great and I am loving life. If I get called in tomorrow morning and told to feck off, that a new hire is taking my place, I will not wish my employer well. Most wouldn’t.
 
Foxbatt said:
Paul Ince is more talented than Keane. His problem was he played in a period where players were only supposed to be seen on the pitch. They can't have any opinions and can't drive flashy cars etc. He was too loud and opinionated. He is two footed, can shoot from range with either foot, can tackle, can dribble and can pass. He can play as a holding midfielder or an attacking midfield.
Here was a black football player taking about his opinion. He was also the cousin of Nigel Benn the boxer so was in the limelight.
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Superb player, alongside Keane helped to represent that ruthless, hungry, athletic, high-quality centre midfield type that we needed to power our team.

Awesome presence on the park, scored the odd goal, and what an inspiration for his team mates. Brilliant player. Brilliant
 
TheReligion said:
Just listened to Ince post match and he answered lots of questions on United.

Spoke glowingly about Ten Hag and said as a former United player he wants the club to do well and it’s nice to see the improvements even if it will take a bit of time.
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I’ll tell you what I heard

“they showed me respect by the team they selected”
 
NinjaZombie said:
Not too surprising he reacted the way he did considering how he left West Ham for us.
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He had a good run at Old Trafford though, six years, lots of trophies. He didn't win anything else at other clubs.
 
Ince was the one player that was a concern when he left in 95. Nobody really anticipated that Butt would develop like he did.

There were also rumours we tried to resign him in 1997 but couldn't guarantee him playing time. He went to Liverpool instead. What's odd is given Keane's injury a few weeks later, he would have been a regular at United for a season.
 
Real Madras said:
Went to school with my dad in London. Along with his cousin Nigel Benn. My dad told me a story about how close he was to Ince at school: they were good friends. One day, my dad got headbutted by an English guy for refusing to give him his lunch money. These guys followed my dad out of school and started chasing him. My dad was a fast runner and he used to run cross country. Lead these bullies on a wild chase through Valentines park, in Ilford only to stop half way through, turn around to face the bullies and out jumped Ince, Nigel Benn and a bunch of brothers with poles and sticks. Dad waved them off and walked the rest of the way home, leaving the brothers to deal with the bullies. No one picked on my dad after that.

Edit: Dad just mentioned to me that Lennox Lewis was one of the brothers that jumped out of the trees in the park that day.
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Buh oh locks. Not true. Especially this in bold.
 
Zen86 said:
He was understandably bitter, but he ruined his legacy for obvious reasons. It’s all water under the bridge now, hopefully he’ll get a bit more respect for what he did while he was here.
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Ive never understood the mind set behind people loathing ex players; if a player was lazy, uninterested, arrogant, selfish etc and failed to perform and slagged the club off then yes, I can see where that would annoy people, it would annoy me; but disliking somebody who played well for us and had a genuine respect for the club while he was here simply because he went on to play for a rival team, even if that team was Liverpool, and got a little carried away, ia bit OTT. Inces passion is what made him a stand out player; yes, the celebration was unnecassary but so too is villifying him.
 
He was just an excellent midfielder, wasn't he? What couldn't he do to a very high level in a top team, that was required of him?

makes me think of someone like Eto'o, who was simply brilliant, but wouldn't be talked about all that often
in conversations regarding "best players of this or that era".

While writing this I'm tempted to think about the great Chicago Bulls of the 90's. Thinking of players who were sublime but don't really get talked about unless you keep the conversation going for a couple of minutes-

Will Ince be aptly compared to someone like Toni Kukoc, For example?
 
fezzerUTD said:
Buh oh locks. Not true. Especially this in bold.
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Lennox Lewis was born in East Ham and went to school in Loxford, ilford. Same school as my old man. You should just take my word for it. I’m not here to write ‘Buh oh Locks’ oh and speak properly.
 
Red in STL said:
Given the way he was shipped out I'm not surprised he felt a bit bitter but IMO he is a legend for those 2 goals in Rotterdam, the same way Ole is for 99
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Hughes forced the move to Chelsea because we signed Cole, Fergie wanted to keep him.
 
Chairman Steve said:
I remember him being the one player of the 1995 squad cull that everyone thought we were mad to let go. Hughes was older and Andy Cole had just been bought. Kanchelskis was a pain in the ass behind the scenes, but Ince was a pretty good midfielder for us and had a great partnership with Keane.
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Yeah, both Hughes and Kanchelskis went down a rung to (pre-takeover) Chelsea and Everton whereas Ince going to Seria A for £7.5m in ‘95, which was comfortably the best league in the world, and for 500k more than the British record fee we’d just paid for Cole shows how genuinely top class he was. The equivalent of letting Stam go in terms of a WC player in his peak we didn’t “need” to lose…

He wasn’t better than Keane though. More showy (great goals, mazy bursting dribbles etc) but not as smart and game aware. Miles ahead of Butt though, but obviously not as willing to play second fiddle.

Had a very ‘Gerrard’ range of goals. Much less prolific, but more partial to an overhead kick…




It’s kinda insane to think there were moments in 1994 when we had Ince, Keane and Robson as a midfield 3. Never lost either when we did.
 
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yeah he was great alongside Keane in the mid 90s but in hindsight yet another genius call by SAF. I agree with all the comments above about the g'vnor but i also felt at the time he was always a little bit lacking in the Champions League and got caught out badly a few times, Barcelona sticks in the mind. I though that was also part of the reason SAF let him go as at this stage SAF was gunning for the CL above all.

I was glad and relieved he got a good reception at OT though, classy by the fans as always.
 
Real Madras said:
Lennox Lewis was born in East Ham and went to school in Loxford, ilford. Same school as my old man. You should just take my word for it. I’m not here to write ‘Buh oh Locks’ oh and speak properly.
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How old was he when this happened. Lennox i mean.
 
When he joined the club I wasn't convinced, we'd had a load of midfield journeymen play for us and wither in the shadow of Robson's reputation and legacy. To be fair to him he developed as a player and was one of the ones that channelled the disappointment of losing the league title to Leeds into the determination and tenacity that finally brought the title back to us. I always felt the whole "guvnor" thing was him stamping his London identity on the club rather than him being too big an ego. I ran into him years ago in Macclesfield and he was a normal kind of guy.

I can see that his negotiation for a new 4 year contract probably came 1 year too late...he had a dip in form just as Roy and Nicky were lengthening their stride and starting to look like world-beaters. United had never really had the option to "cash in" on a player since they sold Hughes to Barca, so I can see that transfer fee being an influential factor.

At the time I was most concerned with how we would replace Hughes (given our perennial cheapness on strikers) and my favourite player at the time...Kanchelskis. I felt we had ready made replacements for Ince, which is possibly a bit harsh. The Liverpool goal celebration was a bit much but I can see how he let his personal anger influence that and consider it water under the bridge, given the series of fraudulent midfielders we have had at the club for the last decade. He was a great player for the club and was part of a story that turned the club into a professional winning outfit.
 
redmanx said:
Ive never understood the mind set behind people loathing ex players; if a player was lazy, uninterested, arrogant, selfish etc and failed to perform and slagged the club off then yes, I can see where that would annoy people, it would annoy me; but disliking somebody who played well for us and had a genuine respect for the club while he was here simply because he went on to play for a rival team, even if that team was Liverpool, and got a little carried away, ia bit OTT. Inces passion is what made him a stand out player; yes, the celebration was unnecassary but so too is villifying him.
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I agree, someone called Mark Hughes a cnut the other day because he was City manager!
 
Tarrou said:
Ince was amazing for us and it felt like he was getting better and better during his time here. I thought Fergie made a big mistake getting rid. Going to Liverpool has obviously tainted my opinion of him, as great as he was.

I started watching United properly in about 91 and can’t say there are any mids I’d rather take now other than Keane & Scholes and maybe Carrick. I’d say he was a better player than Carrick but players like Carrick are a bit harder to find.
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I seem to recall that Ince wanted to go to Italy as Italian football was the place to be at that time. It was viewed as lack of loyalty to United especially considering the level of success he was gaining in Ferguson's team. He's remarks on his return to England to Liverpool were very disrespectful to a club that had given him so much success. Things like this is the reason he's not as highly regarded as eg Andy Cole.
 
032Devil said:
I seem to recall that Ince wanted to go to Italy as Italian football was the place to be at that time. It was viewed as lack of loyalty to United especially considering the level of success he was gaining in Ferguson's team. He's remarks on his return to England to Liverpool were very disrespectful to a club that had given him so much success. Things like this is the reason he's not as highly regarded as eg Andy Cole.
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That's the one thing he omits now in interviews. He did spend that whole season threatening to move.

He may have been just bluffing while negotiating a new contract but it was not that big a suprise when he left
 
He was probably our best player in 92 /93 season. It was a massive surprise when he left a couple of seasons later.

Fergie sold him, it was his decision. There was all this 'oh he had the guvnor on his boots' but that seemed a bit petty. Reckon there was another reason.

He came back to England and Arsenal had Vieira and Petit was in the post. The other options were not appealing I'd guess after playing for Man Utd and Inter. Shame.

Still not a bad spell for us. Crucial role in

2 Leagues
2 FA Cups
League Cup
Cup Winners Cup
Super Cup

Nicky Butt was a good player but Ince was a level up on him. Reckon we could have won a Champions League before 1999 had Ince stayed.
 
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